My reply to Respectable Liberal Blogger Ezra Klein and his fellow travelers; Plus: Hillary threatens S-CHIP critics
Update 1:35pm Eastern. WHY DO YOU HATE CHILDREN SO MUCH?!
Update 1:00pm Eastern. Snort-worthy blue-on-blue spat of the day: ThinkProgress vs. CNN.
Snort-worthy reverse conspiracy theorizing of the day: ThinkProgress in a tizzy over a McConnell aide’s e-mail to reporters about blogger coverage of Harry Reid’s poster child abuse, which the left-wing group touts as proof! proof! that McConnell was “involved in the right-wing campaign to smear Graeme Frost and his family.” He’s no more “involved” in the “right-wing smear” than CNN or any of the other MSM outlets trailing behind and finally asking hard-headed questions about the story behind the story.
Update 9:25am Eastern. Your S-CHIP editorial cartoon of the morning comes from Nate Beeler of the Examiner…
Meanwhile, Time magazine recycles Democrat talking points and passes it off as reporting.
Update: Hillary Clinton, She Whose Hand Rocks The Cradle, warns S-CHIP critics to “lay off.” Or else what, Mrs. Clinton?
“I don’t mind them picking on me; they’ve done it for years,” Clinton said to laughter from the audience at Symphony Hall in Boston. “You know, I think I’ve proven I can take care of myself against all of them.
“But President Bush and the Republicans should lay off Graeme Frost and all the other children who are getting health care because we have decided to do the right thing in America,” Clinton said.
Hillary should lay off the kiddie shields. Last time she exploited a sick child to argue for universal health care, it didn’t turn out so well.
***
The Respectable Liberal Blogger Ezra Klein in repose
On behalf of all liberal bloggers of purported good faith, the Respectable Liberal Blogger Ezra Klein has chivalrously stepped up to the plate to challenge me to a debate about S-CHIP.
I’m. Trrrrembling.
With. Laughter.
A good-faith debate would require that Respectable Liberal Blogger Ezra Klein actually be a person of good faith. He is treated as such in some elite conservative circles, where his work is linked frequently and intellectual repartee among the Beltway boys’ club is warm and chummy. He is free to continue traveling in those cozy circles where highbrow right-wingers are not so mean and scary.
But I’d just as soon share a stage, physical or virtual, with Respectable Liberal Blogger Ezra Klein as I would with Chris Matthews, Geraldo Rivera, or an overflowing vat of liquid radioactive waste.
First, let’s bust the cherished myth that Respectable Liberal Blogger Ezra Klein is as brilliant as he, the nutroots, and his respectable conservative friends think he is.
He is proudly touting the discovery of a blog post I wrote about my experience with Maryland’s individual health insurance market in 2004. He excerpts this part:
I have commented before on the problems with central planning in health care. I certainly am not convinced that a government-run system is the answer, but I do agree with Krugman that there are serious problems with our health insurance system, particularly in the market for individually-purchased (non-group) coverage.
After my husband quit his job earlier this year (to become a full-time stay-at-home dad), we had a choice. We could either buy health insurance from his former employer through a program called COBRA at a cost of more than $1,000 per month(!) or we could go it alone in Maryland’s individual market. Given our financial circumstances, that “choice” wasn’t much of a choice at all. We had to go on our own.
We discovered that the most generous plans in Maryland’s individual market cost $700 per month yet provide no more than $1,500 per year of prescription drug coverage–a drop in the bucket if someone in our family were to be diagnosed with a serious illness.
With health insurance choices like that, no wonder so many people opt to go uninsured.
What he fails to excerpt is the rest of the post:
In the end, we decided to purchase a very high-deductible plan (sold by Golden Rule Insurance Co.) coupled with a tax-sheltered Medical Savings Account (MSA). We couldn’t qualify for the preferred rate because Golden Rule says I am underweight. Hmph! In any case, while Krugman and most Democrats don’t seem to like MSAs, in our case we were glad they were an option.
Update: The Times reports that the proportion of Americans without health insurance is on the rise. The Wall Street Journal, on the other hand, says the proportion has remained steady. (Both are right; it depends on which timeframe one is talking about.) The WSJ editorial writers suggest:
States like New York could do a lot for [those who cannot obtain health insurance] merely by getting rid of the state insurance regulations that make a basic policy roughly 10 times more expensive than it is in neighboring Connecticut. Better still, Congress could save poor New Yorkers from the tyranny of Albany by putting an end to our Balkanized and anachronistic 50-state insurance market and simply decreeing that there shall be nationwide commerce in health insurance. They could then buy policies issued in saner states or over the Internet.
Respectable Liberal Blogger Ezra Klein and his Pavlovian (Yet Respectable) boosters are treating my 2004 post as proof-positive of my utterly flabbergasting HYPOCRISY!
Look! The wingnut complained about the health insurance market! Ergo, she is a HYYYYPPPPOCRITE. And stupid! And a Nazi bitch!
Continue flinging your peas. I do have a spit shield now.
Grown-ups, on the other hand, will be able to grasp effortlessly that if I had decided not to buy private insurance and then demanded that the government cover my medical expenses and insure me after a catastrophic accident, then, yes, why, yes, you could flap two HYPOCRISY! cards up and down in each hand until your feet lifted off the ground.
In fact, I advocated MSAs and noted approvingly the Wall Street Journal’s suggestion that the cure for limited market choices was less government intervention. Not more.
This is perfectly consistent, in other words, with my INHUMAN, FASCIST, CAPITALIST, WINGNUT views.
Is it Respectable Liberal Blogger Ezra Klein’s view that only commentators and analysts who adore the current state of the market are allowed to criticize S-CHIP’s mission creep? If anything, health care entitlement growth will make the problems I wrote about three years ago worse–problems due in significant part to the government regulations the WSJ spotlighted. Herd more people into government-subsidized health care and the private (unsubsidized) individual market will become even more dysfunctional.
True to form, however, other Respectable Liberal Bloggers are mindlessly promoting Respectable Liberal Blogger Ezra Klein’s discovery of my observations as the Holy Grail of Hypocrisy Cards–and falsely characterizing my post to boot. Respectable Liberal Blogger Jonathan Cohn at TNR’s The Plank claims that “I couldn’t find health insurance” and that “there was no affordable coverage to be had.”
Reading comprehension grade: F.
Nutroots pandering grade: A+ with an unhinged smiley face!
RLB Cohn thinks he has another trump card in noting that “[i]t’s the insurers who sell individual and small business coverage that screen carefully for pre-existing medical conditions, raising premiums or denying coverage for those whom they deem high medical risks.” Other left-wing blogs have zeroed in on the Frosts’ reported inability to obtain affordable insurance after their car accident.
Well, yes, it sucks. But Earth to liberals: That’s how insurance works–if you don’t buy it before you need it, you shouldn’t be shocked if it’s impossible to get after you need it.
Yet, somehow, I’m the HYPOCRITE for acting responsibly by considering alternative health insurance plans before anyone in my family required catastrophic care. As I wrote in my post, I wasn’t too happy about the choices at the time, especially the most expensive plans, but instead of expecting Big Nanny and American taxpayers to be our insurer, we made the decision to shell out for an inexpensive, high-deductible plan. (Yes, such plans do exist.)
Most noxious is the continued sanctimony of left-wing bloggers positioning themselves as champions of the children of working-poor in their embrace of S-CHIP expansion. Notice how they say nothing about the entitlement creep that has this working-poor children’s health insurance program covering a growing number of adults.
Large numbers of these adults, also growing in number, are by no sane definition “working poor.” As Tom Blumer at BizzyBlog points out:
In California…it appears that there’s nothing stopping a trust fund baby, if their ONLY income comes from investment returns (i.e., it’s “unearned”), from qualifying for SCHIP! Paris Hilton and Nicole Ritchie could sit at home and stop boring us with their TV show, appearances, and commercials, have babies by any number of entourage members, and join in the SCHIP party. Is this a great country or what?
Seriously folks, 46 states and the District of Columbia (HT Democracy Project) do not have an asset test for SCHIP. It seems likely that they, like California, as Kesler has just shown, don’t include “unearned” income either. Such laxity in regards to assets and “unearned” income may also be present in some or all of these states’ much larger Medicaid programs.
This is nuts.
Meanwhile, RLB Cohn piles on with another complaint about us savage right-wingers. I missed his e-mail in the deluge of moonbat mail that’s currently overwhelming my inbox. He wanted to know if I had tried to contact the Frosts. Here’s your answer: The reason I went to the Frosts’ commercial property was to try and interview Halsey Frost. He wasn’t there, which is why I ended up talking to one of his two tenants, who was happy to share his views. In fact, he noted that two other media outlets had stopped by. He was happy to talk to them, too. So much for my “grilling” and “harassment” of the Frosts’ friends. Out of respect for the family, contrary to this mythic image being conjured up of me pulling a Code Pink-style stunt at their home, I did not go onto their private property uninvited. I simply drove by their house, on a public street, and reported what I saw.
Can you imagine if I had gone on their property? Knocked on their door? Or called them up?
If you’re a conservative blogger and you don’t call them, then you aren’t getting their side of the story. If you do call them, you’re guilty of harassing them.
If, on the other hand, you’re an MSM reporter who asks only softball questions and snaps photos of the couple at their doorstep, you’re a Respectable Journalist.
As I’ve said before, you can’t win with these people.
“Debate” Ezra Klein? What a perverse distraction and a laughable waste of time that would be. And that’s what they really want, isn’t it? To distract and waste time so they can foist their agenda on the country unimpeded.
Last point: Let’s take the costume off, Mr. Klein, shall we? More than a year ago, I informed Respectable Liberal Blogger Ezra Klein that he had printed false, libelous claims about my run-in with the thugs at UC Santa Cruz. He refused to retract them and continues to intentionally spread that false, libelous information–weaving it, in fact, into one of his latest diatribes:
Something has gone wrong on the Right. Become sick and twisted and tumorous and ugly. To visit Michelle Malkin’s cave is to see politics at its most savage, its most ferocious, its most rageful. They say they’ve spent the past week smearing a child and his family because that child was fair game — he and his family spoke of their experience receiving health care through the State Children’s Health Insurance Program. For this, right wingers travel to their home, insinuate that the family is engaged in large-scale fraud, make threatening phone calls to the family, interrogate the neighbors as to the family’s character and financial state.
This is the politics of hate. Screaming, sobbing, inchoate, hate. It would never, not in a million years, occur to me to drive to the home of a Republican small business owner to see if he “really” needed that tax cut. It would never, not in a million years, occur to me to call his family and demand their personal information. It would never occur to me to interrogate his neighbors. It would never occur to me to his smear his children.
The shrieking, atavistic ritual of personal destruction the right roars into every few weeks is something different than politics. It is beyond politics. It was done to Scott Beauchamp, a soldier serving in Iraq. It was done to college students from the University of California, at Santa Cruz. Currently, it is being done to a child and his family. And think of those targets: College students, soldiers, children. It can be done to absolutely anyone.
This is not politics. This is, in symbolism and emotion, a violent group ritual. It is savages tearing at the body of a captured enemy. It is the group reminding itself that the Other is always disingenuous, always evil, always lying, always pitiful and pathetic and grotesque. It is a bonding experience — the collaborative nature of these hateful orgies proves that much — in which the enemy is exposed as base and vile and then ripped apart by the community. In that way, it sustains itself, each attack preemptively justifying the next vicious assault, justifying the whole hateful edifice on which their politics rest.
It is a blessing and relief that these mobs, as of yet, do nothing more than smear, that the blood they exult in is figurative and the inflicted harm is emotional or occupational. But they are howling, braying, thirsty mobs nonetheless, and their frequent, communal savagings of chosen representatives of their enemies is ugly and unsettling. It’s impossible not to wonder when the first one will drive by a house, and then decide to ring the doorbell, and then. Indeed, it’s already come damn close.
Christy Hardin Smith, has more, as does Digby. Think Progress has the facts of the story. And it’s worth following some of the links, including the one to Malkin’s attack on college students from years past. Malkin is, last I looked, the highest traffic rightwing blogger. What she’s channeling is real, and it should repulse and worry decent people, no matter their political orientation.
Good faith, eh? What would Ezra Klein know about it?
Now, run along and thump your chest over your “victory” at BloggingHeadsTV or something.
I have to get back to work. You know, “stalking.” “Assault.” “Savagings.” “Howling. “Braying.” “Hateful orgies.”
That stuff.
***
Previous:
Democrat poster-child abuse, the nutroots’ pushback, and the continued campaign to silence the Right
Video flashback: John Kerry’s health care poster child abuse
Graeme Frost and the perils of Democrat poster child abuse Updated
See what others have said
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Michelle, I really don’t know how you do it. I don’t think I would have the resolve to keep doing, day after day, what you do. You bring so much to light about what is wrong in politics today. And you put up with more crap than probably anyone else. I couldn’t do it. I have much respect for what you do, and how you handle yourself.
Orgies?
There are ORGIES???
Why was I not informed?
Michelle, I think you should take him up on the challange. You, armed with the facts, might be able to sway some of those RINOs back to “right” side.
And, there you have it.
That is why there is no one better than Michelle Malkin!
Don’t wait for an apology, Michelle.
Um, didn’t you read the Klein diatribe I excerpted?
These people are unswayable. Facts will not sway them. Nothing will sway them.
The term “projection” comes to my mind… They see in “The Other” was is actually in themselves.
was=what
oops…
I completely agree with StephC.
Especially after seeing the video from the Chris Matthews ‘interview.’
I only wish I had half the strength to deal with such disagreeable people that you have.
MM - So it’s true that you never sleep. How much coffee does that take?
It’s all the pea flinging that really gets my goat. Who raised these miscreants?
I had a similar experience to Michelle’s regarding obtaining individual health insurance when I lived in New Jersey. My least expensive option was around $500, and that was just for me. I moved to Hawaii in 2003, and was shocked to find that I could purchase individual coverage for less than $200! Now Hawaii is as socialist as a state can get, and it requires employers to provide health insurance to all full time employees. Although I disagree with the policy, I have to believe that costs have been driven down at least partly because of this.
Ezra Klein? Never heard of him. Is a response necessary? The eagle does not do battle with the fly.
Who would debate someone who is basically sanctioning exploitation of children as spokespeople?
I don’t get why they think this has ANYTHING to do with SCHIP. But the warped thinking of liberals is always hard to follow.
If MM had said to herself “health insurance sucks, I’m going on SCHIP”, then they could have jumped up and down and rotated their heads 360 degrees. But what are they thinking here?
Well, there’s your problem. NJ is the most corrupt and expensive state in the union. And it’s run by corrupt and expensive Democrats.
The pathological dishonesty of these people never ceases to amaze me.
There was a case in the news a while back about some assistant DA in florida who was busted for soliciting sex with children.
Within a few hours, sombody from Kos had gone to city hall and paid money to find the political affilaition of the perp. (He was GOP). Their very first instinct, always and everywhere, is to see how they can turn something to their own political advantage.
Everything is political for these people. They coined the phrase “the personal is the political”, and it follows that the political is the personal.
Truth is fungible to these guys,Michelle…whereas with you it is an unalterable constant…so never get down in the mud and rassle with a pig….it only wears you out and the pig enjoys it
The ‘respectable’ Mr Klein is a typical leftist, i.e. utterly self absorbed and intoxicated with his own sanctimony. As well as a shameless drama queen. All of his rhetoric about “hateful orgies” and “howling, braying, thirsty mobs” and “savages tearing at the body of a captured enemy” directed at a nationally syndicated columnist asking legitimate questions strikes me, as a sane man, at the very least, strange.
Michelle Malkin…Queen of Troll Trouncing.
As usual, GOOD JOB!!
Klein is a whiny little weasel, isn’t he? Overly impressed with his perceived superiority of his limited intellectual abilities, he squeals his estrogen-charged message throughout the land. It is a pity, truly a pity, when facts get in the way of a perfectly smug and condescending literary lynching.
This is the guy who got beat up by the kids who had their lunch money stolen by the school bullies. A mouse in the corner, whose only possible redeeming quality in life was to assume the part of intellectual, though ill equipped to bear that cross.
The guy apparently has found a following on the left. Heck, in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king. That would be on the other side of the looking glass, where logic has no place and natural law is replaced by fantasy. Mr. Klein can only debate in his own world, where the Chesshire Cat’s disembodied grin is there to encourage him onward. Where else can a man lacking in morals, courage and character claim the absolute moral high ground in rendering judgment upon those he deems unworthy of his precious gems of wisdom and wit? No, Mr. Klein must stay on his side of the looking glass, where up is down, right is wrong, truth is fiction and socialism solves all the world’s problems.
Mr. Klein fits the definition of an oxygen thief. His sole contribution to the world is the production of carbon dioxide. Someone alert Al Gore! (By the way, which side of the looking glass is Al on these days?)
Jim M., guessing your comment felt pretty good to type out in sort of an emotional venting kind of way, but I’d rather read your thoughts regarding the substance of the issue at hand. Ad hominem attacks are always kind of lame and extremely ineffective. Switch the references from Klein to Malkin, and you comment would fit right in over at Kos.
“Debate” Ezra Klein? What a perverse distraction and a laughable waste of time that would be. And that’s what they really want, isn’t it? To distract and waste time so they can foist their agenda on the country unimpeded.
Michelle - Isn’t all this discussion about the Frosts’ personal situation a “perverse distraction and a waste of time”. We can spend hours debating whether or not the Frosts should qualify for assistance or should have been used as the poster family for the program. That said, shouldn’t the discussion be turned to the real issues, SCHIP, its validity, who should be covered, criteria for coverage, etc. Isn’t that the agenda that is being foisted on the country unimpeded, not the Frosts? So if you’re so confident in your position and the facts, why not debate him? What do you have to loose?
I never doubt myself for why I come here, but it’s so nice to be reinforced.
I believe I conveyed my thoughts on the issue at hand. The issue in this thread is Klein and his ilk and the highbrowed dishonesty that masquarades as truth in some alternative universe.
There was no “emotional venting” nor was there any ad hominem attack. There are more than sufficient examples of Klein’s tactics and vitriol here and elsewhere to allow me to reach an informed opinion on who Klein is and what he is all about. You cannot reason with people who have no ability to reason. There was no attack. It is my point of view; my conclusion after reviewing what he has written and what he trys to pass of as thought.
There is a difference between making a disparaging comment about someone out of spite, and making a comment about someone based on fact. Klein was hoist on his own petard.
Now, with respect to the issue of SCHIP, I pretty well conveyed my thoughts on that topic in the section discussing that topic. Of course, if you were truly interested, you would have seen that already, and would have not had to make the comment to mask taking me to task. If you don’t agree with me, fine. Say so. No need for the passive/aggressive ploy.
Hell, my uninsured kid can kick ass in a socialised medicine debate. Do not fall asleep Michelle.
These dishonest cretins need to be shunned and vilified, not debated. Right on, M!
About a year an a half ago I lost my job and my insurance. I had already set up an HSA, (MSA by another name), for a high deductible plan at my former job.
When they offered COBRA I nearly choked on the cost and said “No Thanks”
My wife was overseas at the time and covered by her country’s system. (She is a LEGAL immigrant) I was without insurance for about 2 months while I shopped around. By the time she came home, I had a plan for the both of us that runs about $800/quarter.
Last November I ended up in the hospital for a week. Plan covered everything but the deductible.
Hillarycare MkII scares the hell out of me. I remember the monstrosity to totalitarianism she tried to jam through last time. If she’s elected, be afraid, be very very afraid.
Fox News website has an interesting article by Sara Bonisteel: Canada’s expectant moms heading to the US to deliver. So much for socialized medicine….
That Ezra Klein guy is off his meds.
Have any of these “grow government” people ever actually been to DMV? I’m sure they think it was the perfect picture of efficiency. How about pulling a building permit. Or maybe even try to sell something to the federal government. I know these three examples are three different levels of government (state, local (and possibly more), and federal). I for the life of me can’t figure out why we would want dysfunction increased. It doesn’t matter what the intention is - failure is failure.
Concerning the costs of insurance too…our “esteemed” legislatures (both federal and state) seem to think they know what is supposed to be insured. If I wanted to buy a policy that covered only my left kidney and not my right - I’m sure there is some law against it. They have mandated coverage for all sorts of things which given my lifestyle are not things I care to cover - but since I choose to get insurance, they have decided for me that I have to get that coverage too. Costs go up, costs go up, costs go up but they can’t see why. I know - vilify the insurance company, and the doctors. Never mind the regulations that both must live under.
I wouldn’t worry too much about Mr. Klein. I also wouldn’t bother debating him. He’s only 23 years old and has never had a job other than writing his opinions. He is not an expert on, well, anything. If anyone is interested, there’s a little more background on him here.
Bless you Michelle. Sleep in this morning. As far as debating or changing the minds of the left…you can’t make a silk purse out of a sows ear.
Another example of why Michelle is one of my favorite bloggers. There is something oddly attractive about an underweight woman “savagely” kicking Klein’s fat head up his backside where it seems to do the most good.
.
I just returned from a visit the from Respected Blog of Ezra Klein and and feel I need a shower after all that spitting and bong water. The only signs of intelligent life are the the conservative responses to their Democrat talking points. Not one of them understands that we are not attacking the Frosts children or that by allowing themselves to be used by the Democrats they open themselves to scrutiny. Maybe more intelligent, well-reasoned postings from people here will shock some of these people out of their zombie like trance.
almeehan: or my favorite “you can put lipstick on a pig but it’s still a pig”
The Left is more intellectually bankrupt today than it has evern been. The blogosphere certainly provides empirical evidence of that. I’m currently in dialog (of some sort) with the “respectable” folks over at TalkToAction.
Collin
http://evangelicalperspective.blogspot.com
We can hope that is true…but observing the lack of success even in this blog in opening the eyes of those who will not see, I don’t hold out lots of hope. None is so blind as those who will not see.
Collinb:
You’re comparing today’s US left to the 1960s? To the 1930s and the Popular Front? To 1919?
How have they become more bankrupt?
I want to personally commend you, MM, for going to the source of the story, and doing a bit of careful, honest reporting.
More, I want to commend you for actually revealing what you learned for the rest of us. I was put in touch with “actual facts” I would never have had from either the puffy MSM or the (understandably but regretably) speculative blogosphere on the right.
You are the queen of what you do because of how you do it. With integrity.
Leftists simply cannot comprehend that.
derel3433…I agree with our question at one level, however at another, I’d have to agree with the statement they are more bankrupt. In general, in history, there was at least an acknowledgement of God. Now the left is openly, willfully, and collectively not only denying God, but trying to shut down those who do still acknowledge God. The left now seems to believe all rights come from man, instead of God while the right, understands “all men ….they are endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights…” The left wants to deny this truth moreso than ever
Another perfect example of the left not being able to compete with ideas that anyone in the public will accept (other than their equally nutroot followers) so they immediately attack the messenger. Only their view can be tolerated and must always be correct because it is their view.
Michelle, Rush, Hannity … the list goes on … attack, attack, attack … with never a thought that perhaps a liberal could be the one that is wrong.
They have yet to produce one valid (and therefore verifiable) response to all of the facts regarding the S-CHIP bill that President Bush vetoed.
It was vetoed because the DemoCraps are attempting to include adults and people with sufficient levels of income who should not qualify for a program whose stated purpose is assisting the poorer families in this country by providing their children with health insurance they can’t afford to provide on their own.
As usual they can not carry on a civil discussion about facts so they hide behind a grand facade of victimization of some segment of the population they claim is occurring and will get worse because of the conservative side of the country.
Isn’t it mindboggling that these people who claim we can solve the terrorist problem and all other world issues by sitting down and talking are the least capable individuals in society when it comes to having a rational discussion? A discussion in which both sides of an issue are presented and considered on their merits and perhaps a compromise can be reached.
They always have to find some “excerpt” that they can put forth out of context and never in its entirety to push their hate-filled agendas.
It has been so long since I heard a single positive word, let alone a positive thought or idea, come out of the mouth of liberals that I cringe when they start to speak. I shudder as I wonder what perverse and insane rant am I about to hear next.
Keep up the great work Michelle. You always give us the whole story and both sides of an issue so that we can better understand what is going on.
You have that right, Someone once said
“you cant win an argument with an ignorant person”
these folks qualify.
the squeaky wheel gets the grease
Translation:
In DemSpeak that means the loudest and most obnoxious is the one that gets the votes
Liberal thought is controlled by sound bites not substance …
So these woman don’t mind the government being in their uterus as long as the they are footing the bill to be there?
Hey guys how about Hillary taking a peek at your prostate?
I understand her’s is bigger than mine, anyhow…
As I recall, you did a pretty good job with Geraldo earlier this summer during the Imus thing. In fact, everyone in the room laughed when you flashed that clip of him wearing that jacket with those foot wide lapels.
As for a debate with Ezra Klein, he’s a nobody. It would be a waste of time.
The only ones performing this “ritual of personal destruction” appear to be those on Mr. Klein’s side of the aisle. Liberals feel they do not think a conservative can often be swayed by facts allowing them to recalculate their stance on an idea/issue and in most cases there will be a shift in their world view. It has happened to me more than once in my life and with many of my conservative friends. Unfortunately once the facts reach the ears of a liberal they automatically become violent and attack those that defy their world view verbally and at ever increasing intervals with physical violence. They are like hateful lemmings marching lockstep over the nearest cliff. I truly believe they are mentally deficient and unable to cope well in modern polite society.
Michelle,
Be very careful of defying “she who must not be named” don’t want you to become another victim of arkancide. LOL. Thank you again for a well researched presentation of facts of the S-CHIP issue.
Michelle,
You’re doing an awful lot of defending yourself these days.
That MUST make you feel pretty damned good! Leftists hate you…what a great honor!
Comment #6:
You beat me to it.
That rambling screed at the end of the opening piece was a classic (no, I am not a psychiatrist nor psychologist) example of projection, which is continually, if not continuously, practiced by the leftists/socialists.
They’ve been doing it as long as I can remember (since the late 60s…ah, the 60s); and, from what I’ve read, since the 30s.
Read what the Islamic radical kooks say and write today to see more projection.
God protect us….
Accept his challenge, and do it on Fox News
There are multiple issues that cause the pricing in health care. Most want to treat the symptom and not the root causes.
As others mentioned earlier part of the issue for insurance cost is the 50 state customization by the state governments.
In each state it is decided from the known catalog of ailments which are must cover items and which the insures can decline to cover.
All things else being equal once the companies have their must cover basic tier then you pick from policies based on how many of the optional issues they add in for the higher tier pricing.
After that you then deal with deductible costs to adjust premiums.
Just like car insurance.
Must cover liability and PIP but if you want theft and other stuff they are add ons with varying caps and deductibles.
Don’t expect that in government health care. Just one size fits all.
Which will then open up a parallel market of self pay care just like Medicare supplement policies.
Too much coffee Michelle?
WOW, way to uncork. Spectacular!
Hubby quit his job to be a stay at home dad? I think I love you! I always wanted to that. When you go against the grain - you just go all the way.
Klein boy could learn ummm, on second thought, no he couldn’t.
Michelle: re your comment in #5 to #3…He didn’t say sway Klein..he said sway the RINO’s. Some of the “uneducated masses” (and I often find myself there in some topics) can be still won over at best, or at least kept from swallowing the poison of the other side. We need to keep working with/on them. To do so, sometimes takes confrontation with the opposite extreme unthinking, unrational and absurd.
Although I do agree with your thought, debating with Klein to convince him is exercise in futility.
Outstanding, Michelle. And you are correct about “debating” a lefty nutcase: impossible, and any such attempt would be a waste of your time. Might as well attempt to “debate” a tape player stuck in an endless left wing talking-points loop. The machine at least will have an Off option.
I’m frightened by the polarity…
Ha! Congrats. You just got the first snort of the day out of me.
Also here is something all need to make themselves aware of.
Many know friends or relatives who have a number of medications they take long term, like for example a heart patient who has a group of 5 or 6 expensive medications they will most likely stay on for the rest of their living days.
You should make yourself aware that there are alternatives.
We had some friends who’s wife was on a heart pill package (without any insurance) that was out of pocket costing them 1230.00 per month, out of their 35K income.
So I did a little web surfing and came up with a site called NeedyMeds that pulls together all the information on the various Patient Assistance Programs run by the drug companies for those who have fallen between the cracks.
Each participant requires application to their program and have individual eligibility requirements and income caps.
Caps vary from 30 to 60K income per year.
But if you qualify you only have to coordinate with the proscribing physician to sign onto their system via the Pharmaceutical Industry Association and electronically submit a prescription to them.
All cases I have used resulted in the medications being shipped to the physicians office for pickup by the patient and come at zero cost for the patient.
For my friend we were able to cut out of pocket expense from 1230.00 per month to 29.00 per month for one drug that did not participate in the program.
One the physician has you registered in with the system, they send notice emails to the physician in time for prescription renewals so that he can schedule any tests or physical reviews to determine dosage adjustment, liver testing and such.
It really is a fine working system.
None of my posts get on this site for some reason, but here goes.
I must say I have no idea what jounalistic standard was held to by driving past their house and describing what you saw. The original point of the articles I read on the Frosts, not just here on MM, but all over the blogosphere, was that they were possibly lying about their income/means. (How could they possibly afford their school, their house, the NYT wedding announcements, etc.) What would a description of your drive past their house accomplish but offer MORE unsubstantiated speculation?
Can you explain that please? Could anyone?
I never ceases to amaze me how these types of people talk and talk and talk and still say nothing. Then when they are challenged, they call names. Last time I checked, that’s indicative of a schoolyard bully, right? Perhaps it is time to grow up!
Call me naive, because there are so many of them and I still cannot believe their lack of logic, their willingness to lie with parts of the truth, their hateful speech, their twisting and turning (writhing, should I call it?) of truth with lies to make a point that makes them feel good.
What happened to critical thinking?? Where are we headed, when such a large part of the population cannot think?
These types used to be the tiny minority that polite society tolerated for politeness-sake, fully understanding their ideas had no credibility. But now, they are making laws and influencing lawmakers. Perhaps we have all been polite for too long!
Michelle, keep up the business of fact finding and critical analysis. You are not the only one out here who can still think.
Who said it? Hitler? Tell a lie long enough and people will believe it.
sounds similar to the program that Montel Williams is a spokesperson for … such programs have been around from the manufacturers for a long time but are only recently getting widely publicized …
I will have to find it again but the drug industry also has all the same info via PHRMA the drug co. industry group.
Their site also at the time had up to date info on the requirements for each program and online applications for each program.
The NeedyMeds site pointed you to the various programs and you contacted them for applications sent via email/fax/snail mail.
As best as I can remember the PHARMA site only required that you email/fax/snail mail your last year income tax copy to each program with a cover letter referring to the application number for their program so they could link the two together.
I see from cruising the left side blogs that Hillary came out with commentary about how the vast right wing blogs are attacking the poor left chosen representative.
So we get a toofer
Vast right wing conspiracy and victim card all that’s missing is a minority to play the race card.
This from the woman who wants to have a national conversation.
If you look at Hillary and Bill’s method of campaigning, every since their earliest elections in Arkansas it has always been for the children. Every tax, rule, law, etc. that they have been for is to support the children in some manner. But somehow the money does not seem to get to where they desire.
davidcaskey
When the Clintons say that “money is the root of all evil” it actually means that the “route” of all money is through their pockets …
#58:
In order to be successful at critical thinking, one has to actually know something, in order to critically think about it.
THAT’S the problem in education today.
Ignoramuses who feel good about themselves are what is being produced by our educational “system”.
Big, big,…verrrrryy big changes/corrections in many areas are going to be necessary to fix our society and protect our culture.
Sorry…comment responding to #59.
Agree or disagree about S-CHIP, Ezra Klein is right about one thing: “the shrieking, atavistic ritual of personal destruction the right roars into every few weeks is something different than politics.”
I come to this site because I, despite my very different ideological leanings, like her writing. And she covers a lot of stories that don’t get a lot of attention.
I leave comments here because I figure no one likes an echo chamber. I am clearly wrong on this point.
Too often MM posts something and allows hateful and stupid comments to go unfiltered. Real clever stuff like calling me “cRusty” and talking about how gays will all be dead of AIDS soon. And stuff like this:
Klein is a whiny little weasel, isn’t he? Overly impressed with his perceived superiority of his limited intellectual abilities, he squeals his estrogen-charged message throughout the land. It is a pity, truly a pity, when facts get in the way of a perfectly smug and condescending literary lynching.
This is the guy who got beat up by the kids who had their lunch money stolen by the school bullies. A mouse in the corner, whose only possible redeeming quality in life was to assume the part of intellectual, though ill equipped to bear that cross.
Look! The wingnut complained about the health insurance market! Ergo, she is a HYYYYPPPPOCRITE. And stupid! And a Nazi bitch!
He fails to mention, the soldier admitted to making the whole thing up. How Conveeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeenient.
The reason they find MM so scary is because they can’t shut her up. I wonder when, they will try to invent the fairness doctrine for the Internet?
josetheguerilla said:
they have already been trying jose …
Davidcaskey
All you have to do is look at the Rules for Radicals published by Hillary’s mentor Saul Alinsky and it will all be clear as to her repeating tactics.
It’s almost like reading Mein Kampf on Hitler.
Ignore it at your peril.
Is this guy forgetting Camp Casy? Wasn’t that a bunch of left wingers driving to the home of a Republican and harassing him and his neighbors?
oops … hit submit by accident …
jose …
I was going to mention that many ISPs censors the availablity of certain websites as well as certain newsgroups as part of their policy … AOL was widely known for years to restrict access of their users in their own browser … then people discovered they could still run IE or other browsers after getting connected to get to the sites that AOL had blocked …
so censorship is already with us on the internet …
sorry for the early submit of the previous post …
Now their pulling stuff out of thin air. Someone call David Coperfield.
DesertLover. They can try to shut her up on youtube, however the internet is so vast she can take another route. I don’t understand how they allow islamic hate to post, but ban some of MM’s post.
Oh-Buenos Dias
Yes, but those are businesses. When they go to far,and censor too much people will catch on, and not use their services. The Government is trying to sensor Rush. I don’t think the Government could sensor the Internet, although China does it.
Buenos días Jose … espero que su día es bueno también
jose: I’m sorry you didn’t understand. Let me translate for you “I couldn’t find any free insurance. I mean - come on - why should I have to pay for anything. Only you silly people think that I should have to be responsible for myself.” There - now with that translation, is it clear?
I don’t get how they do not take a good long look at the problems with our insurance. For example, how illegal immigration raises our cost. Instead they want to ram socialized medicine down our throat. It takes four months for me to get an appointment at the VA. They are more interested in trying to silence those who fact check the fact checkers.
On October 11th, 2007 at 9:41 am, Rusty said: I come to this site because I, despite my very different ideological leanings, like her writing. And she covers a lot of stories that don’t get a lot of attention.
Hmph, I have heard of those thugs of UC Santa Cruz through a friend & the stories are pretty absurd. MM, thanks for the transparency & consistency & stay steadfast.
Absolutely pathetic. If Klein is the fool you make him out to be (he is not) then you should have no trouble debating him. What are you afraid of? Oh, right. FACTS.
Yes, it’s the FACTS. I fear the FACTS!
Michelle,
I think the only real solution here is for you to force down about three boxes of Twinkies so that you can save some money on your health insurance premiums.
The UC santa cruz mascot is The Banana Slug, a bright yellow, slimy, shell-less mollusk …… nuf said….
Then why not debate him? Your reasons above basically amount to “because I don’t want to.”
“Something has gone wrong on the Right. Become sick and twisted and tumorous and ugly. ”
This seems to be the left’s new meme. I’ve seen it popping up more and more often, even though there has been no noticeable change at any of the conservative ‘blogs I visit (and I’ve been visiting them for years, so I’d probably notice).
It’s the same sort of tactic as calling Petraeus a liar. It’s a simple practice of fabricating a reason to ignore all the facts an ideological foe brings to the table. If they were really interested in a debate, or hearing the truth, they’d be asking honest questions about these things. . .not labelling those who present the information as ‘hateful’ or ‘facist’.
It is getting, really, really, really hard to take these nutroots wackjobs seriously anymore.
I’d say that Ann Coulters line about her getting upset when liberals quote her out of context, but liberals getting upset when they are quoted in context, fits the bill. Respected Liberal Ezra needs to be smacked with the reality feather.
Then why not debate him? Your reasons above basically amount to “because I don’t want to.” - nikkos
She pretty much explained in the article. It wouldn’t be an intellectually honest debate. He’s already demonstrated that he’s willing to ignore anything Michelle says that doesn’t support his point. . . I wouldn’t try to debate someone like that either. What would be the point?
Both parties of guilty of this practice. Remember the “snowflake babies” trotted out a few years ago?
Either way, I think Michelle should do the debate. It would make for good TV!
Not to answer for Michelle, but, why waste the time debating someone who is simply interesting in ad hominem attacks, smears, and misrepresenting “facts.”
Nikkos - are you brain dead. Debating a tape recording is not a useful exercise.
Nikkos:
“So when did you stop beating your wife?”
Get it?
He’s mental.
sorry all - I need to keep the discourse a little more civil - but good grief.
He left this fact out….
As I read the quote of RLB Ezra Klein’s latest diatribe at the top of the thread, I would have sworn I was reading a description of Media Matters, or MoveOn.
Is he actually saying it is wrong to call a fabricator of war crimes a liar?
He is right to condemn the “shreiking, atavistic, ritual of personal destruction” but he is a little off target.
Drop - 100 Left - 180.
MM I live by 2 saying the authors are unknow by me. they are; “Never get into an arguement with an idiot because he will beat you to death with experience.” and “Against logic there is no armor like IGNORANCE.”.
MM. My first comment ever. Thanks for what you say and how you say it. I think you should debate Klein at any college with a fair moderator. He would run out of facts in about 5 minutes. But in the end it will come down to differing opinions. Liberals WANT to spend their money helping more people and they think everyone else should too. Facts come in second to feelings.
Stay on the high road.
I think MM would do a debate with anybody, who honestly wanted to get to the root of problems that plague our insurance problems. They are not interested in that. They want smear her. Just ask Rush.
Bravo Nikkos. Michelle, if he is so intellectually inferior and you have the FACTS, why not debate him. Wouldn’t it further your cause if you showed him to be lying, pea flinger you make him out to be? It’s easy to hide behind words and hurl insults at your opponents if you never have to engage them in direct confrontation. I for one would welcome an intelligent (KEY WORD INTELLIGENT) debate by opinion makers on this subject.
Thanks les, your comment is appreciated!
Hahahahaha!
Oh man that link did my heart some good!
and
Ha. Have fun defending that, echo chamber.
les - let me explain this with small words to make sure you understand. The facts have already been exposed and they have been ignored. That makes the people who ignore them ignorant. You suggest having an intelligent debate. Can you have an intelligent debate with an ignorant person? If you continue to ignore the facts, may we call you ignorant?
Rusty: I’m a little unclear on your logic. Please explain medical savings account again - government subsidized? So you think allowing something pre-tax is the same as subsidizing it? Guess your 401k account is also gov’t subsidized too then.