The GOP race in Florida
Check out the latest Rasmussen numbers for the GOP race in Florida. Romney’s got a slight lead, McCain and Giuliani are neck and neck, Huck’s plummeting, and Fred’s gotta figure out what to do with his 12 percent. Note that a significant chunk of The Maverick’s supporters are wavering:
The latest Rasmussen Reports telephone survey finds Mitt Romney with a slight lead in Florida’s Republican Presidential Primary. John McCain and Rudy Giuliani are close behind in what may develop into a three-man race. It’s Romney at 25%, McCain at 20%, and Giuliani at 19%. Romney has picked up seven points over the past week while McCain and Giuliani each inched up a point.
Last week, before the Michigan and South Carolina Primaries, Rasmussen Reports polling found essentially a four-way tie for the lead in Florida. However, Mike Huckabee has slipped to 13% in the current poll. A week ago, he was the top choice for 17%.
One major wild card in the race may be Fred Thompson. The former Senator from Tennessee is considering dropping out of the race after a disappointing showing in South Carolina last Saturday. Twelve percent (12%) of Florida’s Likely Republican Primary Voters still support the actor turned politician.
Even though early voting has already begun, the race remains incredibly fluid. Just 54% of likely voters say they are “certain” of how they will vote. Six percent (6%) have not yet made up their mind and 12% say there’s a good chance they could change their mind.
Giuliani and Huckabee have the most solid support at this time. Sixty-seven percent (67%) of Giuliani’s supporters are “certain” they will vote for him along with 65% of those who favor Huckabee. For Romney, just 55% are that certain. For McCain, just 48% are that certain. In fact, 22% of McCain’s supporters still say there’s a good chance they could change their mind.
A Politico writer asks: “Could Huckabee be angling for the No. 2 spot on McCain’s ticket, or a Cabinet position in a McCain administration?”
Duh.
Meanwhile, a Fred decision is expected tomorrow.
What if he throws his support to his good friend McCain?
See what others have said
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If Fred gets out, most of the good conservative Fredheads will most decidedly not vote for the liberals Huckabee or McAmnesty. Most of what I have seen shows the bulk of them would vote for Romney. That holds even if Fred endorses McCain from what I have seen. That would mean another 5-15 points for Romney in every state he’s in including Florida where he already has a 5 point lead. People should go out and vote for the most viable conservative running. Vote Mitt!
if fred is the true conservative his followers claim he is then he wouldn’t throw his support to mcpain. it will be quite telling if he does. a true conservative would not through support to that dem in a repub suit.
hopefully, those that support fred will make up their own minds as to who they will support.
My 2 cents here in Florida:I am voting for Romney in the primary. A month ago, before the debates, I would have said Thompson—but I don’t want to vote for him if he can’t win this. A year ago,I would have said Giuliani.Am not considering Huckabee.
I would never, ever vote for McCain in the primary. However, if he somehow becomes the GOP nominee against the Democrats, I may have to hold my nose to vote against Hillary or Obama. I am hoping people will start remembering his vote for amnesty last summer and fall. It surprises me that McCain is still in the running at all. There appears to be a lot of amnesia, or there are uninformed people out there voting for him.
The debates made me change my mind about Romney. He looked good and would do well against any Democrat–so would Thompson (and I am hoping for a VP slot for him).
Since the MSM wants either McCain or Huckabee, I am going for Romney.
The idea that Rudy is holding his own in Florida goes to show you how liberal Florida is becoming.
.oO WWCD (What Would Chad Do)
I don’t think Fred will endorse McCain, I base that on a comment he made on Fox, that he had sat next to McCain in the Senate and yes they had developed a friendship but he and McCain did’nt see eye to eye on very many issue’s. I hope he does’nt drop out but I guess we will see what he’s going to do soon.
Fred, It’s time to jump ship and throw your support behind Mitt. That’s the best you can do for the Republican party. Help defeat the Rinos Mccant and Julie Annie.
For quite awhile I have been amused at the polls (or poles as Big Media spells it) Gov Romny has been consentently secound while the others soared and plummetted. He keeps getting delegates.
As too Sen Thompson, yeah if he c
backs MacAss that will be his colors.
Now all Gov romney has to do is select Duncan Hunter as VP and we win.
I will vote for Sen Clinton if MacAss is nominated, after all 4 of her is better then 8 of him…
I’m sorry to see Fred doing so poorly. While I would welcome him on the ticket as VP he was never my first choice for Pres. I still support Romney as being the best choice for our party with McCain a distant third. The Huckster is last on my list.
With all due respect, Lindsay, an election isn’t a horse race where you are trying to guess the winner in order to win.
One of the biggest things wrong with the election cycle is 24 hour news coverage full of analysts trying to guess the winner. When you step into the voting booth, you have one chance to choose the person you think will serve the country best. Don’t throw your vote away on somebody else’s opinion.
aj, having a conniption fit in 5…4…3…
I too hope that Fred will stay in the race, at least until Super Tuesday. Even though his chances of getting the nomination are very slim, he can still serve his country by taking votes away from the Huckster.
I also don’t see Fred endorsing McCain, when I looked at Fred’s web page last week there was a link to Michelle’s poll showing the prefered pairings. With the two highest Fred/Mitt & Mitt/Fred
My guess is that a lot of the support for McCain was coming from those who didn’t like/trust Huckabee and felt that McCain was more electable.
A lot of Catholics I know were leaning towards McCain after Huckabee won Iowa, but now might be switching to Romney.
Mitt Romney is a far better choice for conservatives than liberals McCain or Huckabee.
The question is/was:
My answer is buh-bye big elephant party. This would reek of the good ol’ cronyism that gave us Bob Dole’s “run” for the White House.
You won’t find a smaller ‘c’ conservative than me. But like serfer62 (#7), I too will stump for a Dem if McCain gets the nod.
If only to watch the pendulum swing.
If you want the most conservative candidate running to get the nominee this is actually a very good strategy. See who the media likes, and vote the opposite. Go Romney!
30 – LOL
AJ has succumbed to the inevitable – Thompson dropping out. AJ drowning his sorrows in a thick porterhouse in 5…4…3…
Look, I know you guys are hoping against hope that McCain will not win the nomination. But Florida is a place I expect a 72 year old to do well – you know the place known for it’s population of older and retired people who think 72 is young.
McCain isn’t great, but absent another conservative who knows how to run a national campaign, he’s really not any worse than the other candidates.
Most people here hate him for amnesty. I hate to break it to you all but the last president was more for amnesty than McCain was or any of the current front runners and it didn’t get passed.
McCain at least recognizes that DC needs to CUT SPENDING. That alone is more than any democrat would do to help America. McCain was for a border fence which was in the bill. I disagree with his comment that a fine means it isn’t amnesty, but he seems to honestly believe that a fine is amnesty.
Rather than throwing him under the bus, explain to him that granting amnesty to illegals means more DC spending more of Americans’ money through entitlement programs without AMERCIAN’s consent. It isn’t about them, it’s about taxpayers and the burden that new citizens place on the entitlement programs (DC spending our money).
It might not be McCain. But regardless of what a poll might say, for the remainder of the primaries, McCain is going to get at least 25 – 30% of the votes. To beat him another candidate is going to have to get at least that much consistently and there aren’t any candidates that will do that.
There is a 90% probability at this point that the nominee is going to be McCain. I am a realist. I hope that you people can get to the acceptance part of this process before you all go into heart attack or seizures because your guy (who can’t possibly be that great anyway) doesn’t get the R nomination.
The primary in Florida will be the first where only Republicans can vote. It should give a better picture of the party’s preference.
I wouldn’t be so sure about Fred dropping out. His supporters have logged over 3000 posts on his website urging him to stay in. Many are continuing to donate and there is a flood of donations just waiting for word from Fred.
The two guys who beat Fred in SC are both questionable as far as long term staying power. Huckabee has failed to attract a wide following outside his evangelical base. And I’ve heard from many religious people who say they won’t vote for him.
McCain is tainted by amnesty for illegal aliens. It has been pointed out many times that his wins came largely from independants and crossover democrats in open primary. He may not fare so well in strictly Republican primaries.
It remains to be seen whether Guiliani’s strategy will succeed. If he fails to do well in Florida, he may fall out of the picture as well.
While Fred’s showing in SC was not as good as he hoped, he has been gaining ground. It is quite possible that a bit of perseverance could reward him handsomely.
Nah, just throw him {McC] under a bus.
If McCain ends up on top, I predict a landslide victory for the democraps come the big vote, as sad as that is.
Endorsement Smendorsement! Who really cares about an endorsement as if this overrides any individual’s free will??
I’ve never really understood this phenomenon except for that it pays homage to the tendency for humans to be part of a group. Consider Fred-heads, Rudy’s patooties and the McCain raging rinos, everybody holds dear their favorites.
Personally, I think the endorsement game is just that: a game. People will still hold their favorites near and dear and won’t be swayed. Even as the field changes and certain players drop out, does this really change the sentiments of their followers? I think not. Of course, practical considerations come to bear and they must then figure out who they should support…a poor substitute no doubt.
I see each caucus as an individual contest. I don’t see this as a process either for winnowing the field to the ultimate choice. Right now it’s about getting the message out and trying to overcome and battle the media’ fog. To the extent the players have bought into the media template they will live or die by their choices. For those who communicate their ideas through real people, person to person and fueled by passion, their messages will be heard and resonate more vividly than any silly endorsement.
McCain is willing to DESTROY the U.S. through supporting amnesty for illegals. This alone should have every man, woman, and child getting out to stop him from getting the monination. He voted to raise taxes over 50!!! times. He attacked the First Amendment with McCain-Feingold. I could go on and on and on. McCain is a disgrace to this country (and before any McCain supporters get all pissy, I am a veteran as well who served in OIF I and III).
On January 21st, 2008 at 12:43 pm, Marshall Russ said:
The primary in Florida will be the first where only Republicans can vote. It should give a better picture of the party’s preference.
THANK YOU!
Nothing thus far matters much… Super Tuesday matters.
I don’t support McCain or believe he’s a conservative either but it will be a cold day in hell before I’d vote for a Democrat over a Republican in a presidential race. We can reach a Republican who’s in office but will be drowned out if its a Democrat. Folks on this site need to gird their loins for battle, cough up a few bucks off the gold card to their preferred RNC candidate and as Michelle says: Suck. It. Up.
Just because I said that McCain will win doesn’t mean that I support McCain. The thing that I don’t like about him is his work on the Tobacco lawsuit in the 90’s. He spearheaded that and basically made a windfall for the lawyers and left the states hung out to dry.
There are many things I dislike about McCain. Like Clinton getting elected (one president, one senate). . . recognizing that it’s over doesn’t mean it’s support.
Get used to it. Choose either McCain or Clinton – or vote for a third party. But those two are about 90% probability going to be the R and D presidential nominee. . .
And our Republic is strong enough to overcome any idiot in Washington anyway. America is not great because of its government or the people involved in the government. America is great because of the people who pay taxes. I wish people who get all caught up in this crap would understand this.
Just food for thought. . . does anyone on this blog know who the president was in 1908 – WITHOUT GOOGLING.
I’d bet 98% don’t know. So with that in mind, the importance (or lack of importance) of the president should come into a bit more focus.
If we survived Bill Clinton, then it is obvious to me that the president really isn’t that important to the prosperity of America. I just want them to stop spending my money – McCain at least says he’ll do that.
Given the above information, should not Fred ease up, plenty of time and distance to out run the rabbits (you might want to check the facts of this parable). And what if Fred withdraws and supports McCain? Perhaps no surprise here. Once a lobbyist always a lobbyist (and a trophy wife to boot).
Hey Soap,
Good one!
He’ll just tax the he!! out of us first. He hates tax cuts and loves tax increases. And how do we know he won’t “deal” with Dems regarding who to appoint for judicial nominations. McCain is a disaster!
Dear Backwoods Conservative,
Thanks for your comment, but I am voting for Romney because I think he would be the best candidate to win for the GOP in November—and I like what he says.
He says all the right things against radical Islam, which is the number one reason for me to support a candidate. NumbersUSA grades Romney above Huckabee,McCain and Giuliani (and below Hunter and Thompson). That is a pretty good endorsement for my #2 issue, which is illegal immigration.
So I have thought this through and will vote with these things in mind—not just voting for the winner of the primaries but the winner in November.
So far, I have been very impressed with Romney after watching the debates: his demeanor, what he says, and his intelligence regarding the economy. Sure, he is viewed as a business man, or a slick candidate. That said,all politicians say what we want them to hear. If I thought Thompson had a chance I would throw my vote to him—but I don’t think he has a chance and I want to see McCain defeated. If Thompson gives his support to McCain I will lose all respect for Thompson.
This is not a horse race to me, as the November election is the future of our country. I believe that my children, and future grand children’s lives depend on not having Hillary or Obama in the White House. If I have a few issues with a single GOP candidate those issues pale to how I feel about the Democrats and what their leadership would bring to our nation.
I believe what we understand is that conservatism has been under attack by the creep of liberalism since 1908. We can ill afford to have another liberal in the W.H. for one minute!
As I have stated before neither we,our family or friends will vote for McCain.He and Clinton share the same views on giving our country away to Mexico!!They support the same type of illegal alien amnesty plans.I realize 50 or 60 votes here or there won’t matter but oh well.We’ll sit out.
How many delegates are up for grabs in Florida????
Total 114 but, 57 now because Florida moved up the primary and got penalized by the Party.
As you wish, Lindsay. As long as you are making you own decision without being overly influenced by the media, I’ll respect whatever choice you make.
For my part, I think Fred is the only true, consistent conservative. I’m not convinced Romney is as conservative as he makes himself out to be, and the others don’t even come close. I voted in SC for who I think would be the best president, and that is Fred.
Raging Republican
Florida has 57 delegates …
Here is a link that gives state by state numbers …
GOP Delegates by State
There are 1081 delegates available on Super Tuesday …
I’m with Lindsay, I already mailed in my vote for Romney. He was not my first choice, that would be Gingrich, but he’s out, unless some miracle happens at the convention.
Backwoods, I usually vote the opposite of what the mainstream media tells me to do! If anything influenced me, it was the GOP debates. I thought Fred did well in the last one (and I like the guy a lot).
Romney has stood out to me as a man who could be president—and the man to defeat the Democrats when it counts.
Unlike others, I won’t stay home and waste my vote in November, no matter who is the GOP candidate—I will vote. However,I would like to vote for someone I like, so am hoping McCain is defeated.
Before any name calling starts, the things I write below be the same no matter who I was backing. For me, and many “Fredheads”, it has been about the MESSAGE not the messenger. Unfortunately it looks like we backed a messenger who didnt know how to run well.
Im a confirmed Fredhead. Back to March of 2007. And there is no way on this earth I’d vote for McCain unless he has some sort of miraculous, Deus Ex Machina conversion on immigration, the border, global warming, political speech, the Bush tax cuts, interrogation techniques & GITMO, repudiates the Gang of 14 deal that set us back on judges nearly irreparably, etc.
In short, other than beating McCain into submission on evey key conservative issue in exchange for his backing, there is no way Fred can convince me to vote McCain. NONE. ZIP. ZERO. NADA.
If it comes to that, I will consider that to be the final act in the GOP’s Country Club Repub betrayal of us Sam’s Club Republicans. The stench of Stevens/Lott/Bush and “Big Government” “Open Borders, and the Lindsay Graham-ish idiocy of non-conservative Republicans will have at last destroyed my part of the GOP.
So I refuse to give further time or treasure to the GOP if they cannot and do not reflect my core conservative values. About the best the GOP can hope for from me and many Fredheads is that I hold my nose and pull the lever for Romney.
McCain and Huckabee are non-starters, and will have me refusing to give my vote to someone I beleive will harm the country. be it them or Hillary or Obama, or Ron Paul.
None of the Above, please.
Record trumps promises every time.
Romney and McCain both have records that would make democrats proud.
I guess all that matters these days is superficial debate apprearances and superficial advertising bombardment.
The GOP doesn’t even realize how screwed we are.
Ya know what’s scary? I have had a half dozen people ask me who is a good candidate to vote for. They don’t know who is Dem or Rep. let alone what they stand for. Someone actually thought Obama was a Republican. People who know nothing about any of the candidates have no business voting. I think a mass email to everyone in your address book (supporting Fred Thompson of course) is in order. Chances are good they’ll vote for him. JMO
ThackerAgency, Howard Taft. And, I didn’t need to google it. Taft really didn’t want the Presidency anyway. He wanted to be a Supreme Court Justice, which he eventually got. We’ve had bad Presidents, and some worse than Taft. No excuse to have another bad one. In this day and age, we need a real good leader. The world is on edge right now and could “topple over”. A President who can’t “hold his own” in the international diplomacy area could doom this country. The heck with domestic issues.
Personally, I think that any of the top 5 candidates, at this juncture, would be an absolute idiot to fold and go home. Even if they have no money.
At this point, it appears that the kingmaker option may be viable. If a brokered convention happens, those still in the game will have far more chips to play than those out.
Not that bad 30pcs’ but I will be disappointed, I still have my absentee ballot for Feb. not filled in yet. I hope Fred stays in and fights his way up to the top, sheesh if HuckFinnished can do it he can. It’s sad he isnt getting the support from more voters, clearly IMHO he is the right man for the job. If he does duck out a Romney/Thompson ticket will work for me.
Fred Thompson came in third for three reasons. Media, fickle voters and cross voting.
Media first. The MSM is choosing who they want Hillary to run against. They know she cannot beat a strong conservative. They are also of the belief that Americans want a moderate or liberal (basically the same thing) in the White House.
On the conservative side, conservative pundits also do not want a true conservative in the White House. Their almost total lack of support indicates they also prefer a liberal president. Taken as a snapshot, one has to think that a true conservative would offer less to complain about, less stories/issues to write about, etc.. in other words, less money and recognition. Like everything else, it comes down to what gets them fame and fortune, not what is best for the U.S. and the people.
Fickle voters. If I hear, or read, about one more voter stating ‘I wanted to vote for Fred, but I didn’t think he could win. Well, obviously not if you don’t vote for him.. arrgggghh.
I tend to think of voters like responders in women’s magazines. Many of them detail the perfect man, hosest, caring, hard working, sense of humor, etc… but, with some, not all, let a guy walk into the room that cannot see anything but himself in the mirror and suddenly they go brain dead. Throw themselves at his feet, hand over checkbook, integrity, morals and dignity. He is everything opposite of what indicate they want, he will use and abuse them, but they will worship him none the less. And no, I am not picking on women. Men do it too, they are just a bit more honest about it and in many cases have even less brain function once their hormones kick in.
This is the way I look at fickle voters. Ask the majority what they want a candidate to do, then look at what they vote for. Maybe fickle is not the right word, but you get my meaning.
Cross voting. As we seen in MI, democrats can and do effect the outcome in situations where anyone can vote. I imagine snowbirds will have their usual affect on FL results, seeing as no one has bothered to prevent them from voting twice. While there are laws intended to punish people for doing so, like immigration, few seem interested in enforcing them.
I sincerely hope Fred Thompson stays in the race. Regardless of his impact on other candidates, he has a message that needs to be heard. If he should leave the race, the conservative voice leaves with him. All we will hear is liberal noise and change, change, change double speak.
If we should survive four to eight years of liberals run amok, will what we have left be worth the effort.
We need to pay attention, fight for what we want, not accept what is being forced upon us. You may be liberal, conservative, or somewhere in between, but everyone suffers if we make the wrong choice.
Go Fred.
GreySheepdog #41, so true. I know a number of people voting for Queen Witch and none of them can tell you where she stands on the issue.
Idiots: “I think she’ll do a great job”.
Me: “Based on what?”
Idiots: “Well she was there before”.
Me: “Doing What?”
Idiots: “Well Bill was a good President”
Me: Shakes head; walks off in disgust.
graysonret
Sorry … Taft was elected in 1908 … Inaugurated in 1909 … Teddy Roosevelt was still President in 1908 …
Rush Limbaugh is saying what he thinks about the upcoming primary and candidates. It is obvious he cannot stand McCain nor Huck. I second that.
I am not a fickle voter nor a superficial one. It is too bad that people on this blog cannot say who they are voting for without others being critical of the choice of candidate and acting like a pre-schooler whose toys were taken (am not talking about you, Backwoods, as you have class and are polite in your disagreement and state why). I was not up for a debate, just sayin’ how who I will vote for in the primary.
The fact that Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter and Katheryn Jean Lopez of National Review like Romney says that I am not too “out there.” Rush is not endorsing Romney, but I have not heard him say negative things about him, either. I don’t listen to Rush every day so I could be wrong.
So don’t paint people with such a wide brush, no matter who they are voting for in the primaries. Last time I checked it is a free country to vote accordingly. I like the sound of a Romney/Thompson ticket.
The battle for conservatism will be in the courts in this next term.
Two maybe three, SCOTUS justices will come up for nomination. If any more liberals are put on the court I don’t think it takes to much imagination to know what would happen. Right now there are two hundred vacant Fed. Dist. seats.
Most of the SCOTUS justices are pulled from the Fed Dist. bench. If a liberal President doesn’t have to worry about the “gang of fourteen” to make appointments the courts will swing liberal for the next 30 years. If you are worried about conservative causes this should be your biggest concern.
ordinary coloradan
Did you make that up yourself? I like it!
I’m one of those “undecided” voters in FL. I happen to like Fred and believe he’s a conservative, but I guess I need to see what he’s going to do tomorrow. We have the 3 top Repubs in town today, so I’ll also look forward to what else is said.
I cannot believe anyone, especially a conservative, would actually vote for Hillary/Obama if McCain gets the nomination.
marshall russ #49
I agree with you. I think people are forgetting about the SCOTUS. I hope everyone is putting as much effort in to their choice for President as many of us are.
Hey navywife, I am with you—that Republicans would vote for a Democrat with all that is at stake! November is a long way off, so maybe they will come around. Let’s just hope and pray that the nominee is not McCain!
I have issues with each candidate, but not enough to help Hillary assume the throne. I’ll do what I can to support our nominee, but I’ll be honest about it. I think to pretend that we agree on every single issue with any candidate is a little crazy.
Also, I think what they’ve done to Florida regarding our delegates is so ignorant. Our state is the first state where Dems vote for Dems and Republicans vote for Republicans and therefore will give us a better indication of the candidates each party really supports.
If Fred does drop, he should consolidate with Mitt, quickly. That is before Rudy gets traction. This would also speed up Huck’s tailspin and change some key primaries that would favor Sen. McCain.
I still hope he can get a late bounce, but if not, he has to do what’s best for party.
The morons at the RNC, in their infinite wisdom, has taken away half of Florida’s delegates for the convention just because the state changed its primary voting day. Now, instead of having a huge impact on the nominee, we’ll have about the same impact as many other states.
If Fred drops out and backs McCain, I will be disillusioned. There’s no other candidate to back except Romney if he’s really a conservative. Otherwise, he would have sold out. I see no reason for Fred to drop out (if necessary) until after Florida and Super Tuesday.
DesertLover…:). True. I think he was referring to Taft. Anyway, we certainly could use a Teddy Roosevelt today. “Walk softly and carry a big stick”.
# 46 I had a similar experience last night at dinner with a friend, who professed support for the “Queen Witch” as you call it (her):
Idiot: I think I’m voting for Hillary.
mngirl: Why? Haven’t I taught you better than that?
Idiot: (laughs) I think she’s the best candidate. But can I just tell you what I am really torqued (sp?) off about ?
mngirl: What?
Idiot: All these whining, snivelling people complaining about their mortgages! It drives me nuts, like they didn’t read what their paperwork said? I had to suck it up with two mortgages until I sold my old house, do you see me complaining?!
mngirl: (spews a really nice red wine back into her glass) You just made your own case for not voting for Hillary. Let me tell you about Hillary and everything she supports……..
I won. One village idiot no longer voting for the Queen Witch. You gotta take’em down one at a time.
way to go mngirl! We all need to do our part to educate the uneducated voter.
greysheepdog#41-Something even scarier,some of the liberals want the POTUS to be elected by popular vote.They don’t even realize that the President doesn’t represent the people,he represents the United Ststes.
graysonret
you got that right!!!
This Floridian thinks Huck as McAmnesty’s Veep is a lo-o-o-ong shot — My money’s on Sen. Grahamnesty for VP. Two of a kind and joined at the hip. The Manchurian Candidate and his lap dummy.
Meanwhile, Rudy was here last Friday – Romney here today. Central Floridians are getting an up close look at the men who would be president.
Rudy Pictures already posted. Romney pics coming up on the Radio Patriot.
Andrea
***NEWSFLASH***
Duncan Hunter on Fox (Cavuto) withholds his 1% in the polls support from Romney. Says Romney’s company Bain working with the Chinese is a deal breaker for him. I still support Romney. He’ll just have to get by without a DH endorsement.
Here’s a good running mate for Huckabee–another Evangelical preacher:
I, too, have had similar conservsations about the Hill-Monster for President, and counter effusive enthusiasm with the dampening that can only come from that most sobering of questions: “What has she done?”
Usual responses such as “she was vice President” and “She knows all the heads of state(?!?!” are common but noone can answer that question. They make their stand on spoken ideology, not proven accomplishment.
Unfortunately, I see very much the same thing coming from the majority of Republicans!
When someone says, “Mitt is against illegal immigration” or “McCain will cut spending” I say, okay, but what have they done?! What can you catagorically point to manifestly and say “my candidate did that“? With McCain it’s easy, the few things he can say he specifically did are generally simply terrible from a conservative point-of-view.
I’ve often said that Rudy Giuliani has an enormous record of conservative accomplishment (which often seems at odds with his moderate rhetoric, a habit probably learned from so many years of campaigning in NYC):In the 3rd largest economy in the US (bigger than Mitt’s or Huckabees) lowered taxes while taking a budget deficit and turning it into a surplus and vastly improving the quality of life for the population. Enormous, magnificent! Beat back organized crime. Damn couragious, ’cause those Soprano types are real and they actually do kill people (I’m from NJ, I know!). Fought the MSM tooth and nail to clean up a city and 42nd street/Times Square. That area, once a slum, is a perfect illustration of his legacy: the place is a successful, sprawling wonderland of familyfriendly eye candy, and it was his idea to do it (I remember the press mocking him – as though he was a fool – when he announced his intentions to do it).
So to those who say, “what has Hillary done” I’ll be frank: what has your candidate done? Mine’s done, manifestly, alot to the point of practical miracles. This isn’t a rhetorical question, let’s get a discussion going. Be honest. Be intellectually truthful to yourself. What has your candidate actually accomplished?
Keep it polite but let’s do what conservatives do best: let’s discuss the facts, not the BS.
Jump in. Have at it. Let’s go, and let’s put the facts on the table, before it’s too late to realize that there’s a difference between day-dreamy wishful thinking based on happy rhetoric and real-life proven leadership and accomplishment.
Mr_Conservative_Cat,#64
He defeated a popular incumbent liberal mayor.
Uh-oh, wasn’t Christmas, 1908 the year Taft sent John Kerry on a secret mssion to Cuba?
Just kidding guys, I would have had to Google it.
That’s a great, relevent point, Marshall! Very significant considering which two of the dems are likely to be the opposition.
You know, Marshall, every single time I’ve put this question up for discussion – every single time(!), as relevent a question as one could ever ask on the subject of political elections – it proves to be a virtual thread killer. The discussion simply dries up. This is significant fodder for sociologists. I’ve never really seen anything like it:
“Hey everyone, let’s drop the political posturing and talk about what our respective chosen candidates have actually accomplished!”
“Hey, did you hear me? Let’s talk about the candidates accomplishments!”
“Hello?!”
*Crickets*
*More crickets*
It’s beginning to look pretty sad, really. Maybe very sad. Perhaps even scarey.
Mitt, Fred, or Mitt/Fred or Fred/Mitt are the only possible ways to veto Shamnesty ‘09.
Any other combination, Republican or Democrat, will guarantee instant residency for up to 30 million law-breakers. And encourage the next 30 million to cross our border in the next decade to replace them, since they would then ‘legal’ and get minimum wage, etc.
Pray for our nation. And hope that 46 more states enact laws that are working in 4 states right now, before 2009.
If Fred endorses, he shoudl esact a price – and it should be Romney.
Mr_C_Cat,#67, I get the same thing when I ask which candidate could win any state north of the Mason/Dixon line?
I like D. Hunter, I like Fred, I like Mitt, Huckabee makes me nervous and McCain even more so. Having said that, I would never think of not voting or voting for the Democratic nominees. We need a winner and I don’t see anybody that take some of the big states other than Rudy.
Well, that’s nice and dogmatic and mostly negative. I’m assuming that Mitt and Fred are your chosen candidates, baturally. So, keep it straight up, Fred, fill in the following blanks with manifest, tangible executive leadership accomplishments of either candidate which is relevent to the Presidency. If Mitt and Fred are lying to you, you’re left ith absolutely nothing, 5676, and so is everyone else, so you better be damn sure of what they can actually do before you vote for them.
So Fred 5676, you took the trouble to post what you did as you do so often, so post to this:
Name 5 manifest accomplishments of executive leadership, things you can point to, not just “supported this” and “voted for that”. It’s a challenge, Fred 5676, and I dare you. Fill in the blanks:
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
Marshall, I like Mitt and Hunter, but 2nd choices behind Rudy because proven ability counts before absoutely aything else. It’s crunch time, Marshall, and get the question out:
WHAT HAS YOUR CHOSEN CANDIDATE DONE MANIFESTLY THAT IS A MORE PRODUCTIVE RECORD THAN RUDY’S.
Keep repeating it, marshall. It isn’t too late to try to shake the sawdust out of the heads of all the self-destructive daydream idealists in the Republican party.
Mr_C_Cat, Another thing to consider is what the Clintons will do to the Republican candidate. I am assuming that Hillary will be the candidate. I am also assuming McCain won’t be the Repub. candidate because of his treatment of the base over and over again. If it’s Mitt they will hammer his Mormonism mercilessly and he will be on the defensive continually. I think he would be a great president but, he is vulnerable. Rudy will make life miserable for the Clintons in NY, NJ and Conn. And if he picks a running mate that can help deliver the south and mid-west it would be good. He’s a very good debater and can articulate his position well. He has a great record and can defend it. What it comes down to is that we need someone that can win.
I wish everyone here and elsewhere could find it in themselves to be as pragmatic as you are. I’ve read so much conservative idealism, holy-than-thou posturing and hissy-fit perfectionism from the Grand Old Party “faithful” that I’m ready to lose my mind.
And I really do think that a level of unreality and imagination have taken hold of both parties this year. The Dems believe that junior senators can be trotted out and made to look like experienced world leaders, and conservative faithful think that by sending “messages” like not voting unless a perfect Reaganesque candidate can be made the nominee that somehow one of these Dem junior senators won’t become the most powerful person on the face of the earth.
If Rome could fall, then so can we. And it won;t be because this election’s Republican candidate wasn’t “conservative” enough – it’ll be because there is an apparent growing disconnect between fantasy and reality in many people’s minds, and somehow the reality of what’s going on doesn’t seem to be catching hold.
Speaking of Reality, I wonder if anyone will take it upon themselves to answer the simple question posed:
CITE YOUR PREFERRED CANDIDATES RECORD OF MANIFEST, TANGIBLE ACCOMPLISHMENT IN AN EXECUTIVE LEADERSHIP ROLE AND COMPARE THAT RUDY GIULIANI’S RECORD.
But I don;t think anyone will. The comfy, cozy daydream of conservative – and unelectible – perfectionism is like an addicition, and they’re too selfish to break the habit even for their kids and grandkids. They’d rather live in the dream. But I’m still hoping that out of 150,000 page hits a day on this site, just one person will address the qualifications of their candidate as posed in the question. Just one, so some of us can have some hope that at least one person may be thinking.
I am thinking! Unfortunately my thinking runs along the lines that all has been decided and the rest of the debates are just theatre. Since my primary doesn’t happen until April, I have nothing to say about it. It will be Clinton and McCain so that the completion of our sellout can be achieved.Duncan Hunter’s non campaign was proof of the end. Before the campaigns he was everywhere talking about the border agents and the fence. Then suddenly he was nowhere. His own website was not updated. As the candidates drop out it will be more evident that we have nothing to say about it.
People on here are much more informed than the average voter. Many people seem to make up their mind at the last minute based on the last debate or the last time they listened to a candidate. That is really stupid. I can’t understand how any real Republican could vote for Guliani or McCain. They both could fit in quite well as moderate Democrats. Right now there is only one choice for Republicans. Go Mitt !
While Rasmussen may give McCain haters some solace (Romney +5), the majority of polls have McCain ahead (RealClear – Politics average McCain +3.3; SurveyUSA -McCain +5; Research 2000 – McCain +4; Strategic Vision – McCain +7; Quinnipiac -McCain +2). He is also the ONLY Republican candidate who beats both Clinton (+4) and Obama (+1.3) in a head-to-head.
Keep your eye on the prize. In politics there are winners and losers. If you don’t back the winner, you have backed the loser. If the thought of either democrap in charge doesn’t cause you to back the Republican (whomever it is), then continue living in the state of utopia, because you won’t like it in the real world. While the President and the Congress can stalemate each other, the courts can and will impact our lives in more ways than you can imagine. The right side of the court is well positioned with Roberts (age 52), Thomas (age 59), Alito (age 57) and Scalia (age 72). The left and “center” are weak with Stevens (age 87), Ginsburg age (74), Souter (age 68), Breyer (age 69) and Kennedy (age 71). Do you want Hillary or Obama choosing who to appoint when the lefties start to leave?
CharlieT…we’re still talking about who to vote for in the primary….who would be the best candidate to take on Hillary or Obama….who would best ignite the Republican base.
CharlieT,#77 I’m not to sure McCain would appoint,if elected, any less liberal justice to the SCOTUS.And if a conservative justice comes up for replacement it would be a disaster.
AuntieEm,
Then prove you’re thinking, please. A nice, general, negative response, but not to the question posed. So you and Dan and Charlie and anyone who answered after my post I absolutely dare you to answer the question and prove you’re making up your minds according to thoughtful fact and not dull impression:
CITE YOUR PREFERRED CANDIDATES RECORD OF MANIFEST, TANGIBLE ACCOMPLISHMENT IN AN EXECUTIVE LEADERSHIP ROLE AND COMPARE THAT RUDY GIULIANI’S RECORD.
Stop running away from reality and just do it, please. If you have your facts together it should be easy, and it’s good practice in defending your choice against the Dems after the proimaries. Or can it be that in terms of accomplishment, your choice has nothing to run on?
4 hours later and not a peep. It’s like I said, Marshall, the question of “what has your candidate accomplished” is a thread-killer.
Well, I’ll stick with it and keep asking it until someone relents with a straight answer. Considering such a question rests at the very heart of any hiring process – and that’s what an election is; we’re hiring a President – such a question really needs to be what we’re talking about first, not something to be ignored in favor of everything else.
I hope though that we as republicans haven’t become as shallow in our Presidential choices as the Democrats, but considering no one wants to qualify their candidates executive credentials and accomplishments, it certainly looks like the posters around here may be just as bad, if not much, much worse. At least the Democrats pretend to be citing experience. All I read here is fawning over rhetoric, and shallow and predictable rhetoric at that. It makes me wonder if Republicans have any chance at all.