John McCain vs. the Right: No easy peace; Update:McCain at CPAC
Update 11:11pm Eastern. The Club for Growth joins what McCain’s defenders derisively and speciously label the “McCain Derangement Syndrome” crowd. Here’s the CFG’s statement tonight. You can dismiss it as “hate” and accuse them of “acting like a liberal,” or you can deal with the facts:
When Janet Hook asked John McCain in tonight’s CNN Republican debate “What makes you more qualified than Mitt Romney, a successful CEO and businessman, to manage our economy?” Senator McCain offered a simple answer: “Because I know how to lead.”
Well, John McCain is certainly right about one thing. He knows how to lead, but he is often leading in the wrong direction, and often found with his liberal Democratic friends at his side. The 2001 and 2003 tax cuts are a case in point. John McCain was certainly a leader on the tax cuts: He led by being 1 of 2 Republicans in 2001 and 1 of 3 Republicans in 2003 to oppose the most pro-growth legislation in a generation.
John McCain joined with his Democratic friends in leading the opposition against the tax cuts. Like Ted Kennedy—who said “Now, they are proposing more of the same, more tax breaks benefiting only the wealthiest among us”—John McCain stood on the Senate floor and declared: “I cannot in good conscience support a tax cut in which so many of the benefits go to the most fortunate among us at the expense of middle-class Americans who need tax relief.” John McCain also proved his leadership skills by teaming up with Senator Tom Daschle in sponsoring an amendment designed to reduce the tax cuts and undermine their efficacy.
John McCain has also been a leader on several other key Democratic issues:
·He led by crusading, along with Democratic Senator Russ Feingold, against the First Amendment, pushing for legislation designed to wipe out free speech from the political realm
·He led by teaming up with Ted Kennedy and John Edwards in sponsoring the Patients’ Bill of Rights, a bill that imposed onerous mandates on insurance coverage and encouraged an increase in the number of frivolous lawsuits filed against healthcare providers
“Having leadership is an important quality, but it is important to consider the political philosophy underlying John McCain’s leadership,” said Club for Growth President Pat Toomey. “Hillary Clinton is also a leader, but Republicans don’t want Hillary Clinton to be their nominee. While John McCain has demonstrated his leadership skills, too often, on economic issues, he is leading the country in the wrong direction.”
Update 10:53pm Eastern. What Karl at Protein Wisdom said: “On one level, I cannot help but respect McCain for not wanting to change his positions to align himself with the conservative base. It is undoubtedly the same defiant streak that got him through the hell of the Hanoi Hilton. On the other hand, many people wish that he would at least reserve his most harsh, sneering, morally arrogant and childish rhetoric for liberals, Democrats and their subset in the media, rather than for those with whom he purports to agree with most of the time. Unlike Romney, McCain has built his political fortune on kicking people right of center in the teeth.”
Update 10:48pm Eastern. From commenter RationalThought: “OK, I was softening toward McCain. I really, really do not want a Shrillery presidency. I think her Supreme Court appointments will be a disaster for decades. But the class warfare BS he’s throwing around — and the anti-business crap — man I HATE that stuff. It’s red meat for ignorant, spiteful, envious voters (the Jerry Springer/Oprah crowd), which means the candidate who uses it doesn’t actually believe he has a damn thing to offer except, “Hey, I really want to be President of the United States.” I don’t know if I can pull the lever for him. And I agree with others here tonight: that nasty little smirk. It was positively…Hillaryesque. I’m back to thinking McCain or Hillary — What’s the difference? I don’t really see it, and for the first time in my nearly 50-year life, I may not vote at all. Why bother?”
Update 8:02pm Eastern. Wisdom from The Other McCain – “If you offer to be a doormat, don’t be surprised when people wipe mud all over you.”
I’m liveblogging the GOP debate here.
Update 6:30pm Eastern. Go here for my chat with Glenn Beck about McCain, Juan Hernandez, Jerrold Perenchio, and the conservative base.
Update: 4:50pm Eastern. Something to make you smile: Makaniak.
Update 2:20pm Eastern. Mark Hemingway reports that John McCain himself is coming to CPAC, in addition to reserving the campaign staff booth reported previously. So he can dismiss conservatives’ “foolishness” to their faces? Should be quite a show. Not to be missed.
Update 2:14pm Eastern. Must-read from Jeff Goldstein, who gets the heart of the Constitutional disaster that a McCain presidency portends: “The McCain Mutiny.” (hat tip – HAheadlines) But I guess we’re all just suffering from “McCain Derangement Syndrome.”
Update 11:25am Eastern. McCain to conservatives: You’re fools!
***
Despite his longtime alienation of the Right on countless issues, John McCain secured a solid win in a closed Florida Republican primary and is assuming the air of inevitability. Many pundits have been urging John McCain to reach out to conservatives (how novel that would be). In response, he made a small point tonight in his victory speech of emphasizing judges–an olive branch, apparently, in the aftermath of the Alito/Fund kerfuffle.
Well. We hear what he says now. But we know what he has done for years:
Insult the base, trash the base, and pay lip service to the base only when it suits his needs.
The declaration that he is the “conservative leader who can unite the party” is yet another smack in the face to those who have watched him reach out and slap conservatives time and again–and then run to the warm, gooey embrace of the liberal media. Is it too much to ask to nominate a Republican candidate who is not as openly and historically hostile to the Republican base as CNN and (McCain’s endorsers at) the New York Times are?
McCain’s open-borders supporters will declare that immigration is no longer a factor in this campaign. They so wish it to be so. (Right on cue, here’s Kennedy-fawning NYT columnist David Brooks dismissing immigration sniffily as “not a good issue for Republicans.”)
But the fact is that McCain was driven to play up his border security promises (however hollow they may be) and to start talking up attrition through enforcement.
That’s a small victory. But questions like this remain: How can McCain honestly reach out to conservatives when he defends his extremist campaign Hispanic outreach director who doesn’t believe in borders and when he boasts a national campaign finance chair and soft-money mogul who poured millions of dollars into the fight against English-language instruction in California, Planned Parenthood, and radical environmental fear-mongering groups?
We know that Juan Hernandez is McCain’s Hispanic outreach director.
Who is McCain’s conservative outreach director?
Hillary Clinton likes to say that whatever differences she and her Democrat opponents may have, “they pale in comparison” with the differences she and her Dem rivals have with the Republicans.
Can the Republican front-runner say that the differences between him and his GOP opponents pale in comparison with the differences between him and the Democrats?
The McCain=Hillary ad from the grass-roots conservative group Citizens United provides the disturbing answer.
Conservatives have core concerns about McCain’s trustworthiness, adherence to conservative ideology, and commitment to sovereignty that can’t easily be brushed off with glib answers about being the “straight talk” candidate. The problem is that the media chuckleheads who get to question the GOP candidates are as hostile and out of touch with the conservative base as McCain is. This monumental deficiency has been exposed repeatedly during the election-year “debates.”
Wouldn’t it be helpful to have at least one bona fide conservative questioner on the CNN debate panel tomorrow night when the GOP candidates meet at the Reagan Library? They made room for minority journalists when they broadcast minority interest group-sponsored debates. They made room for local journalists when they broadcast the Iowa caucus and NH primary debates. Why not someone at the GOP debate who actually knows and cares about what conservatives care about?
Too much to ask, apparently.
***
Last month, I asked readers: “Would you, could you, vote McCain?” How about now? At the moment, I’m with Rush: “I can see possibly not supporting a Republican nominee.”
Yes, the possibility is real. But we also have a long, long way to go.
With that in mind, I’m running a closed poll for registered MichelleMalkin.com commenters. (For those who can’t access the poll, I’m asking: Where do you stand with nine months to go until Election Day? If it’s McCain vs. Hillary in November, will you 1) Vote McCain; 2) Vote Hillary; 3) Stay home; or 4) Don’t Know.) I’ll post the results at the end of the day.
This portion of the content is restricted to registered users of this site. Please log in to view the content:
***
Meantime, let me share some of the reader e-mail that’s pouring in. At the moment, the depression and disgust are palpable. John McCain may have declared that he is the conservative uniter. But judging from my mailbox, his fight with the Right is far from over. On to Super Tuesday:
Carol…
I cannot in good conscience vote for John McCain.. If the country is going to hell, I’d rather Hillary, Barack, or the Dems can take credit for the destruction of the country than the Republicans.
Eric…
As a lifelong, politically active Conservative I’ve decided to vote Dem if McCain is the nominee. Why? Because I think that McCain will perform almost exactly like a Democrat and it is better to have the real thing in office rather than a Dem in GOP clothing. If McCain is elected and then performs poorly, because he acts like a Dem, he virtually guarantees a Dem win in 2012. However, if a Dem wins and runs things as they are dying to do then the GOP has a strong shot at 2012 and beyond.
I’d like to see someone start a very public campaign to keep Conservatives home on election day to make sure the Dems win, but win with a large segment voters sitting out so they can’t falsely claim a mandate.If McCain wins it will be harder for GOP House and Senate members to oppose him on Liberal initiatives, initiatives they would oppose if a Dem were to propose them.
Rick…
I’m a member of the conservative base and I just can’t see myself voting for John McCain EVEN if Hillary is the opposition. I am voting for Mitt Romney knowing that he panders. But at least he will promote conservative principles through the course of the election. Bottomline, I would be willing to lose with Romney over winning with McCain. McCain would ruin our movement by redefining what it means to be conservative, furthermore there is absolutely no way of knowing how that guy will govern.
I will never vote Democrat, but I will stay home!!
About me:
49 years old
Married and father of 3 (married once)
Business owner/operator for 21 years
College Educated
Christian faith
Extremely anti-abortion
Extremely pro-gun ownership
Support: strong national defense; small government; lower taxes; free trade; strong borders; personal responsibility
Harvey…
I think the Republican establishment needs to know just how many of us voters will never vote for McCain. I certainly won’t. I’ll just pass if he’s the nominee. I like the country’s chances with 4 years of Hillary better than 8 years of McCain (as much as it pains me to say that about a Republican)…
The electorate needs to know that McCain cannot win in November… and if I’m wrong about that and he does win in November, I think American voters will get the wrong impression of what it means to be a conservative. I have issues with all the Republican candidates and feel that no true conservative is still in the race… but if McCain becomes the nominee, I won’t vote for him.
Gerry…
If McCain becomes the republican nominee, Rush will be proven right. The “republican” persuasion will cease to exist. It might as well merge with the democrats to become its true self. Good riddance.
Staunch conservatives for life, my wife and I will vote for the democrat nominee (Billary or Obama) since they are scarcely different from McCain except on Iraq. Better to have a democrat pres kill the country than a faux-conservative republican like McCain kill it.
Then maybe another Jimmy Carter in 2008 will bring forth another Reagan for 2012.
Dave….
I’ve not voted for a Democrat in 25 years. I wont’ this year either. But if “my” party’s choice is McCain, I’m sitting on my hands. We’ll walk in the wilderness for the next 8 years together.
William…
Read my lips: I will NEVER vote for McCain.
Rod…
It seems to me that John McCain’s straight talk express is running on four flat tires. As a veteran I have always respected the man if not his policies. As the nation watched the Republican race in Florida it soon became apparent that the race to the finish line was a two man race, it also showed how sleazy and nasty McCain’s will stoop to gain a few votes. As he attacked Mitt Romney with underhanded tactics and outright lies he not only lost my vote he also lost my respect.
David…
Dear RNC:
I am very concerned about the direction toward which it appears that the Republican Party is going. In the words of Presidential hopeful John McCain, “they voted us in to change government, and the government changed us.”
John McCain’s own admission of how he failed in his duty as Senator, along with the rest of our fellow Republicans who were voted out of office in 2006, to make the changes that he promised is very telling. First, it raises suspicion as to his promises that he is now currently making. Additionally, it provides us with real insight into exactly who John McCain is, and why he should not be the Republican nominee.
John McCain, the “Maverick” has proven that he is indeed more of a liberal than a conservative or a Republican. What makes McCain a moderate is his staunch support for the war in Iraq. However, all of the Republican candidates, save Mike Huckabee would provide the same strong backing for the war. Which brings me to my next point demonstrating why John McCain would be more appropriate running for the Democratic nomination than a Republican one, McCain’s biggest successes in the Senate are renowned as the liberal’s biggest legislative accomplishments in the last quarter of a century. McCain-Feingold, a big blow to free speech and capitalism, McCain-Kennedy, was not only a smack-in-the-face to conservative Republicans, but also to more than 80% of the American people, who believe that there should be no amnesty, whether technical or not, and finally his global warming initiative McCain-Lieberman is a monstrosity that demonstrates his self-acknowledged lack of understanding of how economies work, particularly the economy of the nation for which he is running to lead.
Most remarkably telling of McCain’s liberal nature is his Clintonesque political maneuvers whereby he lied about and twisted Mitt Romney’s record by saying that Romney stood for something that even the most generous assumptions would not support, then attacked Romney for being dishonest, and repeated it consistently with the hopes that the public would believe it. This effective Clinton tactic is deceitful and it is not the sort of tactics that Republicans should use in a race against each other, simply for the reason that if for some reason a Republican were to lose, despite these terrible tactics, the Democrats would have plenty of ammunition to use fellow Republican’s own words against other Republicans.
I cannot support a candidate who claims that the American people have lost their faith in government and claims that he can restore faith in government, yet at the same time cannot even refrain from being dishonest in a campaign. John McCain is one of the biggest reasons people have lost faith in government, especially over the McCain-Kennedy bill where secret meetings were conducted with the hopes of ramming amnesty down the nation’s throat, despite overwhelming opposition direct from the American people.
If John McCain is selected as the nominee, I will not sit out of the election, but I will vote for whoever the Democratic candidate is. Rush Limbaugh and others have pointed out that if the choice comes down to between a Democrat on one side and a liberal Republican on the other, it’s much better to have the Democrat because at least all the problems that will arise from such an administration can be blamed on their party not ours. It is absurd to suggest that we should vote for a liberal because he is the only one who can beat a fellow liberal. I give much more respect to the liberal who announces his or her intentions and sticks to them rather than the liberal who pretends to be the most conservative Republican only to change positions in office and hide behind the shield that it was important to “reach across the isle” to get something done. Furthermore, we have all seen the damage that George Bush’s compassionate conservatism has done and how he has refused to serve the will of both the party that elected him and the American people as a whole, who believe that the borders should be closed and all the illegal aliens here asked to leave, go home, and wait at the end of the line like the rest of the millions who are trying to come here legally.
I pray that better judgment befalls you, as a party, and you do the right thing and select anybody but John McCain. It will truly tear the party apart in a way that I don’t think that you would like. I am prepared to donate the maximum contribution to the Republican party if the nominee is anybody but McCain, however if the nominee is McCain, I will keep my hard earned cash and vote for whomever the Democratic candidate is.
The sentiment expressed here is not isolated to my own personal beliefs, but it is felt among many of the conservatives in our party. We have been betrayed by John McCain enough. For us, a victory this Fall is not nearly as important as adhering to the principles that once made the republican party great.
Newt Gingrich has set forth a plan to win the majority back by following some simple conservative principles. To the Republican moderates some of these ideas may sound radical, but they are all winning solutions backed by a majority of Americans and transcend party lines. His ideas represent what real Americans believe and a majority of the nation support, like make English the official language, close the border and put an end to illegal immigration, and there are many others, all of which John McCain does not embody.
Thank you for taking the time to read my letter. I hope you do indeed consider the ramifications of seeking power over principle. In the end, if you only go for the power and forget the principles for which we represent, you will have no power.
One more from Vietnam veteran Russ Vaughn:
Up front, as a Vietnam veteran, I will readily concede that I respect John McCain for his service to his country, first as a naval aviator and POW in Vietnam, then for his long years in our national Congress. I even will admit to the fact that I somewhat admire McCain’s desire to effect some sort of political reconciliation with the Democrat party. That being said, I must also make it very clear that I do not support certain decisions McCain has chosen on his pathways to political advancement.
Now that the Senator has won primaries in New Hampshire and South Carolina and the network pundits are proclaiming he may well be the Republican “Comeback Kid,” I am reminded of an old Army joke about a platoon sergeant faced with the prospect of breaking the terrible news to one of his young charges, Private Jones, that the soldier’s mother has just passed away. The sergeant calls his platoon into formation and barks out the order, “All of you with living mothers take one step forward.” Then after a momentary pause, he mutters, “Not so fast there, Jones.” That’s my take as a veteran and a conservative Republican on this new political development: “Not so fast there, McCain.”
My first and biggest beef with John McCain is that when a very brave group of Vietnam veterans who had served with John Kerry stood up to say that Kerry’s self-serving portrayal of his war record was patently false, that his blanket charges of war crimes against them were absurd, and that his testimony in Congress was used by the North Vietnamese to further torture McCain’s fellow POW’s, Senator McCain airily dismissed these courageous men and sided with his Senate pal. Playing conciliator in the national media, McCain despicably denounced the Swift boat veterans’ ad as dishonest and dishonorable, hinting that they were pawns of George Bush and the Republican right.
Like all the leftists in the MSM, John McCain never gave these true American heroes even the least opportunity to defend their claims. As a veteran who had suffered more than most to defend our constitutional right of free speech, McCain inexplicably used his powerful office and national presence to ally himself with the repressive forces of mainstream media to suppress that right to men who had risked their lives in combat to preserve it. It was one of the bitterest betrayals the Swift boat vets and the millions of us Vietnam veterans supporting them would have to endure. We expected treachery from the MSM and Kerry’s campaign, but not from John McCain.
What I can never reconcile in my mind, my heart or my soul, is how this naval aviator, POW and true war hero, could so easily turn his back on his fellow sailors, combat veterans all. In the name of political expediency, and a sorely misguided attempt to lay to rest all the troubled ghosts of Vietnam that his treasonous Senate colleague was primarily responsible for creating, John McCain turned his back on the true heroes and sided with a phony vet with phony medals and a suspect discharge.
Never mind that I disagree with McCain on immigration, taxes and his unconstitutional McCain-Feingold bill; that’s all merely politics and has nothing to do with honor and loyalty to those who served bravely alongside you in combat. Nope, that’s not the issue. But I’m putting the Senator on notice right now; if you should somehow get the Republican nomination, you are gambling with the votes of millions of veterans like me unless you repudiate your reprehensible siding with the traitorous, treasonous John Kerry. I have never stayed home on Election Day in protest of a distasteful candidate, but this could be the first time for me and many Vietnam vets, again turning our backs on a fellow vet who turned his first.
The Senator should read the excellent recounting of how a determined few veterans, whom he disgracefully defamed, defeated his old buddy, John Kerry, in the 2004 campaign. In ‘To Set the Record Straight,” authors Scott Swett and Tim Ziegler, lay it out, page by page, what the concerted efforts of a few honorable patriots with an unrelenting resolve can accomplish in the arena of national politics.
Like the old platoon sergeant, I would caution, “Not so fast there, McCain!”
Russ Vaughn
Vietnam 65-66
Bryan Preston has some good suggestions for both McCain and the Right:
The GOP could do worse than nominate a bona fide war hero for the presidency, even while he presents serious problems on many issues. Our party at least takes national security very seriously and votes on it as a priority, something that can’t be honestly said of the Democrats. And for all his maverickness, McCain does vote conservative about 80% of the time. That fact gets lost in his high-profile betrayals of conservatives and conservative principles, and the existence of legislation called “McCain-Feingold” and “McCain-Kennedy.” He needs to work on something called “McCain-DeMint” or “McCain-Hunter.” Some sort of earmark-slashing tax cut package would be nice…
…Hope and courage are two things in short supply these days. If you have either one, and especially if you have any amount of both, use them.
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McCain has surrendered on the war on terror. He has surrendered on interrogation. He has surrendered on protecting the border. He is not a proponent of protecting this country. He is too busy figuring out how to give it away.
I am aware of Freds flaws, of the things Fred has done, of his weaknesses, and still found him to be the best guy out there, and still find him to be the br=est option Mitt would have as VP.
I also believe that Nixon was a great President whose great deeds have all been overshadowed lost and forgotten by Watergate.
I am relieved that McCain lost in 2000, and have been very pleased with Bush, other than on a few subjects such as Immigration. I think you misunderstood a few things I was saying there.
Whether it’s McCain or not, this whole situation is just a reminder of how vital it is to return a Republican majority – comprised mostly of new faces – to both the House and the senate!
RetFireman
I agree on Nixon … he simply got caught doing what all the rest of them had been doing for years … the problem was the cover-up … too bad they didn’t look at BillyBob with the same disdain over trying to cover his A later on …
The poll doesn’t have my option, so I will state it here. I can not, in good conscience, vote for Hillary, or anyone else in the Democratic Party. I WILL NOT vote for John McCain. I also know that my duty as a member of this Constitutional Republic is to vote, so I will not stay home. I will vote third party. I don’t know for who, but I may just do a write in for Fred Thompson.
As a man who has spent the past 18 years upholding an oath to protect and defend these United States from all enemies, foriegn AND domestic, I will not willfully contribute in any way to her destruction. I could care less WHO is at the reins when the country goes down. The fact is that she WILL go down with any of those choices.
Fornicate quicemque es non nostrom
Heinlein was right.
All of you people who are talking about taking your ball and going home need to grow up. This idea that we’ll let the Dems wreck the country and then sweep in and take over is just silly. Things don’t work that way. And why would you want to do that to the country? We simply cannot let the Clinton crime family back in the White House. The damage to the military and to our security concerns could be fatal in the dangerous world of jihadists in which we now live. On the domestic front, the huge socialist programs she would institute will never be gotten rid of. And the naive, foolish Obama would be even worse.
Take a deep breath, people.
Mr. Conservative Cat,
I prefer McCain to Romney, but I will happily support Romney if he wins the nomination.
FALL INTO LINE does not mean behind McCain. It means behind Romney, McCain, or even Huckabee (that would be difficult).
If any of them win, they are better than Hillary.
Respectfully,
eric aka the Tygrrrr Express
I pretty much have to echo Archon in #205. Staying home is not an option. Voting for the ‘Rat, be it Clinton, McCain or Obama, is not an option. Indeed, given there is no pro-war third party, that isn’t even an option.
Instead, I’m looking at writing somebody in. The question is, who? I can’t in good conscience write in somebody that already failed in this campaign, especially since, excepting Ron Paul (who I can’t vote for), that person will in the end endorse McCain. I don’t want to write myself in, partly because that only solves half the ballot, mostly because I’m nowhere near Presidential. You think you could take the 4-8 years, Michelle?
It strikes me that McCain is trying to play the “moderate”, hoping to get support from both the left and the right. Unfortunately, it may backfire with him losing support and alienating both ends of the political spectrum, leaving him disliked by everyone.
Grayson, no…that would be Hillary.
eric
The main issue for McCain is going to be his running-mate. McCain may not make it through a first term as President, so it is as important as ever for him to pick a partner that will sway some votes his way (should he get the nomination.)
If his pick is a politico/liberal/faux centrist, then he does not deserve to be the conservative’s candidate. For the sake and future of the Republican Party, he must pick a conservative, or this party’s over!
Was a thought, eric. We all know Hillary is playing the “moderate”, though the left support her anyway, knowing her true agenda, and the right won’t support her, for the same reason.
Ombre,
Not sure of the specific legalities, but one thing is for sure: if the American people and aspects of the press begin demanding a recount, it makes it 1000 times easier for Mitt to say, ‘the will of the people needs to be obeyed” instead of the sour-grapes “I want a recount”.
So get out there Rose and start demanding!!!!
Or for you, I’ll say it this way:
GET OUT THERE ROSE AND START DEMANDING!
Instead of posting a response to this, go to the comments section of the Fox News stories relevent to this and make a demand (I just did on 4 stories, the posts were awaing moderation when I last looked). And another blog. And sit around on hold trying to get through toa talk radio host. You can do all these things Rose and to them today while it still matters.
GET OUT THERE ROSE AND START DEMANDING!
If I understand many of the comments I’m reading here, the underpinnings of the assorted “I’ll-fall-on-my-sword-before-I-vote-for-John-McCain” arguments seem to be:
1. Churlishness and spite. “If I don’t get my idea of the perfect Republican nominee, then I’ll vote for Hillary!” Example:
Gee, thanks. Just remember, if you vote to make things worse (and if you don’t understand by now that Hillary would be a worse president than McCain by an order of magnitude, there’s no hope for you), then you cannot in good faith claim that you have no responsibility for the consequences.
You’ll have dicked over the country to satisfy your own selfishness, pettiness and vindictiveness – just like a donk would. Why not become a donk, and be consistent?
2. Pessimism, defeatism, and ennui. “I can’t vote for Hillary, but I can’t vote for McCain either.” Example:
Then you’ll “vote” for the greater of them. All the donkeys need to win is for Republicans to throw away their votes in some futile and pathetic display of self-destructive “principles.” Sucking your thumb and voting for “none of the above,” or writing in some no-chance third-party candidate, or throwing a tantrum at home on election day is a vote for Hillary – just as much as if you’d pulled the lever for her. Don’t ever let yourselves think otherwise.
By the time the primaries get around to Oregon, the Republican nominee will already be decided; I’m figuring that it’ll be McCain. I’ll be one of those “holding my nose” in the general election and voting for him. Not out of some blind party loyalty, but from my own particular motivator: Fear. Fear not only of the prospect of how much we have to lose under “Bubba’s Third Term,” but also of people who should know better doing peevish and foolish things to make that nightmare become reality.
It’s truly amazing that so many who would cheer Michelle’s “Suck It Up” philosophy when it comes to dealing with the bad mortgage situation can’t bring themselves to apply the same philosophy when it comes time to do what’s necessary to stave off the political, economic, foreign policy and military disasters this country would experience if Bill & Hill set up shop at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue again.
On January 30th, 2008 at 12:25 pm, RetFireman said:
********************
I do get to rattling on, I hope I didn’t misunderstand as much as I may have sounded like I did.
I think McCain is the differnt kettle of fish, but your mistake 8 yrs ago was repaired, and I think it is so because when we make mistakes of the heart – often God is there, “catching us”.
Nixon – I still think we did the best we could with what we had.
McCain is NOT the best we can with what we have.
McCain has already done more damage as a Senator than Nixon ever did as President.
And we’ve had a good opportunity to see him in action to this point.
I’m hoping that we are wise enough to learn from our past problems.
Taking a man who doesn’t function well in a high position of power, and elevating him still further – recipe for total disaster.
The weight of the mantle is significant, and quite sufficient to crush a lesser man.
It is an unkindness to vote for a man who is patently inadequate to the challenge. Quite like speaking pleasantly with a man for a few minutes, then suddenly opening a trap door under his feet to some disaster below.
And besides, he has not EARNED the office.
CraigC, what makes you think that idiot liberal McCain will not do the same things you describe above? If the country is going to suffer for the next 4 years, let it be at the hands of proud liberals, not a liberal disguised as a conservative. Nope, I will not support McCain under any circumstance.
Sorry, Reg, but I don’t think you can convince enough people to empower McCain so he can he “dick over America” soley to satisfy his own bizarre selfishness, pettiness and vindiciveness. You’re welcome to though, if you’re so inclined.
#295 On January 30th, 2008 at 12:34 pm, Archon said:
“Fornicate quicemque es non nostrom
Heinlein was right.”
LOL!
By my ~35-40 year-old Latin, I think that – Fornicate quicumque es non nostrum – means:
“Screw anything, (but) not ours”
Am I close?
“It’s truly amazing that so many who would cheer Michelle’s “Suck It Up” philosophy when it comes to dealing with the bad mortgage situation can’t bring themselves to apply the same philosophy when it comes time to do what’s necessary to stave off the political, economic, foreign policy and military disasters this country would experience if Bill & Hill set up shop at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue again.”
Regulus…AMEN!
I agree 100%.
Some in this room think that by a Hillary win over McCain, they will take the party back and gain power.
Wrong…they will be marginalized.
Also, if McCain wins without their help, they will be even more marginalized.
At least if they support McCain (or another republican) they can then take credit for unifying the party and being part of a winning coalition.
No one…is indispensable.
Respectfully,
eric aka the Tygrrrr Express
If you aren’t happy with McCain, I suggest voting third party. The Constitution Party would probably appeal to most folks around here, and it will be running an actual conservative in the election. There is no other way to make the conservative vote count. Voting for Hillary won’t do it, and voting for McCain certainly won’t. Not voting won’t either; nobody will know you did that because you’re a conservative who is sick of Repbulican sell-outs. On the other hand, a whole lot of conservatives (it would take about a million or so to be noticed) voting for a conservative third party would send a very loud signal to the Republican Party about what happens when you betray your base.
I’m both uneasy and uncomfortable with McCain. It looks like a Romney vs. McCain death match winner take all. Huckabee is quite clueless.
I voted for Guiliani in the New York state primary (absentee voter). Yeah, I know, I know…pointless, but I liked his national security platform and he had some interesting tax reform ideas.
There was never really a viable
“conservative” in the race, sad to say. Americans (of all political opinions) think there’s something dirty about the word “conservative” because the Republicans screwed up. It was people who pretended to be “conservative” but instead were RINO’S that screwed up and grew mad with power and pork.
Unfortunately, McCain embodies everything that’s not conservatism. Romney is not much better with the whole I was for abortion before I was against it. Romney has changed his mind so many times I’m about to get whiplash.
I guess if it was between McCain vs. Hillary I would pick (gulp!)him. Otherwise is “none of the above” an option? That’s how I feel about the election right now. I guess Reagan Conservatism really is dead.
CraigC, think back to when this happened once before. Carter was elected president and things looked very bleak. That is when conservatives really got serious about looking for a person that would really care about our concerns. While is seems obvious to us what should happen, it may take an Obama or Hillary to shake up the conservatives for 4 years to bring us all back together.
I would prefer everyone would wake up know before it is to late, but we never seem to learn from history until it is to late.
McCain doesn’t have a snowball’s chance in hell in winning if he goes up against cHillary. MSM knows it. Hell, even a political novice such as myself, knows it. What I don’t understand is why people think beating up conservatives to go out and “rock the vote” for McCain is going to make any difference in the grand scheme of things. Since when has the MSM cared about what Republicans want and need?!?!… Since McCain became the frontrunner, that’s when. Before him it was Huckabee. Never Thompson, Hunter or Tancredo. Now it’s – McCain, McCain, McCain nonstop. I’m tried of lambasting him. I’m tired of being lambasted. Let’s see what happens after Super Tuesday.
I will not vote for a criminal and traitor no matter that he calls himself a Republican.
I cannot believe the people that are telling us all to vote for un-indicted conspirator(Keating 5) and somebody who wants to sell America out to the Mexico/North American Union.
Sorry, I would rather have gridlock with Hillary in office than a RNC Rockefeller Republican ushering in the NAU.
I am amazed that people will knowingly vote for a Traitor in the name of party.
The RNC has played you all for fools.
I totally agree with Regulus.
We have a candidate–John McCain–who is pro-life, strong on the war on terror, is campaigning to build a fence and secure the border, and is leading by 7% over the Democrats.
Yet some conservatives would brattily stay home and not vote (or worse, vote for Hillary, the socialist, or Obama, the anti-American pseudo-Muslim). We KNOW that Hillary and Obama will not secure the border, will give Al Qaeda a big win in Iraq, will let gays join the military, will appoint radical judges, etc. Yet some conservatives would not vote for McCain in a general election? That is insane.
To get you up to speed there, Reg:
Other parties are on the ballot, they don’t need to be written-in.
A quick history lesson:
You do realize the Republican party was born as a “third-party” in 1854, correct?
Last – if McCain were the GOP nominee and he lost to the Dem candidate – which he surely would, quicker than you can say “cranky old white guy” or “Bob Dole” – then anyone who voted for him would have “wasted their vote” every bit as much as anyone voting for any other candidate who didn’t win. (or for that matter, as much as anyone who did the odd write-in vote)
What ever happened to the Bloomburg factor?
Terror is a tactic you can’t fight a war against a tactic. We have war on terrorists and right here among us advising the guvment are terrorists, give me a break, war on terror. Tell me, why is oil close to 100$ a barrel when before 9-11 it was around 30? It’s the jihad how difficult is this to comprehend? Fighting the jihad against us is costing them and us a lot of money they need to get it somewhere so why not from us? Someone/anyone needs to put the intelligence back in our intelligence agencies.
I believe that in the end muslims will follow their imams and book not the USA someone show me where freedom or democracy are listed. Go ahead make your argument based on fact if you can. But remember this, if you are a moderate muslim your life is in jeopardy, if you want to reform it I dare you to say that to an imam, any imam. We are concentrating on the country of Iraq meanwhile they are taking the continent of Africa. Say, who has more resources, especially in a supposed future anti global warming environment, Iraq or Africa?
They ask us to fix climate change while they employ culture change. Anyone think the islamists care about the climate? How about Mexico, China, Russia or India? Nope, destroy my culture and destroy any chance of accomplishing anything involved with climate. I have always been an environmentally conscious individual willing to listen to any ideas but now the message is, leave the place clean for the next group. f/o. If the dems want to surrender I say we push them out front of us use them as a buffer between us and the islamists we will be stronger when the islamists wipe these surrender monkeys out.
I will believe it when they start calling it like it is a war against global islamofascism, oh wait, Romney already said that. Yes there is a reason that a majority of these people think the same way in Pakistan, Indonesia, Iran, Somalia, Sudan, America and on and on.
The biggest mistake Nixon made was having some success in Vietnam he never should have tried to win. You know the dems, they wont have any of that!
There is room at the table for all of the candidates, they all have some good ideas and should all have a voice the question is leadership, The fact is that right now right here McCain is being deceived by a Mexican nationalist. We are facing the greatest deceivers of all time out there, how do you think he will perform? McCain once destroyed bridges, now he is building them, the question is what will these bridges be used for?
Another fact is the media has furiously covered op the truth since 9-11 and the DC pols are frightened of the media. Who put these dog and pony shows (So called debates) on, the media, therefore the media controls DC. Will they all of a sudden change, no I don’t think so.
Rasmussen has him ahead by 7 points right now. How many Republicans have been this far ahead of a Democrat this far in advance of an election? It is looking like a landslide if McCain is the nominee.
Bingo.
It’s a lucky thing for America that people had more courage to fight the establishment parties back then, than they have now.
“New” is like “Change” – by itself is meaningless.
It is only if the change to something new is to a higher quality – sufficiently higher quality – that it matters if you get it or not.
You can have entirely 100% “NEW” and have the same old same old.
John Adams – Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone, which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free Constitution is pure virtue, and if this cannot be inspired into our People in a greater Measure than they have it now, they may change their rulers and the forms of government, but they will not obtain a lasting liberty.
Tell that to the Wisconson pro-life people who he persecuted all the way to the Supreme Court.
Yes, that’s why he wants to stop interrogating terrorists and give them “O.J.”-style trials instead.
Yes, we saw how he fought so hard along with his other fellow “Masters Of The Universe” to do just that. Ooops, my mistake – he and they fought to make the illegal invasion legal and to turn over America to anyone who jumps the border.
Other than those small things, you’re spot on.
Gabe…
Agree with you as well.
The democrats fear McCain, and rightly so. He did not want a “surge.” He wanted a full scale escalation. He is to the right of Attila the Hun on the War, and that is good enough for me.
Respectfully,
eric aka the Tygrrrr Express
If McCain is going to be the nominee, then he is going to have to convince the conservative base of the Republican party that he can be trusted. His first step would be in the selection of a VP candidate, say Duncan Hunter. His words cannot be trusted, and we will have to know him by his actions.
This is truly a sad state of affairs. McCain has a long history as a RINO, and he is trying to convince the base that he is not a RINO. Whether he can pull that off and beat Hillary iquestionable. And if he does somehow manage to beat Hillary, will he govern as a conservative. Too many Ifs.
That is what I do best!
MDS = McCain Derangement Syndrome
A person suffering from MDS would sit at home and sulk during an election (or worse, vote for Hillary or Obama) and give Al Qaeda a big win in Iraq and throughout the world. . .because they hate McCain more than Al Qaeda, just as those with BDS hate Bush more than Saddam Hussein.
They would rather Obama and Hillary win an election and destroy our country, all to spite someone with an 80% conservative voting record.
The amnesty debacle is all that one needs to know about the man. Vote (or don’t) accordingly…
Duncan Hunter endorsed HUCKABEE. BAH, a pox on him!
Leave him to run for Cal Sen.
CNN readers claim to know why McCain is winning: http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/01/30/mccain.appeal.irpt/index.html
Read it and weep – clearly shows most people are still getting their info from the MSM and will never have half the insight MM readers have.
The raw truth – most cnn readers see McCain as honest, loyal and grandfatherly. Gotta go puke now…
The battle is not over yet!
IT IS TIME TO GET ACTIVE!
SUPPORT MITT ROMNEY!!!
Sign up to help Romney’s campaign on http://www.MITTROMNEY.com
Contact your local Republican party to find out how to get involved.
Make a donation.
Convince your friends & family to vote for Romney.
THERE IS NO REASON FOR US TO SETTLE FOR McCAIN AS OUR NOMINEE!!! But we all need to get ACTIVE right now!!!
purplepeep said:
“You do realize the Republican party was born as a “third-party” in 1854, correct?”
Yup, people nowadays are much more afraid to move away from things even when they aren’t working out – or are a disaster. The establishment parties (as you called them) count on that petrifying fear.
Well, Pickle, I think folks will pretty much do as they want, but the usual argument that’s raised against not voting either/only Dem/Rep just doesn’t hold up. If it did it would mean that anyone who voted for any candidate who lost would have “thrown his/her vote away”.
News Flash, McCain will not secure the border either.
I’ll be heading up to the courthouse to offically change my registration so I won’t get the fund raising calls.
I hope McCain picks either Giuliani or Thompson as his VP.
If he picks Giuliani, Rudy would be an amazing attack dog. He would go after Hillary with more reckless abandon than he could as the top guy. McCain could play the nice guy.
Respectfully,
eric aka the Tygrrrr Express
The two front-runners for the GOP have complementary strengths. McCain is strong on foreign policy/national defense, but weak on domestic policy/economics. Romney is strong on domestic policy/economics, but has no known background on foreign policy/national defense (as a governor, he wouldn’t be involved in that). Put the two of them together and you’ve got a good all-around candidate. That being said, I agree with Godzilla from early today, that coservatives’ best chance is to vote conservative for representatives and senators (what senators are up this year). A right leaning congress would certainly complement a President McCain or President Romney and definitely be needed in the face of a President H. Clinton or President Obama. The big picture is: the presidency is important, but not the whole ball game.
Sorry, Gabe, but as strongly as it’s been advocated noone has yet been able to make the case why a McCain should be encouraged to “win an election and destroy our country”. Make the argument for that and you’ll be miles ahead of the rest.
If you honestly believe these polls mean squat, you are being played for a fool.
Once the nominations are settled and the general campaign begins, the MSM that has been so adoring of McVain in order to get poll results like this will turn against him with a vengance. They’ll exploit his temper, his weaknesses with the base he’s forsaken, while minimizing the issues where he has strength. By the time November rolls around, he’ll be trailing in those polls significantly, to either Hillary or Obama. With no conservative base to rally around him – thanks to his own actions of the last 8 years – he’ll be toast.
And as for the rest of you who keep saying that “conservatives will be marginalized” if we sit out, here’s a newsflash: We are ALREADY marginalized. If it were otherwise, McVain wouldn’t be the frontrunner.
A daffodil and a human being and a fruit fly all have about 75% of their DNA in common.
Why take poison because you don’t want to shoot yourself?
Demand the GOP do something about it.
Force them to open the convention.
I saw something one time, in a Christian Convention. The organizers were trying to proceed according to schedule arranged MONTHS in advance. One group of ladies in the balcony began to quietly and very rhythmicly pound a beat with one foot. Or with one foot then the other. slow, rhythemic, steady.
But it was the Holy Spirit.
But it was like that African tribesman in “A Far Off Place”…
It took quite a while, but after an hour or hour and a half, the entire stadium was worshipping God and ignoring what was going on with leadership on stage.
What if we start a movement – and we generate a decision on a write-in – and pass it along, with a steady drumbeat.
Slow and solid and quiet.
Just say, this parade is going to the River to get CLEAN. We got to a curve in the road, and the leadership went down the road, but the huge huge mass of people went straight to the River, and washed ourselves clean. And the leadership never saw the crowd was no longer there at all.
Like a slow, soft steady timpani drum, quietly…
Shall I play for you…pah-rum-pah-pah-rum…
#
#
#
me and my drum
#
#
#
talk to the Lord, the Holy One, and hear…
#
#
#
Where do I get in line to sign up for the new conservative party? A party that believes in conservative values beyond just the war!
Ninety first Psalm
Yet some conservatives would brattily stay home and not vote (or worse, vote for Hillary, the socialist, or Obama, the anti-American pseudo-Muslim). We KNOW that Hillary and Obama will not secure the border…
Indeed. But my eyes tend to roll when the the best case anyone can make for McAmnesty needs to invoke Obama as a secret Manchurian-terrorist. Now that’s desperation.
Here is Juan Hernandez’s open boarders, anything goes lunacy in his own words:
Here,
Here,
And here
This guy is insane! And why any republican in his right mind would choose to associate with this fringe radical is beyond me. John McCain is out of control and I am sick of it. Somebody needs to tell Johnny Boy that he is running on the wrong ticket!
ARRGGGGG!!! THIS MAKES MY BLOOD BOIL!!!!!!!
Amazing: the religious right is thisclose to reversing Roe vs. Wade and ending (or severely cutting into) THE HOLOCAUST, THE GENOCIDE, THAT IS ABORTION!!!! But naw, McCain has insulted us and backs amnesty.
The anti-terrorist right screams “THIS IS THE BATTLE OF A GENERATION! WE HAVE TO FIGHT THE ISLAMOFASCISTS! IRAQ IS THE BATTLEGROUND!!!” But naw, McCain has insulted us and backs amnesty.
You frauds.
Balderdash.
Who would ever put a stick of dynamite in the engine cylinder and light it (McCain) and claim they were just trying to REPAIR THE CAR???????
Hang onto McCain and flush the GOP and the nation.
What is most important to you?
Why validate the votes of Independents and Democrats in the GOP Primaries?
Billy, your post was just a bit all over the place there. What’s your core beef/issue?
On January 30th, 2008 at 1:35 pm, Gabe said:
McCain doesn’t have a snowball’s chance in hell in winning if he goes up against cHillary.
Gabe, how many Republicans were actual Republicans and not RINOs? Let’s not pretend that we do not know why McCain has such popularity as he does. The majority of Republicans here have a huge problem with McCain.
Which Dems fear McCain? The NY Times endorsed him…
Waaaaay back at #128, Granite said:
Close. “Screw anyone that isn’t one of us”. The phrase has been floating around the team room here for a couple years, and I felt compelled to share it.
I’m with Gabe and TGUSA on some of their points. Gabe, I hate to disagree with you but there are gays in the military and the commanders are letting them stay in their respective units even after they come out. As a military spouse, I wish gays would keep their sexuality to themselves. Get over yourselves. You’re in the military to defend the country, not your homosexuality.
I feel like our country is descending into laziness and chaos. We don’t have the balls to tell illegals to go home (as an entire country), we need nanny welfare state social programs (like Europe has) to tuck us in at night so we can all suck our thumbs in contentment, we cave into any global fad that presents itself (global warming, HIV/AIDS in Africa, etc) but we don’t really know our own hearts and minds.
People want to be pandered to (on both sides) rather than dealt with honestly and openly. As a nation, we turn a blind eye to lack of personal responsibility, corporate/political greed that allows unfair trade deals and unfair competition when it suits us and then when liberals spout off against it, it’s the biggest surprise of going. Even worse, the far left nutjobs (and even some reasonable sorts) demonize the military and screech no more war. If being proactive against terrorists is the difference between our survival or our nuclear winter, I’ll take it.
I also don’t like how the civilian population (on both sides) has chosen the easy path by not serving in the military. There seems to be such a disconnect between civilians and the military (as people like my husband can attest). This won’t make me a popular person, but I think every person who is able-bodied should serve 2 years in the military (between the ages of 18-25)… we wouldn’t nearly have the current indolence going on now.
No matter who wins- Obamalamo, Billary, or McCant… there will still be divisiveness because Americans can’t stand each other. I’d rather not compromise on things like the economy, military, or national defense as some people seem bent on now. People want the easy… as long as it comes out of my hard-earned money. No thanks.
Rose, I think it’s a sad commentary that some folks would write off all the destruction McCain would bring on America just because he has a “R” after his name or because he seems to temporarily on their side of one issue. (Until McCain changes as he desperately seeks his far-left buddies approval, that is)
Sorry, but the damage that would be done to this country and yes, the entire world should Hillary become President and the two of them enter the White House again at this point in history, with what is currently going on in the world, with what is going on in Islam, with the enemy we face, with the war we are waging, with her swearing to surrender to the very people who have vowed to see us all dead of enslaved is far beyond “Sucking it UP” or comparing the it with the housing and mortgage situation…
Wow…how you could even compare the two is frightening, and makes me wonder if you actually grasp the severity of the situations going on here.
Um…um…er….um…well, only because they fear him, 30P!
It’s already been said but that poll needs the option of a different party. I might go that way if it’s McCain.
I contributed to Duncan Hunter. (Looking for a refund after his endorsement of the Huckster)
I despise McCain. He is a RINO. No argument there.
However, he did, for once, shun media adulation when he came forth strongly in favor of the surge in Iraq. That tells me that McCain does truly believe in victory against the terrorists. While I don’t agree with his proposed coddling of captured terrorists, I do believe he, in contrast to any democrat, will not surrender in the war against islamo-fascism.
While I will vote for Mitt on Super Tuesday, if McCain is ultimately the nominee, then I will vote for him. Our country’s future is too important to sacrifice for the sake of engaging in a temper tantrum over the absence of a true conservative in the race.
Any type of primary or caucus that lets people change their prior registered affiliation for the purpose of voting and then change it back again before the general election is simply letting itself be hijacked by those that are trying to manipulate the candidate of the other party …
In the case of FL I think it is obvious that since the DNC stripped them of their delegates to the Dem convention that many of them didn’t bother voting in the Dem primary because it was meaningless so they changed to Republican for the primary just to hijack the outcome …
No way I can prove it other than if someone can get their hands on all the records of the registration changes and then track them through the general election …
Anyone care to make a bet that all of the dems that changed registration for the primary change back to dem before the general?
Thanks Purplepeep. That’s has to be it!!
Kam – if your worried about ‘a temper tantrum over the absence of a true conservative in the race.’ then wait till you see McCains tantrum when he loses to Hillary.
I will never vote for someone who stabbed me in the back.
Purple: my point is that there’s an ocean-size gulf between the rhetoric of “the base” and their feelings on McCain. He’s been solid on judges and the war. Roe v. Wade is a vote away from being overturned. Clinton and Obama has pledged to leave Iraq. That Michelle and others even contemplate staying home or voting Dem almost shouts “we didn’t mean it!”
The latest results …
If it’s McCain vs. Hillary in November:
Selection Votes
I will vote for McCain. 29% 212
I will vote for Hillary. 6% 46
I will stay home. 36% 262
I don’t know. 29% 210
730 votes total
The McCainiacs had better rush to sign up as GOP volunteers. No one else is interested.
Fine. Now we’re fools and bigots. I still wont vote for him.
#258
I don’t think mandatory service would solve the problem. You would still get people with the same attitudes, and they would end up even more vocal in their disdain for being “forced” to do something they didn’t want to. Historically, armies of conscripts get their butts kicked by armies of motivated pipe hitters who believe in something (Thermopolaye, anyone?)
I’m much more a fan of Heinlein’s model. “Service means citizenship”. If you want to be a productive citizen and vote, you need to serve the public in some capacity. Not everyone is physically able to serve in the military, so make sure there are other options: Police, firefighters, emergency workers like paramedics, and teachers, to name a few. You serve the public a few years in one of those capacities, and you will have earned the right to vote, and to run for public office.
Not a new idea. Just a good one.
Indeed, if McCain had his way the planned terrorist attacks that were exposed via interrogation likely would have gone on as planned throughout the world, including in America. On the plus side, for those who support McCain, those who obtained such information would be be punished.
With McCain giving them such carte blanche to plan attacks in America we might not even have the option to surrender.
I cannot think of any good reason to vote for RINOcain but that he would not be AS bad as Hillary. It’s like a doctor deciding on natural methods with a 10% chance to live(letting Hill win) or surgery with a 25% chance(a vote for RINOcain). There is a SLIGHT chance that he might do some good things(Bush/Alito and Roberts). I see NOTHING good coming from Hill and don’t believe she will get credit for our demise as has been stated so well before by other’s here. Therefore I’m sorry to say that I will hold my nose and vote.
“#258
This won’t make me a popular person, but I think every person who is able-bodied should serve 2 years in the military (between the ages of 18-25)… we wouldn’t nearly have the current indolence going on now.”
I’d favor 2 years of National Service (or local, State Service) starting after high school graduation (or age 18 for dropouts). Wouldn’t have to be military, though that would be one obvious option.
I don’t see why supporting the War in Iraq has anything to do with being conservative. When I think of war-mongers I think of Democrats. Just follow the tradition of war.
emjem24, I agree, I wrote the pres and suggested that right after 9-11. We all need to be prepared and all who can should serve. Not everyone will see action there are enough volunteers for that, as always. Everyone should at least complete boot camp purely for the training to be prepared in the next and future emergencies. If you cannot supply medical attention, put out fires, pick up a weapon, or some other assistance and you are not handicapped, if you think you can walk around and not take responsibility emigrate some where else I got no use for you. I actually got a reply back for the first time ever, dang I wish I hadn’t had the delete attachments on now I will never know what was written.
Well, all I can do is decide for myself that I will not be a party to my country’s destruction simply because McCain has hurt my feelings in the past.
I repeat. Any democrat president will endanger this country in a way that McCain, for all his faults, never will. It’s that simple.
Fellow conservatives, and there are none more conservative than me, sitting this election out due to their distrust and dislike of McCain are endangering their country.
This is why a two party system is a joke.
It doesn’t matter if McAmnesty or RomnestyCare is the nominee for the GOP.
If you’re against amnesty, higher taxes, socialism, Gorebull Warming hype, erosion of the 1st & 2nd amendment, and liberal judical appointments, the GOP and Dem parties just aren’t for you.
Flushing your principles while voting to keep a label in power (my preciousssssssss) is pretty stupid.
-Conservative before Republican.
I have no problem with this as long as it includes everyone from 18 – 54.
Scenario #1: I vote for McCain, he wins and next year there’s a vote on amnesty. My reps won’t hesitate to vote for amnesty because McCain won after all and now they don’t dare vote against him.
Scenario #2. i voice my vote by not voting. Hillary wins and amnesty is on the floor. My reps fight it tooth and nail because they saw the base revolt and their not afraid to fight Hillary.
hmmmm… what to do? I think its clear as day.
A movement of a new party (perhaps named “The Conservative Party”) with a Thompson/Hunter running would make the message to the RNC?
I’m not sure if I shall vote, should it be McCain.
Mister P:
Your assessment of support for the Iraq War having nothing to do with conservatism is ridiculous. As a conservative, I’ve supported the war. Yes, I know, I’m not Ron Paul. I really hate it when anybody who supports the war or is patriotic and loves their country when they support the military is called a “war-monger” or even worse, a war profiteer, or they “wrap themselves in the flag.” It literally makes my blood run cold when people (on both sides) say this… this really contributes to what I see as a disconnect between the civilian and military populations (I’m seeing this as a military spouse unfortunately).
Yes, the military can be run more efficiently and there is waste. There are bases that can be closed but, unfortunately, war is part of the human experience. People will always have conflict with one another. I’d rather have a standing military that ensures our self-defense as well as it being a deterrent against the baddies coming down the pike.
The probability that an armed uprising will occur in the U.S. in the next 10 years is increasing daily. Our representives no longer serve to protect the interests of the citizenry, but that of the special interest groups and foreign gov’ts that donate to their campaigns and fill their pockets with cash.
The two main reasons for the American Revolution were TAXES and Foreign Occupation.
Our current leaders refuse to protect our borders and they cannot be trusted with our tax dollars! They believe in the rights of the government over the rights of the individual.
I hope i’m wrong but it’s looking more and more likely every day.
That’s an oversimplification of what most people here “feel” toward McCain. You cheapen our well-reasoned and valid points regarding McCant’s record, past and present, for what?? That’s always a good way to rally the troops… NOT.
“I’d favor 2 years of National Service (or local, State Service) starting after high school graduation (or age 18 for dropouts). Wouldn’t have to be military, though that would be one obvious option.”
I understand your point, MrP. But I think at 18/right out of highschool is a time before a person has settled down into life. At 40, for example, someone is much more likely to have a job and family, at the least. Things that will cost money to “take them away from”. I think civic roles along the lines of the old “civil defense volunteer” and perhaps police, fire reserve – things alike that – would work better for those who really can’t drop everything for a year or so.
But I do like the idea that Americans should be required to put something into their country and to appreciate how fortunate (even with America’s warts and all) they are to be citizens. It should be a matter of pride and personal sacrifice of time, if nothing else.
Madchef:
If anything, I think we might have a 2nd civil war (I hope this never happens). Political civility no longer exists between the parties. There are two camps that now exist in this country: keeping the federal government out vs. the federal government controlling every aspect of your life.
There is a fight for the very direction and future of our country. God help us if a liberal (of either party) takes control.
30 pieces of silver…
I detest the Jayson Blair Times. The fact that they despise Rudy was another reason to support him. However, they did not “endorse” him in the sense that they said he was the best republican, but still worse than all the democrats.
If he wins the nomination, they will make him out to be a hard right conservative.
On the war, they will be right…and so will he.
Also, Beaker, you make good points as well.
Respectfully,
eric aka the Tygrrrr Express
Great, let’s see if he has the malkins to sit down with you for a serious Vent! I doubt he will. In fact I’d be willing to bet that he will avoid questions from you in particular and true conservatives in general.
Ooh, ooh, 30P – I got it :: raises and waves hand! ::
Because it’s a whole lot easier than defending McCain’s record??
I said what I did, because I was a draftee and served my two years. However I do not like the idea that all the people after me just get off scott free. Where was their two years of service? I assure you the draft inconvenienced many of us. When I came out, I could not find a job. When I went to the State unemployment office, the clerk told me I shouldn’t have majored in Math and said there were no jobs. The jobs were taken by those who were weren’t drafted. Many draftees were married and had children, but they had to serve anyway. Many of my friends were inconvenienced to the point of dieing in Viet Nam. So I have little sympathy for middle-aged excuses.
If you don’t want McCain as the nominee, you Super Tuesday voters better get out and vote for Romney. After that it’ll be too late.
Really. Was Roosevelt a conservative?, Were Kennedy and Johnson conservatives. As a conservative I would say that the United States is not responsible for the well fare of the rest of the world – period. We have plenty of our own problems to resolve. I would rather see that military on the border. Remember Bush saying “I do not believe in Nation Building.” – Well I still don’t.
Bobby Jindal in 2012!
#294, Mister P
I’m going to have to disagree with you here. American troops do not belong on the border. This is not East Germany. That is what we have a Border patrol for.
When people mention things like bringing home the troops in Germany or Okinawa, I’ve found that it is usually out of ignorance. Our troops are not in these places for nation building. They are not there to defend those nations. They are there as part of a force projection strategy that ensures any future wars WITH the US will not be IN the US. And besides, I like going OCONUS.
He’s almost got it right, since there is no such thing as true Communism by definition the word has to be Socialist,my Russian’s teacher was right the Communist ideology alway’s turn’s to Socialist Ideology and the Socialist Ideology turn’s into Capitolist Ideology and and visa versa Capitolism turn’s to Socialism and Socialism turn’s to Communism. Like I said though their is no true Communism
So here we are at the crossroad’s of becoming a Socialist society, when both parties start looking the same we should be very scared that the Conservitive Capotilist Ideology is being stamped down to a point where our voice’s will not be heard, I will never vote against my Conservitive Capitolist Ideology and voting for Billary or McPoser would comprimise that Ideology. Patrick Henry said it best give me liberty or give me death, I would take death before voting for McPoser. I personally will be writing in my choice of a true conservitive. I will not be a party to the destruction of Capitolism.
The demographics of Florida are such that the most familiar names get their majority votes.
Meanwhile, the MSM gushes forth (again).
McCain, pure and simple, is nuts. Only a nut would put into his campaign structure Vincente Fox’s buddies.
Romney, on the other hand, is your typical politician, flawed and real.
When super Tuesday rolls around, McCain will have lost again.
That is, I sure hope so.
John McCain is no more liberal than either of the Bushes, both who struck deals with the Dems and strayed from conservative principles all too often. We all know that our current President isn’t nearly as conservative as he is portrayed by the MSM (That it were so!) yet we generally suppport him, knowing the damage the Dems can do if he has no backing. To those that say they would never vote for McCain I say, would you rather have had a President Dukakis, President Gore and and President Kerry in the Oval office?
30 pcs of silver,
I did not intend to offend. I was simply trying to express my assessment that not voting for McCain because he has gone out of his way to provoke conservatives will endanger national security. I believe my assessment to be well-reasoned based on the public acts and statements of McCain and the democrat candidates.
Failure to recognize the critical difference between McCain and the democrats when it comes to the war and to vote accordingly endangers national security. It’s that simple.
And please don’t forget, I despise McCain. But it’s 2008, not 1992 or 1996 or 2000. Things changed on 9/11. Hillary doesn’t think so, McCain, for all his many faults, does.