McCain Estrangement Syndrome; Update: Bauer endorses McCain
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Reader Peter Raymond, a retired US Navy captain, e-mails: “Isn’t it time to help Team McCain with some suggested campaign posters? I’ve attached a few to get the ball rolling.”
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Are you a fellow McCain critic tired of being diagnosed with “McCain Derangement Syndrome” and “dyspepsia?” Andy McCarthy offers some welcome relief. He turns the tables on the anti-anti-McCainiacs with his own diagnosis: McCain Estrangement Syndrome.
Are John McCain’s supporters trying to drive conservatives away from their candidate?
Senator McCain is the inevitable Republican presidential nominee. He is headed, though, for a defeat of McGovernite dimensions if he can’t sway conservatives to get behind his candidacy. For their part, conservatives don’t want McCain, but even less do they want to spend the next four-to-eight years saying “President Obama,” let alone reliving history with another President Clinton.
In short, there are the makings here for a modus vivendi, however grudging. Yet, McCain’s admirers appear to think belittling the senator’s good-faith opponents is the way to go. Theirs is a case of the pot calling the kettle “deranged” — and it will prove duly futile.
Put yourselves in my shoes for a moment. I have not supported Sen. McCain. I admire his perseverance and love of country. Still, I don’t think he is a committed conservative, and his penchant for demonizing all opposition is, to me, extremely off-putting. Protestations to the contrary notwithstanding, there’s nothing delusional about that.
In fact, as between the two of us, it’s McCain’s supporters who are deluding themselves. I take them at their word, for example, that a hallmark of the senator’s politics is his tenacity on matters of principle. Consequently, I am skeptical of his assurances that he would appoint conservative judges who will apply rather than create law. Why? Because he has a recent, determined history of beseeching federal courts to disregard the First Amendment in furtherance of a dubious campaign-finance scheme in which he believes passionately. Conservative judges would (and have) rejected this scheme, just as they would (and have) rejected another signature McCain position: the extension of Geneva Convention protections for jihadists.
Yet, we continue to be belittled:
McCain’s supporters continue to mock thoughtful, good-faith critics as “deranged.” The principal objects of scorn are such conservative talk-radio icons as Rush Limbaugh, Mark Levin, Laura Ingraham, and Sean Hannity. A number of those folks are friends of mine, and, indeed, I appeared on a couple of their programs in the run-up to Super Tuesday. The discussion wasn’t “deranged.” I’m not deranged, and neither are they…There’s a battle on the horizon for the future of conservatism. On one side are those who revere unchanging principles, especially a healthy suspicion of government. On the other are those who would refine old principles under the guise of adapting them to new situations — those apt to see government more as a force for good than a necessary evil.
Sen. McCain runs in the latter circles.
Say it loud. Make some noise. Refuse to be marginalized.
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Related: Read this. And See Dubya’s got some straight-talking McCain campaign bumper stickers.
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Update 11:08am Eastern. Gary Bauer endorses McCain.
More endorsements are meaningless without persuasive action.
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Sorry, Michelle, but some of McCain’s critics are already comparing him to Hitler over at Hugh Hewitt’s blog…
That seems deranged to me!
Why should I support McCain. He has demonstrated with his actions over the last 4 years that he is in no way a consevative. His campaign finace reform is censorship. The amnesty for those who break our laws by coming here and STEALING not only jobs but geting handouts and taking of identities of hard working CITIZENS. His little hissy preteen fits of self absorbed “its my ball and I will take it home if I don’t get to play” attitude.
There is absolutely no way I can vote for this man. I will support and vote for Congressional members of the House and Senate that are conservsative,but as for the Presidency … it is lost in my opinion.
ROD—JOR,
McCain is not a “moderate Republican”
He is a “SWITCH-HITTER Republican”
Or an “AC-DC Republican”
Or an “optional Republican”
Whatever else he may be…
he is no conservative, and
he has NO INTEGRITY.
After you realize that, the rest seems to speak for itself.
I like Capt. Raymond’s campaign posters for McCain. They pretty much hit the nail on the head. LOL
I think the “Ride a Maverick to Victory” would have been cuter, if it had the cowboy yelling “Gee! Gee!”. But, that might have been lost on someone that hasn’t worked with horses and mules.
I still don’t get it. In a contest between Obama and McCain, why would we NOT support McCain?
I can understand pushing him to more solidly conservative principles, and it has already made a difference.
In Virginia, I received a recorded message in which he promises Supreme Court justices “like Robert and Alito.” He promises to keep us engaged abroad in the War on Terror, and he is solidly pro-life and will appoint judges who are pro-life.
Is Huckabee any better than that?
Would Barack Hussein Obama appoint pro-life judges, stay in Iraq, and support the troops?
I’m sorry, if anyone does not vote in the general election to “get back at McCain,” they ARE suffering from MDS. They would rather destroy the mission abroad, have our troops lose in Iraq, and throw away any pro-life victories in order to punish McCain to have Ohama win and wreck our nation.
Compared to your self-absorbed hissy fit that you won’t vote for him in a general election–even if it means that 4000 troops have died in vain, all our pro-life victories are in vain, that we lose in Iraq, that we get NO border security with Obama?
This is sheer craziness.
We might not like McCain but he is still better than anyone else still on the menu. I was going to order Hunter with a side of Thompson but they ran out before I could order.
Gabe wrote:
“I’m sorry, if anyone does not vote in the general election to “get back at McCain,” they ARE suffering from MDS. They would rather destroy the mission abroad, have our troops lose in Iraq, and throw away any pro-life victories in order to punish McCain to have Ohama win and wreck our nation.”
…but at least with a Democrat doing all this, we Conservatives would still have our “dignity” while watching the country go to hell. Sheesh….
I understand your frustration….it mirrors my own.
Personally if McCain is the nominee I don’t see how I could possibly support him at this time or any of the POTUS choices being shoved down our throats. From the dictionary I came up with the following:
From the above definition of a conservative McCain has shown himself through his actions and deeds he is anything, but a conservative. He will have to come to us if he wants our support for I am done with being told to be a good little soldier, get in line, salute smartly, and pull the R lever no matter what. Don’t worry I will show up at the polls, but unless we see significant action by him my wife and I will vote “none of the above” for POTUS and concentrate on doing what we can in sending conservatives to the House and Senate.
I think it’s funny that McCain supporters say (as Andy pointed out):
But yet, they tell us to forget your principles and be a lemming…vote for McCain. Talk about double speak. I like McCain for his belief in his principles, you are wrong for sticking to yours.
No wonder there is a growing number of Republicans/Conservatives saying… “Go Obama”
Boomer-
Yes, I think it has been established that McCain is not a Conservative…but neither is Romney or Huckabee or Clinton or Obama.
We weren’t given any choices this election year.
But to hand over this country to the Democrats while they hold the House and Senate would be disastrous to this nation.
I, for one, cannot stand by and watch that happen. Look, we Americans stopped McCain/Kennedy from shoving their immigration “plan” down our throats. We showed McCain that we have a powerful voice now with the blogs and talk radio shows.
He won’t be able to get away with much unless he puts out more Conservative ideas. We won’t let him.
On February 11th, 2008 at 9:20 am, Artbyruth said:
Yup, and he’s just waiting to get in the WH with the full backing of a Democrat congress so he can that shove that immigration plan back down YOUR throat. Even a blind man knows that plan is waiting int he wings for dusting off as soon as the election is over. The Dems (with the support of the RINOs) won’t be able to bring it up fast enough if McCain is the POTUS. It would be to salivating a gesture to watch HIM shove it back down the conservatives throats after he pandered to them.
It will be funny.
Gabe #5 and 6# I’m with you but, I have to agree with article about McCain’s people. They cannot expect to get support so easily from people he has offended with his attitude toward them. It is up to him to try to assure them he will not disappoint them if elected. MDS should be called Liberal Derangement Syndrome and we would like to see McCain come down with a good case of it!
I disagree with people here most of the time, but I give you this: you thought McCain was Dukakis when he was down and you still think he’s Dukakis when he’s up. You would rather have a Democrat than McCain. I think you’re nuts, but at least you’re making up your own minds.
MM, on the other hand, is like the rally leader in 1984 (the book by George Orwell). In the middle of a hate fest against one country comes word that they are the allies. The leader changes the tune barely missing a beat.
I love reading stuff like this, as “Conservatives” are telling me how tough McCain will be on security:
Tough on WoT, Iraq? Ummm…
only if your blind
Well, don’t worry. McCain isn’t going to get elected anyway. Any real conservatives that are out there might as well vote for him, because he’s going to be the closest thing you get in this election to a conservative.
For the past four years, the republican’t party has been trying very hard to self immolate. With their “leader” GWB holding the match. So, for anyone still trying to be conservative… might as well vote McCain. Don’t worry, he won’t be elected… and that will show ‘em!!
Parts of the MSM is already comparing Husein Obama, to Jesus. They are actually saying he has a “messianic” presence.
This election is getting so freaking weird. I never thought I would be in the middle of a people who collectively are going insane, and are bound to bring the rest of us with them.
IMHO The only biblical reference for Obama, I can think of is the anti-Christ…
Really, truly, can’t we all get along?
This obsessive dislike for McCain is a bit over the top. He’s just one man for crying out loud!
Tearing him apart, not voting or voting for a democrat seems to be popular. Stop giving in to the hate and start trying to come together. Really, the petulance is tiresome.
….#16….Real conservative? God help us!
What? This reminds of the advertising slogan “look for the union label.” Is there a definition of a Conservative label? These kind of discussions are teetering on the brink of Kookdum. It’s my way or the highway divisiveness.
Sadly, this sand box isn’t too much fun to play in with all the smelly depositions that are being made.
Let’s get a little real here, folks…
Some of you are quoting McCain promises, made in the course of this nomination fight, tailor-made to court conservatives. You obviously are putting credence in them.
That is simply weird…
delusional…
irrational.
One of the things we KNOW (having been shown several times VERY RECENTLY) about McCain’s character that he
LIES.
What do we know about his regard for the Constitution? He SHREDS it.
What do we know about his respect for the opinion of those in opposition to his pet ideas. He PRACTICES PERSONAL DESTRUCTION, demonizes, goes bully-boy…but only if you are a Republican. He makes the Clintons jealous with what he gets away with.
What do we know about his real mind? Who does he have whispering in his ear? Who are his friends? With whom does he draft legislation?
How does he feel about free markets? About entrepreneurs? About contracts?
I think people underestimate how easy it’ll be to vote for a conservative third party candidate when they see polls showing McCain trailing badly in the polls.
My bumper sticker suggestion:
You Know McCain Will Lose Anyway;
Be a Maverick and Vote for a Conservative Instead.
/shameless plug on
I have posted my most recent column, Advice for John McCain. Please read and pass on.
/shameless plug off
What do you call a politician
1) who believes the government should get more of your money, not less (against tax cuts)
2) who believes in Global Warming and advocates government controls and regulation to “fix” it, resulting in less freedom for individuals and companies
3) who believes that terrorist non-citizens apprehended as enemy combatants should get the benefit of our court system just like US Citizens and not be under the jurisdiction of the US military who captured them
4) who believes waterboarding is “torture” just like cutting off limbs, poking out eyes, drilling through the skull, blowtorching various body parts, etc.
4) who believes that illegal alien invaders should get special preferential treatment even though they break our immigration laws with impunity
5) who believes that open borders is preferable to “building the g-d fence” and that we couldn’t find Americans to pick lettuce for $50/hour
6) who believes that the “Gang of 14″ was a good idea even though it prevented the Republican majority from finally putting an end to Democrat filibustering of judicial nominations
…and there is much more like Keating 5, I just can’t remember it all (which may be what he’s counting on).
As a conservative I would not and can not support a politician who believes and acts on these things. I am under no obligation to support and vote for someone because there is an R next to their name – isn’t that what we question about 90% of blacks voting for a candidate just because there’s a D next to the name?
It’s not a dislike for the man – it’s a fundamental disagreement over principles and ideas and the actions he has taken throughout the years – his past actions speak louder than any present words. The past is prologue.
O yeah and let’s not forget he believes wholeheartedly in limiting the people’s right of free political speech…just a minor thing, really, sort of based on the principle “If you can’t say anything nice, don’t say anything at all…or we’ll fine and/or imprison you!”
You aren’t being belittled. But you aren’t saying anything new or newsworthy either. It’s as though you are saying over and over again ‘water is wet’ as though it is some revelation.
Do something interesting other than telling everyone that ‘water is wet’ or ‘McCain is not conservative’.
Call for a third party conservative. Don’t vote for McCain. There are tons of D’s who won’t vote for McCain either. That doesn’t make them bad Americans.
I guess I just don’t know what you are trying to accomplish by telling everyone over and over and over again that ‘McCain isn’t a conservative’. None of the front runners were and now you are ‘surprised’? That’s what gives me pause for reflection.
He’s not different now than he was 2 months ago, and he’s not going to change. None of your whining is going to make him change. YOU DON’T HAVE TO VOTE FOR HIM. NOBODY IS FORCING YOU TO VOTE FOR HIM. So don’t vote for him. We get it already.
That still remains to be seen.
Might I add everyone should look at Ruths web site. She is an outstanding artist. Nice, very nice Ruth, I thought I was the only conservative artist out here.
Excellent summary, LONGBOW…
and let us NOT forget that McCain is a Republican today…
only as a cynical political posture to serve his drive to gain power.
He could swing either way…
all the same to him.
ACHefty~I read your column and you said something that I’ve been saying for awhile~McCain needs to pick a conservative running mate.
McCain def. wasn’t my choice for the Republican party, but I still think he’s better than what the dems are offering us.
You know, all this debate about supporting McCain in the general election vs. Hillary OR Obama, IMO, somewhat misses the point that ONE OF THEM will end up in the Oval Office. We may not like the choices – I know I don’t – but not voting won’t keep them all out. I know that there are principles at stake, but paraphrasing Gabe in #5 above, there’s a lot more at stake here than which party ends up winning. Think about this – we put either of the Dems in the White House, the troops come home in 60 days, and then – BAM – al Qaeda pulls off a big one, and we’re back to 9/12.
My point is this – If that scenario were to play out, it might not matter so much who’s sitting on the Supreme Court, or how many illegals are “doing the jobs Americans won’t do”. All I can do is vote, but I’m at least going to do that to try and keep al Qaeda off American soil.
I think one thing is seriously being overlooked in the whole thing.
Does anyone honestly believe that McCain has a shot?
There’s no doubt that he has damaged himself with conservatives, but does anyone honestly believe that “He ain’t Obama/Hillary” will be enough to get out the votes?
I don’t think it is.
That’s rich coming from the site that often slams those with “Bush Derangement Syndrome”
OldGuy has it right.
McCain cannot win.
He can’t carry the South.
He can’t carry the Inter-Mountain West.
He is easily the weakest of the former first tier candidates because of who he is and has been.
But our nominating process has given us this loser.
That is what we need to be addressing with our vote.
Blind Mule-
Thank you very much for the compliment on my art. I appreciate that very much.
The wolf painting is from a photograph by Monty Sloan at Wolf Park. A blog post about the park is currently up over at Blackfive.net because blogger Laughing Wolf recently visited the park. They have a video of him with the wolves! It is great.
Yes, being a Conservative Christian artist is rare these days. But we have to stick together!!
Thanks again,
Ruth
All I need to know about McCain is that Geraldo loves the guy.
Yes, we should hold McCain accountable and let him know that he needs us not just to win this year, but again when he wants his second term.
That notwithstanding, sometimes I find it just bewildering how so many people can storm around hissyfitting saying they just can’t, in good conscience, vote for McCain. Even as someone who can’t stand him, I find this attitude to be somewhere between the Twilight Zone and the Outer Limits.
I’m getting tired of remaking points differently every time the same people simply state in 10 words or less that they cannot vote for him “in good conscience”,so here are are some retro responses which I’ll be using from now on:
On Immigration:
On the issue of judges, as much as most of us on this board dislike McCain immensely, mostly because of his liberal stand on this very issue, he isn’t half as liberal as Hillary or Obama. In the future some similar suits will eventually make it to the Supreme Court. Right now this country is balancing between two worlds; we are neither a Sovereign Nation nor a Sanctuary Nation. Whether we become one or the other will likely depend on just a few judges who just happen to be among the most powerful on earth, and who cannot be removed for the rest of their lives. As ironic as it seems, if McCain is the Republican nominee, we’re going to have to support, vote him into office and tolerate him for four years. Why? Because Hillary or Obama will fill the judges seats as quickly as they possibly can with open-boarders socialist liberals - maybe in just a few months from taking office. Will McCain? Not likely. Why? Because McCain wants power first, and if he wants a second term, he’s going to have to at least modestly stay in line. Hillary and Obama get their power from those who believe in the reverse of what we do.
On Not Voting McCain on Conscience:
Those of us who are sucking it in by voting for McCain have principles, too, which one would not know from some of these posts, and I feel our principles are better than theirs, quite frankly, with all due respect. We’re doing something monumentally unplesant personally for the good of the country, as opposed to doing something for ourselves, and when you vote in contradiction to the good of the country over a misplaced sense of principle, you’re doing it for yourself. Sorry, but that’s how it shakes out unless you explain how allowing Hillary or Obama will be good for the country (and none of that Rush-on-meds stuff about uniting the conservatives as we all skip into the land of Oz, because that’s what that theory is, the land of Oz.)
Here’s a question for you:
If by the inaction of putting your “feelings” above the good of the nation (an illness some conservatives seem to have caught from liberals these days, it appears), you contribute your little share to the deaths of 80,000 of your innocent, hardworking fellow Americans, and breaking the hearts and destroying the lives of hundreds of thousands more as those killed will be grieved, will you still, knowing what you did, be able to look at yourself in the mirror and say “Yes, I was right and I’d do it again.”
Let me give you a head’s up from where I stand: if your answer is “yes”, then in my opinion, knowing the potential in advance, you are self-aggrandizingly delusional to the point of having very serious issues with reality, to put it politely. No offense, but I mean that sincerely.
Your feelings are important. Your sense of ethics and morality are important. But your little feelings do not trump the needs of your country. If every soldier in our military thought like you do, then we’d have no heroes.
We all have to do lousey things for our Country, shi*ty things we simply hate. But you and I, by the Grace of God, are not called upon to go out and die while doing them. But as you know, our soldiers do. For you to say that voting for a candidate you detest is too difficult and too painful for you to do, you and like-minded soulmates should take another spin around Arlington National Cemetary sometime. Look at each grave. In that instant of death, as realization hit, I’ll bet all of them wished with all their heart that they were instead home with their loved ones, but I’ll bet not one regretted doing what needed to be done.
It seems to me that sucking it in and casting an unpleasant vote for the best interests of the country when unpleasant choices are all we have isn’t asking for a hell of a lot in the big picture. Or are you so self-absorbed that you just don’t care?
Folks, I read your postings and I can only agree to disagree. Imagine you live in Tx. Bush lied to get elected but put siginificant space before each blow to conserfative causes. Rick Perry lied but only waited 2 weeks to hammer conservative causes, Now KB hutch guts the fence before running for
gov. McCain will do the same only he will shaft the whole country! This race is far from over and quite frankly I would think Huck, far from first choice would be more responsive to us conservative causes than McCain. At least Huck does not have a track record of deliberately shafting conservative voters.
I think of George Orwell every time I hear the term Gay Marriage. Newspeak is alive and well in America.
BTW: You have the analogy above wrong. Michelle is not like that guy at all. Instead she is the one in the room that realizes that guy has no conviction.
Artbyruth,
Blind mule is right, your stuff looks nice. I only took a very quick peek but it looks like watercolor to me. If so, congrats again, because that, unlike most other mediums, is one in which no mistakes are allowed – those transparent washes are a one-way road; trickier than the final result would suggest.
How strange…
Some of us here are saying we will never support McCain.
We say why; rationally, clearly.
We have shown why, using sound political realities, he cannot win a general election.
We are being attacked for not supporting a man who we feel deserves no support.
The man’s character is fatally flawed. He is not “imperfect” as one post said. He is unsupportable. He is reprehensible.
He is better than a Dimocrate? How can that be, when he has shown MORE THAN ONCE he was prepared to be a Dimocrate…if it served his hunger for power.
Consider this: how many federal judgeships are unfilled now, and will be at the close of this administration, because of John McCain and his “band of brothers” who deplored the Constitution and, at least respecting the Republicans, defied their leadership and their constituents?
The question still remains Mr_Conservative_Cat, can he galvanize enough voters to come out and support him in enough numbers to defeat Hillary or Obama?
The sad fact is that he is a lackluster offering with nothing to energize the voting public to support him.
It’s not enough to get all conservatives to vote for him, there has to be a certain number of moderates and independents willing to look at him and choose him over the other choices.
I don’t think he has the appeal needed to get enough votes to win in a general election.
All this teeth gnashing and hand wringing is pretty useless considering what we got to work with here.
“Go right…”
Monitors meet coffee.
Still ROFL
MM, you said it best when you said “Senator McCain is the inevitable Republican presidential nominee. He is headed, though, for a defeat of McGovernite dimensions if he can’t sway conservatives to get behind his candidacy. For their part, conservatives don’t want McCain, but even less do they want to spend the next four-to-eight years saying “President Obama,” let alone reliving history with another President Clinton.”
What more can be said beyond this? We are going to have to hold our noses, vote for McCain, and pray hard that he won’t betray conservative principles. We already know that either Dem candidate will most assuredly do so…right?
Lets concentrate on seeing to it that we pack our state legislatures with conservatives and send good law makers to the congress. It seems to be our best hope for defending against what’s coming.
I’m not going to be critical of those who choose to support McCain that’s their decision.I just know myself,family and friends will not.We will vote down the ballot.Maybe McCain and Dr.Hernandez can join Mexican president Caldarone this week in his illegal alien promotion tour,he was in New York yesterday meeting with various open borders folks and in the coming week will meet with the govenator in California.This is not a state visit rather a 5 day illegal alien promotion tour of the U.S.
I also feel the republicans in congress and the senate will fight a amnesty harder against a democratic president.
***MAVERICK CANDIDATE, meet MAVERICK VOTER***
Now that the democrats have managed to place one of their own on both party tickets, conservatives need to look at their options. We can vote for a man whose actions have shown his contempt for conservatism or we can stand on principles (has anyone stopped to think our words and actions have meaning?) and vote for the most conservative third-party candidate available. McCain won’t beat the democrat party candidate anyway and I would like to think that some of Bush’s minions (Graham, McConnel, Hutchinson, Kyl, etc.) would have a more difficult time supporting the coming new “amnesty” if it was presented by a Democrat president. McCain’s dislike of the appointment of Alito tells you where his court appointments are headed. We would get more Suiters on the bench. If conservatives voted massively for the Constitution Party candidate it would send a message to the Republican Party. I plan to let my Senators (Chambliss/Isakson) and Representative know that they will not receive my support unless they promote and support conservative legislation. I will vote for the most conservative running from all parties and vote for and support Congressional representation that deserves my support.
Heh. What goes around comes around, eh, Michelle? (Almost makes you want to rethink the whole name calling thiing, doesn’t it?)
I enjoy the smugness of some liberals/Demoncraps thinking that those of us who refuse to support McVain are pulling for their party.
NOT.
I am not voting for any presidential candidate.
McVain, Hillbilly, and Obamanation are all of equal value.
That says it all. That is the PERFECT!
I’m with Gabe and Artybyruth on this in a manner. Altough I may not vote as I have no faith in the current political process. I do know one thing, personally I Don’t give a crap if you have an R, D or Q or any other letter next to your name. I care about the good of this nation and the survivle of our people. I Am a Nationalist, not a Constatutionist. And frankly, there is no Conservitive canidate, and frankly if two of our three picks win, what makes you think a nation will be left to vote for in 2012?
I for one Don’t think it will be, I just hope what takes its place will be worth it. Already with the turning on MacCain, I shudder with knowladge that Obama and Hillary will have the best chance, and there is nothing “good” for our people in any fiber of their whole beings. I will tread the 08 election and not old my breath on a new one.
tread and hold* I need to proofread more
The conservatives who recently discovered they loved Romney did nothing prior to last week to elect him, so he’s gone. (And BTW he’s no true conservative either.)
I’m voting for McCain. There is no true conservative running, but there is a true leftist. Think about it, hard, before you write McCain off.
the jack bauer endorse should help his national security cred. good news.
I’m with MM, unless we see some action I continue to think of each new endorsement as a “sell out” and a non-event in changing my non-support for McCain.
George Allen – sellout, he should know better, seems like he would do anything to be relevant again.
John Bolton – sellout for promise of Sec of State or something, such an int’l policy wonk I doubt he gives a hill of beans about domestic policy (taxes or illegal immigration).
Gary Bauer – never heard of him so I can’t say
Tom Coburn – I assume sellout, but I really can’t figure it out, I took him for smarter than that – does he think McCain won’t give amnesty to 12-20M illegals as soon as he hires a few border patrolman and builds a barbed wire fence across the southern border?
If Jeff Sessions endorses without having McCain sign his immigration pledge – then I will really lose faith.
The McCain campaign didn’t suffer a July crash fer noth’n, the outrage was real and well deserved, not all of us has forgotten the back stabbing and name calling.
McCain has his own continuing outrage to blame for his problems.
Nobody on the right believes him and he’s shown no sign of proving anybody wrong.
If he thinks he can win the Presidency from the votes of not so far lefties more power to him.
I doubt he can pull off any such thng and we Conservatives have every right to continue outing McCain as a liberal every bit as long as he continues consorting with known amnesty lobbyists and bashing us for not being stupid.
“On the other are those who would refine old principles under the guise of adapting them to new situations”
By definition, principles are unchanging. If you “adapt” them to new situations, they aren’t principles as much as political tactics. And yes, McCain does run in that circle. Which is the problem.
i smell a photoshop project for later…heh heh.
Hmmmm! I have been one who has been supporting a vote for McCain but I am having second thoughts.
How about a vote for Hillary with the thought that she will be better than Obama but splitting the democrat party.
African-Americans may start looking seriously at what another party has to offer and elitist whites would have fun criticizing her every move. The feminists and Hispanics would be happy and very defensive to any critics.
All of that may allow a true conservative to emerge that we can stop bickering over. Too devious? This is politics!
Just what are the best interests of the country and what is the “big picture?
Some would argue that the best interests of the country do not lie in “settling” for the lesser of two evils. Some would argue that had the prevailing widsom of settling for less than what is truly right been accepted over 200 years ago we would still be a colony of Great Britain.
As for the big picture, does the big picture focus on the short term goal of prevailing at the polls 9 months from now, or does it look beyond short term results and focus on the future.
Berating people who have the courage and conviction to stick to their principles happens to be the very topic that Michelle raised in this thread. If you don’t vote for McCain, you are anti-troop, anti-security, uncaring and “self absorbed”. You should “get in line” and “STFU”.
While most people do think for themselves and would undoubtedly consider the impact of the alternatives, when coated with the accusatory rhetoric of their very principles being loathesome to the best interests of the nation, it becomes ever-more unlikely that the option of settling for the lesser of two evils will be viewed as an acceptable alternative.
There are those who beilive some things in life are not neogtiable nor subject to compromise, like core principles and values. If we are to be damned for holding the line on our core beliefs, our sense of right and wrong, than so be it. We will stand with those other men who refused to settle and stood by their principles, men who include those whose signatures appear on the Declaration of Independence and those that include men and women whose final resting place is marked, etched in marble, on the stones in Arington.
Some of us served this great nation to preserve freedom and liberty. Freedoms that include speech and expression. Freedoms that include the right to cast our vote as we see fit. If you have a difference of opinion, it is certainly your right to make it known. But it is not anyone’s right to work to silence the freedom of speech or expression, whether through intimidation, threat or otherwise.
Speakup–
Hmmm…
I think there is definitely something there…
Could that be the real impulse behind the “shut up and break-over” tone of McCain and some of his more strident lesser-of-evils apologists…???
Jim M. said:
“But it is not anyone’s right to work to silence the freedom of speech or expression, whether through intimidation, threat or otherwise.”
Unless, of course, you happen to be John McCain who was the principal author of the un-Constitutional McCain-Feingold act….
Within the first two years of Hillary or Obama the SCOTUS will be 5/4 or more likely 6/3 liberal activist. We can elect all the conservatives we can and it will be for not. Every conservative issue will be set back for the foreseeable future. I don’t see that that will be good for conservatism and the country.
Gary who???
Not quite true. If a Democrat wins the Presidency, the Republicans in Congress will be galvanized to REJECT their socialist ideas. The Dems will have to fight tooth and nail to get anything bad passed.
If McCain wins the Presidency, Republicans in Congress will be pressured to support the socialist ideas that the Democrats already support. All those crap bills just sail on through for a guaranteed signature.
And if he wins, that would almost guarantee his place in 2012 as the incumbent. So… do I vote against him, allow the Dems to screw things up, and have a chance to get a real conservative positioned against an ineffective Dem incumbent in 2012… or do I suffer through (potentially) 8 years of McCain just to see another Dem elected afterwards?
No thanks.
OK, OK, I get it! Conservatives are PO’d that J-Mac is the GOP nominee.
This talk of voting for a democrap is utter lunacy, however! The idea that a “bad” 4-years with a dim in office will only lead to a new Ronald Reagan in 2012 is a pipe dream.
Well, he (Mac) gave a good speech at CPAC, but what he needs to do now is take action (he is still a senator, BTW) over the next 6 months and put his money where his mouth is.
I am still decidedly undecided, but I don’t want to leave my vote for POTUS blank if Sen. McCain can help it.
As it stands today, I will not support that RINO, Mr. McCain. If he would like to introduce some legislation to control illegal immigration or restore political freedom of speech or make a statement that Gitmo will remain open for business, I might consider voting for him. But until then, forget about it.
“Yet, we continue to be belittled:”
Sorry but if the shoe fits…perhaps we should continue whining until we have the scary and ever popular Obama presidency!
Get on with it already.
That’s a good point, Jim. I suspect there were many folks who wrung their hands at the prospect of independence and the unknown.
Personally, I’m just not moved by “it’s the end of the world” variety arguments. Nor by the, “yes, America’s doomed to go down the toliet, but with candidate A the flushing sound will last a month longer than candidate B” reasoning.
I understand folks who make ut are sincere, fine people but it leans toward the hysterical in my thinkin’.
Now, what I really want is more photoshops! Great good fun on a Monday morn.
Mike – I think if you look at the general American electorate/landscape it’s more than likely he’ll still be a Senator even after the election. I suspect that’s why he hasn’t resigned that office.
You got it right that he can do tangible things in Congress right now to validate any newly-claimed conservative creds.
Exactly the point of my column. Excerpt:
I remember Gary Bauer. He co-authored Children At Risk – great read, by the way - with Dr. James Dobson. He was also in the Reagan administration in the 80s in the Dept. of Ed, if I remember correctly.
I hadn’t heard that he was endorsing McCain. I wonder how that is setting with his co-author, who has come out for Huckabee?
Sound advice Michelle, but it needs to be coupled with a caveat: And don’t marginalize yourselves.
Purist conservatives aren’t being told to “shut up.” Pointing out the consequences of sitting things out or casting a “protest” vote in November, and asking people to consider those consequences carefully, isn’t telling anyone to “shut up.”
To claim otherwise is sophistry, something I am not accustomed to seeing issue from Michelle’s keyboard.
By all means, speak up! This is your big chance to do what you can to make a positive difference. You can influence party planks, influence staff choices, influence the Vice President pick, and more.
McCain isn’t stupid. He’d like to get your votes. That gives you leverage, if you choose to use it.
But self-marginalization through variations of “No, never, death first!!” pronouncements isn’t putting that leverage to any good use.
If the Republican Party is a damaged vessel in your view, wouldn’t you rather try to do everything possible to salvage her before having her scuttled? There’s 8 or so months to try to salvage something. Why not give it a try before simply firing a spread of torpedoes?
Thank you, Mr. Conservative Cat, I appreciate it.
And yes, the painting is watercolor. I do drawings in pencil and paintings in watercolor for now. Am thinking about oils soon.
Milwaukee Mike wrote:
“This talk of voting for a democrap is utter lunacy, however! The idea that a “bad” 4-years with a dim in office will only lead to a new Ronald Reagan in 2012 is a pipe dream.”
Yes! Look at how the Republicans in Congress have acted since 2006. Nothing has gotten done.
And to think that they would stand up to a Hillary or Obama is another pipe dream. They won’t do squat and Hillary or Obama will appoint Socialist judges who will make law from the bench.
Am I thrilled to have McCain as our nominee?? Heck no! I am an Arizona native and know McCain and have written letters in the AZ. Republic to him denouncing him time and time again for his Liberal views.
BUT he is far better than Hillary Clinton and Barak Obama who will destroy all the hard work our military has done in Iraq and they won’t lift a finger to protect us and Israel from Iran because they think “America” is the enemy in the Middle East.
At least McCain gets it that the Terrorists are the enemies.
Maverick candidate — meet maverick voter? ummmmm … that was my line. To use it, send fair-use fee to my blog. (Joking — about the fee.)
Message to
ScroogeMcAmnestyMcCain, the Estranged One:1) how about AFTER the fence is built and employment verification system set up — to include a cabinet-level admin to supervise a nation-wide SS verification system available to all authorities (say 1 yr?) — declare a moratorium on legislation until AFTER public hearings? Meanwhile, enforce existing laws.
(That might ease some of the anger.)
2) Back off on closing Gitmo. (Otherwise, offer to send all enemy combatants to Arizona and let YOUR state deal with them …. they’ll love wearing pink!)
3) Mention torture and waterboarding one more time and we’ll demand that you release your classified CIA files on your confinement in Hanoi. Choi duc oi, eh?
4) And Mitt as your VP will go a long way toward redeeming your contemptible demeanor.
5) And about Lindsay Graham …. Doesn’t the South Pole need an onsite, year-round diplomatic envoy? Snow plow fleet commander?
Regulus wrote:
“By all means, speak up! This is your big chance to do what you can to make a positive difference. You can influence party planks, influence staff choices, influence the Vice President pick, and more.”
Yes exactly! When he announces his pick for VP and we Conservatives (and bloggers) do not like the choice…do you think we will be silent and just go along with it??
No, I imagine there will be an outcry that McCain will not be able to silence…and that is what FREEDOM is all about. Our influence will begin long before he enters the White House.
I don’t think he does. He doesn’t realize that leaving the border wide opens exposes this country to terrorists, gangs and diseases.
Sophistry is saying one thing while meaning another. I would say she always mean’s what she says. I assure you the politicians however are quite good at sophistry. She does not need to act like a politician and abandon any of her principals. I would say that the way you phrased your argument was expert sophistry. You know, like making the weaker argument the stronger
“At least McCain gets it that the Terrorists are the enemies.”
That he wants to befriend, lawyer up and protect captured terrorists who are plotting to attack American civilians and troops speaks to a profound “not-getting-it”.
Yup. A good, sincere person may disagree with me, but all that means is – well, a good sincere, person just disagrees with me.
Well said, purplepeep!
How interesting that when one says they cannot nor will vote for McCain it equates to they are not voting at all.
This is not what I said. I will vote, for my senators , congressman, even the local dog catcher.
I see alot here expounding the RINO line of we must support the republican at all cost. Well the republican in this case is no different then the democrat. McCain has demonstrated he could care less what the party would like and the conservatives. The gaggle of 14 is but one example.
Seems to me that there is a lot more RINOs out there then I previously thought.
I love how I get called a RINO and every other name in the book for backing McCain, and yet the anti-McCain people complain they are being called names such as “deranged.”
Some of the comments ARE deranged, or does nobody remember people rambling 2 days ago on this very site about Joseph Mengele.?
Insults go both ways.
G. Gordon Liddy refers to those anti-McCain forces as “Suicide Bomber Republicans.” He is right.
Respectfully,
eric aka the Tygrrrr Express
http://www.blacktygrrrr.wordpress.com
On February 11th, 2008 at 1:09 pm, purplepeep said:
-Mister P said:
Sophistry is saying one thing while meaning another. I would say she always mean’s what she says. -
“Yup. A good, sincere person may disagree with me, but all that means is – well, a good sincere, person just disagrees with me.”
I’ll have at it tooth and nail with folks but I try to avoid questioning their root sincerity.
Though I do expect sophistry and dissembling from establishment politicans of any party and I am pleasantly surprised when one goes against that grain.
McCain gave a very good speech at CPAC, and appeared sincere about his desire to unite the Republican Party.
However, as each day passes with no substantive signs regarding consideration of reassessing some of his policies, the sincerity of his words becomes more and more questionable.
In fact, based on what we have seen since his speech at CPAC, it looks like McCain’s idea of uniting the party is to rack up endorsements from the party faithful who then attempt to achieve unification by chastising and berating those who may still take issue with his nomination.
I saw Jack Kemp over the weekend accuse Sean Hannity of “ragging” on McCain. Ragging? It seems the unification plan is focused on marginalizing or demonizing the McCain doubters, relying on good old peer pressure to shame conservatives into hanging with the cool kids. Such tactics make some of wonder why substance is being buried under a pile of rhetorical guanno, looking all the more like any outreach will be limited to reaching out to clasp a hand over the mouths of McCain’s detractors.
So far, the simcerity of MCCain’s words bears no resemblence to the sincerity of his actions.
What is funny about this is that G. Gordon Liddy was the suicide bomber that did in President Nixon.
I really wonder if some of you realize how morally and rationally untenable supporting McCain would be.
This isn’t a matter of supporting a “lesser”. In many important ways, you are looking at a distinction without a difference.
McCain is not a Dimocrate…at the moment…, but he has flirted with accepting that “brand”. Funny for a “maverick”. Unbelievable for a conservative who says he is Reagan’s heir.
Are you seriously fooled by his option to run as a Republican? Do you believe his claims to be a conservative?
He is most demonstrably a fellow traveler with some of the most liberal “minds” in the political class, where he has also distinguished himself as a more than usually disdainful enemy of the rights of people vis-a-vis their government.
Are you fooled by his cheap-talk election cycle “conversionSSSSS” respecting border issues and illegal immigration, limited government, tax policy, federal funding of stem-cell research, or…well, you do the research?
When did you hear him promise to repeal McCain-Feingold?
His embrace of the anti-rational religion of global climate change is at least as threatening to the future of Western Culture as is his moral confusion on the status of jihadists, with his drive to bring them into our midst and provide them criminal defendant protections (unheard of in our history of warfare).
Are you blind to what the man says?
For a remarkable number of those posting here, the answer seems to be…
Yes!
Ted Olsen has endorsed McCain. I doubt anyone can find some personal motive to account for Ted Olsen’s endorsement. Now there is no excuse to boycott McCain. Case closed.
Sounds like they are reverting to Clinton (Liberal) Mafia tactics.
***MAVERICK CANDIDATE, meet MAVERICK VOTER***
It’s called he drank the RINO kool-aid
***MAVERICK CANDIDATE, meet MAVERICK VOTER***
“Morally and Rationally Untenable?”
So McCain supporters are immoral and irrational. Got it.
It is this kind of commentary that allows those on the right to be portrayed as intolerant bigots.
I am a rational individual leading a moral life that supports McCain.
It seems those screaming the loudest in capital letters about being attacked are doing most of the attacking.
Respectfully,
eric aka the Tygrrrr Express
I am going to vote for gridlock rather than for a traitor to our country that tried to get one leg of the stool of the North American Union/SPP implemented using every sleazy back room deal with La Raza, LULAC demonizing conservatives and 80% of the American people along the way.
Juan McCain is an elitist, CFR, sock puppet who along with the RNC apparatus manipulated the vote for him to become our nominee.
As Brett Winterble said in his Human Events piece;” The Republican Party has been hijacked. Over the past month a new Axis of Evil has emerged — not one based in Damascus, Tehran or Pyongyang — but instead in Cedar Rapids, Charleston, South Carolina, Derry, New Hampshire and Boca Raton, Florida”. “It is the liberal and “independent” voters in these 4 states that have nearly completed a deed that makes Kim Jong Il envious — the near crippling of the American Electoral System”.
IMHO-there was massive voter fraud,or vote rigging, especially in Florida, Louisiana, W Virginia NH, California and now Washington State.(Do a Google, the MSM is not covering this)
Liberals and independents elected our Nominee thanks to people like Charlie Christ(r)who allowed illegal party changes on Super Tuesday. In Los Angeles, California, there are over a million voters that had their voter registrations hijacked so they could not vote for a nominee and currently there are 2 million absentee ballots that have not been counted, yet McCain was declared the winner. I was one of them and had to demand a provisional ballot.
Watch this YouTube video of a registered republican being told he had to vote democrat in California.
Not a peep from the CFR controlled MSM, their guy “won”.
The Rockefeller GOP Elite have sold conservatives out and will sell America out if we do not take our Party and country back.
Brett Winterble’s battle cry says it all;” This is our party, not John McCain’s or Mel Martinez’s, or Lindsay Graham’s. The Republican Party is THE conservative party dammit. Let’s admit it and take it back. RINOS and Liberals have taken the GOP plane hostage, and its time for us passengers to revolt…and do what has to be done — Let’s Roll.”
Ted Olsen’s wife was killed in the attack on the Pentagon by Islamofacist terrorists who were here illegally. I don’t see him supporting someone that he thinks can’t be swayed on these major issues
But, but, but… if you vote third party instead of McCain, McCain will lose by 30 points instead of 15 points!
Now it is a boycott, suicde bombers …. LMAO. The call to stand with ones principles yet bend and change ones views is being stated. I do not like McCain, never have , never will.
I am mjust stateing my opinion and calling it like I see it. Do not RINOs bend and change their stance? I see those who want strong conservative values yet are calling to change them in order to keep a Republican in office. This does not fit with standing tall for ones beliefs. So if the shoe fits wear it. As for being a suicide bnomber. Well if you drop me off in Medina with an explosive pack, yep I may be one. Otherwise I am standing with my principles.
Indeed, just four years ago he was thinking of taking the brand of and being rode by a Democrat who has made a lifelong career of trashing our troops.
No, you don’t get it.
Nobody that I have seen here as said you are immoral or irrational…although both of those might be true of any of us.
Rather, what was stated was a question about whether you realize how morally and rationally untenable supporting McCain certainly would be.
Can you deny the points made following that?
No only do you not “get it” in the particular, you don’t seem to get it in the general.
Based upon some of the comments above, it would appear that there are some McCain staffers or operatives working the conservative web sites…
A person’s “character” has been defined as “the sum total of dispositions to action (including thinking and saying). An action is (apparently) out of character if it does not conform to the pattern the person has so far exhibited…” Oxford Dict. of Philosophy.
Listen to what is (and was) being said, watch what was (and is being) done. Judge for yourself!
G. Gordon Liddy refers to those anti-McCain forces as “Suicide Bomber Republicans.” He is right.
Heh, funny point there!
I think the dependence on irrational terminology to attempt to demonize those who disagree is not just silly, but also a big counterproductive waste of time.
Good, sincere people will just disagree, doesn’t require “bad guys”, much less “suicide bombers”. Pure silliness.
It was a condescending question!
What I clearly “get” is that I have my convictions, and my convictions are as valid as anybody elses.
Those that disagree with me…fine.
However, those that have a problem with me backing my convictions are bigots, pure and simple.
To indict everyone supporting McCain…including the above fellow ranting about voters in Boca Raton being worse than Kim Jong Il…is lunacy.
Respectfully,
eric aka the Tygrrrr Express
Arguing about who is right – those supporting McCain or those against McCain – is pointless. We are all adults here with most of us having lived through several elections.
We will make up our own mind on how we will or will not vote. As for me, at this juncture, I am considering leaving the top slot on the ballot blank and voting on the rest of it.
Might that change? Maybe. But, it isn’t looking good at this point. However, I am a thinking person and will continue to evaluate what transpires. If McCain begins to put some conservative actions with his rhetoric, I’ll see.
Will arguing with me about Clinton or Obama getting in office instead sway me or telling me that I have MDS change my mind? No. I don’t do well with intimidation – never have. It must be a character flaw of mine.
Only if by “convictions” you mean feelings.
In that case, I totally agree. Nobody can say your feelings are invalid.
But if by convictions you mean “considered positions”, I respectfully…and strongly…disagree.
For a person to take a contrary position…one based on reason…is NEVER bigotry.
But you do, undeniably, have a right to your opinion. I merely argue that that opinion seems to be predicated on a value system that you may wish to review. If, indeed, you are a self-identified conservative, I have stated a challenge to consider McCain’s reality against your proclaimed values.
Ragspierre,
You disagree with me, therefore I need to review my values system.
Perhaps you may wish to revalue yours.
You are now officially a pompous gasbag, and further dialogue with you is unnecessary.
I will continue to enjoy being mainstream America while you and the rest of the asterisks speak loudly to each other and learn nothing.
eric aka the Tygrrrr Express