On March 24th, 2008 at 3:32 pm, granite said:

#13 On March 24th, 2008 at 2:53 pm, JsinGood said:

“As soon as 200-pound bad guy decides it’s time to wrestle, 98-pound female police-person is at a serious if not lethal disadvantage.
Not always true – I have a good female friend who was part of an LAPD gang unit, and she got into a number of physical match-ups with gang members much, much larger than her. It’s how you fight, sometimes, more than size.”

And how would your female friend fare going against a 200-250 lb. gang-unit trained police officer who, in addition to his size, strength, and speed, has been trained how to fight smart?

“It’s how you fight, sometimes, more than size.”
OK.
Besides the “sometimes”, what about all the other times?

Precisely. And how many more altercations will a smaller woman get into because she is assessed by an assailant as an “easy target” that would not occur with a larger male officer?

To wit: not to be too precise, but a smaller (under 5 feet, slight of frame), roughly retirement age woman friend of mine was traveling in Philly and was almost carjacked. I say almost because
she pulled her rather large handgun out of her purse and put it into the perp’s face. He ran (probably soiled himself as well). She is a crack shot and was on her way to a marksmanship competition. LOL!

Or the pendulum swings to the other extreme, my kids school has skewed the curve so that my boy in 6th grade getting 85% is considered a C student; should he ever get into even the high 70s he’ll be a D student…there was a time that 72 or, at worst 75% was considered good for a C. “A” & “B” grades are both squeezed into the 90-100% bracket.

Depends who is writing the test. In my test 60 was about an average score. I saw tests as learning experienced and felt free to ask the hard questions.

On March 24th, 2008 at 2:26 pm, procopy said:
This is the same stuff they’re doing in every facet of life – you don’t want to upset anybody’s sensitivities.

In school, it’s the “Everybody get’s an ‘A’” mentality.

Or the pendulum swings to the other extreme, my kids school has skewed the curve so that my boy in 6th grade getting 85% is considered a C student; should he ever get into even the high 70s he’ll be a D student…there was a time that 72 or, at worst 75% was considered good for a C. “A” & “B” grades are both squeezed into the 90-100% bracket.

Yes, it creates an insular mentality. But that is not a bad thing.

Well, it’s like I stated. Insularity isn’t bad unless it creates a barrier to positive change or improvement (which I’ve seen many times). However, I agree that insularity, alone, is not a bad thing.

#19 Just a Grunt said:

That’s a great story, Grunt. Sad but true.

Did you ever hear about a Colonel John T. Corley while you were with Infantry at Ft. Benning?

Does anyone know if this was one of the Board’s findings?

The findings of the board were inconclusive at best. The initial reason for convening the board was to find out if there was a definciency in the operations that led to the death of Suzie Pena. Instead, Cheif Bratton used the board as an excuse to push his political agenda, and even then, questions like yours were left unanswered.

Elite organizations are insular by nature. In a group like SWAT, the Rangers, SF, or anything similar, you are dealing with a group of highly motivated, type A personalities. These people are self starters who constantly strive to achieve the peak of their operational capacity. They know that they need to depend on the other people in their group for their very lives. This develops some pretty close bonds within that group. You work with the same people, day in and day out, trusting them to do their job and watch your back, and they in turn are trusting you to do the same. Yes, it creates an insular mentality. But that is not a bad thing. It makes them better. It pushes them harder.

Just checking in as I’m working harder now on my actual business and don’t get to stop by much anymore. . .

but here’s my two cents. Diversity is not something that society should attempt for some ‘nirvana’. The idea that diversity is good stems from the idea that every society is good and there is no bad within a diverse society.

That’s the problem. Diversity means BOTH the good and the bad of society. So for example, with Islam we get a bunch of people dedicated to their god, but we also get the suicide bombers as well. You can’t have a ‘diverse’ society that only has the good parts of each society.

Diversity is a red herring put forth by the media.

This is probably one of the most incoherent posts that I’ve made in a while. . . but I’ve been studying and reading and learning and my brain is near mush by now.

How about an averaged sized female officer, whom is really smart, or an average sized male officer whom is really smart?

A female officer with a black belt in some martial art form, or a male officer with the same? (Duh, I know…how would one know?)

My point is, men are more intimidating than women when wearing black and carrying weapons. That is deterrent, and makes the composition of SWAT forces important for safety, and trust reasons!

Among its criticisms of the LAPD’S SWAT team, the Board of Inquiry found that its culture is “insular.”

This doesn’t say whether or not the Board found that the “insular” culture was negative or otherwise to blame for the death. Does anyone know if this was one of the Board’s findings?

It is moronic to imply that insular equals bad.

There’s nothing wrong with a culture being insular unless the culture itself is bad. In such a case, the insularity impedes a positive cultural change.

It’s quite possible that LAPD SWAT has a bad culture. However, 1) I haven’t heard this claim, and 2) even if it is true, while relaxing the standards might someday reduces the insularity, it certainly doesn’t address what was bad about the culture.

I don’t really care how many pull-ups a shooter can do… just don’t lower the marksmanship standards.

brooklyn red, I think that SWAT experts might be better qualified for optimizing the criteria by which candidates and graduates are selected for their program (as long as they are attempting to make the teams better).

Hollywood is responsible for much of this airheadedness. In movies and on TV, 120# women regulary karate kick the krap out of 250# male bruisers, leaving them crying for mercy.

Our kids see this silliness so many times growing up, (and get in actual physical altercations so rarely), that they believe it is a reflection of reality.

So naturally, they think women would do just fine as SEALs, Rangers, or SWAT members.