Whom to root against? CAIR sues Abercrombie & Fitch

By see-dubya  •  August 2, 2008 11:17 AM

Okay, this is ridiculous on many levels.

The Oklahoma chapter of the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR-OK) announced today that it has filed an EEOC complaint on behalf of a Muslim woman who was allegedly denied employment at an Abercrombie Kids store in that state because of the applicant’s religiously-mandated headscarf, or hijab.

The woman told CAIR-OK that a district manager claimed he could not hire her because her Islamic headscarf “does not fit the Abercrombie image.”

What, wasn’t the OKC Hooters hiring? This plaintiff is fighting to preserve her modesty while going to work for a company that’s injected more soft porn into our cultural bloodstream than Cinemax?

Next up: the Bada Bing Strip Club gets sued for refusing to let their dancers shimmy inside a burqa.

Of course the plaintiff was going to work for Abercrombie Kids, which is a pretty creepy bit of branding synergy right there. I didn’t even know such a thing existed. But I can see the niche it fills–parents worried that modern society is too sheltering. Some dad’s out there going, “my kids are going to preserve their innocence too long…is there a store where I can get them a head start on that lucrative streetwalker career?”

I remember when Abercrombie and Fitch was basically like Cabela’s or Bass Pro Shops for the Weatherby and Orvis set. I still have a faded T-Shirt of theirs, with the rhino logo, from the late 1980s. It’s a great loss.

On the other hand, as with Jamal Miftah, this is radical Islam asserting itself yet again in the heartland. This isn’t Manchester or Khartoum or Basra. Based on the A&F store locator, this is apparently either Penn Square Mall, or Quail Springs, or Woodland Hills malls in Oklahoma.

Which shouldn’t be surprising–after all, terrorism expert Steven Emerson first encountered radical Islam at the Oklahoma City fairgrounds on Christmas day, 1992.

So whom do I root against? The worst reactionary impulses of the seventh century, or the engines of postmodern degradation? A pox on both their houses.

UPDATE: It’s Tulsa, again. Thanks to reader MikeOK.

______________

{Post by See-Dubya. H/T to Cuffy at Perfunction–but a CONTENT WARNING on his post. He’s included some catalog samples of what “the Abercrombie image” is all about, which aren’t safe for work.}

Posted in: CAIR, Girls Gone Wild

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Comments


  1. #393691
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 11:33 am, zorro said:

    A pox on both their houses.

    As a general rule, it is not nice to curse anyone. But in this case, I agree. May they both be infested with flees of 10,000 camels.

  2. #393692
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 11:35 am, love2rumba said:

    Lock CAIR and Ambercrombie and fitch executives together in the same room – come back in 3 days remove the survivors and put them in prison for life and take the remains of those that didn’t survive and bury them…..problem solved

  3. #393693
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 11:38 am, pueblo1032 said:

    This is rich… They want to work at TARGET, but not handle pork… They want to drive a cab, but no liquor or dogs… Now, the greatest drain on adolescent morality in the retail sector??? Where does their seeking to control the AMERICAN business end… Not until they control it all, and we stop for PRAYER five times a day, and all say ALLAH AKBAR…

  4. #393694
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 11:42 am, Kimmer said:

    A few months ago I was bemused by something I witnessed at our local mall. A Muslim family — dad, mom (wearing the hijab), and two little (younger than 10 years) daughters entered an Abercrombie store. It wasn’t the Abercrombie for Kids, either.

    I wondered what their reaction was to the near-naked Barbie and Ken life-sized posters.

  5. #393695
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 11:46 am, Helene said:

    It’s amazing that the A&F manager was so stupid and commented on this ladies’ costume.

    How dumb can you get. All he had to do was to deny her a job after the interview and to keep his mouth shut.

    Next, we’ll have a bunch of muslims show up in burquas and demand employment at Victoria’s Secrets.

    The manager could have called her bluff and had her work full-time replacing stock or working at the cash register.

    Recently a hairdresser got in trouble for not hiring another Muslim, who refused to remove her scarf. The hairdresser believed that showing your hair should be part of the requirement for working as a hairdresser. Personally, I would never go to a hairdresser with a headscarf.

    Muslims could start their own businesses and sell to their own market, but they want to force changes in ours.

    We need to get smarter and not allow them to discriminate against us.

  6. #393696
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 11:50 am, tgusa said:

    Well many muslims are not afraid to say that they hate our culture yet they want us to deal with theirs. The message I get is there’s some lyin goin on. Nope they want to change us by force of law if necessary. I make a point of never shopping where I see these people, it’s a free country after all. They can go off anytime (sjs) and being a responsible parent if I were to do that I should be arrested, it’s a hate crime. Just say no, to islamist threats and intimidation that is.

  7. #393697
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 11:55 am, MikeOK said:

    This web site says that it was Woodland Hills mall in Tulsa.

    Also, it sounds like Steve Emerson’s encounter with radical Muslims occurred in downtown OKC, probably at the Myriad (now Cox) Convention Center. Still, it’s pretty scary stuff.

    Tulsa also has a few decent strip clubs so if the Abercrombie lawsuit doesn’t work out, there are still plenty of opportunities. Oh, and there’s always Hooters.

  8. #393699
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 11:58 am, robhic said:

    I don’t think you can go wrong rooting against anything CAIR! Like Mark Steyn writes in his excellent book America Alone, Islamofication starts out subtly and grows with each and every victory or (especially) legal win. See France and The Netherlands for example. Or even Britain!

    No, I don’t think there is anything such as bad anti-Islamofication!

  9. #393700
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 11:59 am, Jeddite said:

    This would be ridiculous if it wasn’t serious. Michael Savage discussed this lawsuit on his program yesterday – he’d know a thing or three about lawsuits against CAIR. And this would be an issue on which I agree with Dr Savage – this wasnt a random resume drop, this is a calculated effort on the part of CAIR to inject more, as you say, radical Islam in the American heartland.

    I have a friend who used to work as a manager at an A&F outlet, and he talked every so often about how he couldnt employ certain people because they didnt fit the A&F “image.” In most cases, it was, well, fat people. It wasn’t managerial decision-making that he was particularly proud of, but we’re not talking about morbidly obese people wanting to fold shirts, this was “pleasantly plump” people who clashed with the hard pectorals an washboard abs that adorn the walls of the shop.

    A&F lawyers will probably claim that physical fitness and dress are bonafide qualifications for occupation to work in their retail outlets, but I suspect they will just choose to settle out of court and the CAIR spook – because I dont believe for a moment this was a random attempt at retail employment – will move on to her next victim.

    And then what? Just one more court precedent, like others mentioned above by pueblo1032 (#3), of Islam trying to force business to function according to its tenants.

    Do you think that being dismissed from a job because a Christian refused to work on Sundays to attend church would merit a lawsuit? I know I dont.

  10. #393704
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:07 pm, robhic said:

    Oops, forgot the link for Mark Steyn’s book: http://www.steynonline.com/index

  11. #393705
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:07 pm, Rob said:

    There is an Oklahoma City Hooters?????
    Address?

  12. #393706
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:08 pm, robhic said:

    Oops, again. Make that: http://www.steynonline.com/

  13. #393707
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:08 pm, birdlady79 said:

    as long as we’re commenting on this – has anyone else read the story where one of the Tyson Foods plants, in Shelbyville, TN, will no longer recognize Labor Day as a paid holiday. Instead, they will recognize the Muslim holiday, Eid-al-Fitr, the end of Ramadan each year to accomodate the 700 muslim workers, out of the 1,200 employees. Let me repeat, Eid-al-Fitr will be recognized as a paid holiday, while Labor Day will not be. I wonder how the other 500 employees at the plant feel about this change? I hope they, en masse, are absent on Labor Day, which is recognized in America as a FEDERAL HOLIDAY, as well as this wonderful new paid day off, which is recognized in the muslim world as a holiday.

  14. #393709
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:09 pm, sdillard said:

    Oh please. No gym would hire someone who weighed 400 pounds as a personal trainer. Doesn’t fit the image. A&F have the right to have their employees look a certain way. I have no problem with that.

  15. #393710
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:09 pm, tgusa said:

    Yes and some companies here are helping them. Did anyone catch Debbie Schlussel’s piece on the islamization of Tyson foods? They are dropping Labor day for some islamist holiday instead. As she says buh bye Tyson. Hope they are well trained in halal and they don’t mind some employees being beheaded here and there for insulting islamist sensibilities[.?.].

  16. #393711
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:12 pm, tgusa said:

    Sorry birdlady79 ya beat me to it.

  17. #393712
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:12 pm, behiker said:

    I had to think about 1/10 of a second… I’m rooting against CAIR. The sooner people start standing up against CAIR and letting them know they don’t control us, the better. We can deal with A&F later and as necessary.

  18. #393713
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:13 pm, robhic said:

    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:08 pm, birdlady79 said:

    as long as we’re commenting on this – has anyone else read the story where one of the Tyson Foods plants, in Shelbyville, TN, will no longer recognize Labor Day as a paid holiday. Instead, they will recognize the Muslim holiday, Eid-al-Fitr,

    Yes, I read that article, too. Why don’t they let the muslims off for their holiday and make them work on the American holiday.

    That way the plant could remain open more days and you’d expect productivity to rise…

  19. #393715
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:15 pm, atheling said:

    Birdlady79:

    Yes, I heard about that too. Time to boycott Tyson.

    Major creeping Sharia.

  20. #393716
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:16 pm, jroberts said:

    So whom do I root against? The worst reactionary impulses of the sixth century, or the engines of postmodern degradation? A pox on both their houses.

    This is kind of nit-picking, but posts here seem to frequently get this wrong: It’s the seventh century. Muhammad allegedly started receiving his visions around 622, and the Muslim conquest of the Near East and North Africa happens almost entirely in the hundred years following.

  21. #393717
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:19 pm, simcoe said:

    Probably she was bait to elicit a lawsuit against deep pockets.

    Better to face the lawsuit up front. If she was hired that would have opened a floodgate of such suits for everything A&F stand for. Right down to the (sacrilegious) stuffed dog on display.

  22. #393719
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:21 pm, see-dubya said:

    jroberts:

    Fixed. Thanks.

  23. #393722
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:33 pm, tre said:

    Personally, I don’t think she wanted a job, she just wanted to cause trouble and claim Islamophobia.

    #11 Rob
    There’s one on Northwest Expressway just east of May Ave. and one in Brick Town. I’m sure there are others.

  24. #393724
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:43 pm, Rip Ford said:

    I’ve been down on A&F ever since they started marketing thongs decorated with cherries to 10-year-old girls. Still, I’m afraid I’d have to side with them over CAIR. As bad as A&F is, they seem the lesser of evils in this case.

  25. #393725
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:43 pm, Rob said:

    #11 Rob
    There’s one on Northwest Expressway just east of May Ave. and one in Brick Town. I’m sure there are others.

    lol

  26. #393726
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 12:45 pm, ajmontana said:

    Oldest trick in the book, this is just a distraction for what CAIR is really up to. no good.

  27. #393730
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 1:08 pm, Jaded said:

    I root against CAIR also and by the way on the Tyson story….they just lost a customer! Thank God for the freedom to decide not to buy the dhimmi’s products!!!!

  28. #393733
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 1:25 pm, beenthere said:

    When A&F starts flying planes into buildings, I’ll gladly do a moral equivalence number with C.W. Until then, get a grip man.

  29. #393734
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 1:29 pm, simcoe said:

    .
    Poor management.

    The dope should have kept the mouth shut. No reason to say anything. But if one must then its: “…found a better (or more qualified) candidate”.

  30. #393736
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 1:35 pm, havok said:

    I’m rooting for A&F…they use free speech as cover. CAIR wants me dead if I don’t convert.

  31. #393738
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 1:38 pm, Boomer said:

    I have absolutely no use for any product hawked by Abercrombie & Finch, but I have to side with them when it comes to fighting this continuous Sharia creep from CAIR and its allies. Despite the 1st Amendment rights these savages gain by coming over here, their form of totalitarian government disguised as a religion can not and will not every be able to coexist with any Democracy or our representative Republic (that I doubt exists after yesterday afternoon display by the Democrat leadership). The camels head is under the tent and unless we act soon we will be as doomed as Europe appears to be. Push back is coming and when it does it ain’t going to be pretty.

  32. #393743
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 1:58 pm, jroberts said:

    Is the hijab really that radical? It isn’t like she’s arguing for the right to wear a burqa at work. I’ve known hijab-wearers that wore otherwise Western clothes.

    I think there are two slippery slope arguments here. The first, as already mentioned, is that if the courts rule that you can’t discriminate on the basis of hijab-wearing, then what’s to stop them from ruling that you can’t discriminate on the basis of burqa-wearing.

    On the other hand, there is another slippery slope. We could end up like France. If you can discriminate on the basis of one religious item of clothing, why not on the basis of any religious item of clothing — e.g., cross necklaces or yarmulkes (not exactly a fair comparison, as the necklace isn’t mandatory in any denomination like the yarmulke or hijab). If A & F can not hire someone for wearing a hijab, why couldn’t they also not hire someone for being a Christian? Or are we only comfortable with religion when it’s invisible?

  33. #393744
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:05 pm, Gabe said:

    So whom do I root against?

    That is easy: the Muslims.

    Does anyone think this Muslim chick is not a pawn of CAIR and other terrorists? Does she REALLY want to work at A & F?

    They are a private organization, and if they feel a Muslim barbarian does not fit into their image, they have the right not to hire this witch.

    The ONLY reason she is suing is to help further the jihad against America.

    Note to barbarian Muslims: If you feel the need to wear the hijab and the burka, why are you even in our country? You would be much more at home back in the place from which you came.

  34. #393746
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:07 pm, brooklyn red said:

    Foul!

    She can’t claim to be religious AND want to work outside the home… its one or the other.

  35. #393747
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:09 pm, Concerned Citizen said:

    Hmmm. Do I want to see my country slowly taken over by jihadis or slowly taken over by Mexicans? Why do I feel like the Ghostbusters when Gozer asked them to choose the form of the destructor?

    Let’s see how much good those all important civil liberties are to the liberals when sharia replaces the Constitution.

  36. #393748
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:13 pm, Concerned Citizen said:

    Hey! Here’s an idea. Give her exactly what she wanted: a job.

    They should instantly apologize and offer her a job. Then have her sit in the stockroom sorting socks all day. When she gets them all sorted, the mangager can come in and jumble them all up again. Minimum wage combined with a boring, monotonous, pointless job. I just wish they had the stones to do it.

  37. #393749
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:18 pm, Lifeofthemind said:

    Remember the old A&F in Chicago’s Loop, terrific store. Hope I have some of the stuff around. Do not think the current business has any connection to the old one. Strange how a reliable firm lasted for a hundred years and then got swept away just when the popular market moved in the direction they had been holding all along. In this dispute the answer is clear, back A&F over CAIR.

  38. #393751
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:22 pm, Gabe said:

    Hmmm. Do I want to see my country slowly taken over by jihadis or slowly taken over by Mexicans?

    To me, the Muslim threat is far worse. All Muslims are barbarians to the core. They will never fit in or assimilate until they have sharia law.

    They only pretend to be Americans. I saved the following article to my favorites because this African Catholic priest is so dead-on correct about this religion of barbarians:

    http://www.christendom.edu/news/archives/archives06/nnorom.shtml

    Speaking of the fall of the Byzantine Empire, Nnorom said that he saw many parallels to today. The Byzantine Empire was a superpower like America and when the Muslims attacked they were surprised. “They did not take the Muslim threat seriously.”

    He stated that the raids of Muslim bands from the desert were much like the terrorist attacks of today. “People have been lobbying for action against these terrorists for over 20 years, but nothing happened until 9-11,” he said.

    Nnorom declared that if present trends continue, by the end of this century Europe would be gone. There will be “Eurabia” instead.

    Drawing further parallels to the past, he said that the Spanish Inquisition was simply another word for Homeland Security. Muslims pretended to be Catholic, just like they are pretending to be U.S. citizens.

    He has it exactly correct: This witch who wants a job at A & F is only a “pretend citizen.” She is a Muslim “citizen” first and foremost. She wants this job only to set a legal precedent and further the jihad.

    Anyone combatting barbaric Islam deserves our support.

  39. #393754
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:36 pm, TypicalWhite said:

    #5 – Helene, I remember that story. The salon in question was a punk salon in London – spiky pink hair and the like. The owner refused to hire the Muslim woman who applied because her hijab would not encourage the sort of customers the shop caters to.

    Last I heard, an Administrative Court had found in the Muslim woman’s favor and awarded her several thousand dollars for her emotional pain.

    Absolutely ridiculous!!

  40. #393755
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:37 pm, Jeddite said:

    Whether or not you like the clothes A&F sells (and A&F’s largest size is probably 10 sizes too small for me) is irrelevant. Whether or not you like the image A&F portrays (I do not) is irrelevant. This is a calculated effort by CAIR to attempt to establish a legal precedent. Does anybody mulling over who to support really believe that A&F jives with Islam? Does anybody mulling over who to support – A&F or CAIR – really believe that this was not a calculated decision to target CAIR? Does anybody mulling over who to support really believe that CAIR didn’t target A&F precisely because they knew the girl would be turned down for employment? Does anybody mulling over who to support really believe that the first place a teenage girl would run to to cry about job discrimination would be the Council on American-Islamic Relations?

    Wake up.

  41. #393756
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:37 pm, simcoe said:

    On August 2nd, 2008 at 1:58 pm, jroberts said:
    Is the hijab really that radical? It isn’t like she’s arguing for the right to wear a burqa at work. I’ve known hijab-wearers that wore otherwise Western clothes.
    I think there are two slippery slope arguments here. The first, as already mentioned, is that if the courts rule that you can’t discriminate on the basis of hijab-wearing, then what’s to stop them from ruling that you can’t discriminate on the basis of burqa-wearing.
    On the other hand, there is another slippery slope. We could end up like France. If you can discriminate on the basis of one religious item of clothing, why not on the basis of any religious item of clothing — e.g., cross necklaces or yarmulkes (not exactly a fair comparison, as the necklace isn’t mandatory in any denomination like the yarmulke or hijab). If A & F can not hire someone for wearing a hijab, why couldn’t they also not hire someone for being a Christian? Or are we only comfortable with religion when it’s invisible?

    Come on jroberts, after all this time and all the world events since 9/11, or even back to the Clinton years, you still haven’t checked it out for yourself.

    According to the Koran, in the world there is only Islam and those with whom Islam is at war.

    To paraphrase a line from the movie, The Sting:
    All ya got to do is reeead!

    Good grief!!

    To paraphrase MM, it is: The religion of perpetual outrage.

  42. #393757
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:42 pm, Stubby said:

    I consider Muslims our enemies. The religion of Islam appears inconsistent with our livestyles and our culture as we know it in the USA. They don’t belong here.

    I was always a very easy going man, accepting people based on their manner, character and values. Not until I was forced to deal with non-assimilating, rights demanding illegals, culturally abusive middle-easterners and now the in-your-face openly hostile behavior of Muslims, has the worst in me developed. I resent the arrogant, superior attitudes of these people and now I am ready for a confrontation with them on a daily basis here in the Los Angeles area.

    Not a day goes by that I don’t experience an adversarial encounter which involves rude and aggressive driving, disregard for rules of courtesy,
    obnoxious use of cell phones, and constant infringements on our way of life.

    They have no right to expect this country to accommodate their culture-clashing, disruptive anti American mores behavior and garb. They are a scheming, deceitful bunch with an agenda to overthrow and control this and all societies whose values are inconsistent with the Islam’s guidelines.

    We need to find a constitutional way to eliminate them from our lands.

  43. #393759
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:42 pm, SpeakEasy said:

    Sorry people but I have to ask; Was it necessary to link Obama with this story through the photograph? If not out of objectivity then how about just giving those of us who are of a different religion a break from seeing him everywhere. No wonder they think he is the second coming of Jesus, he seems to be omnipresent.

  44. #393762
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:45 pm, RyanInSanJose said:

    Does such a strict religion even allow someone to work at A&F?

  45. #393763
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:46 pm, SpeakEasy said:

    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:42 pm, Stubby said:We need to find a constitutional way to eliminate them from our lands.

    Does the 2nd Amendment count?

  46. #393766
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:53 pm, Stubby said:

    SpeakEasy…

    The 2nd amendment was partially written for this situation. It does count.

  47. #393767
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:55 pm, SpeakEasy said:

    Great Stubby. As my grandmother used to say, “Praise God and pass the ammunition!”

  48. #393768
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:57 pm, Stubby said:

    SpeakEasy

    Grandmother knows best. We have to respect our elders.

  49. #393769
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:59 pm, Ocracoke said:

    Speakeasy,
    Do you mean here or at Perfunction? If you mean Obama’s picture at Perfunction, it was simply the next thread down–no tie to this issue of AF at all.

  50. #393771
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:01 pm, JDinTX said:

    If we don’t say anything other than we don’t want to hire you, maybe they will go back to some other land. I think it is time to deport all muslims along with the illegals. They are trying to take over and run everything their way and it is not the Christian way I want. If I own a store, I hire and fire whom I want. I think I am smart enough not to offend by saying I don’t like your headdress.

  51. #393772
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:04 pm, englishqueen01 said:

    Recently a hairdresser got in trouble for not hiring another Muslim, who refused to remove her scarf. The hairdresser believed that showing your hair should be part of the requirement for working as a hairdresser. Personally, I would never go to a hairdresser with a headscarf.

    Not just any hairdresser – but an alternative hairdresser. I saw a picture of the shop owner in question, and she had pink hair.

    The owner also said the Muslim woman in question walked into the interview like she owned the place. In the end, the shop owner paid 4,000 pounds for “hurt feelings,” even though the tribunal hearing the case did not find the Muslim in question a victim of discrimination.

    Shari’a law won’t win by force, but politically correct liberal types will help it win by litigation.

  52. #393773
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:05 pm, atheling said:

    SpeakEasy:

    Bring back Alien and Sedition laws and enforce them against those Muslims who are preaching destruction to America and the murder of Americans in mosques and Wahhabi funded schools.

    As for jroberts question about the hijab, yes there is a slippery slope. When women are forced to wear such symbols of oppression, I oppose it. In France, they threw out the baby with the bath water, but there is a difference between voluntarily wearing a cross, and being forced to wear a hijab. Already in Sweden, non-Muslim women wear hijabs to avoid harassment by Muslim men on the streets. That is unacceptable.

  53. #393774
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:12 pm, SpeakEasy said:

    Ocracoke,
    The thread on MM.com links a picture of Obama to the A&F kerfluffle (IMO wrongly) through the wearing of an A&F T-shirt by someone in the crowd. We conservatives have to practice what we preach (objectivity). Lord knows there are plenty of issues to oppose Obama on that we do not need to invent them.

  54. #393776
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:18 pm, and Im all out of bubblegum said:

    Speak and Stub: Amen!

  55. #393777
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:21 pm, right_on said:

    Businesses need to hire Human Resource personnel who know how to turn down an applicant within the bounds of the law. For example, “I’m sorry Miss, but we hired an applicant who was MORE QUALIFIED for the position.”

    How could they disprove that?

  56. #393778
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:21 pm, Mookie said:

    We need to find a constitutional way to eliminate them from our lands.

    Every single Muslim in America? What if they’re here legally?

  57. #393780
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:28 pm, jroberts said:

    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:37 pm, simcoe said:

    But it isn’t the case that Islam has always acted like that. Regardless of what the Koran says (similarly, if you wanted insight into the past and future of Christianity, the Bible would only tell you so much), at some times Islam has gotten along pretty well with other religions, and at other times it didn’t. E.g., for about 1300 years the most important Jewish community was in Muslim Baghdad, which produced really important Jewish philosophers and Talmud scholars like Saadya Gaon. Moorish Spain until 1148 was pretty tolerant of Christians and Jews, and then after 1148 the Almohad dynasty took over for 100 years and exiled the Jews and Christians; many of the Jews (most notably Maimonides) left for equally Muslim, but more tolerant, Cairo. Muslim mercenaries were frequently hired in the early Middle Ages for wars between Christian kings. Catholic Pilgrims were allowed into the Muslim occupied Holy Land. Historically the relationship between Islam and other religions has wavered between getting along fairly well and violent suppression and forced conversion; this can be said, in the long view, about any other religion.

    I should mention that I have slight personal bias. I’m a grad student in medieval theology. The notion of

    after all this time and all the world events since 9/11, or even back to the Clinton years [emphasis added]

    is, as far as I care, remarkably short sighted. 15 1/2 years is not something that I would ever describe as “all this time” and “even back to.” That’s barely 1% of the history of Islam.

    On August 2nd, 2008 at 2:22 pm, Gabe said:
    The Byzantine Empire was a superpower like America and when the Muslims attacked they were surprised. “They did not take the Muslim threat seriously.”

    That’s only sort of true. By 1453 when Constantinople finally fell, the Byzantines definitely took Islam seriously. In the 7th century when Islam took a huge chunk of the Byzantine empire, Byzantium didn’t take them seriously because the Muslims came out of nowhere. So, between the Muslim conquest of the Holy Land and the fall of the Byzantine empire, there were about 800 years of taking Islam seriously.

  58. #393782
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:35 pm, rambler said:

    This just seems to be a CAIR ploy to cry discrimination. This woman would stand a snowball’s chance in …. of getting a job in an strict islamic country. If our country is soooo unkind to them, they are free to leave. The rest of this counrty does not need to bend to the will strict islamic rules. There are many jobs which would not allow her to wear a scarf because it would be a safety issue. CAIR needs to get over itself.

  59. #393783
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:36 pm, Stubby said:

    Hi Mookie…

    Legally here or not, they all need to go in my opinion. It is my impression, from their notable silence as a group opposing terrorism, that they all are deep down on the same side of the fence. The jihad thrives on plants in our society and they remain obscure for years. I am suspect of them all and since the risks are so obvious and so devastating, I am not comfortable with any of them.

    Why take any chances when our country is at stake and their intent is so clear.

  60. #393784
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:37 pm, prendad said:

    The Oklahoma chapter of the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR-OK) announced today that it has filed an EEOC complaint on behalf of a Muslim woman

    Dear CAIR-OK: If your excuse for existance is primarily “American-Islamic Relations”, perhaps you should stop filing SILLY lawsuits against American businesses. I really don’t think that this process promotes good relations between you and anybody else on the planet. If that is not possible, change your name to more properly reflect your hidden agenda. Perhaps something like “Council To Get In The Face Of America And Piss Off Infidels” or perhaps “Organization Of Perpetual Assholes Who Whine About Everything That Does Not Please Them”. Oh, excuse me, that last one has already been taken by the Democratic Party.

  61. #393785
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:41 pm, Dimsdale said:

    People just have to understand that certain jobs are going to have certain standards of dress and decorum that you have to adhere to if you want the job. After all, YOU are the one asking for the job. If Home Depot says you have to wear orange shirts every day, you do it. If IBM says suit and tie, you do it. Free expression is great, but in a private company, they make the rules. If you don’t like it, go elsewhere, or start your own business and compete. Don’t come in demanding that they change for you.

    Sadly, that is what our litigious country has come to.

    I remember when Abercrombie and Fitch was basically like Cabela’s or Bass Pro Shops for the Weatherby and Orvis set. I still have a faded T-Shirt of theirs, with the rhino logo, from the late 1980s. It’s a great loss.

    Yeah, A&F used to be a great store, just like Banana Republic. They used to have really great stuff, then some B-school genius ruined both of them. Both are just crappy Gap copies now. I went into the local A&F recently (for as long as I could stand the annoyingly loud music, and say crappy, worn, holey jeans for $80!! I swear I saw a pair I threw away years ago. What a ripoff. And the porny posters fit for a pedophile are just pathetic ploys to get stupid teens to buy their overpriced crap.

  62. #393789
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:57 pm, gippergirl said:

    ERRONEOUS!!! I always cheer for the free market! If she wants a store where everyone prances about in their hijabs, then guess what? SHE CAN OPEN ONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is AMERICA, I don’t care for A&F, so I don’t shop there…let freedom ring!!!!!

  63. #393790
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:57 pm, Romeo13 said:

    Sorry MM… have to disagree with ya on this one…

    Do you REALLY want to wake America up to the threat of Islamic Sharia law???

    Explain that they threaten Dogs, Alcohol, and PORN!

    After that, stand by for the Fireworks.

  64. #393791
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 4:04 pm, atheling said:

    On August 2nd, 2008 at 3:28 pm, jroberts said:

    I should mention that I have slight personal bias. I’m a grad student in medieval theology.

    What school? I don’t trust the garbage taught in many colleges these days.

    And as for your statement that Muslims got along with Christians and Jews at specific times is more to do with the tolerance of the rulers at those times, rather than of Islam’s “tolerance” itself. If any good came out of Islamic lands, it was in spite of Islam, not because of it.

    Even a stopped clock is right twice in a day.

  65. #393798
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 4:46 pm, James Felix said:

    When I was in the Navy it was a tradition for us to feud with the Marines, and for them to feud with us. Squids trash talking Jarheads, Jarhead questioning the manhood of the squids… it was a constant thing.

    But if a fight broke out in a bar overseas there was no question, at all, whose side we were on.

    You may not like A&F, your reasons not to like them may be valid, but at the end of the day they’re Americans, and we have more in common with them than we have differences.

    I hope they crush CAIR.

  66. #393799
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 4:55 pm, James Felix said:

    …at some times Islam has gotten along pretty well with other religions…

    That depends on your definiton of “getting along pretty well”. When the adherents of other religions submitted and accepted Dhimmi status sure, they were peacefully co-existed with.

    One can also say, honestly, that blacks in the pre-Civil War South had a low incidence of homelessness and near-zero percent unemployment. That doesn’t mean they were “peacefully coexisted with” or had a good life.

    Islam has never peacefully co-existed with other religions, seeing them as equals and regarding them with a “live and let live” attitude.

    Historically the relationship between Islam and other religions has wavered between getting along fairly well and violent suppression and forced conversion; this can be said, in the long view, about any other religion.

    There’s on big, huge, important difference. Christians stopped forcible conversions something like 400 years ago. Islam is doing it today.

  67. #393800
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 4:56 pm, Christian Soldier said:

    This has NO-Thing to do w/the garb of Islam…

    it is the “camel’s nose”..
    CAIR and ACLU are VERY clever–”don’t fight with guns …fight in the courts-win-a little at a time..”

    Remember the book _Alms for Jihad_ -Saudi billionaire – UK – threatened to sue Cambridge Press -CP folded like a cheap suit…pulled (BURNED ) the book-
    Same Saudi billionaire -_Funding Evil_
    book still on selves-author-US citizen book published here in US-

    US citizens WAKE UP !!!WILL YOU??????

  68. #393801
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 4:56 pm, James Felix said:

    Explain that they threaten Dogs, Alcohol, and PORN!

    And bacon.

    If those four things aren’t worth going to war over I don’t know what is. :)

  69. #393803
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:12 pm, Christian Soldier said:

    Didn’t SS Nancy P wear a dhimmi scarf when she visited our “friends ” in the countries of ISLAM!????!!!!!

  70. #393805
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:15 pm, no2pcbs1 said:

    piglets anyone??

  71. #393806
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:18 pm, brooklyn red said:

    Christian Soldier, pssst- squeeze, don’t jerk.

  72. #393807
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:26 pm, Rusty said:

    If A+F wouldn’t allow someone to wear a rosary or a crucifix or a cross necklace, you’d be singing a different tune. Got to support CAIR here.

  73. #393808
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:26 pm, nyc123me said:

    “The woman told CAIR-OK that a district manager claimed he could not hire her because her Islamic headscarf “does not fit the Abercrombie image.””
    THAT was a huge mistake. You NEVER tell a prospective employee (or anyone else not directly involved in the hiring process) why you are not hiring them – NEVER. If they ask, at most you apologize and say for legal reasons you cannot provide any further details, on or off record. Anything else opens you up for exactly this kind of litigation. That district manager will most likely get a DCM notice in the near future. (DCM = Don’t Come Monday)

  74. #393809
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:28 pm, nyc123me said:

    Rusty, a rosary is worn UNDERNEATH clothing and therefore not visible – that is no comparison to wearing a friggin sheet with a hole in it over your head, you idiot. Stop trying to compare chalk with cheese, you’re full of it.

  75. #393811
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:33 pm, brooklyn red said:

    Rusty, she can wear anything she want’s around her neck… but head scarfs, like percings & ink scare off customers.

    But you don’t really cair care do you?

  76. #393812
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:39 pm, brooklyn red said:

    nyc123me, “employment at will” would make this point mute in a severance…

    so may be the right course is to hire & fire on the same day. LOL.

  77. #393815
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:45 pm, simcoe said:

    jroberts,

    It is correct to assume that our American (and the world) leaders have not taken Islam’s reassertion at this time seriously. They also seem to be ignoring the fact that it is not just a religion but also a political system.

    Anecdotal evidence across the ages only proves:

    One: There have been points across the ages when Moslems have been persuaded by some charismatic believers, such as now, to live closer to the teachings of Koran. That teaching is, convert the infidels or kill them.

    Two: There hasn’t been a force strong enough to hold back the invading hordes. Though America is trying. However, I fear it won’t succeed if it continues to ignore the fact that Islam is a political system.

    The world is not just being invaded by a religion. There is an attempt to take over America by a political system in the guise of a religion. What better place to work to this end than a nation that espouses “…freedom of religion”.

  78. #393816
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:45 pm, Rob said:

    “The woman told CAIR-OK that a district manager claimed he could not hire her

    Could someone rise to the district manager position and be THAT stupid?

  79. #393820
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:54 pm, Bruce said:

    HA! Would to God we could be rid of all evil atrocities: CAIR and Abercrombie!!

  80. #393821
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:54 pm, brooklyn red said:

    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:45 pm, simcoe said:
    jroberts, It is correct to assume that our American (and the world) leaders have not taken Islam’s reassertion at this time seriously.

    simcoe, with all due respect (sir/madame) invading & occupying 2 countries (a good thing) suggests that they do take it seriously… ignoring the threat at home, well not so much.

  81. #393822
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:54 pm, nyc123me said:

    Could someone rise to the district manager position and be THAT stupid? – Rob #78

    Good question Rob, but it’s quite possible unfortunately – seen a few people in positions they were in no way capable of purely because it gave the company a good diversity record. It is that sort of thing that creates prejudice, ironically.

  82. #393824
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:55 pm, nyc123me said:

    .. not that I am saying that was the situation in this particular case.

  83. #393828
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:12 pm, brooklyn red said:

    nyc123me, can’t wait till the cases go public, then I can tell you about my last boss, an openly lesbian middle aged woman, who has an agenda of replacing experienced male employees with recent female grads… she prefers girls of Italian decent though, no head scarfs.

  84. #393829
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:14 pm, Bill Grant said:

    Whom to root against?

    Anyone who doing this:

    ” Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Messenger have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.” Koran Sura 09.029

    I would buy something from Abercrombie & Fitch in solidarity but anyone past the age of 17 who wonders in to that store instantly feels about as out of place as… well… someone in a burqua would be.

  85. #393830
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:17 pm, Christian Soldier said:

    Another example of the CAIR “camel’s nose under the tent”:

    http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/08/muslim-woman-sues-oregon-city-for.html#comments

  86. #393831
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:20 pm, Christian Soldier said:

    B-red
    like thisssssssssssss :-) ??????

  87. #393832
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:22 pm, Micheleeroo said:

    While I have zero respect for Abercrombie (didn’t know their ads had gotten THAT bad), I have just as little respect for more modest people who whine because they can’t get hired there. WHY WOULD YOU WANT, AS A MODEST PERSON, TO WORK FOR A SLIME SHOP LIKE ABERCROMBIE? Think, people, think! The lawsuit should be dropped.

  88. #393833
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:26 pm, Laree said:

    The Enemy of my Enemy is my Friend.

  89. #393834
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:27 pm, William Teach said:

    It’s funny, because there was a protest here in Raleigh against A&F.

  90. #393835
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:28 pm, atheling said:

    On August 2nd, 2008 at 5:26 pm, Rusty said:
    If A+F wouldn’t allow someone to wear a rosary or a crucifix or a cross necklace, you’d be singing a different tune. Got to support CAIR here.

    Of course you have to support CAIR. They are an enemy to America. And you always side with America’s enemies.

  91. #393837
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:37 pm, brooklyn red said:

    Christian Soldier, Much better!

    now, see if you can pick out the officer(s) :)

  92. #393840
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:46 pm, tgusa said:

    Muslims can’t live in America and practice their religion, they prove it again and again one or the other will have to go. Muslim sues Oregon city to gain discriminatory swim rights, pretty spread out there for a supposed tightly knit community, wonder why.They seem to be, well, everywhere.

  93. #393841
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:50 pm, Christian Soldier said:

    B-red-
    I’m working on it :-) (-:

  94. #393842
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:53 pm, brooklyn red said:

    tgusa, re: Muslims can’t live in America and practice their religion,…

    Of course they can! Their religion is conquest. And we let them practice it just fine… we can probably hold them off through our lifetimes, but if you have kids… Oh my.

  95. #393844
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 6:55 pm, tgusa said:

    brooklyn red,
    Oh yeah, I forgot about that. Doh!

  96. #393847
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 7:00 pm, brooklyn red said:

    tgusa, but of course you are right. “…one or the other will have to go.

    me? well I’m kinda set in my ways…

  97. #393850
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 7:05 pm, bit_boy said:

    Just another examples of the Muzzies not being able/flexible enough to function in a modern society. I think the courts will someday tell the Muzzies to leave their religion in the mosque and leave the mosque behind a sight barrier.

  98. #393852
    On August 2nd, 2008 at 7:08 pm, Christian Soldier said:

    brooklyn red and tgusa- you are so right!

    They-also- protest when there in NO – THING to protest!!!!

    http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/08/stop-war-with-iran-protesters-march-on.html#comments

    I hope to have grandchildren-I’m not turning this country over to a 14th century mind-set…
    talk about set in our ways….:-)

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Categories: CAIR, Girls Gone Wild



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