Saddle up: Saddleback Forum open thread; Obama on abortion: “Above my pay grade,” attacks Clarence Thomas
For those of you watching the Rick Warren/Obama/McCain show tonight, here’s your open thread.
Watch online here.
Wake me up if anything interesting happens.
Like I said before, I’m not holding my breath…
***
Obama on abortion: It’s “above his pay grade.” What the…
Obama on which Supreme Court justice he wouldn’t have nominated: Clarence Thomas.
Disturbingly, commenters note, the Saddleback audience cheered.
RACIST!
(Update): Allah’s got the near-gaffetastic video of Obama’s Thomas remarks.
Mark Levin: “On Obama’s best day he can’t hold a candle to Thomas’s intelligence.”
***
McCain on when babies are entitled to human rights: “At the moment of conception…this presidency will have pro-life policies.”
Define marriage: “A union between a man and a woman. One man and one woman.”
Warren asks about California marriage preservation proposition and Calif. Supreme Court. “California Supreme Court was wrong.”
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The more I watch the CNN coverage, the larger feeling I get that they are deliberately NOT showing many clips of BO in order to protect his image.
For every clip of BO, they have shown 3 for JC. As well, the ‘pundits’ are doing nothing more than throwing the occasional vapid platitude BO’s way.
OH oh…Huckleberry’s on now.
I watched the forum on CSPAN and then on the streaming website, so I missed the network “talking heads.” But if it’s true, the vacation excuse is just possibly the lamest cover for a candidate that I’ve ever heard the media use — and that includes all 8 years of Bill Clinton.
McCain was obviously more prepared. I think that Obama simply planned to sit down and chat with his good buddy Rick Warren, and charm the American people with his affability and “we can all work together for a brighter tomorrow” attitude.
McCain answered questions straightforwardly. Obama quoted platitudes and stumbled through answers.
The biggest difference? Obama admitted that his presidency will consist of hosting non-ending debates among rooms full of scholars with differing opinions; McCain projected an ability to solve problems based on his own experience and decision-making capabilities, rather than relying on rooms full of eggheads and elites.
I think this is the difference between a 46 year old immersed in post-modern scholarship and theoretical problem solving, and a 70 year old man who has spent the last 40 years neck-deep in one tough situation after another.
“Little Bighorn”
Arrogance and overconfidence got the better of Barry boy tonight.
CNN now just replayed the abortion question.
BO: 47 second rambling answer; “Well, ummm… I think, uhhh… women talk to their pastors about it…” etc. etc. etc.
JC: 2.1 second answer; “(Life starts) At the moment of conception”
Night folks. This has been fun.
BSR
A few people are doning this, most of us don’t really care about them unless they are forcing thier agenda on us.
I think Hillery would be the better socialist candidate right now and therefor want BO to win.
She speaks befor BO at the convention I hope she turns it on like never before and then I hope BO has to speak without a prompter!
O o round of antacids for the delegats!
On August 16th, 2008 at 10:20 pm, Omu said:… On August 16th, 2008 at 10:20 pm, Omu said:…When will Americans grow up and stop persecuting gay people!?…
When they accept the fact that they are in the minority & stop trying to force their agenda on everyone else. That would help.
Don’t count clinton out. It would not suprise meif the roll count changed…
ACTIONS vs. words….
Actions speak louder…
John M’s words ….REACH ACROSS THE AISLE…matched his actions…
He’s considering a pro-DEATH VP running mate….
School’s still out for me…..
Time to invest in Novartis stock!
Seriously. To say that gay people in this country are persecuted is to diminish REAL persecution.
Obama on ‘Define Rich’: “I don’t know what the housing market is doing right now.”
I agree with the comments about FOX News. It was beyond ridiculous when Carl Cameron prefaced his opening remarks by discussing Obama’s jetlag! As for the FOX panel format, Charles Krauthammer is the only one who demonstrates consistent excellence with his insightful remarks and incredible intelligence. He blows away everyone else on Special Report; on those rare occasions when he’s not on, I am always disappointed.
Two of the contributors tonight are Democrats, so their praise for Obama is somewhat understandable, but Bill Sammon, who is normally very good, must’ve also watched a different forum.
Tonight we came as close as we have so far to a side-by-side demo, and as expected Tide beat Brand X hands down. On Nov. 4 it will be McCain by a length going away.
Oh, and another thing: Why does FOX insist on foisting Mike Huckabee upon us!
No question, definitely. The African-American gentleman, particularly. He’s almost apoplectic in his defense of BHO’s answers! What he calls, “nuanced” and “thoughtful”, everyone reasonable saw as, “bobbing” and “weaving”.
Hey, Libs: you wanted this guy to be your “savior”. He’s as good as he ever was, so there ya go!
And on this whole “jet lag” thing, BHO’d been in Hawaii for a week. He was three hours fresher than McCain; not the other way around. Flying East is the easy direction! Sheesh……
I did a kind of ‘live blog’. Gotta tell, ya, I’m no fan of McFeingold, but if this had been an actual debate, he would have beat B. Hussein, hands down! I’m a little more, just a little mind you, about McCain.
If it’s Roland, he’s always “apoplectic”. Before the forum, my tv was set to CNN in the other room and I could hear his pre-show ranting and I hurried to turn it off…my goodness!
Just going over the whole conversation above:
Never will. It is tatoo-ed on my soul.
Ya beat me to it. (24/7 member & OC recruiter)
Cannot WAIT for noon Monday!
Still think this was the best line of the night:
Well, I am transcribing this to DVD for posterity:
The first asswuppin’ of the general election season.
Besides, y’all know Senator B.O. is going to conveniently “misremember” all this, so having it engraved in DVD is a good idea. God Bless the Oil Industry and the Plastics it produces (Big Wind ain’t gonna’ do that!)
John Kerry as BHO vp we can only hope
I’m sure the few extreme McCainites who post here will feel good about this ‘forum’, and rightly so – McCain did himself proud. As for Obama, you could tell with every question that he was not thinking about what he believed in, but rather how he can avoid answering in any definite terms (that way he can claim he was misquoted later if criticized).
Nite all.
On August 16th, 2008 at 10:54 pm, rsdm9154 said:John Kerry as BHO vp we can only hope
yeah, can’t wait till Jonnie has a few, & asks BHO to bring his car around front…
Oh, and you just KNOW if it had been McCain jetting back from a Hawaii vacation, the media gimps would’ve been screaming that it was unfair because Obama had been working hard for America while McCain was kicking back and all rested from his holiday. They make me sick.
Kerry has his own issues right now, starting with increasing amounts of noise about why he refuses to debate his Republican challenger, Lt Colonel (Ret) Jim Ogonowski.
Side note: Ogonowski’s brother was the pilot of one of the planes that was flown into the WTC.
IMO, Bill Richardson is Obama’s only viable option. In Dick Morris’s words, “he needs someone who knows where the men’s room is in the White House and someone who can find Georgia on a map”.
World-map, that is, not US.
Not even going to guess on McCain’s VP.
Just think he should do as Carl Cameron suggested and pick on the 29th.
It would help take away Senator B.O.’s thunder.
B.O.’s thunder will be stolen by HRC
This was a great format. Again, add a one-on-one with both candidates at the table and you’ve got a winner.
I can dream, can’t I?
Hey, what happens if someone gets the nomination & no one will accept the 2nd spot… seriously, then what???
Wow! Watching this the second time around while recording it to DVD, you see and hear SO much more.
guesses on McCain’s vp anyone
Oh! Em! Gee!
You just described a fantasy I’ve been having:
“Hillary, will you be me VP?”
“With you as President? Are you KIDDING?”
…and the Clinton cackle keeps going and going and going …
McCain wasn’t my first choice. I must admit he did a great job. However, has anyone else noticed that BHO has an uncanny ability of making his opponents look good? I actually found myself feeling sorry for Hillary!
I’m going with Condie, this could be the pro-chice, sort of, candidate he was talking of.
I’m hoping for Romney.
ROFL.. I was just taking a look at the reaction at HuffingtonPost.. omg some of the comments are hilarious! Most of them think Obama was thoughtful and intelligent (uhhhh.. uhhhh.. that’s not my payscale.. uhhhhh) and were quoting out of context outrageously.
Some are saying that McCain must have been given the questions in advance as he was able to answer so decisively and rapidly. Sorry dear, that’s how a POTUS should be, not some dumbass who thinks there’s 57 states in the union.
This is where I almost fell off my chair though:
“Did anyone see the post interview on CNN with David Brody and Barack Obama? I was completely shocked to hear Brody say to Obama, “let’s call a spade a spade.” I couldn’t believe he would use a racial slur and I was stunned the CNN aired it!”
True morons, and I only read a handful of the 2,000+ comments so far. If you need a laugh, go check it out. Seriously, you couldn’t make this stuff up, pure lunatic left gold.
So much for going to bed.
“Tired” after a vacation?
When Nixon came back from a vay-cay the line was “he’s tanned, rested and ready”.
Barack didn’t even need to work on a tan!
Rick Warren: He did ask a couple of decent questions, but overall, the questions were still weak. He is no Jesus (who called politicians names “You go tell that fox”) or John the Baptist (gotcha politics – “It is not lawful for you to have your brother’s wife), so I am disappointed, but this was to be expected.
Obama: He actually came off OK, except that his performance is contrasted with McCain’s performance, who put just Obama to shame.
McCain: I am one of those people who really dislikes McCain. In spite of this, I thought McCain was on fire. Even inspiring. From what I saw tonight, I might even end up voting for him! The contrast between his simple, direct, confident answers vs. Obama’s carefully taking both sides of the issue was dramatic.
I really, really cannot believe how well McCain did tonight. I was expecting him to get owned in a softball format such as this, but McCain came across very well and really went after the Democrats’ lame policies.
Just wow.
see, even you anti-warren, anti-christian folk! and Michelle. this was the best questioning and informatiion EVER about them. wow! mccain was and is awesome! Warren & new christianity is awesome. JUDEO-CHRISTIAN PRINCIPOHS!
the way the dem talkies tried to pander on obama…WOW… and tried to weasel that mccain miffed up on some stuff… WOW… and the mistakes and lies! wow! people are gonna gulp… watching these two SIDE BY SIDE.
Obama would not have chosen Clarence Thomas what a surprise
and why cant Obama hold his head up
Oh, I’m glad I wasn’t taking a drink of anything when I read that one!
Although I haven’t been a big fan of McCain, I was very impressed with his performance at Saddleback tonight. He gave all the “right” answers, imo.
Barry was a total pandering fool, as usual.
Someone here asked earlier about the crowd’s response to McCain…Orange County, CA, which is where Saddleback Church is located, still has a substantial conservative presence, as do parts of San Diego County. It’s tough being a conservative here in CA…
I have mixed feelings about the benevolent Emperor Richardson. Part of me would like to see him leave New Mexico but the other part of me shudders at the thought of him possessing the power of the vice presidency. He is big time pro illegals.
We are overwhelmed here with them.
Shame they didn’t touch on the illegal immigration issue. Perhaps just as well – that could’ve torn it for McCain.
Goodnight folks… this was fun.
I’m not gonna pull a “nyc” I’m really going to bed.
hehe, I’m trying, really I am.
Um, didn’t someone in the drive-by media say that B.O. was given the questions in advance, or that they BOTH were?
And somehow B.O. STILL managed to come off lame?
(sing-song)
…someone didn’t do their HOMEwork…
This seems to be a theme with this guy.
He goes to Germany to immitate JFK at the Brandenburg Gate and ends up with thousands of Germans chanting his name in front of Hitler’s Tower.
(sing-song)
…someone didn’t do their HOMEwork…
Watching this the second time while recording to DVD:
Charles Krauthammer caught B.O. dissing Clarent Thomas for
lack of experience and pointed out that B.O. is not one to talk.
And the Texas State Motto applies: “Yep.”
Am I the last one standing?
Time to take the role of Death in the great universal party:
Put the chairs on the tables and turn off the lights.
(points if you know what author THAT comes from)
‘night all … keep the faith … whichever faith that may be …
“All of the above … None of the below.” —TimLenox
I’m here Tim. It’s only 10:13 here.
Monday:
Glenn Beck 9am-Noon
Rush Limbaugh Noon-3pm
Can’t hardly wait:
It’s the SUSPENSE that gets me!
Oh, damn, Onamesa,
I feel like that cowboy in Tombstone, hearing,
“Ah’m here, Huckelberry.”
I have a pretty good idea what they’ll say. Rush will be hilarious.
For The Record,
Mic is even better the 2nd time around and B.O. is even worse.
He is the original empty suit. Obama that is.
I just don’t get the appeal. He doesn’t even talk the talk much less walk the walk.
Rush is going to be GOLDEN!
24/7 member and OC recruiter here.
(in fact I was in Operation Chaos, the Prequel, before Rush was on the air:
Voted for Jackson in ’88 and changed my registration after the primary, along with tens of thousands of others. My father had a blast watching the DNC catch on. Laughed for days.)
Man, I’ve heard the Christmas story before and it chokes me up even the 2nd time in one night.
Sorry. Couldn’t bring myself to vote democrat, not even for Rush.
The story that really chokes me up is the one about Cindy bringing the baby home.
Talk about comparisons, how about Cindy and Michelle O side by side?
I’m watching the replay. Caught the last half hour of Obama, and after the first half hour of McCain, I’d have to agree he’s beating Obaaa…mmmm…uhhhh…. pretty bad.
When they take away the prompters this BO guy is as lost as the proverbial “lost ball in high weeds”……
Okay, here’s how it went down:
Born in 1965, turned 21 in 1986.
Registered to vote in 1988 as a Democrat.
Father and brother looked at me as if I had just beamed down and asked, “WHY?”
I said, “We know who our candidate will be: Vice-President Bush. I want to vote in a primary.”
Came home from voting and they asked, disdain dripping from their words, who I voted for.
“Jesse Jackson”
They looked at me as if I had just told them I was going to marry a goat and asked, “WHY?”
“Because I want George Bush to win.”
Silence for about fifteen seconds, then laughter and drinks ensued.
Changed my registration to Republican the next day.
That Sunday, Dad was reading the NY Times and laughing off his chair.
Turns out, Jackson was ahead by 15% and 15% of the registered Democrats just switched their registration to Republican the week of the primary.
Dad said the DNC was just catching on, screaming in horror, and begging Jackson on their knees:
“Please, please, please! You think you’re going to be the first black president, but you have no idea what is going to happen to you.”
Yes, I was one of the reasons they made Super-delegates.
That has made Operation Chaos possible 20 years later.
I am an Operation Chaos Veteran.
Watch the MSM spin tomorrow.
The Dems don’t like being snookered. They seem to lose their sense of humor.
Yeah, and they REALLY go nuts when they lose elections!
Newest sponsor of the DNC:
Confuse-a-crat!
My family are lifelong dems. My dad was the local president of the democratic party. I’m considered the er black sheep of the family.
Okay, I can’t do better than that so I’m quitting while I’m ahead. ‘night!
Doesn’t surprise me at all.
Just because you go to church on sunday does not mean you are really a Christian nor does it mean you have a brain. Trust me I have seen what I have just said
Heck, they barely speak to me. The Sunday dinners got a little tense.
Clarence Thomas is awesome. Also, I don’t get the issue of abortion. What part of “thou shalt not kill” don’t they get?
“Someone here asked earlier about the crowd’s response to McCain…Orange County, CA, which is where Saddleback Church is located, still has a substantial conservative presence, as do parts of San Diego County. It’s tough being a conservative here in CA…”
But also keep in mind that Lake Forrest–the actual city the church is in–is the renamed El Toro, as in El Toro Marine Air Station home of the 3rd Marine Air Wing (at least before the base was closed) so there are a lot of retired Marines living in the area and Camp Pendelton is just down the road too.
Okay, the DVD is almost done and I have to answer this one because I’ve actually given it some thought:
They support abortion and oppose the death penalty for murderers (especially child killers), which causes one to ask:
“Are they self-hating human beings?”
The answer, believe it or not, is YES.
They grew up watching nature films and demonstrations by activists who stress the “mental” in environmental and teach that human beings are the problem in the world.
The last girl I dated is a member of these groups and has been so brainwashed by this propaganda that she wishes all humans beings on this planet would “just disappear”.
She actually cheered war and terrorism because of the humans killed, until she watch the Twin Towers fall from her brooklyn home and wondered if her aunt was still inside.
Then she stopped cheering war and terrorism but still wished that all humans would “just disappear”, siting 9-11 as an example of why.
It didn’t take long for us to realize that we were not compatible.
However, if you understand where this comes from and apply it to their actions, you can understand the idea of supporting abortion while opposing the death penalty for murderers.
It’s still insane, but you can understand it.
How did Osama Bin Laden put it?
“You celebrate life while we celebrate death.”
My attitude:
Fine, Slim, you asked for it.
We’ll give you what you like and keep what we like.
Flip the Devil the Bird for me.
Okay. The DVD is done. Starting another copy and going to bed. ‘night.
Hey Tim, can’t wait until Osama reaches, as Rush says, “cave temperature”
The difference I saw between Obama and McCain tonight reminded of some wise words I once heard about honesty, particularly in reference to people trying to lie their way out of trouble. “If you always tell the truth, you won’t have to worry about remembering what you said.”
Obama is so slow and hesitant about his responses because he’s always having to think about where he should stand, and what it would be most advantageous for him to say.
McCain is able to answer so quickly because he doesn’t have to think about where he stands; he knows where he stands.
Oddly enough, that’s similar to my reasoning when I gave up lying back in high school: The truth is easier to remember and often so weird that people won’t believe you anyway, so why waste effort on a lie?
Okay, really going to bed now, so I’ll look for your witty comments in the morning. ‘night.
You’re right BC. Obama is a chameleon. He has no core. McCain=what you see is what you get.
Why Tim, you think I’m witty? Thanks.
Goodnight.
I’m a republican who does not require my pastor to be one too. I never knew I was so rare.
Moonshot,
Trust me, I’m almost positive my priest isn’t a republican.
Hmmmm, not seeing too much from our lib seagull friends on this thread. I am sure they are all wringing their hands now that they finally realize Obummer is an idiot.
My Favorite Obama quote of the night;
“the devil is in the details”
Yep! He certainly is……and who should know better than O.
I got a chance to see the “debate” in the second showing but didn’t have the opportunity to join the conversation hear. Got on about an hour ago and read every single one of the posts. What a treat, you all did a great job of analysis and I enjoyed every I read. Thanks, now I can go to sleep.
I do want to add that I was prepared to hold my nose and vote for John McCain. Mainly because of his pro-life position. After tonight, I won’t have to hold my nose anymore.
Probably not seeing too many libs here because they are all over at huffpo or kos figuring out how they are going to fix this and getting their talking points. They will be all over the place tomorrow once they’ve been told what to say.
Can somebody please tell me, has Obama added some silver into his hair to make him look older? I have not noticed his hair being so salt-n-pepper? Anybody else?
I thought this was a much better format than I expected. Obama does not do a good job in a setting like this when he can’t read a teleprompter. No wonder he won’t agree to town hall meetings with McCain! He came across as phony and inexperienced as usual but it really came out with his long, drawn out answers. I thought Warren was getting really irritated with the length of stump-speeches he gave.
For McCain, ever since the illegal immigration fiasco I have not been a big fan. Tonight he won me over! He was so genuine and ready to be commander-in-chief. When he answered the greatest personal moral failure being his first divorce I thought that was so real, geniune, humble. His vietnam stories were chilling. He was quick to respond to answers and I thought the most important ones were evil threat being Al Qaeda and islamo fascists, abortion, and drill now!
I can’t wait for the debates this fall. I honestly do not think Obama will be elected this November after watching tonight.
wish they would let bob barr in the forum too
“Pay-grade”? What is the “taking kickbacks from Tony Rezko” pay grade?
Who taught Barry military phraseology? Jesse MacBeth?
I can’t think of a job insignificant enough to be at Obamas metaphorical “pay grade”.
Going in, I had my reservations about the format and about Warren’s seeming to be in the tank for Obama. I really thought it was set up for McCain to get ambushed and for Obama to come out looking palatable to Christians. Boy was I surprised.
Full disclosure, I didn’t begin following Obama until mid-March with Wright. I’ve never gotten over Obama’s attending that church and for standing silent in the face of Wright’s lies and hate. Obama is the height of cowardice.
I was glad to see Obama stumble over the abortion issue. I wish Warren had pushed him on it, but the cat now seems out of the bag. I read where he had a heated exchange (with video) with David Broder afterwards–he wasn’t ambushed, it was previously arranged. Typical Obama, “I want to be available for interviews, but the last thing I want to do is answer a lot of hard questions.”
I thought McCain was outstanding. He can make me grind my teeth at times, but on national security, he’s it. His responses were surprisingly good and to the point. Even his one supposed gaffe (the comment about $5 million as rich) was harmless because he even joked that he was sure he’ll see that in a sound byte.
I’m really surprised that the conservative Fox commentators (Sammon and Krauthammer) were so complimentary about Obama. He was awful. And it was incredible to watch the other two spin Obama’s performance. You knew they could tell they were in trouble because tthey HAD to compliment McCain because it was so obvious that he outperformed Obama. The former Edwards aide (Chris something) immediately started spinning it that Obama was in an unfriendly environment and that he succeeded in being able to subtract at least a few of McCain’s supporters. If anything, I think McCain heartened conservatives, and he convinced fenceposts independents that they don’t want to endure four years of potty training Obama.
John McCain was fantastic! His answers were exact, direct, and explicit to the point of there being no doubt as to where he stands on issues of security, the economy, and life. I am proud to support him!
Obama’s performance was terrible. His responses sounded like those an unprepared high school student would give to an open-response/essay test: inexact, completely lacking in specificity and facts (his “abortions have not declined in the last eight years” response was just flat out false) and incomprehensible.
It was clear Obama was deliberately trying to be open ended with his responses, so as not to be penned down to any one position and risk offending his leftist donor$ and friend$, but that just makes more evident where his loyalties lie – with the left, not with everyday Americans.
After last night it is clear Obama represents the interests of the left in America, because he is the left: he responded from the left, he skewed his non-answers to the left, and he defended the left with equivocating replies to very sensitive questions on security and life. He is too far left to adequately represent the greater interests of the American people. McCain is the obvious choice for President because he represents the greater goals of the American people and their desire to live free, live prosperously, and live securely. McCain represents life “
aboveat my grade.”I think the salt-n-pepper is the real color–it shows up prtty often in quick takes –but then who knows–I’ve seen it before though
Thank God for cable tv — choices included the All-Michael-Alla-Time-Olympics (who needs flippers?) and another broadcast of Underworld. Flip in, Michael and Friends Smoke the Waters, flip out: Lucans and Vampires play nice. Saddlewhat?
if Maverick shows more brass like this.. I might reconsider my vote for him..