Fabricating a GOP tyrant
The entire editorial is on point, but here’s the best part of the Colorado Springs Gazette’s lead editorial yesterday, titled “Fabricating a GOP tyrant,” which rips ABC’s Charlie Gibson and the rest of the MSM for their desperate attempts to demonize Sarah Palin’s faith:
This is the dishonest marginalization of a candidate some members of the mainstream media simply do not like. If she won’t marginalize herself with outrageous statements, some will pull them from thin air. Even if Palin were as bold about God as the media pretend, it wouldn’t put her in odd company. Consider the following presidential quotes.
Certainly no one should feel inclined to agree with them, but if Palin is too religiously extreme for public office, how do we explain Washington, Kennedy, Carter, Clinton and Reagan?
“It is impossible to govern the world without God and the Bible.” – George Washington, Farewell Address, 1796
“Let us go forth to lead the land we love, asking his blessing and his help, but knowing that here on earth God’s work must truly be our own.” – John F. Kennedy, inaugural address, Jan. 20, 1961
“Let us teach our children that the God of comfort is also the God of righteousness. Those who trouble their own house will inherit the wind. Justice will Prevail.” – Bill Clinton, April 23, 1985, after the Oklahoma City bombing
“Those who are lost now belong to God. Some day we will be with them.” – Clinton, April 23, 1985, Oklahoma City
“You can not divorce religious belief and public service. I’ve never detected a conflict between God’s will and my political duty. If you violate one, you violate the other.” – Jimmy Carter, Atlanta, June 16, 1978
“Freedom prospers when religion is vibrant and the rule of law under God is acknowledged.” – Ronald Reagan
One can agree or disagree with any or all of the above statements about God, and a great many others that have been made by presidents since the beginning of the this republic. What’s indisputable, however, is the fact that presidents – on the left and right – have a tradition of claiming partnerships with God as they’ve steered the executive branch.
Palin, by contrast, has merely spoken of prayers that God might have a plan. She has been nowhere near as boldly religious as the men who have governed us for 200-plus years. Perhaps standards are different for women.
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Thanks for passing along this excellent editorial.
The one common DS (“Derangement Syndrome”) most of the left seems to share is GDS. God Derangement Syndrome. The mere thought there is a true “One” to Whom they must someday answer to sends them into a frothing frenzy.
If McCain/Palin take the states where they lead today, then Colorado is the key. If they take Colorado, game over.
It’s doubtful that the voters up Denver way will read a Colorado Springs editorial. Getting this Sunday editorial online on a popular site for a Monday morning read was a nice move.
Perfect example of how liberals love to invoke God or Jesus when it suits their purposes. “Jesus was a community organizer” is a prime example. If a conservative does it, then they want to set up a theocracy.
What a load of lgm. My Bible doesn’t have any stories about Jesus shaking down the Romans for gladiator gear. In fact it’s just the opposite:
“Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s” (Mark 12:13-17)
How many of you think John Kennedy would be the democratic nominee today after a statement like that? All lgms, raise your hand.
Yep…just as I suspected. None.
Oh the Liberals in the MSM just love to point out a Republican’s Christian Faith and demonize it in ways that would make Lennin shudder, yet they are CONSTANTLY turning a blind eye to how often the Democrat candidate will hi-jack a Sunday Service, more than likely in a Black majority church, to show their candidtae getting “One with the people”, campaigning directly to the congregation.
The Left is spending millions in campaign dollars trying to convince the country, (sorry guys, we just aren’t that stupid) that they are down with The Word, doing everything to convince the Religious Majority in this country that the Republicans do not have the only Christian beliefs, and the MSM repeatedly turns their back on such stories.
The mere fact that over 85% of this country claims to be Judeo/Christian, who believe in One God and believe in The Bible, yet the MSM repeatedly insults anyone who believes only demonstrates their narcissistic beliefs that only the Intellectual Elite are worthy of all knowledge and the rest of us are merely “Clinging to our Bibles and our guns”.
It is too bad they all seem to have misplaced and forgotten those pictures of Bill Clinton clutching someone’s Bible in his hand while trying to convince the country of his repentance after his cheating on his wife, and also their ridicule of Ronald Reagan for not going to church every Sunday and keeping his religious practices to himself.
Colorado is definitely up for grabs. Going by recent polling so is the usually Dem-Prez solid Minnesota (my turf). Average folks here are more independent than they are partisan – that’s why we ended up with former Gov. Jesse Ventura.
My sentiments exactly.
Dennis Prager has preoffered the thought that if you were to read JFK’s inaugural address without attribution or any embedded temporal clues to college kids they would cite it as coming from Reagan or Bush.
(They’d go berserk hearing Kennedy’s tax cut speech!)
Even a better one.
Exactly.
Last I checked Jesus was a carpenter … not a community organizer …
It’s official, they r Nutso!
Camparing (in a misinformed way) Odopey to Jesus?
Whoever made the last batch of kool-aid made it justtttttt a tad too strong.
It’s Killin em and
I Love it!!!
McCain/Palin 08′
Image: long lines at the Odopey cracker factory after nov. 4th.
Very good piece. Thanks for passing it on.
David Barton over at wallbuilders.com
is breathtaking in his historical knowledge of the Faith that America was founded upon, it is not up for debate.
PERIOD
can get links there to watch the series
online or order a copy.
dem slacks misquoting His word simply verify the prophetic nature of the Bible.
disclosure: am a bitter clinger from PA
Excellent editorial. I only wish that newspaper had a bigger circulation, but getting those observations picked up here and elsewhere will help resolve that problem, for this excellent observation at least. I had had hopes that Charlie Gibson would at least be fair in his interviews with Gov. Palin; he’s the anchor of the MSM I trusted the most, or thought was the most fair. But he’s pretty much proven that was an incorrect assessment on my part. Aside from Fox News, you don’t have any news medium any more that even pays lip service to being “fair and balanced.”
Aj,
as much fun as this is to witness the implosion am reminded daily of Sec. Rice’s words re Sadam was something like “he is wasting the world’s time”.
let them thin their own herd!
Ron,
psst they just got the best circulation they could ask for MM put on her blog and no doubt RL will mention today as well.
oh and PS. choo choo Charlie jumped on a train today did not bother to tune in.
some silly gimic GMA is to visit 50 states in 50 days, wonder if any of their crack staff knows they can’t do that on a train lolo… perhaps that is what the missing 7 states obama thinks exist do provide turnstiles for the ABC train..lawdy!!
I would rather prefer someone who believes in God and follows His word than have someone who sits in a church for 20 years listening to things that are not biblical.
Take heart, here in Colorado there are about as many Independents as there are Democrats or Republicans. Happily, the voters in Colorado are not sheep. Also, there is a big military presence here. Boulder and downtown Denver do not necessarily rule the state. But the key will be getting those independents in the semi-rural areas out to vote. That’s why you are seeing Obama in places like Grand Junction this week.
I’d like to see that when they go to Hawaii.
It’s as if God has sent Sarah Palin to be a shining light in a dark room. When the light comes on, the creatures of the dark – cockroaches; rats; evil doers; liberals; etc – scurry into hiding trying to extinguish that light so they can get back to what they do best. We’ve seen some scurrying going on these past two weeks haven’t we?
Sarah Palin doesn’t have to proclaim her Christianity – her walk testifies to it loudly and clearly. Non-Christians can’t see it or understand it and to them it’s foolishness and yet, at the same time, a threat.
None of the wild claims about Sarah Palin’s faith by the foolish MSM is disconcerting to Christians as they recognize exactly what she believes and why. They can identify with her.
The quote from Washington is erroneous.
His farewell address does not mention God or the Bible.
Washington, as were many of the Founders, was a Deist. His farewell address alludes to “Providence” and he advises all to “observe good faith”. But the quote attributed to him is simply not there.
http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/washing.htm
This is sloppy journalism.
Do you mean to view the “America Heritage” series online or links to the stations that air it? I checked the site, but I didn’t see any online stream viewing options.
I agree Barton and WallBuilders is an excellent resource. Especially for those who are not aware of how strongly America was founded, and built on, biblical Judeo-Christian morals & values.
AMEN! May God help us.
It’s not that Palin is a Christian, so are Obama, Clinton, and Carter (Reagan didn’t and Bush, Jr. doesn’t practice their professed religion much.) It’s Christianism, terminology due to Andrew Sullivan. Palin wants to teach creationism (aka intelligent design) in science. She believes he dinosaurs died out 5 thousand years ago. She called the invasion of Iraq a holy war.
She supports abstinence only sex education even though both she and her daughter failed this class. Regardless of what she says she believes, she’s wrong for America.
Who would have thunk it? My little home state of Colorado, being the linchpin in the election.
Should be interesting in our state. Both sides have areas within the state which strongly support one side or the other.
Palin, is in Denver today. Obama, is going to Grand Junction, Pueblo, and Denver this week, too.
Most Denver voters can’t read, anyway
) … but I agree. I’m out on the eastern plains and get almost all my news from the internet. Our little excuses for newspapers here are leftwing rags, because they are owned by the Denver Post. Even though, the plains are predominantly republican.
Our fight out here is to keep Marilyn Musgrave in the House.
Somehow we all new that the MSM and the Obama Campaign would try and paint Sarah Palin as a Christian fanatic.
They think,
Only liberal Christians are allowed to be in politics in this country.
Jimmy Carter, the Clintons, and Barack Obama are Ok Christians; Christians who don’t follow the word of God, the Bible.
Thanks fine with me because,
Sarah Palin has God on her side
McCain and Palin should make use of those quotes on the the campaign trail and point out who it was that originally spoke the words.
The left and Dems sicken me. How dare they mock my religion. And in fact, mock the religious beliefs of the VAST majority of our nation.
Whoopie Goldberg with her “Do you believe in separation of Church and state” comment. She couldn’t even BEGIN to define what that phrase means. Most liberals haven’t a clue as to what it really means.
And Charles Gibson should stick to interviewing Rachael Ray. Recipes are about as complex an issue as he can handle…or be trusted with.
Squaawwk… Polly want a cracker?
Nice parroting of the New York Times’ lies, distortions, and innuendo, goofball!
lgm, please see this for the source of the information about Governor Palin that you quote above.
On September 15th, 2008 at 7:21 am, DesertLover said:
…
Last time I checked Jesus was the Messiah, not Barack Obama.
Until this year, Obama’s children were present for the Reverend Wright’s black theology strewn sermons. Allegedly within them was the creationism lgm so detests.
BTW, lgm, ain’t America great? Had you been an Iraqi in Iraq when Saddam Hussein was in power and you slandered him, his henchmen would have taken their time with you.
Typical lgm swoop and poop…
Ignore the Angry Left!!!!
It’s Killin em and
I Love it!!!
McCain/Palin 08′
Image: I wonder if they put a cover over lgm’s parrot cage at night.
Come on, people! Don’t you get it by now?
It’s okay to talk about God and Jesus when you’re a Democrat or liberal – or when you’re comparing Barack Obama to Jesus. It’s okay to invoke God’s name when you’re laughing about a destructive hurricane, okay to speak of God when you defend abortion or socialism or a loss of Constitutional freedoms.
But it’s not okay to talk about religion or God when you’re a Republican or conservative. You cannot possibly have deeply held beliefs that some things are wrong, sinful, or incorrect. You cannot possibly believe God demands you behave a certain way out of love, respect and deference to Him. You cannot possibly love your life or your children. You are just a bigot. You’re a sex-deprived prude who hates everyone else.
That’s how it breaks down.
Like everything else, it’s okay for liberals to be religious — but it’s not okay for conservatives. Just as it’s okay for liberals to hurl racial epithets at minorities who are conservative, just as it’s okay for them to mock and criticize conservative women, just as it’s okay for them to engage in egregious acts of violence in the name of “peace.”
Free speech for me, but not for thee. Free religious expression for me, but not for thee. Etc., etc.
And they just don’t get it.
If they gave up the religion bashing, the traditional-family hating, and the unfettered love of abortion, they’d probably never lose another election.
But no. They crawl out of the woodwork to throw crap at Palin, her family, her religion and – by extension – insult the majority of Americans who have families, who know disabled children, who go to church.
Liberals may think us conservatives are a bunch of unintelligent, illiterate, bitter, gun-clinging fools – but we’re not. We know when our lives, our values, our choices are being held in contempt and since Palin’s nomination, it’s been glaringly obvious how the MSM and an alarming number of Barack Obama backers really feel about the rest of America (here’s a hint: THEY HATE US!)
Great uniter indeed. Obama’s done a fabulous job of uniting the Freakish Enemies of the Normal under the banner of hatred for a good portion of America.
If any of you folks have participated in programs such as Alcoholics Anonymous, the need for the recognition of a higher power becomes self evident. I would consider it dangerous electing someone who is so arrogant not to admit their human fallibility’s and not seek guidance outside themselves.
Remember that, to the left, religion is nothing more than a tool (“opiate of the masses”). Never will you hear a leftist even utter the word “faith”. BTW, to the left, Christian faith is such a foreign concept that they keep confusing it with a religion.
You’re a liar. As usual.
And, thanks to all of you who have refuted the hogwash “Jesus was a community organizer.” Makes a nice slogan, but it’s patently false. The left, once again, is happy to try to equate BHO with Jesus, but the metaphor falls hopelessly flat.
Jesus was an extremely divisive figure, hated and feared by the Jewish religious leaders who convinced the Romans that he was guilty of blasphemy in order to justify His death on a Roman cross.
The statement of a closed mind. A political fanatic.
Actually, you hear them mention “faith” alot. It’s just that they’re never very specific about the object of their faith. It is always rather vague. And the MSM never questions them further.
Great post, englishqueen, great post.
You left out something, however. Only the left is allowed to be intolerant.
I couldn’t resist sharing that I, too, am clinging to my gun as well as my FAITH. My husband and I bought handguns recently to celebrate our 2nd amendment rights. We have always had shotguns and rifles, but he had to sell his handgun when we first got married due to financial struggles. It’s been a long time, but he and I are now proudly clinging to our guns once again!
No. He just shares sources with that epitome of political brilliance – Matt Damon.
They have a religion, called communism. They have a god, named Marx. And their Messiah is Obama.
Now there’s credible resource material.. ANDREW SULLIVAN( sheesh)……. lgm.. keep talking, you’re funny , in a sad sort of way.
You mean you believe the dinosaurs died out? I thought your “theory” was they evolved into birds, monkeys and sheep?
Yup indeed; “Excitable Andy” has become the laughingstock of the blogosphere.
Depends on which “theory of evolution” ya go by, b-cat. The biggest denominational cage-match fights are between the Darwinist true believers – it makes for some bigtime “get out the popcorn” fun!
Thank you, Michelle, for passing along that excellent editorial from the Colorado Springs Gazette. Well put and right on. Here in Pueblo, we have a fairly conservative newspaper in this blue collar union town. They also offer conservative responses to the left and are soundly criticized for it, but they press on. Today, Obama is scheduled to appear at a rally here, and our Democrat Senator and Congressman will probably be here, this is a strong Democrat (union) town. As our local Republican county chairman said, no Democrat can carry Colorado without winning in Pueblo, and the Republican party is out to see that doesn’t happen. As “happy2behere” said above, Denver and (“the Peoples Republic of…”)Boulder don’t speak for Colorado. At least they didn’t. The last couple of elections they gave the governor’s office and both state houses over to the Dems. Go figure. As you have pointed out, there is so much hatred in the “left”. God help them. And us (US). The local paper often publishes letters from local Democrats praising Obama and slamming anyone on the Republican/Christian right side of the spectrum. And those same people probably claim to be good Catholics, too. God has to be shaking His head and wondering…how we got so screwed up as a nation…no, He saw it centuries ago, and had to leave us to our free will to screw up…
Sigh….
Yes and no. He doesn’t specifically mention the words God and Bible. In fact, that “quotation” seems to be a summary of what he does say in his farewell address:
Given that Christianity was THE religion of the United States at time, and that George Washington was undoubtedly a Christian, when he says that religion is “indispensable,” he could not have been referring to any religion other than Christianity. Otherwise, why would he have said this to the Delaware indian chiefs:
Wrong. See the link above for Washington. As for the rest of the signers of the Constitution, we know the religious associations of all but one of them. Of the 55 signers, only 3 of them were Deists, one of whom was Benjamin Franklin, the man who initiated the practice of opening sessions of Congress with prayer.
The remaining 51 were sworn members of churches which today would be called fundamentalist. At the time, one of the requirements of becoming a member of a church was to swear to a statement of faith. In other words, they could not become members by simply warming a pew, they were required to confess to being Bible believing Christians before they could become a member of their church.
If we don’t worship God, we’ll find someone or something to worship. Even if it’s ourselves. That may be why some libs are so vague about their “faith.”
Re: “Jesus was a community organizer.”
Sarandon and a whole slew of useful idiots have been repeating the Democratic talking point that “Pontious Pilot was a governor.”
We all need to remind them that “John Wilkes Booth was an actor.”
Game.Set.Match.
The rules of religion and a structured society give us a framework to live our lives. The example I use is that of musical composition. Without the principles of harmonics the composer finished produce would sound caotic.
PurplePeep…Whereabouts in Minnesota are you? I live in Bloomington!
Hey, I get it, purplepeep! Like Purple People Eaters!
opps
On September 15th, 2008 at 11:01 am, FamilyMan said:
The rules of religion and a structured society give us a framework to live our lives. The example I use is that of musical composition. Without the principles of harmonics the composer finished product would sound chaotic.
freedom OF religion NOT freedom FROM religion. only communists seek to abolish religion and ban religiosity.
Wow! Well stated, englishqueen!
WHen it came time to make an important decision, Pontius Pilate voted “Present”…
On September 15th, 2008 at 8:51 am, padikiller said:
The quote from Washington is erroneous.
While you are correct that George Washington did not actually say, “God and the Bible” you are incorrect in your assessment of what he did say.
Religion and Morality were the words he used. There was only one religion of which he would have been speaking, Christianity and only one arbiter of morality, the Bible.
In his Thanksgiving Proclamation, Pres. Washington clearly refers to God, God’s blessings on this nation and the need to give Him thanks and pray for His blessings to continue.
Liberals try to rewrite history and distort the faith of our first President and others with the Deist charge. A Deist would not pray to a God they did not believe could be moved to show favor or who had no hand in the the blessings of this nation.
Great point!!
On September 15th, 2008 at 10:55 am, EWTHeckman
LOL, beat me to it. Great minds thinking alike.
Jesus was the Messiah. Barabbas was a community organizer.
I’m curious as to what the group of left wing activists that share the lgm account.. I’m curious as to what you people think is “right” for America.
Would it look like this?
Full line, IMO, should be:
“John Wilkes Booth was an actor who attacked a Republican.”
You mean it doesn’t require a conspiracy for two people to look at the same evidence and reach the same conclusions independently? Wow! Someone needs to tell the lefties!
While you are correct about the quote, you are definitely wrong about being deist. As George Washington was an Episcopalian, he was also an Episcopalian Parish Leader. As far as ‘many’ being deists, this is patently false, as there is only one that flirted with being a deist that was Jefferson, he was actually a unitarian. Now, there were many of differing opinions on religiosity among the founding fathers, but that doesn’t make them diests.
You see, diests do not believe in the providence of God, unlike the Jews and Christians. Diests believe that God does not intervene in Creation. It is obvious by the statements made by George Washington, that he did believe in divine providence, or the intervention by the Creator on his Creation.
So, next time you go to point out someone’s sloppy journalism, or inaccuracies try not to step in it, it just makes you look stupid.
sorry jvette, didn’t read your comments until after….you beat me to it
A simplified odds analysis of how likely spontaneous generation of enough DNA necessary to produce even a single protein molecule is very eye opening. Here is a simplified analysis where all simplifications go in favor of spontaneous occurrence:
Proteins are built from strings of amino acids ranging from 100 to 1,000 molecules in length. We’ll simplify by assuming they are all 100 molecules long. There are between 42,000 and 43,00 known proteins. We’ll round up to 45,000.
DNA is built from 4 different nucleotides. Three nucleotides are required to select 1 amino acid from the 20 or 21 possible amino acids. (I’ve seen both numbers.) This is because the DNA nucleotides are a base 4 numbering system.
I’m also assuming perfect conditions for the formation of DNA and ignoring all other variables, even though they would also reduce the odds of spontaneous generation. In order to produce a functional protein, the DNA strand must be in exactly the right order. If any molecule is out of place, the protein will not work. Also notice that I am dealing only with a fraction of the total DNA needed to produce a functioning cell.
The odds against any particular location in the strand containing the correct nucleotide is 1 in 4. The odds against getting the correct sequence in 2 sequential locations is 1 in 16 (4 x 4). The odds against getting 3 correct in a row is 1 in 64 (4 x 4 x 4). The odds against getting 300 correct in a row (the minimum necessary to produce the shorted protein molecule) is 1 in 4.15 x 10^180. (4^300) Divided by 45,000 proteins, the odds against getting ANY DNA capable of producing a functioning protein is 1 in 9.22 x 10^175. Remember, the actual odds are far worse because I simplified everything in naturalism’s favor.
By comparison, there are estimated to be 10^80 atoms in the universe. The universe is also estimated to be 13.73 billion years old. If we round up to 15 billion years, that gives us 4.73 x 10^17 seconds. So if every single atom in the universe was randomly generating a 300 molecule string of DNA every second since the universe began, the odds of success would still be 1 in 1.95 x 10^78 against producing a DNA strand which could produce the simplest protein.
Now multiply those odds against the rest of a DNA strand (15,000+ nucleotides for a single-celled organism), nevermind the rest of the structures in even the simplest cell.
<sarcasm> Yep! That spontaneous generation of life looks sooooooo reasonable and “scientific.” </sarcasm>.
I think I understand the problem the media has with Gov. Palin’s comments regarding God, as compared to those of the other politicians, at least those still living.
They are concerned that, when she says it, she actually believes it.
Now, there you go confusing the libs with actual numerical facts, which they doesn’t fit in with their fuzzy math. the whole cells mutating sounds good to an ignoramus, but just ask any cancer researcher about ‘mutating’ cells. Yeah, the cells only mutate into cancerous cells. I get never get my mind past that point to even believe in tthe evolution theory.
Bada bing!
WHen Bill Clinton made similar statements it was wink-wink nudge-nudge we know he HAS to say stuff like that occasionally. I remember reading an article a while back that compared the number of religious references in presidential speeches. GWB (dangerous Fundie) has actually made fewer references than Clinton did.
i thought i hit preview.. yikes on my spelling and grammatics..
Probably the greatest prayer delivered by a president was FDR’s on the morning of the D-Day invasion:
Franklin Delano Roosevelt
June 6, 1944 (Operation Overlord)
My Fellow Americans:
Last night, when I spoke with you about the fall of Rome, I knew at that moment that troops of the United States and our Allies were crossing the Channel in another and greater operation. It has come to pass with success thus far.
And so, in this poignant hour, I ask you to join with me in prayer:
Almighty God: Our sons, pride of our nation, this day have set upon a mighty endeavor, a struggle to preserve our Republic, our religion, and our civilization, and to set free a suffering humanity.
Lead them straight and true; give strength to their arms, stoutness to their hearts, steadfastness in their faith.
They will need Thy blessings. Their road will be long and hard, for the enemy is strong. He may hurl back our forces. Success may not come with rushing speed, but we shall return again and again; and we know that by Thy grace, and by the righteousness of our cause, our sons will triumph.
They will be sore tried, by night and by day, without rest — until the victory is won. The darkness will be rent by noise and flame. Men’s souls will be shaken with the violences of war.
For these men are lately drawn from the ways of peace. They fight not for the lust of conquest. They fight to end conquest. They fight to liberate. They fight to let justice arise, and tolerance and goodwill among all Thy people. They yearn but for the end of battle, for their return to the haven of home.
Some will never return. Embrace these, Father, and receive them, Thy heroic servants, into Thy kingdom.
And for us at home — fathers, mothers, children, wives, sisters, and brothers of brave men overseas, whose thoughts and prayers are ever with them — help us, Almighty God, to rededicate ourselves in renewed faith in Thee in this hour of great sacrifice.
Many people have urged that I call the nation into a single day of special prayer. But because the road is long and the desire is great, I ask that our people devote themselves in a continuance of prayer. As we rise to each new day, and again when each day is spent, let words of prayer be on our lips, invoking Thy help to our efforts.
Give us strength, too — strength in our daily tasks, to redouble the contributions we make in the physical and the material support of our armed forces.
And let our hearts be stout, to wait out the long travail, to bear sorrows that may come, to impart our courage unto our sons wheresoever they may be.
And, O Lord, give us faith. Give us faith in Thee; faith in our sons; faith in each other; faith in our united crusade. Let not the keeness of our spirit ever be dulled. Let not the impacts of temporary events, of temporal matters of but fleeting moment — let not these deter us in our unconquerable purpose.
With Thy blessing, we shall prevail over the unholy forces of our enemy. Help us to conquer the apostles of greed and racial arrogances. Lead us to the saving of our country, and with our sister nations into a world unity that will spell a sure peace — a peace invulnerable to the schemings of unworthy men. And a peace that will let all of men live in freedom, reaping the just rewards of their honest toil.
Thy will be done, Almighty God.
Amen.
There are two things that Liberals like to state that I find to be absolutely hillarious. One of them is a new one. It is this misnomer that GOVERNOR (they LOVER to omit her official title when addressing her as a blatant sign of disrespect, belittlement and avoidance of fact) Palin wants to instigate a “Abstinence Only” form of Sex Ed in schools, then state the fact that her 17 year old daughter is pregnant is proof that such a thing would not work.
Fact of the matter is, she does NOT want an “Abstinance Only” Sex Ed taught, and the Sex Ed classes now taught do not teach abstinance. It is the same that her daughter took. They refuse to admit that maybe…JUST MAYBE…had she received an Abstinance Course instead of the , “If it feels good, do it…everyone does cause it’s ‘Natural’” form of Sex Ed that Liberals fight for and is the prevalent form in public schools, maybe, just maybe, she would have received the kind of approval to stay abstinent that is required beyond just parental teachings and such. It would have helped to lend the peer approval of remaining celibate until married or at least of a decent age to care for things the proper way.
Of course they also continue to leave out the fact that she is marrying the father of her child, unlike the droves and droves of Liberals and Democrats who claim a father is not required to raise children, that a woman does not need to be married, and throws dirt in the face of all those welfare mothers who continue to give birth to child anfter child ithout keeping track of how many different fathers their children have. She made a mistake, accepted responsibility for it, along with the father, and is handling it. THAT is the very foundation of Conservative beliefs. Accept responsibility for your own actions. Do not blame others, for no one held a gun to your head.
The other is one that is far more ingrained into the Liberal Mindset, and they use it as a way to justify their own Godless ways and the way they wish things were.
That is to claim that basically everyone, especially all but maybe one or two, of the Founding Fathers were not Christian and believed in God and used the Bible as a guidepost for the way this country would be founded and governed, but instead were Deists etc.
This shows a blatant ignorance as to the times, the beliefs of the times, the very statements and writings, as well as speeches of the Founding Fathers. While Deism was a passing “fad” of the times, the vast majority of those who founded this country were died-in-the-wool Christians, and people need to not be sucked in to the Liberal re-writing of history.
Just because they wish things were one way in order to justify their lack of morals and values, does not mean they can change history and make them so.
Oh, and LGM, interesting that you drop a dud bomb with inaccurate quotes, talking about subjects so obviously above your paygrade. Back under your bridge!
And Jimmy, if you’re reading, I’m calling you out for your failure to say anything about the MSM smears of Palin’s faith.
Oh come on AG…you know Jiimah was nothing but a Deist and that quote is taken out of context.
/sarc
Read George Washington’s Thanksgiving Day speech for his thoughts on asking for God’s guidance and protection for our country–it has over 15 references to God. Then check out one of his general orders to his soldiers about no “reverend” Wright swearing / cursing in the Continental Army a number of years earlier–he knew death was at hand and did not want to offend God.
I paraphrase the old Mexican plaint, “Poor Mexico–so far from God and so close to the U.S.A.” POOR LIBERALS–SO FAR FROM GOD AND SO CLOSE TO HELL!
And I’m calling him out for his lack of support for Israel.
“I will bless them that bless thee, and curse them that curse thee.”
When are you folks gonna’ stop whining about sexism in the media?
Palin needs to explain why she went to 5 colleges in 6 years just to get a BA?
She should also explain why a responsible mother with: a son leaving for Iraq, a teenage pregnant daughter and a down syndrome baby would join a campaign that involves such intense media scrutiny – is that what a good mother does?
I went to 3 colleges to earn my BA – what’s your point? Isn’t her record of accomplishments over the last 16 years at least as important as her late teenage years when she was attending college?
As to your other questions, her son is of age and is deployed to Iraq to fight for our country, her daughter is marrying her child’s father and Gov. Palin and her husband seem quite prepared to handle the challenges of their new baby.
I must have missed it. What is the ssource of repeated reference that Sarah Palin believes dinosaurs still existed only a few thousand years ago?
Yup. And an analysis of the odds of DNA – or anything else for that matter – coming from nothing (“ex nihilo”) is even easier to calculate.
I hazard a guess:
Obama’s back orifice?
lonewolf said:
I’ve tried to find that out myself. I certainly don’t believe anything that I am told about Palin until checking it out first. Remember the smear that Palin supposedly called Hillary a whiner? FALSE.
Anyway, all I could find was a claim by some guy that, several years ago, she told him that she was a young earth creationist. Sounds pretty iffy to me, but don’t wait for the facts before pouncing. And where is Trig’s birth certificate and DNA test?!?!?!?! Lefty wackos wanna know!
It was a blog. A joke that Damon and the media fell for before it was debunked. Repeatedly. More here. And here.
On September 15th, 2008 at 7:03 am, Craig said:
In my opinion it appears that JFK was the last Democrat President…
the rest have been Democratic Socialists.
JFK stood up to the Communists, so he would never be the nominee of today’s Democrat[ic Socialist] Party.
Just to be clear – I’m a young earth creationist. Just seems to explain everything better. I only have to make one leap of faith – GOD did it just as he said he did.
GOD wasn’t a democrat so he didn’t use nuance to explain what he did – he just said “on day one, I did this, on day two I did that..on day three…”
And for those that think I’m crazy, I’ll give a simple one – please explain the seven day week.
And all God’s children say – AMEN!!!
englishqueen01 said:
I think they also could be referring to the info that is mentioned HERE.
After doing a search on Philip Munger, he appears to be a real person, but I do not know how reliable a source he is.
conservativesRus said:
I think there is a lot more to the Genesis creation account than most people are aware of. Which day of the week did God create the Earth? Read carefully.
I think most people would consider me a Biblical conservative – I believe the Bible is the inspired Word of God, infallible, inerrant, and so forth. However, I do not believe my understanding of the Bible is infallible.
I’ve studied the creation account and evolution for years now. Over that time, as I continued to learn more and more, my positions have changed a great deal.
My current view is that the creation week in Genesis 1 refers to a literal, 6 24-hour day period of creation. I also believe the universe is probably billions of years old.
I believe Genesis’ record of the creation of Adam & Eve is a literal, true, accurate, historically correct account of how those two historical persons came to be. I also believe that human beings probably evolved. I believe there are some things in Genesis that are very difficult to explain apart from presupposing something like evolution.
Doesn’t sentence one contradict sentence two there (and vice versa), TMan, or am I missing something?
purplepeep said:
It is very strange to be sure, and I probably would have thought someone who believed this to be a heretic not long ago. But this is where my own personal study has led me. Perhaps I am wrong about this, but this is the result of my own honest struggle with this difficult subject.
Interpretation
Suppose mankind already existed before God created Adam. Suppose that man had already arrived on the Earth as a result of some natural process that God had set in motion, like evolution. For some reason, perhaps God decides to then engineer a special human being. God works under the restraint of making a man that is fully compatible to evolved man (“natural man” henceforth), and genetically engineers a person that has a lifespan of about 1000 years. The genetically engineered human has such a long life span because God has designed him to be resistant to heart disease, cancer, to age well, etc. Unlike natural man, Adam and Eve are genetically perfect. But why suppose this?
Biblical Support for this Interpretation:
Cain
It would make sense out of Cain’s fear of being driven out – for there would already be plenty of people out there. It would explain how he could move far away from his family, and yet found a city. It would also help explain how his offspring could go into various industries, as if they had already existed (Genesis 4:17-22).
Noah
From Adam to Noah, with only a couple of anomalies, everyone listed lives 900+ years. What is especially significant is when the lifespans begin to gradually decline – the children of Noah. It was during the life of Noah that “the sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves, whomever they chose” Gen. 6:2. It might be that the sons of God refers to Adam’s descendants (genetically engineered man), and that the daughters of men refer to natural man. This is noted in Noah’s generation, and notice that in the next generation, the lifespan of Noah’s children are less than the 900+ that had previously been the case. Perhaps Noah’s wife is from natural man, or mixed, explaining why Noah’s sons do not live as long.
Longevity
Shem, Noah’s son, only lived 600 years. The lifespans would gradually decline until all lifespans are similar to what we see today. Notice that in Gen. 10:32 even seems to suggest that these descendants became part of peoples that already existed. If you plot the lifespans of these people, it creates a mathematical curve – clearly something is going on here. The decrease in lifespan makes sense if you have the continued mingling of Adam’s genes with natural man. Over successive generations, the weaker genetics of natural man begin to dominate, slowly watering down the “pure” genes.
Early Marriage
This would also explain why it was so important to marry close kin early on, but after Adam’s genes were sufficiently diluted, close marriage was forbidden. Close marriages are only harmful due to genetic problems. If one had perfect genes, that would not be a problem.
Sarah
Consider the odd fact that Abraham is concerned that his wife, who was then around 90 years old, was so attractive that men might kill him to take her. This is very bizarre, no? Abraham lived to be 175. Sarah died at 127, but perhaps she had a similar concentration of Adamic genes as Abraham (they were closely related). Perhaps Sarah died prematurely for whatever reason, and had a life expectancy similar to her husband, around 200 years or so. If this is true, and if she aged well (like all those closely related to Adam), even at 90, she may have only appeared to be 30-40 at the time, thus explaining how she was still very attractive.
Jacob
One more point, and I think this is key. Consider when Jacob meets Pharaoh in Gen. 47:7-10. The Bible only records one thing that Pharaoh said to Jacob – he asks Jacob “How many years have you lived?” Reading between the lines, Jacob has probably told Pharaoh about his life, prompting Pharaoh to ask “Just how old are you?!” Look at Jacob’s response.
Jacob says he is 130 years old, which is pretty impressive, considering he wouldn’t die until he was 147. When Jacob says his years are “few,” he is using the humility that was customary at that time, indicating that he realized that 130 was a lot of years compared to other people. Jacob also realizes that, even though his lifespan is greater than that of normal people, it is nothing compared to the lifespans of his ancestors! In this passage, Jacob seems to be aware that he has a much longer lifespan than normal folks, and that his family’s lifespan is gradually getting shorter, but he doesn’t appear to understand why.
The End of Longevity
After Jacob, you only see a couple more people that have special aging – like Moses and Caleb. But after that, you don’t see it again. At that point, presumably the genetics have become so diluted that there is no distinguishable difference between those who are descended from Adam and those who are not.
Loose Ends
If this hypothesis is correct, then why didn’t God simply say so in the Bible? Well, considering we didn’t even have a basic knowledge of evolution or genetics until relatively recently, it wouldn’t have made any sense to anyone until the present time anyway. So it would make sense of the fact that the Bible records some very odd things (the life spans) which are obviously noteworthy, but never tries to explain them. These things could be figured out thousands of years later when man reached a certain level of scientific understanding.
Well, TMan, I won’t call you a heretic, lol. I will say your take is unique in some ways, but familiar to other speculation that I’d consider more “way out there” than yours.
I’ve heard various theories that offer the idea of “ancient astronauts” came here. (In fact that’s actually part of one of the competing theories of human evolution.)
I follow your line of reasoning and I think you are somewhat on the same track with most folks who are biblical literalists. But you diverge from them in your starting hypothesis and conclusions.
I believe most literalists will note that with the fall of man sin and death entered this world. Mankind was built to live forever. But with the introduction of sin decay set in – as a result, as you have noted, lifespans become increasingly shorter as the ages rolled along. Sin upon sin, century after century.
I think you get off track, though, for a couple of reasons.
It seems you are trying to reconcile bad science, i.e. “evolution”, with “what really happened”. Although evolution changes every 10 years or so and is riddled with mistakes & fraud (e.g. “Piltown Man”), I would expect God, in contrast, to be a truthful and constant reliable source.
What’s hard for me to reconcile in your thoughtline is the One capable of the creation of the heavens and earth would have to fall back on Darwinism at any point. To me, there’s no logic or reason to that. That is, if we’re talkin’ about an omnipotent Deity here
Another point – Eve was so named, as Genesis tells us, because she was “the mother of ALL living”.
But as I sez, it’s an “IMHO” the big error is in trying to reconcile changing fiction (Darwinism) with God’s established, clear word. It would be like a court considering both true and false evidence & testimony as equally valid evidence in coming to a judicial decision.
I’m not discouraging you from pondering and considering such things at length, you’re obviously considering things deeply. I’m just saying I think you might consider the possibility there may be some chaff in with the wheat. Or, to use another of Jesus’ allegories, even tiny bit of leaven can mess up the matzah. (Well, that’s more my translation of His words, lol)
There just happens to be a current series by the “Grace To You” ministry titled “The Battle for the Beginning” that may be of interest, since it’s going over things you’ve brought up – if you’re so inclined. (Nothing cult-like, it’s “generic” evangelical Christian teaching.)
You can download the MP3s of the daily talks or read them online (or do both, for free) at this page:
The Battle for the Beginning
I’ve been finding them interesting, your take may be different. But it’s all the different takes folks have that just adds to making life more interesting!
Thanks for expanding on your thoughtline, TMan.
uhangtight
Jefferson, who was not a Christian, was also an Episcopalian Parish Leader, in Albemarle. So was George Wythe, an avowed Deist. Any leader who wanted power had to be a church leader – the church then performed most of the day-to-day government and social functions. Such was the political reality – non-Christians were oppressed. For example, until Jefferson changed it, Virginia law provided that Christian apostates could be punished by loss of rights and even imprisonment.
uhangtight
This is simply not true. A central tenet of classical Deism was the belied in Divine Providence – the belief that a Creator provided the Universe and then left it large alone to be dealt with by human reasoning.
What we know of Washington does not support the contention that he was a Christian. He attended church very infrequently, and when he did go, he would hang around outside while Martha took communion.
There is no reference in any of his adult writing of any reference to Jesus and the Constitution drafted by the Constitutional Convention over which he presided, deliberately excludes any reference to God at all.
If you are interested in studying the Genesis creation account, I highly recommend checking out Dr. Sailhammer’s Genesis Unbound. His take on the 6 days of creation is that it is a literal week, but is far different from the usual YEC (Young Earth Creationist) interpretation. It doesn’t describe the creation of the universe, but the miraculous recreation of the Holy Land.
The Fall
I’ve always had a problem with the view that there was no death in creation until the fall. Adam needs to partake of the fruit of the tree of life in order to live forever. That suggests that death was built into him, and only through this fruit is he able to stave off natural death. Death seems to have been built into creation from the beginning, not just as a result of the fall. I believe the death that came from the fall is spiritual death, not physical.
Lifespans
I don’t see how sin would cause people’s longevity to go from 900+ to 120+ (I believe Gen. 6:3 refers to how long Noah was to preach before God brought judgment through the flood, as opposed to making a new arbitrary age limit). If you look at the lifespans, they are steady for several generations, even as you go from no sin to a world filled with violence, corruption, and wickedness. The lifespans should have already been decreasing if sin was the cause of the drop in lifespan.
Evolution
As far as evolution goes, yes, I believe it does have problems. The origin of life is perhaps the greatest problem for the atheist who seeks to explain life apart from God. Perhaps evolution isn’t correct, but at least something like it appears to have happened. In general, you see that early life was very simple, and you only get complex life forms later.
I wasn’t very religious growing up. I was taught evolution was a fact, and never even questioned it. Then I became a Christian, and many of the people I admired rejected evolution. So I began to study the matter, and over a period of years, I came to reject it myself – I thought it was a total sham.
I was so convinced that evolution was bogus science, that when I decided to go back to college, I seriously considered pursuing graduate studies in biology in order to refute evolution. I wasn’t content to just complain about evolution, I was so outraged at how this pseudo-science was being beat into people, that I was determined to bring an end to it myself!
I had a few months to study before school started, and as a budding Christian apologist, I was trying to make a choice. Should I study biology in order to refute evolution, or study philosophy to present arguments for the existence of God?
I started reading college level text books in biology. I noticed that they were full of faulty arguments against God and so forth, the atheist authors made all kinds of mistakes. But something else happened. I noticed that some of the things that I had been taught by those opposed to evolution were wrong. In fact, I noticed that there was evidence for evolution, even good evidence.
Look, I don’t want to get involved in a deep scientific debate on this subject, but let me say this. I went from having been completely convinced evolution was wrong, to believing that there really is something to it. I know that makes me anathema to many, but that is where the evidence led me. Just like I followed the evidence towards faith in Christ – that there is a God, and that Jesus rose from the dead, so the evidence convinced me that evolution, or something along those lines, has occurred.
I don’t see it as God “falling back” or leaning on nature, as if God needed any help. There is a kind of elegance in evolution. You don’t have a bunch of little miracles all over the place, but you see the Great Mind having put it all together at the very beginning. Through one act, God created the great variety of planets, stars, galaxies, and life forms. That shows planning and genius to me.
Sure, God has the power to have created the entire universe, fully functioning, ready for man, in a single instant. But He didn’t. Whether you believe God created the universe over 6 days or billions of years, the simple fact is, God created the world through a process, rather than a single instant.
What exactly does it mean to say that she was the mother of all the living? It can’t mean mother of all living things, for she obviously isn’t the mother of the plants and animals.
Does it mean she is the mother of all the living human beings? She wasn’t the mother of Adam. Just going from the Biblical text, the woman isn’t named Eve until after God pronounced His judgment on the serpent, Adam, & the woman. As far as we can tell, she is named Eve after God has declared that from her would come the seed that would crush the serpent.
We know that Jesus was descended from Eve, and that (only) through Jesus & His cross can we have life. So Jesus’ cross becomes our tree of life. So I think it can be true that Eve was the mother of all the living, even if she wasn’t the mother of all human beings.
I’ll be sure to take a look at The Battle for the Beginning when I get the time. Genesis is one of those subjects I never get tired of studying. Just when you think you’ve already heard all there is to say on the subject, there comes something new. That is why I never get tired of studying the Bible, it is such a deep book.