Liveblogging the town hall debate: Zzzzzzzz
I don’t have any prizes to give away, but you get Special MM.com Bonus Points if your insipid question suggestion gets asked tonight.
As for drinking game proposals, I recommend taking a swig every time Tom Brokaw inserts his two cents after the citizens ask their questions. Apparently, the two campaigns agreed that he wouldn’t be allowed to do so — but he has since balked and said he wasn’t privy to the memorandum of understanding.
Second drinking game variation: Drink when Obama ties Bush to McCain again.
Here we go…
9:01pm Eastern. Tom Brokaw is on. He is as orange as an Oompa Loompa. Sen. Obama won the coin toss.
First question: Alan Schaefer. “What’s the fastest way to bail these people out?”
Obama gives his standard blame Bush, blame greed screed.
Expands bailout for the middle-class, fix health care, energy, blahblahblah.
Sen. McCain: “Americans are angry, upset, a little fearful…I have a plan to fix this problem. It’s got to do with energy independence, keep Americans’ taxes low…packages of reforms.”
Will he or won’t he talk Fannie/Freddie?
Prepare to be disappointed.
“We’re going to have to do something about home values…for retirees…I would order Treasury Secretary to renegotiate home loans.”
Oh, dear.
HE WANTS TO EXPAND THE BAILOUT. He wants to do what ACORN wants to do.
We’re Screwed ‘08.
He wants to make housing unaffordable to responsible, careful people.
I think I’m going to throw up.
What did I tell you? Yes, I called it:
It would be wise to dramatically lower your expectations of this debate. The town hall format lends itself to the worst pander-style, personal sob story politicking.
McCain is yammering about “greed and excess.” Nothing about Obama/Fannie/Freddie.
9:10pm Eastern. Obama is free to bloviate about his bogus tax relief plans Obama says “McCain is right” again about the housing loan modification proposals. Great. They agree: ACORN rules!
Next questioner: Oliver Clark asks the same question about how the bailout is helping people out.
Here we go: McCain mentions Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Mentions that Obama was second biggest recipient of Fannie/Freddie. Fannie and Freddie were the match that started this forest fire.
Goes back to his “stabilization” proposals.
Sorry, Mac, that’s not enough. He forgot to mention Jim Johnson, ACORN, etc., etc.
Obama attacks McCain as a “deregulator.” Obama puffs up his letter-writing “reform” efforts. Weak. “I never promoted Fannie Mae.”
McCain gets no follow-up.
Brokaw inserts his two cents. Take a swig. “Are you saying the economy is going to get much worse?”
Obama: “We’re going to have to coordinate with other countries” on further action.
CRIKEY.
Same question to McCain: “I believe it depends on what we’re going to do.”
He REPEATS his idea of buying up bad loans so people can renegotiate.
Next question: Teresa Finch. “How can we trust either of you when both parties are responsible” for this mess?
Take another drink. Obama’s just blamed Bush again.
9:21pm Eastern. McCain’s answer involves touting his work on “climate change” with Joe Lieberman.
Gag.
Next drinking game: When McCain says “reaching across the aisle.” Go. He’s saying a whole lot of nothing.
And another one: Take a swig every time he repeats Joe Lieberman’s name.
He keeps talking about earmarks — but, um, not about the ones he and Obama approved as part of the Crap Sandwich 2.0.
Obama’s talking about prioritizing spending. Blech.
Brokaw chastises both candidates about their time limits.
First Internet question: What sacrifices will Americans have to make?
McCain talks about eliminating government programs.
“We have to eliminate the earmarks.”
Except all the ones he just supported in the Crap Sandwich bailout!
9:30pm Eastern. Obama’s turn. He brings up 9/11. As a “tragedy.” Not as a murderous, evil attack by jihadists. But a tragedy.
I remind you of Obama’s compassion for the jihadists.
Drink up. He took another shot at Bush for telling people to shop and conduct business in the face of the 9/11 attacks.
Leadership from Obama: He recommends people weatherize their home.
No word about those tire gauges.
Brokaw: How would you break bad habits of too much debt and too much easy credit?
Obama: Yes, we’ll have to cut spending, but a scalpel, not a hatchet.
McCain: “Nailing down Obama’s tax proposals is like nailing Jello to a wall…likens Obama to Hoover…I am not in favor of reducing taxes for the wealthy…pitches $5,000 refundable tax credit for health care…”
9:37pm Eastern. Obama wants to break the rules he agreed to and respond to McCain. Brokaw stammers. He’s going to read the next question…no, he’s going to ask his own question: Will you give a date certain on reforming entitlements.
Obama won’t guarantee a date. Then segues back to his rejoinder to McCain on taxes. More anti-greed stuff from both candidates.
Back to citizen questions: Ingrid Jackson asks McCain about “climate change and green jobs.”
Prepare for more disappointment, people.
Drink, drink: “Joe Lieberman and I” kept on this issue.
At last, something I can support: McCain pushes nuclear energy, assails Obama for his opposition.
9:47pm Eastern. Brokaw is lecturing the candidates again about the time limits. Obama blames McCain.
9:48pm Eastern. McCain goes after Obama for his pork-laden energy bill vote. McCain says he’ll vote against the earmarks.
Except all the ones he just supported in the Crap Sandwich bailout!
Next question: Lindsey Trella. “Do you believe health care should be treated as commodity?”
Obama launches into his I Will Heal All stump speech.
McCain repeats his $5,000 tax credit idea. He made a hair transplant joke that no one laughed at. Cringe.
Brokaw question: Is health care a privilege, right, or responsibility?
McCain: “I think it’s a responsibility.”
Obama: “It’s a right.”
Well, finally, a stark, unequivocal difference between these two.
9:57pm Eastern. I feel like watching the Palin/Biden debate again. How about you?
Obama is rolling right over Brokaw. And Brokaw is letting him.
Question: Phil Elliott. “How will all the economic turmoil affect our ability to act as a peacemaker in the world?”
I am so sure this dude is “undecided.”
10:01pm Eastern. McCain lays into Obama’s failed judgement on foreign policy. “We don’t have time for on-the-job training, my friend.”
Obama is back to Bush-bashing. Drink. Now, we’re just rehashing last week’s debate.
Worthless.
McCain-Bush, McCain-Bush.
Sarah Palin was so much more effective at defusing this talking point in her debate.
McCain is doing…nothing.
Except: “My friends, my friends, my friends, my friends.”
McCain says he’ll bring home troops in victory and honor, Obama would bring them home in defeat.
Citizen questioner Katie Hamm asks about Pakistan.
McCain attacks on Obama’s invade Pakistan remarks.
Obama wants a follow up, in violation of the prior agreed-to rules.
Brokaw gets rolled again: “I’m just hired help here.:”
Obama: “You’re doing a good job, Tom.”
In. The. Tank.
Obama recycles “Bomb, bomb, bomb Iran” and annihilation of North Korea talking points. Like I said: This is just a rehash of last week’s debate.
Next…
10:23pm Eastern. Brokaw wants a yes or no: Is Russia under Putin an evil empire.
Obama blabs for 45 seconds without a yes or no.
McCain: Maybe. It depends on their behavior.
Terry Shirey, retired Navy chief. Question is about support for Israel. Would you be willing to commit to troops if Iran attacks Israel or would you wait for UN Security Council?
McCain thanks Shirey for his service. “Obviously, we wouldn’t wait for UN Security Council.”
Obama promotes sanctions.
10:30pm Eastern. Brokaw saves the most insipid question of the night for last from “Peggy in Amherst:”
“What don’t you know and how will you learn it?”
Obama immediately launches into his Dreams of My Father biography spiel. Talking up his mom again. Food stamps. Mentions Bitter Half Michelle Obama and the American Dream.
The stupid-meter is broken.
McCain ignores the question and gives his same wrap-up statement as last week: Country first.
10:34pm Eastern. Obama and McCain step in the way of Brokaw’s teleprompter.
One last whine from Tom: “You’re in the way of my script.”
Crikey. Thank goodness, this torture is now over.
11:16pm Eastern. I’m forcing myself to watch some of the post-debate commentary.
Disaster: Mitt Romney apparently wasn’t made aware of McCain’s new $300 billion housing entitlement plan. And Fred Thompson could barely muster up enthusiasm for McCain.
No mention of Ayers. No mention of ACORN. Not even the feeblest attempt to expose Obama’s radical roots.
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Categories: Barack Obama, John McCain
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» Bad manners
WarEagle82, I apologize if my tone was overboard. I’ve become sick of hearing conservatives say they’ll vote minor party because they think McCain is as bad a choice as Obama. I look at all the issues and I clearly see stark differences.
Trollman, four years of Obama might bring to the next great conservative President, like Sarah Palin, but I don’t want to have to go through four years of post-9/11 national malaise for that to happen, especially with the threat of Islamic fundamentalism.
Maybe HE should be president with a “can-do” attitude like that!
I have a technical question. How to I block the quote seperate from my response? (I need to ditch my newbie image)
Gammy. It needs to be soaked in heavy cream overnight before smoking.
I still don’t understand why people expect McCain to be anyone other than himself. He’s 72. He’s not going to undergo some kind of conservative rebirth. He’s just going to get mad because we don’t agree with him and blame us when he loses. Just like he did last time.
Morgan said:
Me neither, but that appears to be the way we’re heading.
where can we get our “impeach obama” bumper stickers?
Committed:
You should do so. Education, especially in history, is never wasted.
Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it. The battle against socialism was faught once before and guess what: Capitalism and Democracy won. As it did then and it will win again.
Thanks for the moral support on this one, Isnala.
Committed:
The way I do it is by cut and pasting what I want to quote, highlighting it, and selecting quote.
Hey folks
Can’t we require a high school constitution test before we graduate people to represent us?
THEY TALKED TO US LIKE WE WERE CHILDREN.
But, I can’t help it if McCain IS nearly as bad as Obama. Plus, it is NOT MY FAULT HE REFUSES TO DO THE RIGHT THING! The man does not want to do what is necessary to win. It is one of the major problems of the GOP. They want the Socialists to like them! The Socialists want to destroy them but idiots like McCain just haven’t figured it out yet.
I have voted for the GOP for at least the last 6 elections. They have failed to live up to their promises and if you will pardon the phrase, the chickens are coming home to roost. Everybody knows the GOP pays lip service to conservative principles. I am NOT playing that game any longer. 75 senators voted for the MOAB. The GOP is dead. The body just hasn’t stopped twitching yet.
On October 7th, 2008 at 11:38 pm, committed said:
After you paste in the text you want to quote, select it again within this comment window, then click the quote button and it will wrap the selected text with the appropriate tags. Then click below the quoted text and type your response…
committed said:
Highlight the section that you want to appear as a quote and press the quote button.
Other helpful tips can be found HERE and HERE.
No problem, Committed!
I also love learning and make it a point to learn at least 5 new things every day.
On October 7th, 2008 at 11:42 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:
On October 7th, 2008 at 11:38 pm, committed said:
I have a technical question. How to I block the quote seperate from my response? (I need to ditch my newbie image)
After you paste in the text you want to quote, select it again within this comment window, then click the quote button and it will wrap the selected text with the appropriate tags. Then click below the quoted text and type your response…
Thanks for the technical tips, guys.
On October 7th, 2008 at 11:41 pm, Isnala said:
Committed:
The way I do it is by cut and pasting what I want to quote, highlighting it, and selecting quote.
FamilyMan that would require us to make people take personal responsibility for their actions.
I’ll keep working on it.. Off to bed!
Goodnight all.
On October 7th, 2008 at 11:36 pm, Morgan said:
It could also being about communism or civil war… These people willing to put the country through hell to have more say in what springs up out of the rubble are idiots who have been manipulated bu the DNC.
Obama wont bring back Reagan.. He will just bring about disaster.
WarEagle82 said:
I think McCain does want to win - which is the only reason I think he picked Palin. It was a good decision, but that alone won’t make up for all of his other decisions that he has made since that have been awful.
In some ways, he is a lot like Bush. It is as if he thinks he can befriend the Democrats. That ain’t gonna happen. They are going for the jugular, and they will exploit any and all niceties to their advantage.
Compromise is when the Republicans cave to them. When was the last time you saw the Democrats cave on abortion, for example?
On October 7th, 2008 at 11:39 pm, Isnala said:
It is imperative to understand that the battle is not just a political or economic battle. It is also a spiritual battle.
Karl Marx said, “My object in life is to dethrone God and destroy capitalism.”
Saul Alinsky literally gave an acknowledgment to Lucifer in the front matter of his book Rules for Radicals.
For all who want to understand the truth about how Ronald Reagan prevailed over the Communists 25 years ago, read and listen to this Reagan speech.
Trying to win the political and economic war, without trying to win the spiritual war, is futile.
In any case, WarEagle82, I hope you will at least move to Idaho instead of Australia. This country is too important to leave just because things aren’t going the way we want them to be.
Isnala said:
That assumes the words of the Constitution have meaning, rather than being a “living, breathing” document that means whatever the liberals want it to say.
I don’t know. Ask McCain his mouth sure wasn’t full of good answers.
No, it’s not an age thing. I’m 33 years old and conservative. My kid sister is 30 years old and is very liberal. I think it’s more of an environment, life experience, weak-minded sort of thing.
If it took the Palin pick to tip one of your children toward Obummer then he was never really a Republican (or conservatve for that matter). Your younger child is looking for freebies so that he doesn’t have to take financial responsibility for his/her education.
This is going to sound cruel (and I don’t mean to be) but I think it’s a really dumb idea for parents to be ponying up money for their kids’ college education. Take if from somebody who grew up in a college town- big name schools with high cost tuition aren’t any better than state/local colleges/universities or community colleges. It’s more about name recognition than anything.
You’ve done your job as a mom. They’re adults now and have to live and own up to their own life choices. I don’t have children yet, but I think the golden rule is that if a kid turns 18 and either doesn’t have a job or doesn’t plan to go to college then it’s time to say they have to find their own place. Too many parents let the public schools, television, and bad peer influence be the ultimate determinant in what shapes their views on life. As a former teacher, I think that many parents coddle their kids too much, don’t let them think for themselves, insulate them too much.
I’ve found and met Obummer supporters that supported him because of a) what freebies he can give them, b) he’s black and “new,” c) they want to vote for the first “anything,” and d) he’s not a Republican. There’s not much reasoning going into voting for this guy. He’s the feel good choice.
Give your kids a couple of years to grow up and get some life experience. The government/Dems can’t provide them everything in life. They’ll either learn or drink the koolaid, like my sister, for the rest of their lives.
Shame on me. I I just don’t know what came over me.
Glenlivet #6
If i quit making sense let me know.
I am, and the vets I e-mail with, very afraid of the thought of O-gasm being elected. His view of the U.S. is NOT what we fought fought for!
even if it is “just” for one term, the consequences could be disastrous!
why are the Kenyan’s supporting O?
why are Islamist’s supporting O?
Is O a natural born citizen?
what about his history of radical advisors?
what about the fact he has not truly answered any question?
hell, I wish “I” could debate this clown!
Couldn’t be more right, trollman. One of the reasons I didn’t support McCain in the primaries was because of his going out of his way to be bipartisan.
There’s a time for compromise and a time to stand your ground. Frankly, it’s more important for Republicans to stand their ground than compromise.
We’ll have to agree to disagree ITookTheRedPill.
I could be classified as Agnostic on my best of days. But you see that is why we are a strong country. Because we allow for this difference with our constitution. We can be of different backgrounds, religions, etc but at the end of the conversation, as long as we can agree to disagree and have a beverage of choice then it works.
Our Diversity is what makes us strong, our Unity is what makes us Great!
Gratz Tom for picking the most stupid question of all time. You win the debate.
Amen!
Marine_NCO. That’s exactly right. Obama is essentially a radical extremist’s mole. A sort of Manchurian candiate, albeit not meant to assassinate a person, but rather assassinate the heart of America and replace it with whatever socialist radical vision it is that his ilk sees fit.
As for the debate, it’s clear that debates are not going to help McCain. That is unless Palin is in one before election day.
He had better rip Obama a new one or it’s over. The changes that will follow here will make America unrecognizable. Yes…. it would be THAT bad.
Isnala,
I classified myself as Agnostic throughout college, and a little beyond it, so I understand where you are coming from. You are free to believe as you wish, without pressure to change.
To win the war that is being waged against us by the combined forces of Islamic Jihadists and Marxists/Socialists/Communists, however, we have to return as a nation to the foundation of what made this country strong, good, and great.
Might I ask that those so inclined FAST and PRAY for John McCain to be removed from the Republican ticket and replaced with a God-fearing Strict-Constructionist Conservative?
While I agree that his views are what you fought for. His right to feel that way is . I enlisted in ‘95, DESPITE the fact that Clinton was in office. Why? Because this country is was still great and needed defending no matter WHO was in the office. That belief will hold true no matter who wins this election. But then again maybe after 13 years I’ve managed to remain idealistic and love for our Flag and Constitution.
Glenlivet # 6?
thanks for the refill!
Marin
Don’t we all.
GEEEEEEEEESSSSSS!!!!!
YES
THE U.S. CONSTITUTION
Indeed. Obama’s whole goal is to “change it and rearrange it”, to replace our Constitution with this constitution, suck the resources out of the former United States, and redistribute them around the world (a la his Global Poverty Act).
The foundation upon which our Constitution was based and our Republic was built.
Actually our republic was built on the fact that all men (and women) are created equal, and that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.
Obama said we have a “right” to health care. Um, no we don’t.
I know how to prosper under the worst of circumstances. I can take control of my life. But dammit, I what to leave this earth with my fellow humans being free to pursue any goal they want. Tonight didn’t give me much hope.
rights rights rights rights rights rights rights rights
me me me me me me me me me me me me me
rights rights rights rights rights rights rights rights
me me me me me me me me me me me me me
OH PLEASE MR GOVERNMENT TAKE CARE OF ME
gone to bed,
nite all,
y’all were way more interesting than the so called debate
FamilyMan:
As long as good men and women continue to stand up to evil and defend those who can’t defend themselves, then hope will never be truly lost.
and with that, good night folks, and take care.
It was a complete disaster–for the country. It’s all over but the shouting. Another hundred years of pain until democracy will rear its head again.
In 500-word answers, I’d love for each candidate to answer the following:
1. What is the role of the President?
2. What is the role of Congress and the Supreme Court?
3. What is the purpose of government?
4. What role, if any, should the government play in the economy?
5. What is your foreign policy, not in reference to any particular country, but as a holistic policy?
6. What is the role of the military, and how would you use it?
7. From where do you derive your world view?
8. Is the Constitution a “living” document? If so, how?
9. What are your views on state vs. federal roles?
10. What is the most just and revenue-maximizing form of taxation?
11. What makes you qualified for this position?
12. How would you improve the American education system?
13. When does life begin?
14. How would you increase national security?
15. What is your vision for the nation?
What I find so striking about these two candidates is that they want to take and take some more and it will never stop. Just like the reckless/irresponsible homeowners and financial CEO’s who thought they could rig the system to their own benefit and to the peril of those who just lost 2 TRILLION DOLLARS in retirement pension and 401K benefits.
When is enough enough? When do we close the spigot and return to financial sanity? How much does my military husband and I have to pay for these dillweed minority and illegal groups to get their “cut” of the American Dream? Does my husband have to lose his job, just like many others in this country, because people can’t be financially responsible and drag the whole damn economy down with them?
I’m absolutely just, I don’t know, amazed that these senseless people keep on taking from us the taxpayer. McCain really disappointed me tonight with the whole I’ll use 300 billion bucks to buy bad mortgages and make everything good promise. That is NOT his responsibility nor is it the responsibility to bail reckless fools out. Obummer was no better.
My husband weathered the storm of the Great Bubba. I just know if we’ll be able to do the same with Obummer. Whatever happens, it won’t benefit the military and that’s what hurts the most. The lazy and the stupid and their representatives/senators run this country…. not the hardworking, sacrificing, conscientious, living within their means taxpayers.
This makes me sick. No amount of liquid courage will get me to feel like my country really cares about the military, its families, or even the average, responsible taxpayer. That’s sad.
We need not only a second American revolution. We need a cleansing in this country of all the stupidity, laziness, and graft running the show.
/rant off
self-edit: Fourth paragraph- I just don’t know. Sorry….
Send_Me
CAN WE PLEASE MAKE YOU MODERATOR FOR THE NEXT DEBATE
Perfect questions!
I will drag myself to the polls and vote for McCain, but I don’t think there are clothespins stong enough to hold my nose. I didn’t like him before and I don’t like him now.
If I had known that we would have ended up with Obama instead of Hillary, I would have switched parties and voted for her. Having the Clintons in the White House again could NEVER be as bad as Obama.
Just depressing all around.
Committed, the toxic politicial and moral waste spewed on kids by college professors and the MSM coupled with the relative economic ease of their lifespan has created an army of O’Bots. Good parenting won’t always win out (in the short-term anyway).
Life has been too good for the generation of kids born right before and during Reagan. Someone currently in their 20’s never even experienced things like gas lines, the hostage crisis, the Cold War or nuclear bomb drills. Coddled, protected, and having wallowed in relative excess their whole lives, the person who tells them they have more rights than responsibilities and promises them the same idyllic life they have always known will get their vote, no matter the financial or societal cost (which they don’t understand since they have been led to believe that behavior does not actually have consequences).
The incredibly high standard of living they’ve always known has rendered this generation incapable of distinguishing between wants and needs. Having to make that distinction or accept the law of consequences is so frightening to them that they need to believe the Obamessiah will protect them from it all.
After working with a team of 20-somethings on a six month project recently was an eye-opener to say the least.
I think it is the time for the newest bumper sticker.
I had Palin at the top of MY ticket
I was working last night, so couldn’t join you all here, but I have to get one little rant out re: Obama’s stupid 9/11 comments, beginning with 9/11 was a “tragedy” that “most remember”. As our illustrious hostess wrote:
As for the stupid remark that it something “most remember” - well, let’s just say that it’s a good thing no one was within hearing range. Way to trivialize a day that is seared in the hearts and minds of most Americans.
Our hostess also wrote:
For someone who has a hissy fit if he even thinks something he’s said is taken out of context, this is lower than low.
The context means everything; remember how the Stock Market fell right after 9/11? Remember how afraid people were, how everyone wondered if it was safe to go out in public, to go to a movie or show, to go to a shopping mall, to get on a train, etc.?
That’s what President Bush was talking about; he was trying to reassure a very frightened populace - and it was a reminder that if we stopped living as free Americans, if we hid in fear, that the enemy had won.
Obama should hang his head in shame - except it’s doubtful that he has any shame.
Rant over.
I’m not sure if this has been mentioned in the previous 1,100 posts, but has anyone noticed that if you search for “that one” on Wikipedia, it leads to Obama?
How has the GOP managed to field such awful candidates for the last 20 years?
For that matter, how have the Dems managed to field such awful candidates for the last 20 years?
Is there no one in this country who is able and prepared to lead?
Think about it:
Clinton, Clinton, Obama, GW Bush, G HW Bush, McCain, Dole, Kerry, Gore, Biden, Giuliani, Dukakis? Are these really the best we have to hope for and offer?
Has it come to this?