Open thread: What’s your position: Buy, sell, hold on, panic?
Here’s a Friday evening financial open thread. How are you all dealing with the market roller coaster? I’m keeping my cool and holding on.
Are you buying, selling, freaking out, putting everything in shoeboxes?
Feel free to share your thoughts, recommendations, etc.
Posted in: Subprime crisis
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- Dave Lucas' Notes » Closing Bell
- Open thread: What’s your position: Buy, sell, hold on, panic? — The 2008 Elections
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Categories: Subprime crisis
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I’m with MM; I’m riding the storm out. In fact, I propose a mental “Hurricane Party” for all of us!
http://imustimes.wordpress.com/2008/10/07/i-fav-colonel-jack-jacobs-author/
I am bored? Where is MM to entertain us with new talking points?
Ok, here’s a YouTube against the bailout. Fox Commentator Napolitano makes a case for a lawsuit by Fannie and Freddie shareholders.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSYEy2WGuqA
The market is merely discounting the inevitability of Obama’s election. As Lee Ohanian explained in a WSJ op-ed, Obama has announced that he will do everything possible to lead the world into a financial depression: trade restrictions, regulation, tax increases, and more government spending.
This is interesting to Genealogist and Family Historians and unlike what people get on “The View” how Brad Pitt and Barack Obama are 9th cousins somewhere back in the hazy past.
This spells out Sarah Palin’s jewish ancestry
http://sarah-palin-2008.blogspot.com/2008/10/sarah-palin-has-jewish-ancestry.html
Shalom
My wife won a silent auction for a gift certificate to the Continental restaurant in Saugus MA so we went there for dinner around 6PM. The place was PACKED, (with just the two us we didn’t have to wait very long though). We had to take Route 1 south to get there and it was almost as bad as rush hour – jammed packed with people going somewhere for the evening, many I assume headed into Boston. Many of the store and other restaurant parking lots along the way were nearly full of cars – people are out and spending their money on a Saturday night.
I really don’t think things are as bad as what our government is telling us and this whole market slump is the tail wagging the dog. If I had had the smarts to have bailed early on and had a lot of cash I’d be thinking about starting to look for some bargains and buy back in about now.
I didn’t so I have to ride it out like most people. But I’m not worried and I’m seeing many people on the road who don’t seem to be worried either.
I have decided to make a little extra money in the current market climate. I plan to sell secure investment repositories that anyone regardless of income status can take part in.
For only 5 payments of $19.95 each, you can send me all of your monitary instruments (cash, gold, silver, etc) and I will dig a hole in my backyard to place your personal capsule into. I will then watch over it for as long as I need to. Since it is about to snow anyway, no one will be able to find it until at least April, no matter how hard they might try!
Why spend your time worrying about all that money you have hidden under your mattress. Let me worry about it instead! Who knows? I may even use a little bit to invest in other things while you are sleeping. Wouldnt that be great! You let me handle your valuables and then one day when you return, you could have an even larger nestegg than when you left it with me!!
Don’t risk an act of God that could potentially destroy everything you have worked and saved your entire life for.
Trust me to be in charge of your life and security!
Operators are now on duty to recieve your first shipment. Dont hesitate, the market is only going to get worse.
RabbidSquirrel,
Can I send you my ex?
Ok, I’ve been noticing a few things over the past few days. I’m no conspiracy nut but is there something going on behind the scenes? As in Obama has already been appointed the new president?
1st Example: I was watching Fox & Friends this morning and they played a clip of Mccain at a rally the other day. He started saying in a ho-hum manner that he wants to be president and then he goes….”you know my friends, Barack Obama is a nice guy, he’s a good decent guy, blah blah.” The crowd was in shock and booed him a bit. He seems like he knows he has already lost and is just phoning it in right now.
2nd Example: Pelosi is already planning for an Obama win. See here.
3rd Example: Just my general observation: There is no fight coming out of the GOP. Why aren’t we hitting at them with all of the evidence of how corrupt, socialist,and evil Obama is? Just the fact that there are now “Obama youth” just like Hitler youth should be brought up to the american people.
I am not a religious person(though I grew up in catholic schools) but I am starting to think that Obama really is the anti-christ that was predicted in Revelations.
My friends, the greatest generation is turning in their graves!
Wolverine!!!
Obama’s not going to the White House unless they hire him to wear the Easter Bunny suit too hand out the eggs this Easter.
It’s Killin em and
I Love it!!!
McCain/Palin 08′
Image: Opps, obama wouldnt make it past the CIA screening.
Honestly, I’m not worried about all of this bailout stuff(only pissed that I and my children have to pay for it the rest of our lives), what I’m worried about is the fact that I work in the oil services industry. If the price of a barrel of oil goes down to $75 or below, my job stability starts getting iffy. We live pay check to pay check right now while we are paying off medical bills from my kids births, etc so losing my job now would not be a good thing.
“A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take everything you have.”
-Thomas Jefferson
I too am in the oil biz #304 and when oil goes from $147 to $75/bbl, my income just went down 49%. How many salaried people can stand that?
Something from ‘Buzzworthy’ that is very interesting.
Obama’s Birth Certificate?
Obama has been acting like he has been appointed president for some months now. Nothing new in that, though it does appear increasing numbers of people are starting to believe it.
Yes, McCain is phoning it in and again appears to have been doing so since the convention. McCain’s dilemma is insolvable. He wants to work with the democrat congress (many of whom are his “friends”), but to do that he must win of course. But to win he has to really attack the democrats but that means he won’t be able to work well with them. So round and round he goes and where he stops . . . Well, he stops Nov. 4th.
Things are really bleak. The only thing people are thinking about is the economy. Understandable, though there is or was a lot more to this election. Barring a miracle, Obama will win. Right now, as Steyn has noted, he is just running out the clock. There is a danger in that strategy of course (ask Tom Dewey), but at the moment I see nothing that can stop the democrats.
If we agree that nation’s get the government they deserve, the American people must have been very bad indeed of late.
After McCain announced Palin I thought he’d win by a landslide. And then he went around opening his stupid mouth when he shouldn’t and not opening it when he should.
He really ticks me off. He could be the candidate America needs and win big, but noooooooooo… he’s milktoast that’s been soaked too long.
Why can’t he see how wildly popular Palin is and follow her example? She’s the only reason he might win. But I doubt even she can help him now.
As long as she comes with your half of everything, I can work with that.
But fairs, fair. Your receipt will be my ex…
I bought on Friday.
I first got into finance in 1980. Gold was 800 and the Dow was 800.
I’ve done well in the market the last 28 years.
There are low P/E’s even in BULL markets. It’s just that there are so so many right now and some that have historical 6% to 8% yields and low p/e, etc.
Its like someone just gave you a 50% off coupon for some of these companies.
. Even AT&T pays 7+% yield and its down 47%. ( not one I’m buying, but I am watching) Or Level three- cheap at under 2 bucks yet it’s risk v reward on that one.
If you wait for the bottom,you will miss it…bottoms are a 20/20 hindsight thing- ALWAYS.
I see it as a great time to buy, do lots of homework and if it goes down another 5% it was still a great buy.
If you’re under 30 buy 3 stocks ( dont spend all your dough), and buy a Mutuals and/or EFT’s.
If anything doubles, you might want to sell 40% (cap gains tho) and you’ll be in it for next to nothing.
Be smart and next year you’ll be happy.
Holding here. May God help this country because our politicians sure are failing us.
RabbidSquirrel,I hereby nominate you for Secretary of Money and Stuff. I like your idea and hope you are successful with your backyard vault. I will be sending you my capsule and payments soon.
When making your decision to buy or sell, remember Obama and the Democratic congress will double your capital gains tax.
The last 30 days have been a reminder to store up treasure in heaven.
Paranoia #31 this week;
The Saudi family is reducing world capital by manipulating the market, in order to reduce oil prices. Why? Their main concern is not their oil revenues but that of their most dangerous adversaries, Iran and Russia.
Just a thought.
Just came across this site.
TaxPayer info. Looks good at first glance.
ATR.org.
and this has good info
shareholders info
The market will lose 20% more value.
Joy wrote:
Thanks for the link! It helped me learn that one of the narrators — Philip Berg — wants to “arrest and try Bush and Cheney for the global crimes of 9/11/01.” He’s filed a lawsuit to do so. So, he seems like a real trustworthy authority on these matters.
Come on.
For some reason I am having difficulty using the trackback function from my laptop using Mozilla Firefox. I will try trackbacking later on.
Anyway, I am buying, knowing full well that the big boys are taking advantage of the panic of small investors.
No panicking here. I am hanging tough, and buying.
Th article I tried to trackback is entitled “Markets drop, liberals celebrate.”
http://www.tygrrrrexpress.com/2008/10/markets-drop-liberals-celebrate/
Respectfully,
eric aka the Tygrrrr Express
When I find myself in times of trouble
Michelle Malkin comes to me
Speaking words of wisdom, let it be.
And in my hour of darkness
She is standing right in front of me
Speaking words of wisdom, let it be.
Let it be, let it be,
Give us no more bail outs, let it be…
FamilyMaN…I don’t read where you are going with the following. I’d appreciate a litle more explanation before I head off to bed. Thanks:
OMU…As for the so-called probe into Sarah Palin..I have this to say. The head ivestigator was a declared Obama supporter, and should have excused himself from even being involved but didn’t…Oh and let me see the Dems expect us to believe there was an abuse of power when the guy Palin fired (Monagren?)was by his own ex-wifw’s account a wifebeater from documents in 1994, and the guy who was a trooper, Wooten, was such a lawbreaker himself that he should never should have been a cop in the first place. Heck if she did EVERYTHING they accuse her of, she is a heroine..she got a rogue cop fired and a wife-beating official removed…
The feminists should be cheering, but aren’t OMU.
The democrats like rules only when they can bend them, and scream for “absolute morality” when they themselves refuse to follow the same course. This is not going to hurt Palin long-term.
Good morning love;
OMU hasn’t come back after my response Just another lib hit and run. I think everyone knows there’s nothing in that scandal that will hold water.
The long term trend line for the DOW, shows an average return of 1.9% per year. If you factor in the long term 15% capital gains tax, the return is even worse. Since capital gains tax is not adjusted for inflation, the average tax must be based on the 5.4% trend of the non inflation adjustements, so 15% of 5.4% is 0.8% tax. Therefore, your 1.9% return is reduced to 1.1% after taxes. The Wall Street shills do not want you to know that this meager amount of capital gains is all you should logically expect from a long term general stock market investment. If Obama and the dems win next month you can expect 30% capital gains tax which means you lose money over the long term. The only solution is no tax on investments. IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN WITH SOCIALIST IN CONTROL.
Obama has been made to look like a complete moron when asked about the capital gains hike. He had no cogent logical answer other than it feeding into his class warfare rhetoric.
I can’t wait for the next four years. I hope there’s a huge anti-socialist movement; bigger than the Goldwater-Reagan movement.
Best investments right know are not in the stock market but donations that will enable a strong firewall of both GOP and Dem reps in the House. Here’s my immediate portfolio – $100 each to
NRCC
TeamAmericaPac
GoPac
Mitt Romney’ PAC
FreedomWatch
and to organizations that will fight amnesty bill tooth and nail in Q1-2009
numbersusa.com
fairus.org
cis.org
These ‘investments’ are for your and your family’s future. They will pay many times over in lower tax bills, higher wages and sustainable first-world quality of life.
GOLDWATER;
If the Obama capital gains tax increase happens and we start paying off the government bail out, we’re screwed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Put all your money in your home. At least we have a warm place to sleep if we can afford to heat the place and pay the property tax.
GEEEEEESSSSS!!!!
Your right but don’t forget to join the “FAIR TAX” groups.
Link to the “Fair Tax” site. Please join with us.
http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer
Exactly. An extra $300 per month toward the principal on your mortgage will save you thousands in the long run and free up cash for future capital investments.
BUY
soon as i can find some spare money;-)
You have spare money?
whiteasianrose
If you have extra money, pay off your hard assets.
Pray for good leadership.
My 401k, I’m holding on (I’ve got 19 years before I’m eligible for the earliest retirement option my company offers), although some of my worse performing funds where I don’t have a lot of money yet I’m transferring to bonds. I have a separate brokerage account that I was using to save up for a down payment on a house (you know, trying to buy a house the RIGHT WAY, with 20% down). Since that was for short-term savings, I cashed that out last Friday (fortunately before this week’s bloodbath) and I’m still debating what to do with that money – put it in CDs or research some bond funds through my broker. I’ll see what will give me the better yield.
Leadership? I don’t see no stinking leadership/sarc
Plan is to sit on what I have, wait a little longer to see if we’ve bottomed out (and I think we’re just about there), and start buying. Lots of bargains out there..Apple at $92 for instance. Be interesting how the new laptops help prices on Tuesday.
Orlo
Interesting video on the Obama birth cert issue.
As for events today, our fire dept (Snyder in Amherst NY) has its Open House today…1-4 pm if in the area..going now to set up
Well, if we could just flip the damn ticket to Palin/McCain, I believe we would START seeing leadership. Sarah would lead if the Lindsey-Graham-choke-collar was removed, and I think you’d start seeing a climb in the poll numbers. A McCain/Palin ticket will lose, and he will drag Sarah down the stinkhole with him.
…Good Morning.
The question; Buy, sell, hold?
I ask can I sue?….. I called my crack Morgan Stanley advisor in mid January and told him I wanted everything converted to cash so that when I got my statement every month it would go up if only a little bit but that it couldn’t go down…he hemmed and hawed, said I was crazy and long story short didn’t do it. I am retired from a wholesale distribution business and saw this downturn coming. My portfolio is now down 75K since January.
Anyboby out there know if I have any legal recourse?
I plan on moving it tomorrow to a different firm all in cash instruments.
Maybe someone has already covered this, but I don’t have time to go back and read 340 comments right now. Later maybe. Anyway, I was just thinking about all the flack right now about the wackos at McCain rallys and their hateful rhetoric. I know there are wierdos on the right, as well as the left. BUT, I have a hard time believing that those people are republicans. I believe they are plants. This would be typical of the democrats, to sabbotage our side by making us look bad, thus downplaying the significance of Ayers, Rezco, ACORN, et al. Seriously, even Rushbo didn’t mention that possibility until a caller suggested it. To me, it is almost a “duh”. I know we have extremists on our side. But, did you see and hear that one woman who said Obama is an Arab? She was possbily senile. Or she may have been a plant. Those protesters who shouted that Obama should be killed…I totally believe they were plants. That is just not our style and never has been. This is all a distraction to get McCain to grovel and go soft on Obama like he was before. This is race baiting at its worst and it seems to be succeeding. I wish we could have pulled in those protestors, found out who exactly they were, and I bet they would be traced back to Obama supporters. This is not a conspiracy theory, it is an educated guess based on the leftists SOP. So, what do we have working against a Republican win in November? We have voter fraud, a huge portion of the media in the tank for Obama,obscuring issues and covering up for THE ONE, economic crises (brought on in part by Obama and his buddies), big name musical groups performing at his rallies (Springsteen, anyone?), massive campaign contributions from “interesting” sources, George Soros pulling the strings of Congress, and a republican candidate who won’t (can’t) fight for the presidency. What do you think our chances of winning are? Sorry to sound so negative. And I am NOT suggesting we give up!!! We MUST get out and vote. There are as many republicans out there as democrats. If the voter fraud can be stemmed before the election, we still have a chance.
I just did the same thing. See my comment #344. I apologize too. Sometimes, things are on my mind and I just have to get them off!
Already sold most; paying house off biweekly with extra 0.5 pmt each time. No credit cards, paid cash for car. Sold airplane (small personal) because the grief to benefit ratio went big time to grief. Fuel, fixed expenses, regulations, etc.
If GE gets below 20, I might buy. There are a few others I’d buy, but power is going to be needed by people until the end….(I sold 2500 shares at ~44; most bought at 25-30)
Max out the credit cards. Sell the home. Live in an RV. Buy all the stock you can. Go on margin. Buy calls.
If you’re a Democrat.
If you’re a Republican, and you own your home free and clear, and you’ve got plenty of cash you won’t need for the next 7 or 8 years, it’s probably a good time to start picking through the ruins. There’s no need to hurry. The crisis isn’t going to end overnight.
We’re approaching the bottom of this crisis. There should have been a correction with the housing bubble, and there was, and at this point we’re at a low point with stocks because of panic. Time to buy low, smart folks.
Hi-jack all you want. Keep the ideas coming.
I’m probably notorious for wasting space on Michelle’s file server by now.
Obama up by 10 in a couple of the latest polls?
drink
HaPPY TRue Columbus Day!
drink
I’ve got nothing in Wall Street…let ‘em tailspin.
When it’s rock bottom, I’ll start shopping for bargains. If anyone has anything in the market, I say now is NOT the time to sell. Just hang on.
I also think the current roller-coaster ride of the market is a set-up. It’s offshore interests driving the market to give Obama a clear path to the Presidency. Our economy is under attack to allow a Pro-Arab, socalistic takeover of our goverment. Don’t get suckered by the hype.
IMHO
Friday I looked at my 401k, down 21%. I’m still holding though. I’ve made decisions in the past that were timed poorly and I missed making quite a bit more money. So yeah, I don’t have much confidence in my timing, so just wait it out with fingers crossed and saying to myself, “buy low, bargains, dollar cost averaging” etc.
Most of my money the past couple years has gone to getting rid of debt and I can poudly say, except for a conventional, fixed rate mortgage I’m debt free, which I am also attacking with a vengeance. A recession is not as scary from this position
I’ve been mostly out of the market but still have a few things which have taken a beating. I’m just going to leave them there as it is too late to bother selling. I’d say the Dow will go down another 800 this week, and it will still have a way to go. We won’t hit bottom for a while yet, especially if Obama wins. I’ll think about buying again after it hits 5000 and hovers there for a couple of weeks.
I have been comparing the two genealogies one by Wiki Answer and the Other by Ancestry.com researchers.
This is the ancestry genealogy, and it cites sources. Clement J Sheeran born in 1907 and not a late immigrant 1915 into the U.S. neither were his parents according to the 1930 Census records below.
6. Clement J. “Clem” Sheeran: b. 30 Aug 1907 WA; d. 12 May 1992 Richland Co., WA [cert. 11627]; m. 20 Dec 1929 Pocatello, Bannock Co., ID [14:630]
7. Helen Louise Gower: b. 22 Jan 1910 WI; d. 12 Sep 1985 Richland Co., WA [cert. 21457]
[Tri City Herald (Pasco, Kennewick, and Richland, WA), 25 Jun 1964, p. 11: “In Alaska – Mrs. C. J. Sheeran of Richland has gone to Skagway to lend her help to her daughter and family, Mr. and Mrs. Charles Heath while they get settled in their new home.”]
1930 – 3rd Ward, Pocatello, Bannock Co., ID, e.d. 10, sheet 6a
Sheeran, C. J. Head M W 22 M 22 WA MN WI Salesman Electric Co.
___, Helen Wife F W 20 M 20 WI WI WI
I really don’t understand why if they are Jewish because I don’t know Sarah Palin’s Mother or her parent’s Religious back ground, why they would be made into late “Immigrants” into the country?
I know how you research someone’s ancestry, you start with current and go backwards and the census records are showing Sheeran as being of Irish descent.
The ancestry researchers, added the Census records to their report of Sarah (Heath) Palin’s genealogy. This doesn’t tell me what her mother’s religion was?
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~battle/palin.htm
The 1930 Census for the states abbreviated
For C.J.Sheeran Himself WA- Washington the 2nd MN his father so Minnesota the 3rd WI his mother Wisconsin.
The second line in the 1930 census, is Helen, this is Helen Louise (Gower) Sheeran. This states WI WI WI that means she was born in Wisconsin so were her parents.
I don’t see any Lithuanian immigrants, who came into the country in 1915- Ellis Island.
This is the wiki answers genealogy for comparison. Link included below.
The only descent that counts in Jewish ancestry is through the Mother in this case Helen Louise (Gower) Sheeran. Wiki Answer article, refers to her as a Jewess Gower.
Is Sarah Palin of Jewish Descent. I am going to spend sometime today, figuring this out. the first genealogy laid out for Sarah (Sheeran) Heath, Sarah Palin’s mother, showed the Sheerans of Irish descent, and came into the U.S. early. The 1930 Census, is not showing immigrants but born both Maternal Grandparents born in America. C.J. Sheeran and Helen Louise Gower.
But this ancestry, that has been out since Sept., is stating that Sarah Heath Palin’s does show Jewish ancestry, through her mother Sarah (Sheeran) Heath. Which is the only ancestry that matters in Jewish descent. This one claims that her Granfather’s first name was Samuel and a Jewish immigrant from Lithuania.
The Ancestry.com genealogy didn’t just make statements, they added the records at the bottom like census’. The 1930 Census for C.J. Sheeran C stands for Clement, I believe, does not show an immigrant, in fact it doesn’t show his parents as immigrants.
This article is the one claiming that Sarah (Heath) Palin’s maternal grand father, was a Jewish immigrant. If Sarah Palin’s mother was Jewish, I am not sure why someone would build a genealogy of immigrants to prove Jewish ancestry. It makes no sense? Jewish people have been in America as early as colonization just like other Major religions, that are represented in the U.S. Some Jewish people fled rather then convert to Catholicism, that was occurring during the Spanish Inquisition, some fled to the New World to escape.
If the census records don’t back up that Sarah Palin’s maternal grandfather immigrated in 1915 claim. I don’t understand why one would be manufactured to explain Jewish Ancestry?
You don’t have to be a late immigrant into America to have Jewish Ancestry. This is confusing. This wiki answers is not a hate site, so they don’t appear to have a bias.
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Is_Sarah_Palin_Jewish
I think the key is not to panic. Sit back hold on to what you have.
Sarah Palin’s Mother’s ancestry, through the mother and so forth, would be the only ancestry taken into consideration.
http://www.beingjewish.com/identity/whoisajew.html
I was at the Clearwater Florida rally, and I was yelling at the press that they sucked! I was right in the front and the only thing between me and them was a wobbly stage barrier. I told NBC and AP they SUCKED and a few of us chanted it. We chanted for foxnews too, but for being fair. there was a guy right behind me that yelled “sit down boy” (I think he may have yelled the “kill him” thing too), to one of the campaign staffers cause the press and he were in our way of seeing the CUDA. The guy was talking to a few of us before the rally started, and he was an anti Obomba supporter, not really a McCain support. I got from the conversation, that he goes to political rallies for the person running against the one he doesn’t like. But, I will say it to everyones face in the MSM they SUCK! I am not afraid of any of those creeps. I am a conservative CHRISTIAN.
On the buy, sell, hold or panic note – I see that the http://www.yahoo.com homepage has an area where they compile polls results between McCain and Obama.
There is even an indicator that shows uptick or downtick in percentage.
So I’m wondering how I can go long on McCain and sell Obama short…
…but more, if Obama’s numbers go up above 60 or so – then it is really time to PANIC.
Here’s some recent stuff I wrote on my blogs:
A note on the Akko riots.
A topic where I pointed to a podcast interview with comics writer Chuck Dixon, who’s a conservative.
A topic where I posted some video recordings of a playthrough of Starblade, one of the earliest games made in 3-D.
I have no choice but to hold. It’s a 401(K). I can’t pull out. I can change the nature of the investment, but oddly, it just seems to go up and up no matter what I do.
I mean, I’ve got 50% in aggressive, 25% in medium, and 25% in conservative. And the aggressive funds still continue to outperform the rest. I lost 2K in conservative in the last two weeks. And I gained 4K in the aggressive. How can that happen if the market is as horrible as I think?
I think the smart people are those who ride this out. Those swayed by the media are getting out now. That’s what is causing the fall. But those with any noggins inside their noggins are hanging tough and now it’s a buyer’s market. The market will eventually rebound. Those who stick with it will benefit. Those who buy now are going to be quite satisfied in two years.
Now I’m glad I’m a tortoise. I plodded along all my life saving. Put it in notes and cd’s. Stock market was gambling to me.
No worries!
Australian markets are open and they’re up near 5% at present.. that’s good news. Futures have the DOW up approaching 300 at present. Waiting for update on the Nikkei – it’s probably a better barometer for the US markets than Australia.
FYI stock markets are open tomorrow (Columbus Day), but bond markets are not.
Have you actually served reality with the divorce papers or are you just on a trial separation?
Get used to saying “President Obama.” Cause I know you would want to treat the office with the same respect that you expect all us libruls to.