Liveblogging the last presidential debate of 2008
It begins at 9pm Eastern.
Liberal Beltway fixture Bob Schieffer moderates. I noted in 2004 that he asked a question about immigration during one of the 2004 debates. Wouldn’t it be novel if the subject finally came up tonight? Not that the La Raza twins would differ much. I’m not the only one who wants to hear some border talk. The Plumber Joe Wurzelbach mentioned it, too.
Got your ACORN martinis, ready?
Drinking game buzz words:
GREED.
GREEDY.
RESCUE.
EARMARKS.
TAX CREDITS.
WALL STREET.
MAIN STREET.
HEALTH CARE.
JUDGEMENT.
BUSH. BUSH. BUSH.
BIPARTISAN.
CLIMATE CHANGE.
Commenter Jencab: “You forgot…”
UUUHHHH
MY FRIENDS
ACROSS THE AISLE
WHEELS OF THE STRAIGHT TALK EXPRESS
I AGREE
MIDDLE CLASS
9:02pm Eastern. Schieffer starts right off the bad with the Dow plunge today. Why is your plan better than his?
McCain: Americans are hurting and they’re angry. Their innocent victims of GREED and WALL STREET.
Drink, drink, drink up.
McCain: They are hurting and they’re angry.
Ok, we get it.
Now, he’s promoting home ownership and preservation at any cost. Pitches his rotten individual mortgage rescue plan. “Put home owners first.”
McCain criticizes Paulson for “not making it their first priority.”
Only superficial mention of Fannie/Freddie.
I repeat what I said earlier today: Hey, chumps: Why are you still paying your mortgages?
Obama: RESCUE package for the MIDDLE CLASS.
My glass is half-empty already.
Obama: TAX CREDIT.
Gulp again.
Obama: Sen. McCain, I AGREE with helping homeowners.
Glass is empty.
McCain brings up The Plumber: Joe, I wanna tell ya. I want to keep your taxes low, affordable health care, I will not stand for tax increases on small business income. What you want to do to Joe the plumber is…have them not live the American Dream.
Obama brings up his 95 percent tax cut fantasy.
McCain blasts Obama for his “spread the wealth around” ideology. I want Joe the Plumber to spread the wealth around. Why would you want to increase anyone’s taxes right now? I’m not going to do that in my administration.
Obama invokes his friend, billionaire Warren Buffett in response.
Not such a bright move there, Barry.
We’re talking about a plumber and Obama leans on one of the richest men in the world as a crutch?
McCain: We need to cut people’s taxes, create jobs, not “spread the wealth around.”
Good. He drove that nail.
9:14pm Eastern. Schieffer asks what specific programs the candidates would cut.
Obama has been blabbing for two minutes without naming anything specific. Blahblahblahblah. He’s talking about making “investments” to prevent diseases.
He STILL hasn’t mentioned a single program.
9:16pm Eastern. McCain should have nailed Obama immediately for failing to name a single program he would cut, but he wants to return to the home ownership/prevention crap. Increasing home values. Blahblahblah. McCain segues into energy independence.
Finally, an answer.
McCain: What would I cut? Across-the-board spending freeze. Some people say it’s a hatchet. I’ll do the hatchet and then the scalpel. Would cut marketing assistance, ethanol subsidies, I know how to save billions.
Grab your drinks: McCain mentions EARMARKS.
9:21pm Eastern. McCain repeats his line that Americans are angry. Pledges to balance the budget in four years. You have to tell me one time when you’ve stood up to the leaders of your party.
Obama: Cites tort reform, charter schools. He slips in a reference to Fox News agreeing with him.
Obama moves to his BUSH-McCain talking points.
McCain: Elaborates on his opposition to Bush administration. I’ve got the scars to prove it. Cites CLIMATE CHANGE. Your record of independence isn’t very convincing.
Schieffer moves to the tone of the campaign. Obama says “erratic,” “losing his bearings, etc.” McCain says “lie,” “palling around with terrorists,” etc. “Are you each willing to say to each other’s face what you’ve said in ads.”
McCain goes first. “It’s gotten tough and I regret some of it.” Blames Obama for not accepting Town Hall proposals. McCain calls out John Lewis for comparing him to George Wallace and calls out Obama for not repudiating him. Very unfair and totally inappropriate. We will run a truthful campaign. A tough campaign. Obama has spent more on negative ads than any campaign in history. He said he would take public financing if I did. He didn’t keep his word. You didn’t tell the American people the truth.
Obama: We expect presidential campaigns to be tough. Whines that McCain’s ads were 100 percent negative and says people don’t want to hear about their hurt feelings. Plays the distraction card.
Obama will not repudiate John Lewis’s remarks, then says “politics as usual” is no longer acceptable.
McCain attacks Obama’s health care and immigration ads. Invokes Joe the Plumber again.
Obama smirks.
McCain: I did not hear repudiation of Congressman Lewis’s remarks.
Obama whines about the purported catcalls at the Palin rallies and rationalizes Lewis’s remarks. Whines about the “palling around with terrorists” jibe. It’s an opening to talk about Ayers…but McCain’s not biting for whatever reason.
9:33pm Eastern. McCain defends the people who attend his rallies.
KNOCK ME OVER WITH A FEATHER. He’s defending the base. “I’m not going to stand for that!”
You just scored some points, McCain.
FINALLY!
McCain: I’ve seen t-shirts that are unacceptable. Things yelled at your rallies.
FINALLY! Rejecting the “mob narrative.”
9:35pm Eastern. McCain ate his Wheaties. He mentions old, washed-up terrorist Ayers and Acorn – destroying the fabric of our nation.
Obama gives his talking points about Ayers (I was eight years old) and ACORN (I represented them in a lawsuit with the Justice Department).
McCain better set the record straight.
9:38pm Eastern. McCain says he launched his political campaign in Ayers’ living room. Mentions Ayers’ 2001 regret that he hadn’t bombed more.
Well, was that enough, folks? What do you think?
I think it’s the best we can expect McCain to have done.
The McCain campaign e-mails the talking points McCain failed to recite…
ACORN’s Political Action Committee Endorsed Barack Obama For President. “[A]CORN’s political action committee endorsed Barack Obama for President. … The endorsement reflects a belief that Obama – who worked as a community organizer on the South Side of Chicago – understands that change must come from the ground-up, as part of a working coalition, rather than from position papers.” (Katrina Vanden Heuvel, Op-Ed, “ACORN: Obama Gets It,” The Nation, 2/23/08)
Barack Obama’s Campaign “Paid More Than $800,000″ To ACORN For Get-Out-The Vote Efforts; The Campaign Originally “Misrepresented” The Group’s Work To The FEC. “U.S. Sen. Barack Obama’s presidential campaign paid more than $800,000 to an offshoot of the liberal Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now for services the Democrat’s campaign says it mistakenly misrepresented in federal reports. An Obama spokesman said Federal Election Commission reports would be amended to show Citizens Services Inc. — a subsidiary of ACORN — worked in ‘get-out-the-vote’ projects, instead of activities such as polling, advance work and staging major events as stated in FEC finance reports filed during the primary.” (David M. Brown, “Obama To Amend Report On $800,000 In Spending,” Pittsburgh Tribune Review, 8/22/08)
Barack Obama Directed Project Vote And Later Taught Classes For “Future Leaders Identified By ACORN And The Centers For New Horizons.” “In 1992 Obama took time off to direct Project Vote, the most successful grass-roots voter-registration campaign in recent city history. Credited with helping elect Carol Moseley-Braun to the U.S. Senate, the registration drive, aimed primarily at African-Americans, added an estimated 125,000 voters to the voter rolls–even more than were registered during Harold Washington’s mayoral campaigns. ‘It’s a power thing,’ said the brochures and radio commercials. … Obama continues his organizing work largely through classes for future leaders identified by ACORN and the Centers for New Horizons on the south side.” (Hank De Zutter, Op-Ed, “What Makes Obama Run?” Chicago Reader, 12/8/95)
· In 1992, Barack Obama Was Hired By ACORN To Run A Voter Registration Effort. “Indeed, Mr. Obama has extensive connections with the granddaddy of activist groups, Acorn (Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now), which has gotten millions in government grants for its low-income housing programs. In 1992, Acorn hired Mr. Obama to run a voter registration effort. He later became a trainer for the group, as well as its lawyer in election law cases. Acorn’s political arm has endorsed Mr. Obama while its ‘voter education’ arm has pledged to spend $35 million to register people this fall — despite a history of vote fraud scandals that have led to guilty pleas by many Acorn employees.” (John Fund, “Obama’s Liberal Shock Troops,” The Wall Street Journal, 7/12/08)
Barack Obama Was Part Of Team Of Lawyers Who Represented ACORN In A Suit Against The State Of Illinois. “Obama was part of a team of attorneys who represented the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN) in a lawsuit against the state of Illinois in 1995 for failing to implement a federal law designed to make it easier for the poor and others to register as voters.” (Mike Robinson, “Obama Got Start In Civil Rights Practice,” The Associated Press, 2/20/07)
ACORN Received Grants From The Woods Fund When Barack Obama Served on The Board Of Directors
· The Chicago ACORN Received Grants Of $45,000 (2000), $30,000 (2001), $45,000 (2001), $30,000 (2002), And $40,000 (2002) From The Woods Fund. (Donors Forum Website, ifs.donorsforum.org, Accessed 6/10/08)
· NOTE: From 1993 To 2002, Barack Obama Served On The Board Of Directors For The Woods Fund. (Tim Novak and Fran Spielman, “Obama Helped Ex-Boss Get $1 Mil. From Charity,” Chicago Sun-Times, 11/29/07)
9:41pm Eastern. Schieffer asks each candidate why their vp candidate would be a better prez than the other’s vp candidate.
Obama gives obligatory Joe is Great spiel with requisite Violence Against Women Act reference and is now talking about “INVESTING” again. Make it a drinking word.
McCain: Sarah Palin is a reformer. She understands families with special needs. She’s ignited our party and people who have never been involved in the political process.
Reader Dustin writes that McCain should have said “Not only do I think Palin would be better than Biden, I believe she’d be better and more experienced than Barack Obama.”
Schieffer asks Obama if Palin is qualified. “That will be up to the American people to decide,” then throws in a jab at McCain on special needs. Says it will take more spending.
McCain: Biden’s qualified in many respects, but has been wrong on foreign policy that’s supposed to be his strength. Cockamamie idea of dividing Iraq in three parts. Wrong about the first Gulf War. National security.
Then McCain jabs Obama back over relying on new spending as solution to everything.
9:47pm Eastern. CLIMATE CHANGE!
Obama is especially smirky tonight, isn’t he?
9:52pm Eastern. McCain dings Obama for opposing Colombia free trade agreement. “Obama, who’s never traveled south of our border…”
McCain slips in Obama’s tea-with-dictators stance. Obama smirks and snorts.
9:59pm Eastern. Health care. McCain is really using Joe the Plumber to great effect. Invokes him again and asks what fine Obama would impose on him if he doesn’t meet Obama’s mandates.
McCain uses a bogus Michael Moore statistic: See the 47 million uninsured lie.
10:04pm Eastern. McCain challenges Obama’s big government policies and mistakenly calls Obama “Sen. Government.”
Yeah, that works.
10:08pm Eastern. Schieffer throws in a SCOTUS question. McCain and Obama agree they wouldn’t apply a litmus test. Obama invokes Roe v. Wade.
McCain better bring up Obama’s lies about his born-alive survivors bill vote.
10:11pm Eastern. YES! He’s finally making up for all those missed opportunities. McCain nails Obama for his extreme, pro-abortion votes. “That’s his record. He voted in direct contradiction to the feelings of mainstream America.”
Obama spins. Filibusters.
McCain rejoinder to Obama — nails him on disingenuous “health of the mother” language/loopholes. Mentions that he and Cindy are adoptive parents, but that doesn’t mean we won’t continue to stand for the rights of the unborn.
Very eloquent. Good job, McCain. (See, who says I can’t say nice things about Mac?)
10:16pm Eastern. Last question is on education.
I’m tuning out Obama. He just said “INVEST” for the 998th time tonight. Blahblah.
McCain calls education the civil rights issue of the 21st century. Talks about choice, parental empowerment. Give parents the same choice that the Obamas have and Cindy and I have to send their kids to good schools. Throwing money is not the answer to the problem. You will find that some of the worst public school districts get the most money.
BINGO.
10:21pm Eastern. Schieffer asks if there should be increased federal role in education. Obama says yes despite the failure of No Child Left Behind. Pay teachers more, fund early childhood education. I AGREE with McCain on charter schools, says Obama. Opposes vouchers.
McCain dings Obama again for exercising his own school choice, but not allowing other parents to do the same.
Obama called on people to put down their video games, but as a McCain staffer e-mails: “But he advertises on them? Disingenuousness.”
Obama tries to rationalize his opposition to vouchers.
McCain sums it up for him: “So because there aren’t enough vouchers we shouldn’t have any even if they work. Got it.”
Obama claims that DC superintendent only supports charter schools, not vouchers. McCain corrects him. Obama sticks to his claim.
Obama is wrong. McCain is right. More here.
Obama: Out-of-touch with minority families demanding choice in D.C.
Debate wrap-up here.
***
11:09pm Eastern Hillary is on Fox News (!) praising Obama through gritted teeth. She says that Joe the Plumber will be “appreciably more positively impacted” by Obama’s policies vs. McCain’s.
“Appreciably more positively impacted?”
And they call Sarah Palin inarticulate…
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ooooo obama is making it clear that he supports that commie bastard HUGO CHAVEZ!!!! He wants to dump on Columbia
hey BO … the union murders in Columbia are being done by terrorists to prevent the country from being a successful trade partner with the U.S. … you friggin’ dummy …
B.O. is talking to the unions right now..trying to keep the union vote.
nailed on the his eloquence..what the hell did John have for dinner, he’s on fire tonite
Color me amazed the grumpy old man in wiping the floor with the anointed one so far! I am still in shock for his standing up for the base and pointing out the unhinged Obama supporters.
Dukakis would have defended his vote on Columbia by bringing up an obscure Peruvian treaty.
this is looking good tonight.
How can people think stopping trade will not cost jobs in other areas? How can people think that punishing the rich or companies won’t come back to them with lost jobs and money leaving the country? It must be magic.
my F5 key is broken
5 million unicorn handling jobs.
Did he just say the Peruvian Free Trade Agreement? Or did I drink too much wine?
Harsh requirements on emissions has caused the car companies more money then we know.
He is snickering at how foolish that he is there since he is already sure he won the election.
Obama has stopped giggling. I think McCain has him really rattled.
Please! Esp 2nd Amendment
BHO didn’t hate the violence his cousin started in Kenya after he lost the election.
Obama is going to try and force innovation in the automotive industry.
Isn’t this how we ended up with things like high fructose corn syrup instead of sugar?
Auto makers are having a tough time because of you idiots forcing them to increase the MPH while still making safe cars!
And may I add – when you finally run the country into a hole, no body is going to care about a fuel efficient car because they won’t be able to afford it!!
MORON!!
the B-HO doesn’t realize that the congress is screwing the auto industry into the dustbin of history
Mav is dicing Barry up like a surgeon in the OR…
It seems like his teleprompter is skipping every other line… what a crock Obie
Obama is looking like Chuckles the Clown tonight. Too bad no one will notice.
Obama doesn’t understand a lot of things…like taxes! I just can’t believe the the majority of the American people can see what an idiot Obama is!
Ditto!
Yeah BO, laugh it up buddy, you know that you said you will sit down with these dictator leaders…
Why doesn’t Obama just give McCain the Hillary finger and get it over with? Every time he laughs, he tries to mock and undermine what McCain is saying.
my point exactly John. Obama for Chavez.
Columbia is one of the best friends we have south of the border Pelosi, Obama, and Reid are in league with Hugo Chavez.
Health care!
I’d like to take limp-wristed Obama into the octagon to rip that smile off.
BO was just totally soporific on free trade.
McCain slams him on no free trade w/Colombia while negotiating with Chavez – thank you!!
BO = Hoover – nice!!
he brought up chavez!! YES!!
COME ON JOHN…COME OUT AND CALL BO A SOCIALIST AND A COMMUNIST!!!!
Is that a hammer and sickle flag pin Glowbama has on his lapel?
Sorry folks, I am livid. The messiah is a freekin idiot. How much is the price of arugala. (sp) I don’t eat the crap. Go mav. He may have found his sack.
BO is creepy, and looks worse when he grins.
OOOOHHHHH!!! YES! Obama just compared Obama to HOOVER!
Oh man… This couldn’t be going better.
That round is definitely McCain
I’d like to see a time analysis on this debate. Shafer has cut off McCain many times, but lets the Anointed One finish every thought. Why can’t Republicans refuse debates with these jerks, the same as the demoncrats did to Fox?
The auto companies will build what people will buy. They get it….finally.
“Let it be written. Let it be done.”
Retooling auto plants? Since when did the government have a role in helping businesses make their production lines more efficient or profitable?
Obama on free trade in reply to JM whines about how dangerous it is in Columbia for labor leaders. Prime example of BHO and when “the going gets tough”–tuck tail and run. What a coward.
OOOOHHHHH!!! YES! McCain just compared Obama to HOOVER!
Oh man… This couldn’t be going better.
I’m really proud of John McCain. He’s killin’ Barry in this debate. I’m all verklemped.
And the moderator keeps not letting Barry respond when John uses his best lines.
Time to go make popcorn — here come socialized medical care…
Here’s another lie.
OK, BO is making up stories again.
vickisoup said: #797
Talking like a lawyer and not a President.
But the majority of the Sheeple love his lawyer speak.
alright, new topic, you you better stop beating up on my man…
His heart is breaking…..poor baby.
final statement…”Sen. Obama, did you bring your birth certificate with you? We could settle this once and for all.”
Obama: Free health Care for everyone! print more money! health is a RIGHT!
I love my 4Runner!
BTW folks … do youo know how much of all that oil that is used in this country is used for gasoline and other fuels? … only about 30% … the rest of that oil goes into all kinds of things ranging from plastics to cosmetics …
LIAR OBAMA. SOMEONE AUGHT TO LOOK UP HIS EXAMPLE. THERE IS NOT A SHRED OF TRUTH TO IT.
I shouldn’t say this but the next time doesn’t one of his elitist smirks, McCain should call him on it, even though he might want to just smack him.
Barry’s gonna let us keep our insurance!
Thank you, Chosen One!
The economy, energy, and health care.
Gee, didn’t we get enough of this in the first two debates?
So far, McCain is killing!
cost controls! mention Jimmy Carter please
Let’s talk about illegals and terrorists.
And don’t forget how the oceans will recede
Health care – oh, boy. Here’s hoping McCain can hit home what his plan will do.
Whenever I hear Obama’s commercial about his mom, I want to tell him that it’s better to be bankrupt than dead. In England and Canada, if your care gets too expensive – they give you a script for pain meds and tell you to get your affairs in order.
McCain needs to tell the American people that if the government runs your health care, your government – not your doctor – has the final say.
Obama’s “insurance companies can’t discriminate” – yeah. No better way to drive them out of business.
“Manage” diabetes and heart disease? Hello, government-ordered diets and exercise programs.
Say inhalater, Obama. Please………
but he’s so clean…and articulate
I’ve got Federal insurance and I guarantee it’s not even comparable to what McCain and Obama get. Lie, Barry, Lie.
N.A.T.I.O.N.A.L
H.E.A.L.T.H.C.A.R.E
Thanks, Karl Obamarx!
Yes for sure Obama has his smirk down. When John McCain talks, Obama smirks. Does that mean he is uncomfortable with what McCain is saying?
I wonder if Obama’s insurance policy covers soul extraction.
How about if you lose your stupid job, you GET A NEW JOB?!?!?!?!?
THEN that “lack of insurance” is a non-issue.
How hard is THAT?
Access to care does not equate to responsibility to pay. Insurance company is responsible to keep costs low. Costs are high because we have to give care to those who refuse to pay.
(sorry, pet peeve subject)
I can already see the already low supply of docs and nurses leaving when the insurance companies pay next to nothing
Between Obama’s lines:
Everyone will get equal health care,
of course some care is more equal than others.
BO even admitted it would cost more. Everything he does costs more. I can’t stand this guy
BO says we’re going to manage diabetes and long-term diseases. What’s he going to do, come to your house and make you eat right?
Obama: Pan. Der. Ing.
Saying nothing in the process.
I loved McCain’s face as BHO was talking. He was like, “what the he** are you talking about? Moreover, what the he** did you just say??!!!”
Noooooo, not the old 47 million uninsured canard!!!
47 million americans including illegals….
OT/ 30 pieces, my son has a RAV and I drive the luxury car….won’t tell, I might get slaughtered. LOL!
John seems so much more focused tonight… Where was this the past several months?
articulate, maybe…clean, NEVER.
Can we move to some NEW topics please? How about the Supreme Court? Immigration? This is the same old, same old…let’s move it along.
Obama just promised things that he cannot deliver on. he might as well part the moon too.
Great, so Obama will turn the country’s medical community into a crowded emergency room with the taxpayer paying the bills? Am I understanding this right? Anyone who wants a look at universal/socialized/nationalized health care just needs to join the Army for a month or look at the VA system.
I just sign up as illegal alien in the ER. Health care is always free! YAY!
Why can’t McCain be more like this. Not perfect, but better.
LOL, Joe the Plumber makes another appearance.
Anybody remember the Nixon price controls? Note to Barry, they don’t work. The other day I read a story from Canada about a man that waited a long time in an ER. When they found him, rigor mortise had set in. Now that’s a health care plan.
Insurance scam, just an insurance scam. Why aren’t we talking with the doctors and the AMA? What are we doing to make the business of medicine better and easier for the doctors which will make it easier for the patients?
Mav’s Talking to Joe the Plumber…AWESOME…
Joe the Plumber!
That dude is going to be famous! hahaha.
good on ya, Joe.
McCain said, CUT H.C. costs, SEAL THE DAMN BORDER!!! -and that’s when I woke up…
Actually, BO is being sneaky with his medical plan. He will make it so costly that companies will pay the tax and let the government take over their health care. Its a sneaky way to have totaly government health care without directly calling for it.
Glowbamee will destroy small business in America!
YEA!!! Tell it like it is, Mac.
Obama wants to “take over the healthcare of America”
I would love to believe that the Average American is seeing the debate the way you are, but unfortunately, I don’t believe they are.
Instead, they will watch CNN and have CNN tell them who won.
Oh good one Mac on Obama’s health care – what’s the fee bambi?
Has McCain promised Joe the Plumber a job at the White House as the Secretary of Water Management????
John is right.. Obama care will be just like the DMV.
yippee … the no employer provided insurance fine … nailed to the wall
RUDE.
S-O-C-I-A-L-I-S-T
Back to Joe the plumber..Go John!
ROFL – Joe the Plumber getting a lot of press!!!!