Keep talking, Smirky: Biden attacks Joe the Plumber; Gaffetastic Joe B. spells “J-O-B-S,” a “three-letter word”
Scroll for snort-worthy update…
Pssst.
Hey, Joe “Home Depot” Biden.
Maybe it’s not such a good idea to be dissin’ small business owners when your ticket has a well-earned reputation as condescending, out-of-touch snobs.
On second thought: Keep talking, Smirky.
Hat tip: Ankle Biting Pundits
***
Smirky Joe’s got some nerve challenging the veracity of anyone else’s blue-collar bona fides, doesn’t he?
“During the debate, Joe Biden gave several Delaware shout-outs, including Wilmington’s Union Street… Maybe, I heard this wrong, or misunderstood, but I think he mentioned Katie’s restaurant…… Wilmington used to have a Katie’s restaurant – way back in the day – and it was in Little Italy, as is Union Street, but I’m almost positive Katie’s wasn’t on Union Street. And it hasn’t been Katie’s in, well, years. Maybe he said Kozy’s – as in Kozy Korner?” — The News Journal
Photoshop: American Elephants
Joe Biden: He’s just like you and me…except, he’s not.
***
Lorie Byrd notes that the attacks on Joe the Plumber are ratcheting up:
Some idiot liberal bloggers are saying there is a big scandal because Joe the Plumber doesn’t make $250,000 and would (GASP) actually get a tax cut under Obama’s plan! I could not make the case against their liberal socialist plan any better than they themselves are. Hey, rocket scientists, here is what Joe said: “I’m getting ready to buy a company that makes about 250, 270 – 80 thousand dollars a year, your new tax plan is going to tax me more isn’t it? I’m getting taxed more and more for fulfilling the American dream.” Got that? He didn’t say he makes that now. You should have gotten the clue when he said “I am getting ready to buy a company.” Evidently the Obama talking points went out saying Joe doesn’t make $250,000 and the idiot lib bloggers ate it up and didn’t bother watching the actual comment Joe the Plumber made, but rather reported this fact as some big Republican lie.
Brace yourself, Joe. The Obama Thugocracy is gunning for you. But what they don’t seem to understand is that even if Joe was John McCain’s long lost son and a huge donor to the GOP, or not even a plumber, it would not matter at all because what was shocking about the video was not what Joe the Plumber said. Joe the Plumber is not going to be making tax policy. What was shocking and more relevant than anything else that has been said in the entire campaign is what Barack Obama said. He told Joe that it is okay to soak those making more than $250,000, even small businesses making that, because then you can “spread the wealth” around and everyone benefits. That is redistribution of wealth — taking from the rich (and from the kinda rich) and giving to the not so rich and the poor. And Obama admitted to it. Out loud. And on video.
***
Update: Snort advisory warning. Joe Biden, skilled orator and lifelong U.S. Senator, says “J-O-B-S” is a “three-letter word.”
Can you imagine if Sarah Palin had said this?
Big hat tip: Jack M at AoS.
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Categories: Barack Obama,Joe The Plumber
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This is Soooo going to bite him in the butt.
What happened to Biden’s blue collar values and Scranton sensibilities?
Questioning a blue collar worker’s credibility! The audacity!
What a dumb ass.
Um, did he say “Senator Palin”?
Yep….keep talkin Joe.
Idiot.
Ha! misscheryl pointed this one out to me and I thought the same way… keep blowin joe, what a marroooooon!
he’s supposed to be in Cal today I think for a showing on ellen and the tonight show…. oh please just let him spew. Joe Bidet, the gift that keeps on giving.
Correction, joe the plumber is NOT ALLOWED to make 250,000 a year. I know, thats racist!!!
his last name really should be “Bologna”
Is there a transcript?
Obama said his taxes were going up! so you disagree Joe?
When he was sharing his folksy anecdotes, he was talking about “made-up” people…now that there’s a real Joe the Plumber, Biden shows his true colors.
From the Department of the Obvious: MOST small businesses have up to 50 employess. It may be six. It may be 16. If you have only 10 employees, your revenue should exceed $250K. Idiot. Don’t worry. Gregory and his ilk won’t challenge you Joe.
I vote for Joe Massengale. Every time I see him, I think “What a douche!”
joe the plumber is really from western pennsylvania where there are a lot of racists you know, he just went to ohio to vote early to help balance out all those acorn volunteers. biden and murtha. the lefts spokesmen on all things military and folksy.
The joke is, Joe the Plumber admits he doesn’t make $250,000,yet. His position is that the American Dream he is pursuing will be more difficult to achieve if Obama’s tax plans are in effect. Obama wants to tax the American Dream.
This guys face lift scares me.
Well, the plumber is obviously a racist! Actually, all plumbers are!
This just confirms how out of touch Biden, and most others are in DC.
It’s beyond their comprehension to what it takes to actually work for a living or to understand what is involved in running a small business. How can they possibly be qualified to run our affairs?
Want a solution? Term limits and requirements that include mandatory private sector work experience, prior to being able to run for public office.
Joe Biden would be homeless if he had to do what Joe does for a living.
Our national leaders are worse than pathetic and Biden is the poster-boy.
PS – especially the plumbers in PA.
Now will John McCain use this video of Joe vs. The Messaiah (as Obama is getting overconfident) as a great campaign ad?
Oh, boy does he need to.
CNN is spinning this hard… methinks I smell fear.
Joe vs. the Volcan-O!
“I don’t have any ‘Joe the Plumbers’ in my neighborhood that make $250,000 a year.”
And I plan to see to it that we don’t have any, either.
I guess Biden has had a meeting with all the small business/plumbers at that non-existent restaraunt….to find his facts.
Revenue has nothing to do with it. It is about profit. That is the key number and the one that they mean when they talk about $250,000. They maybe should do a better job of making this clear.
And these two bozos (is that a racist comment?) who say they are in touch with middle class, because they grew up there, have NO idea what it takes to run a business of any kind, let alone a small business.
Welcome to the clown show…. Mr. Empty Suit and Mr. Foot in Mouth.
Joe wants to buy the plumbing business, he has been working for. That would mean he would employ many Plumbers but he isn’t going to say be a Big huge Plumber, like Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, who snaked the American Taxypapers wallets for Billions. So Joe the Plumber a would be Small Businessman. Obama said, he was for the Small Businessman, was he for Joe the Plumber, before he was against him GRIN.
Truth is Obama hates small business owners because they keep “his people” in chains. He wouldn’t be talking that way to Joe the Plumber if he were black.
Joe Plumber for Secretary of Commerce!
One thing I’m curious about.
The Obama campaign keeps saying that 98% of small businesses make less than $250K a year.
I can’t help but wonder how they came up with that number.
Based on what I know about small businesses, any business that makes less than $250K a year doesn’t employ anyone and isn’t a serious business.
For example, my neighbor works on custom motorcycles. He has a small business where he has clients. But this isn’t his main source of income. He’s an accountant. The motorcycle business is more of a hobby where he can make a few bucks. For him to be able to charge for his work, he made a small business.
Also, there are a ton of failed small businesses. Businesses that don’t make any money.
If these are included, I’m sure Obama’s numbers are right. But that’s a deceptive figure.
Well they haven’t so we’re left to assume worse case scenario.
Ole Joe has had so much botox his eyes are swollen shut. I’m assuming his nose has had just as much as it would be around 4 feet long with all the lies he’s told.
No, it means revenue, unless he specifies otherwise. People who file as individuals – which includes a lot of small businesses – are taxed on “income”, not “profit”. Nice try anyway, shyster.
Besides isn’t it the gleaming tenet of a Marxist to steal people’s money and claim to want to help the poor?
That is Obama’s ‘we will tax everyone else but not YOU’ tax plan. I’d be interested to know where he got those percentages as well.
AnotherBrian,
The $250K number means profit after all the employees are paid, as well as all the other deductible expenses to the business. Often times the owner also draws a salary as an employee, so even if a business clears very little in profit, it does not mean the business is not doing okay. I have a client that owns a bar. After everyone and everything is paid, including his salary, it only shows a very modest profit. But he is doing well from the salary.
I disagree because there are so few small business with that kind of profit, that a tax of this kind would be fairly insignificant at increasing revenues.
So – what’s your point? A profitable company is the one that creates jobs.
Have you ever gotten a job from a company with low or no profit? No…you get LAID OFF. Obama wants to punish profits, which takes money away from companies…money they’d use to provide pay and benefits to their employees.
Not everyone can be a lazy, government-paid lacky, chap.
Joe the Plumber might be the October surprise.
4USA, there’s a better idea for term limits. 12 years, that’s all they get. When someone is elected, the 12 year clock starts running and doesn’t stop. At the end of 12 years, they are out of politics.
AND…
They are not allowed to hold any other government job. They can’t take any job that is paid using public funds. Nothing. Force them into the private sector completely.
How many outgoing politicians will vote for a tax increase if they know they have to get a job in the private sector? None.
I’m a financial advisor, serving mostly families with a net worth of over $1 million. The overwhelming majority of my clients, more than 80% of them, are Joe the Plumber.
They’re plumbers, landscapers, contractors, deli and restaurant owners etc. Their net worth is so high because as they continued to make money they kept their blue colllar habits. That means instead of country club memberships and Ferraris they paid off their homes, bought their businesses and put money away.
These men and women keep the economy going through their hard work, but to socialists like Obama they’re the rich, the “fatcats”. They need to have the success they worked for taken away and “spread around” among people who are too lazy or stupid to succeed on their own.
It’s wrong, it’s unfair, and it’s un-American. You’d think the spectacular failure of the USSR would have been the last nail in the coffin of this absurd idealogy. Such a shame that it wasn’t.
A guy taking in a gross of exactly $250,000 per year will pay almost $12,500 in taxes under Obama. That’s a lot of cash that can be use fot capital reinvestment that’s flushed down some hole; the Obama hole.
We will rename black holes Obama holes.
And that’s the next thing in the sights for the libs. Too much salary? We’ll tax it.
Hell, they’re already eying 401(k)s, since it’s unfair I put away 10% of my pay since the age of 25 and others didn’t.
You don’t create wealth by making smaller pieces of pie. You make the pie bigger.
Obama doesn’t want to do that.
Comrade Joe is the gift that keeps on giving. Old smirky just can’t keep from making those gaffes. One good thing is he keeps letting everyone know how out of touch he is with not only the electorate, but also reality.
Welcome to the United Socialist States of America! We’re boned!
I should say an additional $12,500 in taxes. Mea culpa.
How d’ya think Putin got so rich?
And this is a man who got a “quality” college education? Sounds like someone that is stuck on stupid…
Joe the Plumber would be allowed to make $250,000 a year if he was black. Since he is white then he has to “spread the wealth” that he worked many years to obtain and to realize the American dream. Way to go Obama. Biden is about as retarded as they come.
Not surprising, you are simply wrong about this. All businesses can deduct pretty much every business expense (including wages) from their income, even ones that are run as a sole proprietorship. So if it makes 100K and pays out 100K to its employees, its revenue is 100K, its income is zero. If it has some left over that is either taxed directly to the owner, if it is a pass through type or to the corporation if it is treated as a C- corp.
The Obama campaign keeps saying that 98% of small businesses make less than $250K a year.
I can’t help but wonder how they came up with that number.
The sad fact is that many small businesses, including many restaurants and bars) misrepresent what they make in order to dodge taxes. Cash goes unreported…
That was an attack on Joe the Plumber? Ooooohhhhkay then.
“It’s kill..
Nevermind, it’s obvious.
Chap, wouldn’t the owner still have to pay income tax on his salary? Just askin’…
Obama hung out with staunch Marists whilst in college. One of them is a child molester.
But if he was, and gave jobs to people that were NOT qualified plumbers…he could get tax breaks and government subsidiaries!
Man, I mean Marxists. I need more speed.
I have more than a few relatives that are plumbers. My great uncle and his sons and their sons.
When you start out, you make nothing. You have to be an apprentice, then a journeyman, before you can be certified as a plumber. This is a process that takes many years to complete.
So, after about 20 to 25 years in the business, they finally get their feet on the ground. And they can do pretty well. But, they are constantly buying new equipment, new trucks, training and mentoring younger apprentices and journeymen, bidding on contracts, chasing down bad debts….And they are by no means accountants.
For most of them, there is no separation between their business and their personal lives. So when tax time comes, they find they don’t have the receipts or records to support all of those supposed deductions. And surprise – after they reach a certain incme level, their deductions start to phase out even under the current tax structure.
I am tired of hearing the lie that only 5 percent of small business owners make over $200,000 a year. The dems are using the stats from the general population in comong up with that number. And it is a lie.
Small business in the US employs over 60% of working folks in this country. And I would bet that 10% of those small business employ over 50% of the 60% figure.
So, when a small business finds out that their profits are going to disappear by higher taxes, about the only thing they can do is to cut their workforce. The employment expense is the largest expense they have, and it is generally the only place where they can make cuts that make any difference.
What Obama is doing is to institute a plan that keeps people firmly entrenched in the middle. No upside to starting your own business (the reward component of the risk-reward analysis is what drives many people to owning their own business). So Obama will stall new business starts and decrease the ranks of existing businesses. And those small businesses that do stick around will trim their payrolls as a necessary move just to break even.
And in the greater scheme of things, Obama’s plan is a sure fire way to smother any kind of recovery. Perhaps that is his goal – to take away all incentive to succeed so as to make the embrace of socialism the only option for people who want to survive.
whew! Bud Fox, I thought you meant Hussein was a closet monk!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marist_Brothers
Maybe Biden’s new nickname should be:
Joe The Dumber.
If Biden wasn’t just a lazy ass pandering politician he could find himself a real job that pays a little more. I’m sorry he isn’t getting rich at the public feeding trough . . . the man is an incompetent fool.
Great idea! BTW, would you believe that there are bureaucrats who would argue that this would prevent people from pursuing elected office? (Or perhaps those that seek such offices would truly want to serve the public, what a concept!)
Joe the Plumber can sink Obama’s fairy tale (as Clinton put it) so why not attack a conservative white male like Joe.
Of course. And if he is getting paid $250K from that salary, his taxes are going up.
But it is not the case that there would be some sort of double taxation on that money. That $250K is simply not considered income to a business that properly deducts it.
This is the reason Obambi would NEVER do town halls with McCain. After all, people at Obambi’s events would never insult Obambi with a question like Joe the plumber asked. Obambi’s true underlying beliefs come out when he is off prompter. And now “plugs” Biden is attacking Joe the Plumber. The $3000 dollar “bonus” for new employees is a joke. If you have an employee making $40,000 it costs the owner an additional $20,000 on top of the salary.
I hope Joe the plumber is ready for what the press will try to do to him for asking the “One” a question. After all he was a plant by McCain’s campaign.
max said:
Right I am still aghast that a teacher at Marist College is using a book by Bill Ayers to teach classes. I’m stuck.
That makes sense, but if the owner’s total business and personal income is still over $250,000, would this person be in the same boat under Obama’s plan as if it was all considered business income? Again, just askin…
chappie you are correct when you say $250k in profits, but since most small businesses are subchapter s corps or llc and the like, the peoples salary and anything that is not spent on legitimate deductions is the same thing. PROFIT in the eyes of the irs. so joe the plumber makes $100k in salary, good, but not bill gates, and he pays his wife $40k to do the books and schedule the jobs, and both own the small business, he only has to make a profit of $110k to be a patriot and PAY MORE IN TAXES. btw, he’ll be paying about 40% in federal, state and local income tax, before he gets around to little things like unemployment tax for his employees, hiring cpas to keep his payments to the government for his employees on time and doing their tax deductions, and heaven forbid he hires more than 10 people, because then he falls under osha and half a dozen other agency rules and will need at least another specialist to keep him out of jail for breaking some beaurocratic rule. everyone should look at the small business owners books to see what percentage of that company goes to keeping the governments from coming after you. tons of commercials are on tv saying joe the contractor owed $250,000 to the irs and some lawyer got it reduced to peanuts. think of how that happened. to those who work for someone, they take your taxes, social security, and medicaid/medicare payments out and send them to the governments. they pay the state the unemployment insurance on you, they pay the workers comp on you, they send you a w2 once a year and still people can’t pay their taxes on time. the day is coming when all employees will be subcontractors and responsible for all this crap themselves.
Obama knows how to consolidate power. The number of people receiving welfare will go up about 10% under his administration. (more votes)
Depends on how the business is set up, I believe. If it is considered a pass through entity, all the income of the business is attributed to the owner. So if say the guy was taking a $150K salary and the business had a profit of $150, then yes I believe that that business owner’s taxes are going up.
If it is not a pass through entity, then the business’s profits are separate from the owner unless a distribution is made out to the owner(s).
Chap …
No where has the $250K number ever been explained as to whether it is referring to gross revenue or profit …
Until that is cleared up there will continue to be at least the inference that the number is referring to gross revenues rather than profit …
Most service businesses, such as plumbing, could not keep the doors open if they only made $250k a year …
That level of revenue would not even cover the annual costs of inventory of parts and equipment required alone … let alone all the other categories of overhead and employees …
Thanks.
Thanks.
I don’t think J.T.P said who he is voting for yet. I just watched the clip twice, and there was no “attack”. J.T.P seems like a good, honest guy with legitimate concerns, and now he’s been made into a gimmick and cartoon. No matter who he is voting for I feel sorry for him. I’m sure SNL will have fun with him this weekend. Poor, dude.
sorry, double post
Smirky Joe and Schmarmy ‘O – what a team.
cheapseat, you are correct, but I have little problem believing that almost all small businesses owners, once all is said and done, don’t clear $250K combined between salary and before tax business profit.
I’m certain Joe doesn’t have any plumbers in his neighborhood, period.
Plumbers usually can’t afford to live where wealthy power abusers make their residence. Usually, the only time they make it past the gated community fence is when guys like Biden drop off too many kids at the pool and backup the septic system.
His disingenuous inclusion of “Joe grocery store owner” only serves to demonstrate how he’s grasping at straws.
Which is why it is absurd to think that this is what Obama meant. Unfortunately, it is not easy to explain in the course of a 1 minute soundbite.
Chap …
Most small businesses are sole proprietorships or at best “S” corporations … many of these file their business taxes as part of their personal income taxes and it all ends up being combined for tax purposes … so hitting that “$250K” number is relatively easy under those circumstances …
Exactly our point – he’s a moron! I really doubt he has thought this through.
Misscheryl …
Well said …
The question you should be asking Max is how is Obama gonna pay for his trillion dollar spending spree when he’s only taxing people that make over 250k…but by his own words, small businesses (who employ the majority of Americans) don’t make over 250k.
HufPo Democrats Bash Joe the Plumber. They really do hate ordinary people, and they really don’t tolerate heresies against the Obamassiah.
I don’t want to get emotional (ok, maybe I do). I made less than $50k last year. My taxes right now are ridiculous. I know (no matter who wins the election) my taxes are going up. I know it. I know it. I know it. I won’t “get a tax cut under Obama’s plan”. I won’t. I won’t. I won’t. (I’m having a tantrum.) I don’t trust Obama (or McCain) with my money as far as the end of my nose. What’s the “scandal” in what JW said? Pols can screw things up way more easily than they can make things better. Look at the bailout (that they both voted for) and look at the mortgage mess that led to the bailout. What JW said is no scandal.
I know about how pass through entities are treated. I still have no problem believing that the vast majority of small business owners don’t “make” (as in actual take home pay) that much.
btw if a company makes no profit year after year, the irs will come after you, because if you don’t have profit, you are a hobby not a business.
guess that tells you who he’s not voting for!
Democrats think a small business owner is some Arab guy with a hot dog/falafel cart in NYC or the corner crack dealer.
Everybody else is an evil capitalist pig who is exploiting the proletariat. Curse you Joe the Plumber for greasing the wheels of capitalism with the blood of the workers!!
Would that be the brown turd?
Actually it was Obama’s explanation, in his own words, that are far more damning than this debate over the revnue vs. profits.
Obama explicitly said, in plain English for once, that he sees the redistribution of wealth as a worthy goal. Go ahead, explain that away.
That really is not the standard, and lack of profit (or minimal profit) is really not a concern to a legitimate operation. The “three in five” rule is just kind of a safe harbor, but not the end of the story.
That’s almost as good as p-o-t-a-t-o (e)??????
Poor choice of words, politically, but entirely consistent with cutting taxes on the lower/middle class and raising them on the upper class. He has made no secret of that. And you either agree with it or you don’t.
Nut jobs is a 5-letter word. Pronounced: Biden
STUCK ON STUPID
If the Obama campaign and the Left are STUPID enough to attack Joe the Plumber on any level, they are putting themselves into a Mark Foley moment. They WILL, not may, lose the election, because of it.
However, their knee jerk reaction to any “threat” is personal attack. Sucks to be them if they continue.
OK … let;s get the official government definitions …
Here is the chart of government definitions of “small business” by category and based on revenues …
US Government Small Business Definitions
If you go down the list to item 238220 which lists plumbing the revenue limit to still be considered a “Small Business” is $14,000,000.00 … that’s quite a bit more than $250k …
You can also check the information available on the Small Business Administration site which links to the chart above for definitions by revenue … there are also references to definitions based on number of employees ..
SBA Definitions
Best to be informed folks before we start discussing or arguing this or any other issue …
I can’t wait for Saturday Night Live to run with this gaff…before their lawyers scub all evidence of its existence from the internet.
Under a President Obama, will TiVo be abolished too?
No, you’re making an unwarranted assumption that when they change tax law to tax these entities, that they won’t also change the law to make the tax on the gross (like an AMT) rather than on the net. I don’t doubt you know current tax law. I really, really, doubt you can read Obama’s mind.
Question for you, Chap: How do I connect the dots on this one?
chappie, EVERY farm owner, EVERY car dealership owner, EVERY franchise owner, as well as many plumbing company, electrical contractor companies and tons of it people, sales people, and dr’s, lawyers and indian chiefs fit into the group to be taxed. what if just 10% of that group says, hey i’m getting out of this business, and putting my money into investments where i pay 15% tax and can run my business from my porch in mexico. how many employees does that leave jobless, and not everyone can work for the government, because the government doesn’t produce anything anyone will BUY. they dispense other peoples money.
In terms of “JOBS” is a three letter word remember,
“There are three kinds of people in this world. Those who can count and those who can’t.”
You mean Obama was caught saying he’s a Marxist and should’ve been more unctuous in his delivery.
IF the plan is for people like “Joe the Plumber” to get us out of our financial mess. On the shoulders of Small business, you wouldn’t want to handicap them, with mandatory regulations and heap some extra taxes on them. This is the out look for the Employment rate right now. IF Joe Plumber, and his peers are going to dig us out, we shouldn’t be putting up obstacles in their way.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20081016/bs_nm/us_usa_economy_13
Obama thinks Government Programs, as in Investment? Government collecting more of our tax payer dollars, are the answer. Socialism doesn’t work, if there is no incentive to work, to create the climate for jobs creation, to create the product- That Obama’s poor folks- who have the wealth spread to them, would buy “No Product, because Obama made it to expensive to create” so what would the poor folks buy with Joe the Plumbers money? If you follow the reasoning it doesn’t work. Obama says he wants to reduce Bureaucracy but as far as I can tell, that is what he is a Bureaucrat.
I feel like I am living Ayn Rands “Atlas Shrugged” where is John Galt.
Joe the plumber was a plant? LOL. This is nothing more than the MSM complaining about the right wing bias of the American public again.