California teachers vs. traditional marriage
Last week, I noted the public school propaganda war on traditional marriage — in the form of a first-grader field trip to a wedding of two lesbian teachers opposed to Proposition 8. That’s the ballot measure to protect marriage.
CTA, the far Left teachers’ union in California, has now donated $1 million to defeat the proposition. I noted their first $250,000 installment for the same-sex marriage lobby in August.
It’s all for the children, of course:
California’s largest teacher’s union has given another $1 million to defeat a Nov. 4 ballot initiative that would ban same-sex marriage in the state.
The contribution recorded Tuesday makes the California Teachers Association the largest institutional donor to the No on 8 campaign. CTA also gave $250,000 in August to Equality for All, a coalition of gay advocacy and civil rights groups opposing Proposition 8.
Union spokeswoman Sandra Jackson says CTA’s 800-member policy body voted overwhelmingly to oppose the gay marriage ban. Jackson says the issue concerns educators because “teachers teach the importance of equal rights for all.”
She says CTA leaders made the second contribution this week because the No campaign seems to be struggling.
Reader Beckie is a teacher in Cali and she’s sick to her stomach:
I just wanted to thank you for your website. I went home sick to my stomach today when I realized that CTA had donated 1 million dollars to ‘No on Prop. 8.’ CTA clearly does not see in the long run that they are perhaps cutting their own throats as parents flock to private schools or begin home schooling as parents realize that they do not want radical ideas dictated to their children.
I am a conservative elementary school teacher living in the Bay Area. (Lion’s Den) I bravely had a Bush bumper sticker on my car last election but this election, I felt that anything conservative message on my vehicle might mean my car being vandalized. (by the other teachers) I don’t think I am the only conservative CTA member and I would love to find a forum that our voice can be heard without threat of losing our standing in our school districts.
Again, I appreciate your viewpoint and I’m bookmarking your website right now.
Reason number 99,999,984 to homeschool.
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I suppose being a rabid left-wing moonbat is easier than actually teaching children how to read or write. Lots more free time I’m sure.
The left seems to be making a committed effort to control both the schools and the media.
In other words, control the knowledge given to children as well as control the flow of information to the population.
There was some guy in Germany who did this in the early to mid 20th century as well.
I also think that the last sponsor of the Olympic Games could give some advice to the extreme leftists.
Fascist Socialism at its best.
From Maggie Gallagher at NRO:
Ouch! Not only is that going to leave a mark, but ACORN has registered that little hispanic girl about 20 times.
Not only is this disgustingly abusive to the young children it is an abuse of the union members dues. The spokesperson may tell the press that the donation was overwhelmingly approved but the actual truth is most likely much different. If the members can be abused like this now, think of how much abuse will go on after there is no more secret ballot casting when the socialists take over.
Teachers constantly complain they aren’t paid enough, yet their union throws $1,250,000 toward a cause that has nothing to do with teacher’s job security. If I were a teacher in California I would be up in arms.
The CTA literally bankrupted itself to defeat the measure that would have raised the tenure term from 3 years to 5 years.
All for the children, indeed.
Don’t kid yourself. When Obama’s elected, private schools and homeschooling will be illegal.
They vill get your children, one way or another. Who knows — perhaps they’ll do like Canada and make it a HATE CRIME to take your kids out of class when they glorify things you find objectionable, too.
Unions need a little competition.
How about a “conservative” union that only lobbies for relevant issues (and therefore, has cheaper dues).
Another example of bureaucrats picking your pockets to grease their friends. I mean it like that – not like that.
Unlike Canada, we still have guns.
Before some troll misunderstands my comment, I do not mean violence against teachers.
this is my gripe on all unions, how do you have this excess surplus funds to toss around, then turn around and gouge the employers for more? if that was put in the a fund for pensions and health plans that would be a far better use for those dues. this would also show that you are a partner with the employer and allow the employer to continue to WORK IN THIS COUNTRY!!! that is one of the reasons we have companies fleeing to set up shop in other countries, the unions have made dinosaurs of their workers.
yet, they still just keep blaming American businesses. i point the blame on the unions. disgusting lot!
You mean wild fire hasn’t destroyed California yet?
I’ve been there and seen the corruption. I taught public junior high for 7 years then resigned when my oldest was born. I’m happily homeschooling two awesome young men. (They get to say “under God” in the pledge; then we hold hands and PRAY!)
The future of our nation is in private and homeschool education. The public school system is a lost cause. Too many liberals have their claws in the highest postitions. The unions are running everything. The conservatives are seriously out numbered!
Parents wake up. Your children being indoctrinated with socialist and entitlement ideas!
BTW ~ I never joined a union, despite extreme pressure.
I would like Beckie and all other California teachers who are disgusted with this stuff to know that she does not have to give her membership dues to the CTA. She by law can give that money to a charity, instead. and via using the same monthly installments that union members use to give to the union. There are other teacher’s associations that are much better and offer the same benefits/legal protection that CTA does.
Conservative unions might wake up all the unions currently pushing Obamunism down their members throats like the United Mine Workers of America and their endorsed candidate Joe “No Coal plants in America” Biden.
Unfortunately, the Christian school I attended has closed. Now we will have to find another to send our son to.
The local ISD is full of racism and drug-dealing janitors.
I thought gay marriage was not going to be an issue in the classroom? If that is true, then why is the CTA spending big bucks on this ballot issue?
Beckie ~
You have my prayers. Even 10 years ago, I had to keep my conservative values private. Only a few, very trusted, fellow teachers knew my true convictions. I was once challenged by my principal for my conservative “religous” beliefs!
Hang in there. You have a Prayer Warrior on your side!
teachers’ union priorities:
1st liberal causes/poliicians
2nd union leaders
3rd union members
63683146432th educatiting students
And educators wonder why many citizens don’t want to send good money after bad in support of public education. The cost per student keeps climbing and the educational output gets worse and worse.
What a waste of dues. I’d expect they would put the money toward the teachers and/or the students rather than social engineering and promoting abominable lifestyles.
I’d like to see the Department of Education eradicated along with the IRS and the U.N.
OMSB, BobonSI,
I was thinking the same thing. They obviously do not need wage increases if they have that kind of money to throw around on political causes. I will start voting NO on any referendum to increase wages until they start using their current wages more wisely. Let’s see how they like that!
Money ~
Public schools receive an average of $15,000 / student.
(not including special needs)
Private schools spend an average of $2000 / student.
I homeschool 2 children for $600 / year.
Let’s compare their standardized tests!
Caligula, thy progeny liveth..
Amen, rightwingmom, Amen.
add to that the agriculture department, HHS, and energy dept.
The teachers’ union is one of the reasons why CA has spent itself into the craphole and why the public schools are so terrible.
Even if I didn’t care either way on gay marriage, I’d still vote yes on Prop 8 because 1) I’m offended the judges snatched away the people’s will on the issue 2) of stunts like the first graders’ field trip to watch their lesbian teacher get married and 3) I’m automatically for anything CTA opposes and against anything CTA is for.
Next time they want more money for schools…just vote NO!
Sambo,
ROFLMYKWO
Ah, more of those union dues going to a good cause, those teachers must be proud
Liberals reject human nature. They believe that humans are essentially blank slates, or like blobs of clay: having no inherent or intrinsic shape, but capable of being manipulated into politically correct (or incorrect) forms.
Liberals also believe that like clay, humans tend to dry out and harden over time, making it harder to mold them into proper form.
That is why they target the schools from K through 12. They feel that if they can just get hold of kids’ minds from an early, impressionable age and work on them for years, the end product will be a “superior” being — in their own image, of course.
That is why schools have fallen from places of learning to centers of indoctrination: the administrators and teachers’ unions see themselves as progressive crusaders in a competition with benighted, traditionalist parents over who will have the final say in determining what final shape the “lumps of clay” will get molded into.
The only marriage is Traditional Marriage. I object to the modifier.
yeah they did that BS with me…values clarification….situational ethics…
didn’t work…I am RIGHT FOR LIFE an OC (original conservative) I rejected their lies and BS long ago…
unfortunately many others don’t seem to mind being manipulated…
I may get yelled at for this but….
It has been my experience that parents care little about what goes on in schools. They expect- and trust- teachers to do their jobs. Fat chance in this day and age. Let there be transparency and accountability. If some yahoo “educator” tries to cram something down a student’s throat or allocate funds for some cause, let the parents be all over him.
California teachers vs.
traditionalmarriageI fixed that for you. Marriage is marriage; no need for a qualifier.
Can some one educate me as to why the government decided to get involved in a soley religious institution in the first place?
C’mon Beckie. You know they are only thinking of the children! After all, they don’t want you to impose YOUR moral beliefs on them.
No idea, but I’d be curious to find out.
I support gay marriage, but what in hell is a teacher’s union doing taking it up as an official cause? Public school education and gay marriage are not things that should mix. I’m sure this is going to do a FANTASTIC job of getting people over to their side…*rolls eyes*
Marauder:
I am in complete agreement.
Pandora, meet box…
I support
gayredefining marriage… from what it has meant throughout recorded history.
This is what you meant to say.
All the little monsters stay in Pandora’s box if judges quit legislating from the bench and lawmakers and voters support keeping the monsters inside. I do think that’s a legitimate argument, though – I can just hear the case Muslim and FLDS polygamists will probably make if gay marriage becomes a nation-wide thing.
Anyway, doesn’t the US rank behind lots of other countries on basic math and science or something? The teachers ought to go worry about that.
i think the group of homeschoolers across the country should band together and open up small schools and teach other children who’s parents want them out of the agenda farms. every time i see how many homeschoolers are out there i think this is a real growth business model, and should be utilized. break the monopoly of the public districts. in my district, this coming week they have 2 days of teacher conferences, so they are taking next friday off. 6 hours a day 175 days a year, and they can’t work an extra 3 hours for 2 days without having a day off. and we wonder why our kids rank behind all the civilized world in education k – 12.
Marauder:
I think you missed my meaning. I meant you opened Pandora’s box in this thread
.
And leave the moral judgments to the ACLU because teaching whats right and wrong is above their pay grade.
btw i too am completely behind the concept of legal if not religiously backed marriage solely because i love reading about the divorce settlements. wait until ellens honey decides to split, great fun. you b***h, no you b***h.
Dexter Alarius, what I write is what I mean to say. Marriage has meant a heck of a lot of things in different places and cultures, from the cementation of a loving, companionate relationship to a political alliance (oops, didn’t mean to bring up the Clintons
) to a man and his five wives to two people who got married simply so one of them could come to America. Personally, I think it should be two loving adults who are committed to a monogamous relationship together.
I don’t think it was a particularly good idea for Massachusetts and California judges to decide that gay marriage would now be legal, though. People don’t like laws that the majority of the population or a substantial amount of the population considers to be immoral, and suddenly making gay marriage legal without any kind of popular consensus was not a good move. Democracy > gay marriage in my mind.
zeroangel: Oh, sorry. Je comprende.
you are such a bigot!! the more the merrier!!
Man Assaulted For Prop 8 Support
Yep, that’s me, big scary bigot. Rawr.
Marriage did not begin based on what it meant to people. Marriage was instituted as tool for man’s deification. The church is the bride of Christ and marriage relates to this relationship. THAT is why marriage was created. In other words, it is an institution created by God NOT man.
That being said, I’m on the fence regarding civil unions. I love dearly the people in my life that happen to be homosexual. Love.Them.Dearly but marriage is marriage between a man and a woman and it doesn’t matter a whole lot to me what people think about that.
This is a big part of the question. Is homosexuality and Identity? Or is it a choice? Is it even Sex?
I think what we have is one group for their own world view upon the rest of us.
Marriage has meant a heck of a lot of things in different places and cultures…
Except it has never meant a guy ‘marrying’ another guy. Whether for religious or legal reasons, marriage has always meant a union between members of the opposite sex.
I object to a handful of un-elected elites deciding something that should be left to the people through the democratic process.
Mister P I do not know the answer to that question. I do believe homosexual behavior is sinful as I believe sex outside of marriage to be equally sinful. I believe all of us struggle with sin..so I’ll leave it at that, because I don’t have all of the answers, but then again, I don’t have to have all the answers.
this isnt’ about ‘rights’ its all about silencing the opposition, especially christians. the force of law will be used to regulate your conduct, and your speech, so you cannot exercise your religious freedom. homosexuality will be elevated to a ‘protected status’ like race.
I guess all the teachers in Cali are gay.
Please clarify.
Misscheryl:
I am sorry if I am nitpicking, but you do know that marriage predates Christianity, correct?
If you love your gay friends dearly, do you think it’s fair for them to get “civil unions” that are equal to a marriage in a legal sense as long as Churches aren’t forced to preside over these unions?
Dexter Alarius:
Intersting stuff from wiki (with sources):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage
To be fair, no one quite liked what Nero did. *smile*
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/suet-nero-rolfe.html
As a middle school teacher in California, I can’t talk about my faith without fear of retribution; I can’t tell students it is wrong to have sex outside marriage or that homosexuality is wrong. Morals??? When I have alluded to Sunday School, many of my students said, “What’s that?” I can’t stomach that my dues are now used to support something that I diametrically oppose. I’ll be looking into having my dues go to a charitable group.
On October 17th, 2008 at 3:01 pm, madmonkphotog said:
I guess all the teachers in Cali are gay.
You might want to check your sources and your attitude. I work with a number of committed Christians who do not condone the behavior our state teacher’s union has endorsed. It just seems the people at the top are gay-friendly.
NO. It breaks down the foundation of civilization with laws. Marriage is a social contract created by a culture in order to strengthen and preserve that culture. Homosexual marriage breaks the boundaries of the law allowing unlimited forms of marriage therefore destroying the culture.
Zero,
First, I take any information provided by Wiki with a huge grain of salt.
Second, the references prove my point. Rome did not recognize same sex unions as ‘marriage’.
All of you sooooo tolerant gay marriage advocates remember without law there is anarchy. A breaking down of a fundamental social construct will lead to anarchy. Is that what you want?
If you’ve read “Cicero” you will realize the a mans propensity for young boys was used against opponents in political battles.
The man said,
“This is now bone of my bones
and flesh of my flesh;
she shall be called ‘woman,’
for she was taken out of man.”
For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and they will become one flesh.
The man and his wife were both naked, and they felt no shame.
Genesis 2:23-25
and again confirmed by Jesus Christ:
But at the beginning of creation God ‘made them male and female.’ ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh.’ So they are no longer two, but one.
Mark 10:6-8
Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
Hebrews 13:4
Dexter Alarius:
Wikipedia references another source which I included (Suetonius: De Vita Caesarum–Nero, c. 110 C.E.) I have been reading it just now, it’s interesting. Wiki is fine as a first source and a gateway to actual challenged research. It is poor if used as an only source (much like any other wiki).
I posted it only because I found it while searching on the topic and thought it was interesting. I am (if nothing else) very much interested in the truth, and not the spin. As I did say previously:
You are correct, from the source it doesn’t say that Rome “recognized” same sex unions as marriage (although a crazy emperor saying it is recognized, does make it legally recognized). All it does say is that it is the
Wiki IS being somewhat vague in that it doesn’t spell out for you that it was the insane Nero that used it in such a way. That requires the reader to read the footnotes.
I don’t need to cite Roman history to make a point, far from it, I would cite many things in history as “what not to do.”
Romans also apparently burned gays. I think that practice is wrong as well. In that sense, I would argue that it is wrong to try and argue against same-sex marriage based on what the Romans thought.
I have typed and deleted so many answers to you on this. Suffice it to say, I am not the judge of what is fair. I love them dearly and I stand by what I said earlier. I think what you suggest is a slippery slope and I think the government should get out of the marriage business altogether. Maybe I’m being niave and trying to use a very broad brush with this issue but there are legal things people can do to protect each other and grant them certain privilages if they so choose without the government putting it’s stamp of approval on something.
FamilyMan:
As I said in another thread:
IMO, denying the priveledges of a legal union to gays and telling them that “they have the same rights as anyone, they can marry someone of the opposite sex!” Is just like telling a wheelchair bound individual to “use the stairs like everyone else.”
Homosexuality was prominent in both Greek and Roman societies. It was just another part of the perversity in the culture including infantcide and celebrated promiscuity. As it was generally accepted by those who were in wealthy and in power it needed no additional recognition.
Misscheryl:
On this I think we agree. I support a flat tax (for example). Joint filing is outdated.
The government should get out of most things.
zeroangel said:That is so much BS
You can not compare a person with a walking difficulty with a fundamental social contract.
I wish there was a thread dedicated to what we think the government should be involved in and go from there! We could operate this nation on a dime!
There is. It’s called the constitution. The only reason we are having these problems is because of activist judges.
Oh please. That’s like if I said that because some people who are opposed to gay marriage are opposed for religious reasons, they want to force their religion on everyone. Totally unfounded and the product of taking one fact and assuming others.
I don’t think I’m “soooo tolerant”. I don’t think people who don’t approve of gay marriage are intolerant; they have their convictions and I have mine. Not approving of gay marriage isn’t any sort of deal-breaker or mark of judgment for me. It’s a difference of opinion, and I recognize that just because someone doesn’t approve of gay marriage doesn’t mean that they’re huge raging homophobes out to make gay people’s lives hell.
It would be one thing if marriage were a solely religious issue. Churches have rules and their rules can be whatever they want them to be, no matter how much some people don’t like them. But marriage is also a civil and legal institution, something any man and any woman can do if they both agree and have the money for a license. I don’t think it’s fair for dedicated gay couples who have lived together for years to have various legal issues that a man and a woman who knew each other for two weeks and eloped to Vegas can avoid. It’s possible for gay couples to get a lot of the privliges that marriage has, but it’s expensive. It’s a long process. Religions should never have to marry gay couples if they don’t approve of gay marriage, but I think gay couples who want to get married should be able to do so in the civil sense. It would indeed be a change in what marriage has traditionally meant, but it would be an expanded definition, not something that would erase the old definition. Nobody’s marriage is going to be worth less if gay people can get married. But whatever happens, it should happen because the majority of the country wanted it that way.
FamilyMan:
I can and did. It is a perfect analogy. A
person in a wheelchairhomosexual COULDuse the stairsmarry a person of the opposite sex with great difficulty and serious effort on thier part fighting thier “handicap”. They could do this in order toget to the second floorrecieve tax breaks anddoget other things that would be denied to them otherwise.Marauder I’m not talking religion. Im trying to point out to you and your kind that there is a slippery slope when primary social contracts are breached. If Gay marriage is allowed, where does a society draw the line?
zeroangel. Your a moron. Go away.
Marauder:
On this point I think we disagree. It is my opinion that homosexuals being denied the civil unions you speak of is a travesty of justice. The majority is not always right. IIRC it was the courts that finally made laws against interracial marriage illegal, not the voters.
FamilyMan:
Back to kindergarten are we? Sticks and stones…
I am human. I exist in a dualist social and religious theology. I therefore have the right and the need to discriminate in order to exist. I chose to discriminate against gay marriages. I chose to convince my culture to do the same .
How’s that sport.
You have chosen to lower your debating skills to that level.
Your analogy didn’t cover how the person in a wheelchair would use this as an excuse to indoctrinate our children.
FamilyMan:
I think you meant to say:
You‘re a moron.
Thanks for the laugh though, sport.
sambo:
Please see #42. I am in agreement with Marauder. This has no place in schools or with teacher’s unions.
How you gonna stop it then? That is the part of gay agenda.
I would argue that it is wrong to try and argue against same-sex marriage based on what the Romans thought.
I have to disagree in that for a thousand years it was the dominant culture in that part of the world. For that reason it can’t be excluded from the discussion.
I have to admit that I haven’t done a whole lot of research on the subject, but I would be curious to know if there has ever been a culture that put same sex unions on the same level as opposite sex unions. That is, other than one in which an insane dictator decreed it for a brief period.
While the libertarian part of me believes what consenting adults do behind closed doors is their own business, I also believe homosexuality is wrong and don’t appreciate the ‘legitimizing’ of the practice being forced on our society by the radical gay agenda as facilitated by the courts, Hollywood, the MSM and others. THey are following the playbook as exposed in “The Marketing of Evil” and taking America into the crap hole of decadence.
Hate the sin but love the sinner, is what I try to live by. If you want to chase members of your same sex that’s your business. But don’t try to tell me it’s ‘normal’ or ‘right’, and don’t try to call your relationship ‘marriage’. It’s not.
It is also not a ‘rights’ issue. Every lesbian already has the right to marry any man that will have her. Likewise, every gay guy has the right to marry any woman that would have him. What homosexuals want is to create a new right that has never existed before — at least not in any prominent culture that we’re aware of.
If you have children, for goodness sake, get them out of public school. And check out the private schools carefully, many of them practice the same sort of left-wing indoctrination as the public schools. If you think you might want to try homeschooling, then try it for a year or two. There are tons of resources and support. Just start googling.
Remember that Bill Ayers is a respected education professor. This is not a coincidence.
sambo These two don’t admit to the danger of changing a primary social contract and the legal slippery slope that will occur. They therefore can be considered borderline anarchist.
Please ignore the trolls.
Lest anyone waste their time trying to argue rationally with zeroangel about same sex marriage, please see our discussion HERE.
Note where he loses all credibility by saying that not allowing same sex couples to file joint tax returns is “cruel.” When I asked him if he was exaggerating, he insisted it really was “cruel.” Obviously, he is not to be taken seriously.
Sweden allowed same sex marriages 20 years ago. As a result marriage has lost it’s social meaning and only 20% of heterosexuals get married.
sambo:
If I had kids in this school in Cali I would be outraged that the school took a field trip to a lesbian wedding (as opposed to teaching Math, for example)and I would likely have a great deal to say about it.
Just because I might agree with some of a person’s ideals doesn’t mean I have to agree with their methods.
Ref Trollman in #93.
Yes, please do read the whole exchange if you have hours to waste with my verbose (and not to mention some of Trollman’s incredibly long posts, some of which fill four screens of text).
As for his comments about joint filing, my response is in #319, and I’ll restate it here:
Trollman. With the reality of social security paying only one of the two retired married couple it is a disadvantage for a homosexual to have a legal union.
This whole discussion is the need for homosexual ACCEPTANCE.
yeah I warned you about zero there…he NEVER lets facts get in the way of his ideology…
right4life he has not addressed the problem of a slippery slope and it’s far ranging consequences.
SLIPPERY SLOPE
man man
woman woman
man woman woman
man man woman woman
woman woman woman woman
man duck
ETC