Michelle Malkin » Confirmed: The Obama DHS hit job on conservatives is real

Confirmed: The Obama DHS hit job on conservatives is real

By Michelle Malkin • April 14, 2009 12:01 AM

Yesterday, Roger Hedgecock and the Liberty Papers posted an unclassified DHS Office of Intelligence and Analysis report titled:

Rightwing Extremism: Current Economic and Political Climate Fueling Resurgence in Radicalization and Recruitment.

The “report” (PDF file here) was one of the most embarrassingly shoddy pieces of propaganda I’d ever read out of DHS. I couldn’t believe it was real.

I spent the day chasing down DHS spokespeople, who have been tied up preparing for a very important homeland security event later today: The First Lady is coming to visit their Washington office. Priorities, you know.

Well, the press office got back to me and verified that the document is indeed for real.

They were very defensive — preemptively so — in asserting that it was not a politicized document and that DHS had done reports on “leftwing extremism” in the past. I have covered DHS for many years and am quite familiar with past assessments they and the FBI have done on animal rights terrorists and environmental terrorists. But those past reports have always been very specific in identifying the exact groups, causes, and targets of domestic terrorism, i.e., the ALF, ELF, and Stop Huntingdon wackos who have engaged in physical harassment, arson, vandalism, and worse against pharmaceutical companies, farms, labs, and university researchers.

By contrast, the piece of crap report issued on April 7 is a sweeping indictment of conservatives. And the intent is clear. As the two spokespeople I talked with on the phone today made clear: They both pinpointed the recent “economic downturn” and the “general state of the economy” for stoking “rightwing extremism.” One of the spokespeople said he was told that the report has been in the works for a year. My b.s. detector went off the chart, and yours will, too, if you read through the entire report — which asserts with no evidence that an unquantified “resurgence in rightwing extremist recruitment and radicalizations activity” is due to home foreclosures, job losses, and…the historical presidential election.

In Obama land, there are no coincidences. It is no coincidence that this report echoes Tea Party-bashing left-wing blogs (check this one out comparing the Tea Party movement to the Weather Underground!) and demonizes the very Americans who will be protesting in the thousands on Wednesday for the nationwide Tax Day Tea Party.

From the report, p.2:

Rightwing extremism in the United States can be broadly divided into those groups, movements, and adherents that are primarily hate-oriented (based on hatred of particular religious, racial or ethnic groups), and those that are mainly antigovernment, rejecting federal authority in favor of state or local authority, or rejecting government authority entirely. It may include groups and individuals that are dedicated to a single issue, such as opposition to abortion or immigration.

From the report. p. 3:

(U//LES) Rightwing extremists are harnessing this historical election as a recruitment tool. Many rightwing extremists are antagonistic toward the new presidential administration and its perceived stance on a range of issues, including immigration and citizenship, the expansion of social programs to minorities, and restrictions on firearms ownership and use. Rightwing extremists are increasingly galvanized by these concerns and leverage them as drivers for recruitment. From the 2008 election timeframe to the present, rightwing extremists have capitalized on related racial and political prejudices in expanded propaganda campaigns, thereby reaching out to a wider audience of potential sympathizers.

(U) Exploiting Economic Downturn

(U//FOUO) Rightwing extremist chatter on the Internet continues to focus on the economy, the perceived loss of U.S. jobs in the manufacturing and construction sectors, and home foreclosures. Anti-Semitic extremists attribute these losses to a deliberate conspiracy conducted by a cabal of Jewish “financial elites.” These “accusatory” tactics are employed to draw new recruits into rightwing extremist groups and further radicalize those already subscribing to extremist beliefs. DHS/I&A assesses this trend is likely to accelerate if the economy is perceived to worsen.

From the report, p. 5:

(U//FOUO) Over the past five years, various rightwing extremists, including militias and white supremacists, have adopted the immigration issue as a call to action, rallying point,
and recruiting tool. Debates over appropriate immigration levels and enforcement policy generally fall within the realm of protected political speech under the First Amendment, but in some cases, anti-immigration or strident pro-enforcement fervor has been directed against specific groups and has the potential to turn violent.

And echoing the anti-military bigotry last seen in that disgusting Penn State University training video, there’s this on p. 7:

(U) Disgruntled Military Veterans

(U//FOUO) DHS/I&A assesses that rightwing extremists will attempt to recruit and radicalize returning veterans in order to exploit their skills and knowledge derived from military training and combat. These skills and knowledge have the potential to boost the capabilities of extremists—including lone wolves or small terrorist cells—to carry out violence. The willingness of a small percentage of military personnel to join extremist groups during the 1990s because they were disgruntled, disillusioned, or suffering from the psychological effects of war is being replicated today.

There’s no hackneyed left-wing stereotype of conservatives left behind in this DHS intelligence and analysis assessment. I asked both DHS spokespeople to tell me who, specifically, the report was accusing of “rightwing extremist chatter” and which “antigovernment” groups are being monitored as “extremists.” They say they’ll get back to me.

In the meantime, be aware of this from the report, p. 8:

(U//FOUO) DHS/I&A will be working with its state and local partners over the next several months to ascertain with greater regional specificity the rise in rightwing extremist activity in the United States, with a particular emphasis on the political, economic, and social factors that drive rightwing extremist radicalization.

Better make a few last-minute signs for the Tea Party. Obama’s DHS is watching:

Honk if you’re a radicalized rightwing extremist!

Guilty of rightwing extremist chatter

Anti-government, pro-freedom: Sue me

***

Previous: Missouri retracts report linking militias, 3rd party candidates.

***

Oh, I’m sure DHS will be issuing its report on self-proclaimed bank terrorists like Bruce Marks of NACA and criminal rackeeters harassing private citizens in their homes to “exploit the economic downturn” any day now.

***

Update: John Hinderaker weighs in the report.

Also good reading in Jonah Goldberg’s thread here.

Posted in: Animal rights wackos, Enviro-nitwits, Homeland Security, Tea Party

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#405

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:36 pm, jxs2151 said:

“First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.”

–Gandhi

I think this is the part where they fight us.
#406

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:37 pm, Living in the PSRK said:

Do you remember Oklahoma City?

YUP.

With a journalist’s practiced skill, the author recounts her amazing journey leading from the smoking rubble of the Murrah Federal Building to the sleazy haunts of John Doe 2. McVeigh’s Middle Eastern cohorts have been solidly identified in dozens of sworn witness statements’ firsthand accounts which are corroborated by a methodically assembled investigative dossier.

The most incriminating testimony centers around former Iraqi soldier, Hussain Al-Hussaini, whom witnesses place in the company of bomber Timothy McVeigh prior to the blast, seated in the passenger seat of the Ryder truck the morning of April 19, exiting that truck at ground zero, and speeding away from the bomb site in the only getaway vehicle targeted by the FBI in an all-points-bulletin for Middle Eastern suspects. Al-Hussaini has been unable to establish his whereabouts for the critical hours of that fateful morning, and more glaringly, the Justice Department has declined to officially exonerate him of suspicion.
#407

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:39 pm, southsideironworks said:

Has our government finally “jumped the shark”?
#408

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:40 pm, Living in the PSRK said:

UnderRoos:

Muslim extremists have been working FOR DECADES creating links to unstable folks in this country.

Looks like now they “Have a Friend in ~~Jesus~~Obama”.
#409

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:40 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 11:31 am, JT said:

Who become the producers if they take down conservatives? I’d love to sit back and watch the lefties try run the whole thing.

My view is they can’t get us all. Lock me up for believing the constitution. What happens to my employees? The majority of whom are left or lean left.

Seems the fascists er ah Democrats would be shooting themselves in the foot. No?

Correct.
Read the full piece that MM linked to.
#410

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:42 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 11:32 am, Danceswithdachshunds said:

Trouble connecting here; DOS attack in progress?

I have noticed the same, off and on, yesterday and today.

Everything is fine right now, but something has been odd. I don’t know if it’s a DOS attack or something else.
#411

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:43 pm, zeroangel said:

Oh my.

Alot of comments here, I must have missed something interesting. I am not sure what it is but I probably agree with Chap.

Did anyone mention Hitler yet? That is, other than me right now.
#413

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:43 pm, Living in the PSRK said:

Just for You, UnderRoos:

From JaynaDavis.com: Tracking Timothy McVeigh’s footprints in this harrowing act of state-sponsored terror came with relative ease compared to unscrambling the rubic’s cube enveloping his crafty accomplice, Terry Nichols. During his federal and state trials, jurors looked upon the seemingly devoted family man as an unwilling dupe who became entangled in McVeigh’s web of control. While being pronounced guilty of mass murder, Nichols assumed the role of the betrayed patsy. That characterization enabled him to escape execution – not once, but twice. How did a terrorist collaborator in the slaughter of 171 innocents cheat death? Malice and motive. Both factor into the criminal equation and both were absent from the prosecution’s case.
#414

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:45 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 11:39 am, Tazed and Confused said:

He has the ambitions of his comrade Chavez in Venezuela.

Chavez’s Venezuela: Obama and Ayers
#415

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:45 pm, Living in the PSRK said:

And this UnderThinker:

In 1996, Jayna played an instrumental role in helping McVeigh’s lawyers uncover Nichols’ Philippine liaisons with the world’s most nefarious brokers of terror. Although the evidence remains under court seal, the author has obtained secret filings which include the sworn statement of Edwin Angeles, the co-founder of Abu-Sayyaf, the Southeast Asian spin-off chapter of Al-Qaeda. Angeles insisted that he attended a meeting in the early 1990s on the island of Mindanao in which Terry Nichols discussed bomb making with Osama bin Laden’s chief explosives trainer – Ramzi Yousef, the convicted mastermind of the 1993 truck bombing of the World Trade Center.
#417

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:46 pm, stillontheroad said:

I had Uncles that served in WW1 – and they were Italian Immigrants that loved the day that they became citizens and were able to fight for this country.
I have an Uncle I never knew whose bones are somewhere in Burma.
I had a grandfather that served in the marines in WW2, A grandmother that assembled B17’s, my mother worked at a Tank plant in WW2 and later served in the military.
My Father ran away from his home a 15, served in late WW2 then Korea and Vietnam.
My brother was in the military as well as 2 of my sisters.
My daughter served in Afghanistan Twice.
I was in the military from 71 to 76 – I did my thing, which I do not talk about.
I also remember how we all were treated when we came back to the USA. I left and worked overseas for 20 years of my life on the first line of defense for this country, it was my contribution to something bigger than my self.
I will bet that a lot of Vets have the same family background and this is the largest brotherhood that I know of. Now we and those like us are being regulated to being called extremists? Or we may assist right wing extremists? We all swore an oath to defend the Constitution and we are witnessing the complete disregard and destruction of that document? I am in complete disgust, more so than ever, of the Liberal mindset, their ilk and the associated lap dogs that seem to think they can get away with this.
#418

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:47 pm, zeroangel said:

Ahh yes. #158, #206, and #225.

Godwin’s law is fulfilled. I am going back to work.
#419

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:47 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 11:32 am, twofoot said

Bravo! And thank you!
#421

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:52 pm, Flyoverman said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:46 pm, stillontheroad said:

Now we and those like us are being regulated to being called extremists? Or we may assist right wing extremists? We all swore an oath to defend the Constitution and we are witnessing the complete disregard and destruction of that document? I am in complete disgust, more so than ever, of the Liberal mindset, their ilk and the associated lap dogs that seem to think they can get away with this.

Hoooah. Glad to see you are still serving.
#423

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:58 pm, rlwo2008 said:

She was the worst governor of Arizona in history. In addition, she is also a…….
#424

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:59 pm, Lucifer Jones said:

Funny, I’ve never seen her and Janet Reno in the same room together.

This should not intimidate conservatives. If anything, this should embolden them.
#426

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:00 pm, rightwingrocker said:

While it’s not news that Barack Obama hates conservatives, for us to bend over and take this would be patently foolish.

Is it any surprise that Americans are organizing against this sorry-@$$ excuse for an “administration”?

RWR
ww.rightwingrocker.com
#427

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:01 pm, Dexter Alarius said:

We all swore an oath to defend the Constitution

Hmm. Are there any pictures of politicians taking their oath of office that show what the fingers on their left hands are doing?

Maybe they are swearing to support and defend the Constitution of the You Knighted States. It’s obviously not the same one we swore to defend.
#429

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:02 pm, thetoysurgeon said:

I tried to log on MM this morning and couldn’t. I had just been on to write my opinions on this thread. I had feared that Rahm had stepped in and shut her down… How will we know when it really happens? Who will get the word out that this “extremist” voice has been shut down! It’s my opinion, but they will be coming for you Michelle and probably me as well.
#431

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:04 pm, stillontheroad said:

Flyoverman said:
Hoooah. Glad to see you are still serving.

You bet — I took an oath, like giving your word to someone – you don’t break it. In my world anyway.
#433

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:06 pm, Dexter Alarius said:

I had feared that Rahm had stepped in and shut her down… How will we know when it really happens? Who will get the word out that this “extremist” voice has been shut down!

Rush, Laura, Sean and the rest need to reserve their frequencies now so that I can tune in on my shortwave huddled in the basement when they are forced to transmit from a barge anchored outside the territorial waters!
#434

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:08 pm, happyscrapper said:

I am your typical right-wing extremist and I am dangerous. Watch out for me! I am a white-haired grandmother of 2 (almost 3), 5 Ft. 3″ tall, slightly overweight, but working on it. I go to church most Sundays and sometimes even in the middle of the week! Beware…I might try something seriously unpatriotic, like demonstrate against ILLEGAL immigration, or insist my government actually uphold the Constitution and enforce our laws. If you see me trying to do that, be sure to get those cuffs on me before I can get a shot off. By shot, I mean a swift strategically located kick. You libs can kiss my old saggy a$$.
#436

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:09 pm, Flyoverman said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:04 pm, stillontheroad said:

I took an oath, like giving your word to someone – you don’t break it. In my world anyway.

Roger that. It does not come with an expiration date.
#437

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:10 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 11:53 am, JonB said:

If civil war is the only road back…

It’s not the only road back. In fact, civil war is one of the two paths forward to Communist “Normalization” (the other being invasion from another country…not as likely as civil war).

Believe it or not, the road back is spiritual revival.

Ronald Reagan understood the antidote.
#438

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:13 pm, undresiege said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 2:45 pm, Living in the loonville said:

Yet you fail to dispute that Nichols and McVeigh were rightwing, anti-government extremists under a democratic president. So what if they had ties to Islamic Jihadists.(Assuming these allegations are even true). They hated the U.S. government more. As you conservatives like to defend Reagan’s arming of Muslim Jihadists during the 80s, “The enemy of your enemy is your friend”.

Now I eagerly await your thoughts on The Turner Diaries. Care to distance yourself from Eric Rudolph.
#439

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:16 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 12:04 pm, NJ-Aviator said:

Civil war isn’t really an option. Any such move would be squashed in an instant. The left figured out how to overthrow a government without firing a shot. And they are well on their way to doing just that.

Obama says he loves this country. His actions say otherwise. What he loves is what he wants to make this country into. That would be a place where government controls all freedoms we previously enjoyed and his party’s power is irrevocable.

+1
#440

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:17 pm, rightwingrocker said:

You know, I’m not even halfway through this thing, and I’ve seen in it more paranoia about “the election of the first African-American president” than I can handle.

If Barack Obama’s race were the big issue with his being in office, he would have a lot more support from the Right. These people are clueless.

RWR
http://www.rightwingrocker.com
#442

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:20 pm, ScaryBiscuits said:

What I’m going to say will probably either be ignored in the surrounding ire following the report, or possibly brand me as a troll. Either way, hold tight — I promise there’s Right wing outrage toward the end. =)

First, one has to really understand how these reports come about. What has happened here is that, in some meeting somewhere, someone voiced a concern about the rising protest activity on the “Right” side. And, to be honest, it’s a good concern to raise. This is not to say that we’re all about to support the overthrow of the government or other “violent action,” but there is significant unrest on one side of the aisle. Like it or not, there will be people who take advantage of said unrest — just think of the commenters whose racist or otherwise unacceptable remarks embarass us here. Thus, it’s entirely appropriate that someone should examine the threat. That someone was likely a GS-9 or GS-11 analyst with I&A.

Second, this is an unclassified version of the report. On page 2, it mentions other “disrupted plots,” which may or may not be classified. Depending on the experience level of the author, incorporating information from classified reports while scrubbing them can be incredibly difficult. If you can’t find a way to desensitize the information, then you have to leave it out. This could explain the total lack of evidence in this analysis.

Third, just as with the jihadis, any righty extremist groups out there will target people who are unhappy with their reality, and offer a way to reshape it. It’s the nature of radicalization. And, given the large number of unhappy people — if here, Hot Air, and other hangouts are any example — there are a lot of us out here. There’s the off-chance that someone *will* fall down that rabbit hole.

That being said, however, the policy analyst in me cringes when reading this. First and foremost, the methodology is shoddy, even for an UNCLASS version. Nowhere do they clearly define what a “rightwing group” is, nor do they ever define what they view as “radicalization.” The definition provided is vague and tars a large number of people and groups with a very wide brush. Evidence supporting their assertions is scant at best, bordering on non-existent. For parallels, they could have looked to Lindh, Gadahn, or any number of other *extreme* right wingers — i.e. fascist geeks. While this may not have supported their theory regarding previous military experience, it does provide an example of homegrown radicalization.

Second — and it may be wishful thinking — it seems to me that the analyst is having a hard time backing up his or her assertions: Could — should — might. They never nail anything down. Possibly because they’re hunting a snipe, but the terminology here weakens the entire assessment. To me, this points to a young idealist from either side of the aisle, someone with little real experience in writing an assessment, and someone with little life experience.

Third, I believe — and some folks here can correct me if I’m wrong — that the document is misclassified. As I recall, the document should be classified to the highest level of the paragraphs therein. There are several paragraphs marked (U//LES) — UNCLASSIFIED//LAW ENFORCEMENT SENSITIVE. Thus, the entire document — again, if I recall correctly — should be marked U//LES.

The Conservative in me also cringes, but for different reasons. Looking at the topics they’ve covered, it’s every one of the Conservative hot button issues, the things that we regularly rant and rave about online, as well as write our Congressmen and -women about. Thus, just because we vent, online or off, doesn’t mean we’re going to blow up a federal building in protest. We’re talking about sending *teabags*, FCOL.

And then there’s the comment about “rejecting federal authority in favor of state or local authority.” I think whoever wrote has never read the real definition of “federalism.” Or perhaps they’ve simply never understood the principle of subsidiarity. The whole idea behind our government system is to allow most issues to be resolved at the state and local levels, where the government and administrators better understand the needs of the citizens; it also lessens the burden on the federal government. Then again, when you’re talking about an Administration that wants healthcare for everyone, and is buying up large portions of private businesses, I guess it can be an honest mistake…

The former sailor in me can’t repeat in a “family” forum what I think of all the allusions to military personnel who are suddenly now becoming a threat. Are the nutjobs out there? Sure. But, again, this document uses some heavy tar and a really wide brush. Generalization is always a bad thing.

And then there’s the tin-foil hat side of me that is just wondering when they’re going to start tagging people with treason and sedition for speaking out. This report is just frakking creepy.
#443

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:25 pm, Flyoverman said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:13 pm, undresiege said:

You need to think of the political spectrum not as a line that runs left to right with far left and far right, Communist and Nazi on either end.

Take the line and bend it into a circle so the ends meet at 12:00. That is reality. “Moderates” are at 6:00. The mainstream left and right are at 9:00 and 3:00. Far, far apart.

The closer you get to the extreme “right” or “left,” the more each philosophy starts to resemble the other. 12:00 is midnight and the intersection of tyranny. That’s why Pol Pot and Adolf Hitler thought the same way. That’s why Terry Nicols and Ramzi Yousef thought the same way. Peas in a pod.
#446

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:28 pm, Alec Rawls said:

(U//FOUO) DHS/I&A assesses that lone wolves and small terrorist cells embracing violent rightwing extremist ideology are the most dangerous domestic terrorism threat in the United States.

Really? Greater than those homegrown Somalian jihadists from MN? Greater than the Lackawanna Six? Greater than Jamaat ul-Fuqra (the Islamberg network)?

If the Obama DHS is serious, then the question becomes “dangerous to what?” Not dangerous to America, but maybe dangerous to Obama’s plans for the dhimmification of America.
#447

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:32 pm, zeroangel said:

ScaryBiscuits:

Very well said. I especially chuckled a bit here:

That someone was likely a GS-9 or GS-11 analyst with I&A.

All commenters should read ScaryBiscuits comment closely. I have little doubt that this commenter works in government (or has worked) and knows much about what he/she speaks of.
#448

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:34 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 12:42 pm, NJ-Aviator said:

You should know by now that segments of the left maintains long term plans. Much like Islamists.

Agreed. And they work together.

We all know that no one read the entire “Democatic Socialist Stimulus” bill before they voted on it.

Now consider this: no one wrote the entire “Democatic Socialist Stimulus” bill in the short time they had to write it. The overwhelming majority of it was already writen, waiting for the right “crisis” to enable its passage without careful consideration.

Now consider this: the same is true of the Patriot Act. The overwhelming majority of it was already writen before 9/11.

I believe that there were Democatic Socialists in this country who knew the 9/11 plans in advance.

Try to disprove even a single one of the truths here:
A Different “9/11 Truth”
#450

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:42 pm, rightwingrocker said:

If the Obama DHS is serious, then the question becomes “dangerous to what?” Not dangerous to America, but maybe dangerous to Obama’s plans for the dhimmification of America.

This is the essence of every left-wing idea ever presented.

People who threaten their plans to destroy everything our Founding Fathers fought and died for (along with the countless soldiers since) are “extremists” and a “threat”. Now we’re going to be called “un-American” simply because the threat to our country occupies the White House.

I hate to be coming back to this, but in this moment, I’m VERY glad John McCain did not get elected. His plans to ruin the country would never have had this kind of strong reaction form America-lovers like us. In fact, people on our side would have been easily silenced because the majority of his votes came from our side.

Obama can complain about racism all he wants. I voted for an African-American for president without kowtowing to the libs – and without bowing down to those who said McCain was an appropriate option when even they knew he wasn’t.

The backlash Mr. Obama is experiencing are the direct result of the things he promised during his campaign and the things he has done since January 20th. Americans are putting two and two together, and they’re doing it quickly. In this way, Obama has been one of the best things that has ever happened to this country. In the end, freedom will win. With McCain, the onslaught of fascist socialism would have continued to be slower, and the people might never have noticed.

RWR
http://www.rightwingrocker.com
#451

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:43 pm, Lucifer Jones said:

I saw our First Mother meeting with the DHS today. Isn’t that nice? One more reason to dislike her.
#452

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:45 pm, ScaryBiscuits said:

zeroangel:

Very well said. I especially chuckled a bit here:

I mentioned that because the document seems as though it was pieced together by an analyst who had little experience producing such a document. This was combined with the knowledge that most of the new hires I saw were coming in at the GS-11 level, with or without a decent MA or MS. It was all about who ya knew.

Or I could be wrong. It could merely be a comment on their education.

I guess the Left doesn’t have sole ownership of intellectual snobbery… *grin*
#454

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:52 pm, zeroangel said:

ScaryBiscuits:

In my experience, if one is coming on as a GS-11 there is (usually) a good reason for it. They must have some kind of formal technical training or experience and are in possession of skills that produce concrete results.

However, I also recognize that GS-11 is pretty much “entry-level” for folks with a college degree. GS-9 seems to be a bit less than entry-level. That is why I chuckled.
#455

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:53 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:01 pm, Dexter Alarius said:

Hmm. Are there any pictures of politicians taking their oath of office that show what the fingers on their left hands are doing?

Maybe they are swearing to support and defend the Constitution of the You Knighted States. It’s obviously not the same one we swore to defend.

Maybe they were swearing to defend this Constitution.
#456

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:56 pm, undresiege said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:25 pm, Flyoverman said:

Very good points. But the recruitment methods of the far right extremists prey on rightwingers that feel left behind and hopeless. They teach them that there are “others” to blame for all of their problems. They teach that extremism is the only answer.
You don’t have a job? It’s because of affirmative action and immigrants.

You’re a pro-life christian? The only answer is to bomb abortion clinics. Kill the doctors, nurses, and judges that oppose your movement.

You’re a proud gun owner. Democrats will take away your guns. Period.

The closer you get to the extreme “right” or “left,” the more each philosophy starts to resemble the other.

Excellant point. The DHS is worried about the extreme right based on the 1990s and a struggling economy. The fears about your guns being taken away, and being denied the right to free speech, and Obama positioning himself for a dictatorship are grossly misplaced. We are talking about extremism here. History teaches us that these fears are justified.

Remember the Bush II years when the ultra-leftists were reliving the 60s-70s with their protest, rhetoric, and general Code Pinknesh. Well the ultra-rightists have the guns, and a belief that “god” is on their side. Bush II went 8 years without a domestic, homegrown attempt on his life. I doubt Obama is so lucky, but I’d like to be pleasantly surprised.

I’m not concerned or fearful about the rational, mainstream conservatives you type about. I think the DHS feels the same way. The fear is the angry, christian, pro-life, anti-government, irrational, violent, bigotted, EXTREMIST of the 90s times 10. The ones that are anxious for a bloodbath, evil, hopelessly irrational. The ones that hate minorities and non-christians. The ones that are ready and anxious to kill. If that ain’t you, you represent the overwhelming majority of rightwingers that have nothing to worry about. For the others, the rare ones that want death and destruction, some who frequent this blog. The DHS is watching, and I hope you they get you in time this time.
#458

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:05 pm, rooster said:

chap says,
Not what I said at all, but not a surprise you would get it wrong. All I said was there was left wing radicalism and right wing extremism. Feel free to flip them right around if you wish there, fella. Not sure why you would think one descriptor is better than the other.

The descriptor is in the tone of the words being used Mr. chap. As someone who claims a law background, you tell me which one sounds nastier, extremist, or radical. BTW, you’re the one that characterized conservatives as extremists, not me, or MM.
Your cute, flippant sarcasm doesn’t go as far as it does on your home page, the huffington post. You would not be missed chap, if you were to just leave!
#459

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:06 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:17 pm, rightwingrocker said:

You know, I’m not even halfway through this thing, and I’ve seen in it more paranoia about “the election of the first African-American president” than I can handle.

If Barack Obama’s race were the big issue with his being in office, he would have a lot more support from the Right. These people are clueless.

Fake charges of racism are all part of the Socialists’ plan.

Obama Nation:
Using Racism In Order To Form A More Socialist Union
#460

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:09 pm, ScaryBiscuits said:

zeroangel:

They must have some kind of formal technical training or experience and are in possession of skills that produce concrete results.

That’s the theory, at any rate. But what I’ve discovered is that what looks good on paper, may or may not produce results in actuality. In a lot of cases, DHS was employing this “paper tiger.” Don’t get me wrong — they do have some really sharp people at DHS, but they’re definitely outnumbered. Far too often, the good candidates get snatched up elsewhere, while DHS sorts through the paperwork and internal politics.

I’ll temper this by saying that was my observation a few years ago, when DHS was rated by OPM as one of the worst agencies to work for. I’d like to think things have improved since then.
#461

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:12 pm, rooster said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:56 pm, undresiege said: #334
You are pathetic! Everything that you wrote in that crap you posted comes straight out of the liberl playbook. The only things that need changing, are dates, and places, everything else that you rant about fits the left, and a very minute minority of some on the right.
Who is the party that birthed the KKK again siege? Talk about violent….get clue.
#462

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:14 pm, flenser said:

That being said, however, the policy analyst in me cringes when reading this.

SB, the citizen in me cringes at the thought that you are employed as a “policy analyst”.
#463

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:16 pm, Speakup said:

“A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people.” —John F. Kennedy

“There are those in America today who have come to depend absolutely on government for their security. And when government fails they seek to rectify that failure in the form of granting government more power. So, as government has failed to control crime and violence with the means given it by the Constitution, they seek to give it more power at the expense of the Constitution. But in doing so, in their willingness to give up their arms in the name of safety, they are really giving up their protection from what has always been the chief source of despotism—government. Lord Acton said power corrupts. Surely then, if this is true, the more power we give the government the more corrupt it will become. And if we give it the power to confiscate our arms we also give up the ultimate means to combat that corrupt power. In doing so we can only assure that we will eventually be totally subject to it.” —Ronald Reagan
#464

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:18 pm, zeroangel said:

ScaryBiscuits:

But what I’ve discovered is that what looks good on paper, may or may not produce results in actuality.

No doubt, I am not trying to take on the daunting task of defending all the GS-9’s and 11’s of the world *wink*.

I have never worked for DHS, but OPM’s word is good enough for me.

All I was saying is that, in my experience, GS-11’s (and 9’s) tend to be educated (or experienced) folks, but are often entry-level (for their education/training level). You get a whole gambit of quality as a result, that is why I chuckled.
#465

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:18 pm, chapoutier said:

As someone who claims a law background, you tell me which one sounds nastier, extremist, or radical.

As someone who has a law background, I will tell you they are pretty much synonyms, and were certainly meant as such. So shut up.

BTW, you’re the one that characterized conservatives as extremists, not me, or MM.

Your ignorance of logic defies logic. To say that there is right wing extremism (or radicalism, take your freaking pick) is not to say that all right wingers are radicals/extremists. This is very basic. I would not admit to not being able to follow this, I I were you.
#466

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:19 pm, flenser said:

Yet you fail to dispute that Nichols and McVeigh were rightwing, anti-government extremists

It’s touching that left-wingers are suddenly pretending to be concerned about anti-government violence. You were all notably silent on this topic back when Ayers was being talked about.
#467

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:20 pm, right_on said:

You know, I’m not a conspiracy nut, but my “Spidey senses” went on full alert prior to the inauguration, because there were already rumblings of this sort of thing in the works. This goes way beyond Obama.

It seems the opposite of what is said is the actual truth when coming from the mouths of these neo-progressives in our government. For example; Full Transparency; Most Ethical; Bi-partisan; Your taxes won’t be raised, etc.

Does anyone else see a “rationalization for action” scenario being set up? The way this Assessment is written, reminds me of the way the Koran was written to control and legitimize action against the “unbelievers.” Don’t be surprised to find out in the months to come, that this administration has people monitoring conservative blogs, and gathering information about participants…to what purpose? I don’t want to contemplate that, but the mere thought of it is unsettling.
#468

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:20 pm, ScaryBiscuits said:

You get a whole gambit of quality as a result, that is why I chuckled.

Amen!
#469

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:22 pm, flenser said:

To say that there is right wing extremism (or radicalism, take your freaking pick) is not to say that all right wingers are radicals/extremists. This is very basic. I would not admit to not being able to follow this, I I were you.

The writer of this report was unable to follow it. Maybe you should tell him to shut up.
#470

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:22 pm, sharrukin said:

Flyoverman said:

You need to think of the political spectrum not as a line that runs left to right with far left and far right, Communist and Nazi on either end.

The National Socialist German Workers Party (NSDAP) AKA Nazi’s were socialists. Left-wing socialists who believed in an all powerful state and government control (not ownership) of industry. They were by no rational measure right-wing.

“There is more that binds us to Bolshevism than separates us from it. There is, above all, genuine, revolutionary feeling, which is alive everywhere in Russia except where there are Jewish Marxists. I have always made allowance for this circumstance, and given orders that former Communists are to be admitted to the party at once. The petit bourgeois Social-Democrat and the trade-union boss will never make a National Socialist, but the Communists always will.” Adolf Hitler
#472

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:24 pm, Speakup said:

“All writers on the science of policy are agreed, and they agree with experience, that all governments must frequently infringe the rules of justice to support themselves; that truth must give way to dissimulation, honesty to convenience, and humanity itself to the reigning of interest. The whole of this mystery of iniquity is called the reason of state.”
– Edmund Burke – (British statesman – 1756)
#473

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:24 pm, chapoutier said:

The writer of this report was unable to follow it. Maybe you should tell him to shut up.

Either unable to follow or unable to articulate properly. Either way, I would have no problem seeing this report “shut up” or its equivalent (so long as rooster did the same).
#474

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:25 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

Take the time to watch and educate yourself…

Videos of Tomas Schuman (Soviet defector Yuri Bezmenov)

The man understands the methods of the communists, and what he described in 1983 is being played out on an almost daily basis in 2009.
#475

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:25 pm, flenser said:

Don’t be surprised to find out in the months to come, that this administration has people monitoring conservative blogs, and gathering information about participants

I work on the assumption that that’s happening already.
#476

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:25 pm, ajmontana said:

I’m late to this party, has anyone mentioned the anti prop 8 mob? are they on the list? You know those angry gays will stomp on your flower beds or something in a blinding tizzy of anti gov at the fed or local level?
#477

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:27 pm, tiredofit08 said:

In my experience, if one is coming on as a GS-11 there is (usually) a good reason for it. They must have some kind of formal technical training or experience and are in possession of skills that produce concrete results.

However, I also recognize that GS-11 is pretty much “entry-level” for folks with a college degree. GS-9 seems to be a bit less than entry-level. That is why I chuckled.

there are some intern programs that require a 4-yr degree that start at a GS-7 and then progress to a GS-12 within 3 years. I know I was in one…I bought back my military time and then retired at a GS-12 step 10 after 8 years due to medical problems…and don’t ask how I got the step 10 for 8 years…lol
#478

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:28 pm, flenser said:

Either unable to follow or unable to articulate properly

Still posing as the clever one? I think everybody here has your number by now.
#479

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:28 pm, John Deaux said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:56 pm, undresiege said:

Contrast that with the lefties who believe that animal rights, environmentalism, socialism, etc. is some noble purpose that they must force on the rest of us because we’re too stupid or uncaring to solve things ourselves. The fact is that the world is as Flyoverman says, the closer to 12, the scarier they are, regardless of which side.

However, the left has already shown us that they like to paint with a broad brush. Remember the assault weapons ban? That didn’t stop Oklahoma City or the WTC, did it? The point is that it was never intended to.

For the record, the worst thing that could happen is an assassination. He’d be held up as a person who would have done great things. I’d rather see him live to see his socialist agenda fail.

As far as misplaced fears about taking guns away and free speech, all Obama would have to do is publicly state that he will never sign a bill limiting gun ownership any more than it presently is and would do the same with any fairness doctrine, and fears would be allayed. Especially since the public statements of some of his appointees are seen as testing the waters.

BTW, it’s nice to see that you are trying to not be so insulting and confrontational.
#480

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:28 pm, nail49 said:

Off topic, but very worthy project you might consider. Note the small flag in the hand at the top of the home page.

http://www.pocketflagproject.com/

I am sponsoring one set (300 flags) through our church and since our pastor is traveling to Iraq in July, we hope he can deliver them in person to a combat unit deployed there.

Good project for Boy Scout Troops, etc.

“We now return control of your televison set to you…”
#483

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:31 pm, zeroangel said:

tiredofit08:

Indeed, you are correct. I know one or two people that did the same thing.
#484

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:33 pm, zeroangel said:

John:

For the record, the worst thing that could happen is an assassination. He’d be held up as a person who would have done great things.

Of course, any possible “matyr” status is not the only reason at all why an assasination would be bad. Afterall, just the fact that an American President met a violent end is a bad thing in and of itself.
#485

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:38 pm, John Deaux said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:33 pm, zeroangel said:

I really don’t think there’s space here to enumerate all of the reasons a presidential assassination would be bad. I was referring to the worst possible reason from an ideological standpoint. We need for the people to reject socialism because they see first hand that it’s bad. That way, it will be a long, long time before it’s tried again.
#488

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:42 pm, Dexter Alarius said:

Nail, sorry I couldn’t make it to Rock Bottom. Too many things going on. Maybe next time
#489

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:42 pm, Flyoverman said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 3:56 pm, undresiege said:

The recruiting methods you describe are effective on both extremes. They have always have been effective throughout history.

My objection to the DHS document is not political. My objection is it is too obtuse to be of any value and provides WAY to much lattitude for interpretation. Thus, it has no use to the boots on the ground non-political, professionals trying to keep the country safe.

It’s a lot like the intell before 9/11. The kernels of truth were buried in a pile of clutter. I blame no one for not seeing it. This DHS document is similar. As a threat assessment of what might be hiding out there on the extreme right it’s worthless, because their definition of the extreme right is so vague and so broad you cannot figure out where to even look.

If this DHS document came the U.S. Border Patrol it would read. “The most likely crossing points for illegal immigrants entering the U.S. from the South are located between the Southwest corner of California and the Southeast corner of New Mexico.” Well that narrows things down.
#490

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:44 pm, chapoutier said:

Spot on Flyover.
#491

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:49 pm, AntonK said:

If you don’t think that Charles Johnson of Little Green Footballs has totally jumped the shark and headed far-Left, then check out his take on the DHS “right-wing extremist” report, then compare that to Michelle Malkin’s and the author/attorneys at Powerline. According to Charles, they’re right-wing extremists.

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/33364_About_That_DHS_Report_on_Right-Wing_Extremism

http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2009/04/023329.php
#493

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:55 pm, Flyoverman said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:44 pm, chapoutier said:
Spot on Flyover.

Sometimes the most logical reason as for a document’s contents is the people who wrote it were simply lazy.

Since you are a law professional you have no doubt seen this in your discipline. Too often in the intell world everything gets piled into a bucket, rearranged, and regurgitated with little of no analysis.

That’s the impression I got reading portions of the DHS document.
#495

On April 14th, 2009 at 5:07 pm, undresiege said:

BTW, it’s nice to see that you are trying to not be so insulting and confrontational.

Flyoverman has been respectful to me so I return the favor. For others, I typically hold a grudge, and will insult those those that insult me. For others, they’re boring, so who cares.

As far as misplaced fears about taking guns away and free speech, all Obama would have to do is publicly state that he will never sign a bill limiting gun ownership any more than it presently is and would do the same with any fairness doctrine, and fears would be allayed. Especially since the public statements of some of his appointees are seen as testing the waters.

I’m fairly certain that Obama has stated he’s against the Fairness Doctrine. Regarding guns, he was in favor of Heller, and they’re really isn’t anything relevant to pontificate about right now.

I understand MM and others are in the business of fear mongering to generate traffic and revenue. I just think people should relax and live their lives until an issue arises to fight.(like Shamnesty was the time to fight) This chicken little crap is silly and dangerous in my eyes. The problem are the extremists. People like MM and Englishqueen like to expand the meaning of extremism to rev up the fear mongering and victimhood. I’m so glad that no matter who is in office, I’ve never acted, or lived like my livlihood or belief system was going to be squashed. It’s a pathetic existence, and for what? Life’s too short.
This will be blockquoted and somebody will make the phony equivalency between Obama, Stalin, and Hitler.

Contrast that with the lefties who believe that animal rights, environmentalism, socialism, etc. is some noble purpose that they must force on the rest of us because we’re too stupid or uncaring to solve things ourselves.

You won’t see me defending those people, but I don’t think we’ve seen a rise in eco-terrorism in the past six months. Violent terrorist on either end of the poltical spectrum should be stopped.

It’s just too bad partisan anger obscures perceptions of reality.

Most people are smarted than me and everyone else on this blog, because they don’t get sucked into crap like this thread. They’re happier people, and get a lot more accomplished. I like to see where people’s heads are at, and couldn’t resist the urge to join in this time. Oh well. MM knows better, but she’s in the business of show business. I just don’t want to see another Rudolph, McVeigh, or Nichols, and I’ve just seen this movie before.
#497

On April 14th, 2009 at 5:13 pm, rooster said:

On April 14th, 2009 at 4:24 pm, chapoutier said:
The writer of this report was unable to follow it. Maybe you should tell him to shut up.
Either unable to follow or unable to articulate properly. Either way, I would have no problem seeing this report “shut up” or its equivalent (so long as rooster did the same).

chap,
I don’t see Pelousy, or Barney Crank shutting up, so I guess I will challenge idioten wie du wenn du dein schnautze auf machen!
#498

On April 14th, 2009 at 5:14 pm, undresiege said:

My objection to the DHS document is not political. My objection is it is too obtuse to be of any value and provides WAY to much lattitude for interpretation. Thus, it has no use to the boots on the ground non-political, professionals trying to keep the country safe.

It’s a lot like the intell before 9/11. The kernels of truth were buried in a pile of clutter. I blame no one for not seeing it. This DHS document is similar. As a threat assessment of what might be hiding out there on the extreme right it’s worthless, because their definition of the extreme right is so vague and so broad you cannot figure out where to even look.

Good points. I just don’t think 95-99% of the population has anything to worry about. I agree with the problems with how it’s written. I’ll leave now before things get repetitive, but have a great week.
#499

On April 14th, 2009 at 5:18 pm, Poway said:

Rogue Cheddar:

Are you in oregon?

Poway