On May 19th, 2009 at 7:52 pm, happy2behere said: Further, I dont see how anyone can claim they know what “most buyers” will or will not buy unless they are one themselves or have data to back that claim up. I knew buyers that would not buy off a straight cost per point or cost per thousand but who would negotiate room in their media budget for decisions based upon psycographic data about minorities, if they thought was good for the client/product.

If you read my prior post I was a National/Local Broadcast Buyer and AE at Networks for most of my career IN NYC so yes I can say I know what most buyers buy!!!! I am a consultant now

Anyway, I think the Aribtron Radio Dairy sample sizes are too small as well, is that your point? Then your concern would be the same as the FCC committee that is questioning several areas of the PPM methodology, like the sample sizes of minorities.

People here are assuming motives of the committe and they are probably right, but nobody here has pointed to anything specific, disclaimer included, about the methodology questions raised by the committee.

Further, I dont see how anyone can claim they know what “most buyers” will or will not buy unless they are one themselves or have data to back that claim up. I knew buyers that would not buy off a straight cost per point or cost per thousand but who would negotiate room in their media budget for decisions based upon psycographic data about minorities, if they thought was good for the client/product.

On May 19th, 2009 at 1:29 pm, happy2behere said:
Yes I did love, and I also worked in the radio industry for a long time, although its been quite ahwile since I did.

That the PPMs should eliminate that kind of alledged cheating is probably true, but my point was that the committe is simply calling for clarity in the methodoligy. And they had some vaild points, not that the Arbitron diaries didn’t have problems too.

They will never get complete clarity because the industry is based on a sample of the complete universe of TL’s broken out by DMA’s and what is bought National/Spot/National Spot.

Also, many minorites aren’t bought by big advetisers no matter what the numbers are because their population size isn’t large enough Asian radio/TV is a perfect example. It’s not a profitable buy for advertisers and the CPP/CPM/IMP/Rtgs are to expensive and not large enough.

As I said in another post this is a new service and will get better as it evolves just like the new Live/C3/C7 minute by minute rtg for TV.

During my 17 year career the actuals are always skewed or inaccurate and advertisers have always complained about the Church of Nielsen and Arbitron.

On May 19th, 2009 at 3:44 pm, Ragspierre said:
Danceswithdachshunds said:
COOOOORRRRR—ect.

Every Arbitron rated station, I think, has to subscribe to the service.

Not dead sure, but I know that somebody pays them for their service.

Whoever it is, they don’t pay for politically correct pap. They pay for good data.

Yes, the service as well as Nielsen is paid for and it is VERY expensive! Most buyers won’t buy a stations/networks that doesn’t have some form of rtg estimation.

PPM ratings are based on audience estimates and are the opinion of Arbitron and should not be relied on for precise accuracy or precise representativeness of a demographic or radio market.

Arbitron’s disclaimer from their site.

Danceswithdachshunds said:

COOOOORRRRR—ect.

Every Arbitron rated station, I think, has to subscribe to the service.

Not dead sure, but I know that somebody pays them for their service.

Whoever it is, they don’t pay for politically correct pap. They pay for good data.

WHY is the FCC involved AT ALL??? If there is some sort of fraud going on in regard to advertising then HOW is that the territory of the FCC? It is not, it the AG’s territory. These radio stations are BUSINESSES and just because they happen to be in the business of broadcasting does NOT give the FCC any sway over how these businesses conduct themselves OUTSIDE of the act of and technical constraints of broadcasting itself.

If they don’t pay their taxes, does the FCC come after them or the IRS? If they don’t pay their water bill does the the FCC shut it off or does the DPW?

Liberal incrementalism is what is going on here; an FCC over-stepping its bounds to effect a POLITICAL agenda. (Similar to the EPA political agenda in calling CO2 a pollutant to abate nonexistent global warming…)

If there is racial discrimination going on in say a liquor store, you don’t call the liquor control board – you call the DA. Why should commercial radio stations be treated differently?