Another Democrat takes refuge at a union headquarters
Democrat Tim Bishop found sanctuary from New York town hall protesters at his local SEIU office. (Update from GOE here.)
Democrat Alan Grayson of Florida followed suit — he’s holding his town hall at the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers Local 606 Union Hall at 820 Virginia Drive.
Union members will man the microphones.
Intimidation tactics? What intimidation tactics?
***
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Categories: Health care,SEIU
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Yeah, so much for pretending that the unions are not a branch of the Democrat Party.
Shocking!
The more that this behavior spreads, the clearer it is that the far-left has given up trying to convince the rest of us (moderates included) that this is a good program. They are now just talking amongst themselves. Keep shooting yourselves in the foot, boys!
Fine , don’t cover them. Let them put on their charade to no audience.
Corrected to maintain sexual ambiguity.
They live for the sound of one hand clapping.
The new Democrat Transparencey Strategy; “Hunker in the Bunker.”
Go there anyway armed with you cell phone cameras and recorders. Look them in the eye and ask them questions directly from the bill.
No need to give a speech or an opinion; their answers to questions directly from the bill will be enough to expose and doom them. It is their House bill, written by their side, endorsed by their leaders; let them defend it.
Jimmy Hoffa: Never let a stranger in your cab, in your house or in your heart… unless he is a friend of labor.
The W’s in Virginia aren’t even hunkering down in a union headquarters. They’re just not having any townhall meetings to discuss the health care bill.
Not, “bok, bok, bok…”, rather, “fok, fok, fok,” when he realized he was going to have his feet held to the fire.
Typical bully tactics, no? Talk big, as long as you have ignorant muscle to back you up. Friggin’ punks…yeah, I have no use for them…either!
Once the supporters of these manipulators realize they’ve been hoodwinked, (typical of radical leftists,) they will treat these shockcollars like armed battlefield combatants, and take no prisoners!
That day is coming sooner than many believe, and it will not be easily contained.
I once belonged to the IBEW. It had it’s good points. But, the union representative was a big democrat. He would protect slackers as much, or more than, the good workers. He held the union meetings in a bar and, being a Christian, I would not go to those places.
I think unions still have some good points, but they need a big shake-up.
Come on foks this can’t be a surprise to anyone. We all KNOW that the democrat party is owned by the trial lawyers and unions.
Congressman Ike Skelton, MO 4th district, where are you? You have time to meet with bankers in Blue Springs, MO on August 14th. You were on the channel 4 evening news broadcast in your meeting. On August 12th a rally was held in Jefferson City asking for a town hall.
Now we know who you represent Congressman Skelton.
aj…
Gotta disagree there … not only cover the “union town halls” … blast the fact all over every information forum you can so that the MSM followers will see they are not important to this administration and the leftist in particular …
Make sure everyone knows that their real message is:
If you don’t belong to a union you don’t have a right to a voice …
NC 4th Dist Congressman David Price reluctantly held his health care “town hall” last week. It was sponsored and managed by SEIU.
This kind of behavior is consistent with Michelle’s other post today about why it’s way too early to claim that they’re backing down on the “public option.”
It’s the Politics of Bad Faith, to borrow from a book title by David Horowitz: Most donk Congressmen and Senators fully intend to screw us upon returning in September to their sanctuary in Washington D.C. Hiding out in assorted “safe houses” until then is a dead give-away of this intention.
There’s no negotiating with these snakes. They simply have to be defeated.
I was in the IAMAW for 3 years, and the UPW for 3. I hated it. So left wing. They would protect slackers and druggies like the crown jewels. They would give money to Democrat politicians and endorse any political whore that was doting on labor.
The labor unions are to the Democrat party what the IRA is to Sinn Fein.
oh that must have been a love-fest of libtards…were they there to pick out new uniforms for their thugs or just make plans for their next beat down?
I don’t know, tired, but if you have local knowledge you might be interested that it was held in Durham on the campus of NC Central. You can imagine how that attracted a broad swath of the community. (sarcasm)
Well put … or, is it the other way ’round? Makes one wonder who are the real “political terrorists” and who are the enablers — until the realization dawns that they’re really just flip sides of the same coin.
And Bok Bok Bok back to MM.
Have the courage to discuss the issues of health care reform.
Have the decency to admit that insurance companies already limit (ration) health care.
Have the grace to admit that medicare is such a popular program that Republican politicians rush to its defense at any opportunity, the same medicare that is a government run single payer system with guidelines that come between the patient and the doctor.
Prove yourself independent by coming our forcefully against lies from the Republican side — there are no death boards, the present proposals are not “single payer”, health care in Britain, Canada, France, Denmark, etc. is as good as ours at about half the cost.
What stupidity,only a small percentage of workers are unionized,and as these dipsticks will soon realize many of them are Republican,or Consevative Dems.
When the counting is done,these hideaway politicians are going to find themselves holding the short end of a very short stick.
Will lgm please report to HuffPo ASAP?
Oh wow. As my relatives in Canada would say, “You’re full of crap.”
Courage… decency… grace… independence… you are calling on our hostess to be herself. Yeah, that outta show her!
How odd it is that one who regularly demonstrates none of the above qualities calls upon others to do what he says and not as he does?
To encourage others toward honest self-reflection requires asking them to step outside their “comfort zone,” not to confirm it. Like saying to a certain leftist commenter here, “Why don’t you try using logic, evidence and reasoned discourse in your posts?”
Again fantasizing the ensuing hilarity if protesters were to set up a picket line outside the union hall…
My cowardly rep always hides in the liberal neighborhoods when it comes to left issues and then is out in the open in conservative neighborhoods when she needs to be pro-America. Guess which neighborhood she used as the backdrop for health care reform.
I see now France and Canada have just as good health care as we have, I remember a few weeks ago when thiers were being touted by lefties as far superior. Enlighten me LGM, which one is it, are they better or just as good quality or what? I can’t keep up with liberal talking points, they change far too often.
I don’t know if it is deliberate but I am seeing something that I like very much in the last few comments.
Folks who feel compelled to address a post from a chronic disruptor are doing so without including that poster’s name anywhere in their own post.
Excellent. Sometimes it is hard not to reply. But avoiding the name of the troll seriously diminishes his attention-seeking pleasure.
Word is that Nick Joe Rahall had a town hall scheduled in Princeton, WV and so many people (Protesting) showed up that he had to move it out doors, or so my wife said during my lunch break.
if dems believed this crap was good for the country, they would welcome meeting with the people and explaining EXACTLY how this bill would help americans. they know this is nothing more than a socialist power grab to maintain lib power forever. when obama claims fed-ex and ups succeed where the post office fails, ignores that the private companies move packages from door to door. the mail moves letters from door to door. if the post office wants to stop losing money, charge mass mailers going postage rates instead of favored rates which are a fraction of what i pay for an envelope containing a bill and a check. i get lands end and eddie bauer along with about a thousand other catalogues 1 a month. i get mass mailers for grocery coupons once a week. it’s like every idiots great idea, let’s screw the good customer and subsidize the garbage. in st louis, every homeowner pays a ton each year in taxes to operate our zoo and museums so people visiting these places won’t have to pay for them. how magnanimous of our politicians. we built a metrolink that goes from the airport to the downtown sites and out to the central visitors sites. and then these people wonder why the citizens who pay for this tourist mover don’t support the metrolink.
RyanInSanJose said (#23):
I doubt you have relatives in Canada. I have friends who have lived in Canada and the US and say the Canadian system is better. Canada has no “pre-existing condition” crap, so people can change jobs without putting their lives in danger.
Regulus said (#24):
Stop going all meta on us and just say something about health care. Is Medicare government run? Does it have limits on care? Do people on medicare want to return to the days when most old people lacked health insurance? Do people on medicare want to go off their “single payer” plan?
frontierguysaid (#26):
European countries spend about half as much on health care as we do. We spend about 15% of GDP and they (depending on the country) spend between 7% and 8%.
As they seem to say in Canada, who gives a crap whether their care is better, or only just as good? They are getting at least twice the value for money we get.
Decide which is a more important issue, then comment on it:
A. Our system wastes 7% of our GDP
B. Some liberal lied when he said theirs is better than ours, when he really meant it is only just as good.
We could both have what we want if you would just move there.
Stop being selfish and greedy.
I’m getting sick of these people who think Canada care is better than US health care. I survived Canada care… barely. Compare and contrast these two experiences.
Incident 1 in the US, I crashed while mountain biking. I was admitted into the emergency room within minutes of arriving, I was immediately taken for x-rays, multiple doctors came by to check my various injuries, I was put in a neck brace, a nurse or doctor checked on me every few minutes. The final outcome was a broken collar bone and 3 broken ribs. I was prescribed pain killers and the doctor explained how to treat my injuries. A follow-up appointment was scheduled with a specialist to make sure I was healing properly.
Incident 2 in Canada – I was hit by a car while bike riding. I waited at least 30 minutes in the waiting room at the emergency room. No x-rays were taken even though there was intense pain in my leg and I had landed on my head. A nurse cleaned my wounds after about 2 1/2 hours and sewed up the cut on my leg. After about 4 hours, a doctor came in and shined a light in my eyes. I was then told I could go home, but the doctor told me I should have someone wake me up every couple of hours to make sure I was ok.
I’ll take the current US health care over Canada any day.
behiker, I’m sure your personal experience CANNOT be taken seriously. Please stop lying about the negatives of Canada care. I’m sure lgm has much more knowledge because his “friends” told him so. And he says it’s wonderful, better than the US/sarc off
Bok bok bok
chicken
got nothin’ under the hood
I dare MM to make a post honestly comparing health care in the US to other countries. Not just “We have the best system” or 3-rd hand quotes from someone’s uncle in Glasgow. Quote facts & figures. If you had `em, you would show `em.
Do any of you wingnuts who think you’re so superior know half as much about health care as Ezra Klein? All you know is “socialized medicine” (which is not what the reform bill is). You’re stuck with the slogans because they are all you have. And you cling to them like guns and religion.
You’re so glib.
TigerLady…when nobody is mentioning the name of a certain disruptor even when they answer its points, it gets mighty cranky, doesn’t it? ~grin~
All are union stooges and cowards and the voters should cancel their places at the public feeding trough.
Ignatius, It reminds me of my cranky cat. He thinks he’s smarter than I am, too.
On August 17th, 2009 at 12:59 pm, lgm said:
Have the good sense to stick to the topic at hand.
If you want to comment on health care reform or HR 3200, I’m sure you can find column addressing those issues, probably even by our very patient hostess.
My Rep. (Jane Harman – D, California) is AWOL over the break. No Town Hall or any meeting with constituents scheduled or announced. Perhaps hiding under her desk in an undisclosed location…
Um, all-righty then!…Buh-bye now! Don’t let the door hit you on the way out, Herr Dimwit!
Please…go! It’s everything you care about, and something devoutly to be wished!
You hate America, and everything that is America (except perhaps for the right to whine and complain.) You believe in the socialist model of…well, everything, so go!
You are so brilliant, I can’t believe you didn’t figure it out a long time ago, lgm! Canada is your utopia…go, please! Be happy! Go!
Oh, I forgot…you’re Jewish, and everyone knows Jews can’t be happy unless their pain is greater than anyone else’s (or so they say.)
And, oops…I forgot for a second, that there is a very large Islamic population in Canada now, so they may not be as welcoming to you, as you would be of them. Too bad!
Do immigrants collect more money on welfare, and unemployment insurance up there? Ahh…who cares? Just go for it…it’s UTOPIA!
I’m sure everyone here wants you to be happy, and clearly you are not. I thought all that (unhappiness and disappointment) would have changed once the political party you will die for got in to power. Clearly I was wrong, and I’m not afraid to admit it.
So now lgm cares about costs, after defending all the big lib spending.
That’s a new one. I like it.
As for Medicare: Yes, I think that most people on Medicare would LOVE to be off the dam*ed system. It costs a huge chunk of money and winds up paying for nothing. And I do mean nothing. The only way to get the bills paid is to buy a medicare supplement insurance policy. Medicare applies EVERYTHING to your “deductible” and leaves you either having to pay for all of your expenses out-of-pocket or relying on supplement insurance. And yes, I’m talking about Medicare A and Medicare B combined here.
If you didn’t have to buy the dam*ed Medicare “insurance” (and yes, you do buy it – it comes straight out of your Social Security check), you could go out and buy a good policy on your own with that money and what you spend on your supplement policy.
And lgm, don’t you dare tell me that I’m wrong. I’ve got two parents on Medicare right now that would kill to be able to opt out of the system.
As for health care and insurance the way it currently is, I have said it before and I will say it again – LEAVE ME ALONE. I have insurance and I love it. It is affordable and I get great coverage with small co-pays. Over the last couple of years, I have had 3 hospital stays – 1 to bring me back from the brink of death from congestive heart failure, 1 to have triple heart bypass surgery, and most recently for complete dehydration associated with food poisoning which almost ruined my kidneys. In all cases, I got immediate care, and my total out-of-pocket expenses for each hospital stay was $300.
Nobody reviewed my case and decided that I couldn’t or shouldn’t get the care I got. I was provided the care, the hospitals and docs billed the insurance company, and the insurance company paid. End of story.
Again, lgm, don’t even try to tell me that I don’t know what I’m talking about. I do. And I don’t know anybody who has health insurance that suffers from that company “dictating” what care they will get.
Yes, not everybody has insurance. But I also note that the left – at the start of this debate – was claiming “27 million” Americans without health insurance. Somehow, in the span of just a few months, that number is now “50 million”.
Who’s doing the book-cooking here?
Fluffy and JT…
It is only my suggestion for your consideration, but I believe that when we cannot resist answering comments of a troll, we ought not to include the troll’s name in our posts. I think ego and attention-seeking is a major motive behind people who habitually come into forums and make a big show out of disagreeing with everyone. I think they get less satisfaction from it if they do not see others answering them by name. Just my idea…
Amazing, isn’t it? Many threads on health care reform yet he still attempts to topic change this one.
It’s particularly funny how he rails about anecdotal evidence when he’s not only guilty of it in the same thread, but calls another a liar for the same type of story.
The hypocrisy inherent in just this one statement is hilarious. He believes this so fervently he doesn’t see the irony of his own words.
Salt said:
Problem with the lgm crowd is they still believe in the “with booze you loose but with dope there is hope.” There is no reasoning with a brain dead turnip.
Well, truth be told I don’t follow what he has to say too closely. I prefer to get my facts from well known medical experts like Michael Moore.
How can you tell when a liberal is l0sing an argument? He starts calling other people names.
The reform bill is indeed socialized medicine.
I could take Ezra Klein on, no problem. His degree is in PoliSci, not medicine.
Reform belongs on the state level, and I want to live in a state that develops a reform that looks like Singapore’s system.
Is that international enough for you?
You are such a mindless idiot LGM, but I’ll respond to your drivel.
Which parties politicians are hiding from their voters all over the country?
Which parties hacks are having to hide at union halls so they don’t have to discuss the facts that are in the bill?
Yeah, real courage hiding behind union thugs from grandma and grandpa.
So your penile implant was not covered. Why should the rest of the policy holders have to pay for that?
So you favor a plan where government “comes between the patient and the doctor”?
You favor a plan which has $60 billion in fraud alone?
You favor a plan in which some health care treatments are not allowed?
You favor a plan in which politicians from both parties agree will be bankrupt without huge tax increases?
RAH RAH RAH!
Have the grace to admit each of what you posted above is a flat-out lie.
Have the grace to admit there are huge waiting lists for simple treatment in each of the countries you listed.
Have the grace to volunteer at your local VA hospital for a month so you have a good perspective to speak on this issue.
Without that perspective, you are just another mindless idiot blindly following whatever your masters tell you.
Each of these countries can spend whatever they want on their socialist programs because they only have to provide minimally for their own defense.
The US quite often picks up the tab for their defense, and since we do so, they have the ability to pi$$ away whatever they want on the latest socialist fad, often while giving us the finger.
lgm said earlier:
Hey, I know you want to take on Malkin, but that would seem to be a losing proposition, you know, because, she like, owns the room.
But, I’ll take the bait. What the hell.
Yes, they do. I agree.
Healthcare is not some unlimited resource sans a price tag. There is only so much to go around whether it is privately paid for or whether we tax people and pay for it through the government.
What’s the point of the rationing argument again? I’m not sure I understand it from either side, really. The fact that government provides it won’t prevent it. We hear all the time about denied coverage from private sector and we hear progressives always calling that rationing. (I tend to agree with jsmiddleton4, in another thread, who said that most people don’t understand their policies. Private companies cannot arbitrarily break contracts either to benefit the patient or themselves.) But government would have to ration also. There are numerous examples. Here’s a doozy regarding back pain from the UK.
I sincerely hope that no one who reads Michelle’s work and comments here is really stupid enough to believe that healthcare can somehow be delivered in unlimited quantities either privately or publicly. Sheesh.
I’m going to touch on some more of your challenges over a couple of comments.
lgm, coming from you shouldn’t that be “slime slime slime” …sorry – don’t know what a slug sounds like
Nonsense. Economics ration health care, and Congress can’t simply legislate away the laws of economics.
LGM, may I suggest you check out Drudge. There are a couple of articles relating to the Canadian healthcare system.
Nice point about Medicare and Medicaid fraud, Republicanvet.
My qualms about the Medicare argument are many, but I’ll boil it down to the two biggest:
1) Thanks to idiotic laws, seniors have no other choices. They’re unable to deny Medicare without losing Social Security benefits. Many of them (now, at least) have paid in to these systems their entire lives and, by God, they better get something back for it. Who, in their right minds, would say, “No, I’ll pay for my own insurance” after you have pulled money from every single paycheck for their entire life? Government creates this silly situation and then declares it a success because it is no longer economically feasible for most seniors to skip it. Give me a break.
2) One has to wonder about the argument that US healthcare is so expensive because of private insurance companies and their greedy practices. What?!? Don’t these lauded wonderful Medicare and Medicaid programs count? Why, yes, they do! They account for 50% of the damned spend. Could someone argue, with a straight face, that Medicare is somehow absent in discussions of the price of American healthcare?
MarcoPolo said (#49):
You go ahead and do that, then I’ll challenge Lance Armstrong to a bike race.
Republicanvet said (#50/51):
Yes. And that’s our system already for Medicare patients. If you have private insurance, it’s a company bureaucrat, not the government, between you and the doctor.
Your figure is wrong, but at some point, there’s a tradeoff between fraud that gets through and the cost of preventing it.
Yes. For example treatments that don’t help the patient. There was a Republican ad featuring a Canadian woman who couldn’t get the surgery she wanted in Canada. It turned out that the surgery was not necessary. And even for treatments that do work, there has to be a cost/benefit analysis, with life being a benefit. There are procedures that are too expensive to do.
Are you talking about present Medicare or health care reform proposals. The reform proposals come with revenue sources — taxes on the rich — that Americans are willing to pay (even the rich, mostly).
They don’t spend more than us, they spend less. And their service is at least as good. If we adopted their system, we would have just as good health care and more money to spend on defense.
DougT said (#52):
The point is that we already have rationing. If you have health insurance, there are bureaucrats (a death board) deciding which treatments you can and can’t have. The “death board” argument against health care reform is bogus.
Insurance companies are For Profit businesses. They use historical data, demographics, and other information, and run it through complicated statistical models to come up with insurance choices and rates.
This basic principle applies to all types of insurance: vehicle, property, life, health, fire,…..
I am assuming that you do have Health Insurance from your employer (or your private insurance if you are self employed).
When you select a particular Insurance from the available choices offered by your employer / agent, it is NO LONGER a RATIONING.
Every year, during the enrollment period, your employer gives you one or more Insurance groups to select your coverage from. They do provide what type of coverage you can select at what price, what is covered, what is not, what are the co-payments, if any,….
Here, let me give you easy to understand example:
When you insure your car for “No Fault” coverage only, and your car is involved in an accident, your Insurance company doesn’t cover the damages to your car (even if you are NOT at fault).
Is that Limiting the coverage? No because that is what you bought.
Health coverage is no different.
My apology to MarcoPolo.
The quote in my post #58 should have been attributed to the socialist LGM.
I wouldn’t make the “death board” argument, either. But, then again, that has nothing to do with rationing care. I thought it was about routine counseling. After all, a doctor’s time shouldn’t be free, even in these cases.
A free market in private insurance would allow me to choose the kind of coverage I would prefer. A free market would encourage lower prices and market innovation by the insurers. A free market would allow non-profit co-ops to thrive. A free market would solve the “pre-ex” conundrum (fairly easily, I’d say.) A free market wouldn’t keep you tied to a job you hated because the “benefits are so good.”
But a free market won’t do away with rationing, it’ll just move the decision point closer to the patient. Decisions about living or dying, seeking care or soldiering on, choosing treatment or letting nature have its way, are always going to be there. I want to be the one making those decisions with my family and my physician, not with a faceless voice in some office, be it private or public. Of course, I will be making these decisions in the context of my insurance, my financial ability to pay, my threshold for suffering, etc.
There are people who want to run to the ER when they feel the sniffles on a Sunday. I don’t want to pay for that, either publicly through taxes or fees, or privately by being in the same risk pool as these ninnies.
Anyway, the real point is that no, the bureaucrats at insurance companies are not making those decisions about treatments. Those decisions were made when the policy was negotiated, likely with your employer. But, alas, thanks to stupid federal laws, you are not allowed to buy your own insurance on the individual market without paying a hefty tax penalty. And, if you did decide to do that, you aren’t allowed to buy your insurance from a company in another state. (Oh, yeah, private enterprise in action? Not.)
Well said, vatodio. Except that was lgm, not MarcoPolo.
Woops…I see you corrected it. Sorry. I’ll shut up now.
Hey! What about me??? I feel left out.
Herein lies the ideological difference. You trust the government to make these decisions. We do not.
Considering the massive fraud in Medicare, one cannot help but think they pay for any kind of frivolous billing no matter how ludicrous. As long as some thief knows how to work the system, and as long as politicians accepting their donations look the other way, the fraud will continue.
As far as a public option “competing” with the private sector, does anyone here believe that the public option will pay for itself through premiums without constant injections of federal subsidies?
Yeah, and what about me? Notice how the troll ignored my posting comparing the quality of medical treatment I had in the US vs. Canada. Apparently, my actual experience doesn’t fit his little fantasy narrative.
What you fail to admit to is that in a free market, if I am disgusted with the service from that bureaucrat, I can easily switch insurance providers.
Who do I switch to if a government plan is the only game in town?
Thanks for the link backing up your assertion. As it is, I was wrong on the figure. The $60 billion in fraud per year is in Medicaid according to this news article:
Medicaid Fraud
While Medicare claims only $3 billion per year in fraud, yet this article claims $27 billion per year in fraud.
Typical of the left though to flippantly dismiss billions in fraud when taxpayers are the ones paying for it.
Your arrogant position clearly is one reason why people are so upset over BHO’s plans….people like you who believe you know better as to what plan may or may not be necessary, and whether the cost is too much.
I would rather make my own choices in that area and not some arrogant lib who thinks the money could be better spent on the NEA or the Snowy Owl.
Prove it. Don’t be like some typical Karnak the Democrat liberal and claim to know what all Americans think. Prove that people are willing to pay higher taxes for BHO’s health care take-over.
Just because you can repeat what you are told does not make it true. Provide some links to back up your assertions.
Way to blow off the other points made.
When are you volunteering at your local VA? You have zero experience with that system, and considering that, you have zero experience from which to base your assertions. Until you volunteer, you don’t have a clue.
By the way, BHO’s plans for a nationalized health care system go way beyond, and are much worse than the VA ever could be.
Congratulations, everyone. You’ve turned lgm into a blubbering idiot.
One part that is left out of this discussion are the many mandates by each state as to what must be covered by an insurance company in order to do business in that state.
If an insurance company wishes to do business in a certain state, they must provide coverage for the list of issues each state mandates, whether you want them or not, you end up paying for them if you select that companies plan.
This means you pay for covering someone’s hair transplant, or certain college professors treatment for sexual dysfunction.
Just like Amtrak. They will need massive injections of taxpayers money just to feed the bureaucrats.
Salt said (#64):
Agreed. We have different preconceptions. Let’s try to resolve this using data. How do government run health care programs work, relative to private ones? Look for data, as opposed to anecdotes (my cousin Vinny got …), or one sided griping (in Canada they have rationed care). Comparisons of the effectiveness of health care in the US and other countries (all with at least as much government involvement as present proposals call for) do not show the US as clearly superior. That’s science: letting data overcome preconceptions.
Jet Jaguar said (#63):
I try not to argue with pure insults.
Republicanvet (#68)
It’s not arrogant to ask that experts decide what treatments are appropriate. Medical insurance does not and should not entitle me to demand arbitrary treatments I want, even if I have a doctor friend on my side (think Michael Jackson).
I shouldn’t give this fool any ink, caught me at a bad time, I accidentally read his post and I know better than to do that too…lgm are you really that stupid or does that come with the kool aid?
Tom Coburn didn’t hide from his constituents.
This wasn’t his only town hall recently, but it was the one that had to be moved out of an auditorium to an open area between buildings at Northeaster State University – Muskogee Campus. No “Sorry, the room only holds 250 people!” here.
ECS
Wow. You actually recognized that you were being insulted. That is unexpected. There may be hope for you after all.
It most certainly is arrogant when government bureaucrats, with a vested interest in cutting costs from what will be a massively bloated program, can pick and choose what treatment is provided, with NO APPEAL!
Currently, if I have a problem with my insurance, I can appeal their decision. If I don’t like their response, I can always write to the State Insurance Commissioner and have it investigated.
I switched insurance plans because they kept erroneously denying coverage for a medical issue that was previously covered by them. A few months after I switched, the State Insurance Commissioner investigated them and found they were denying many claims, because they refused to hire the staff needed to review the claims.
I had a choice.
With this thugs plan, there will be no appeal.
I went through 7 years of fighting with the VA before my injuries from the first Gulf War were determined to be service-connected…and then only after testifying before Congress.
I could have appealed their denials, to the Board of Veterans Appeals where they were over 1 year behind in their decisions.
You are an ignorant fool if you believe the rest of America should be forced into this kind of nightmare.
No liberal “lied”, they just believe everything they are spoon fed. Not sure if you have (you probably have though) many liberals have been squawking all over the place about how our system needs overhaul because France’s is so much better. (Although I read they want a system more like ours now), the point is lefties will say ANYTHING, it is almost like they invented the tell it enough and it will become truth.
You are not going to convince me that everyone sharing each other’s bills is the way to go here. It has been tried, and has never shown to work out well.
Guess what? I have a friend too, very pretentious British guy who works in LA (Hollywood type, actually an assistant to a prominent actor). He got his citizenship here (still lives in Britain though) so he would not have to pay the high tax rate there. As usual European elitists do, he whines about America and Americans and how Britain is so much better about everything, especially healthcare. Well, he is in LA and has to see a doctor here and actually admitted afterwards how much faster he was treated here then he could ever have been in Britain. He even admitted (not apology, but it is a first step) that his criticism of US healthcare was ill informed. Does this story count as much as your happy Canadian friends and how much they love their healthcare?
I know you consider yourself academia and therefore much smarter than most. Sorry, I put my money on the majority of Americans. They are still smart and when paying attention they smell the BS from miles off.
Actually,I believe that’s whats known as a “pre-existing condition”.
Canadian Health Care We So Envy Lies In Ruins, Its Architect Admits
By DAVID GRATZER | Posted Wednesday, June 25, 2008 4:30 PM PT
http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=299282509335931
I literally laughed out loud when I read that….
A) tort reform
B) get the government out of health insurance.
Yet in a prior entry, you ridiculed the private insurance companies for doing that very thing:
I guess that is what Obama and the Democrats were trying to do by ramming through this legislation before the August recess, before anyone, including much of the Congress, could read it?
So Obamacare would have unlimited health care coverage for all citizens (and illegals, apparently) at any age or condition? And simultaneously lower the costs? Oh baby! Sign me up! /sarcasm
Have the grace to admit it is bankrupt and Obama and the Democrats are looking to this boondoggle to pay for it.
Have the courage to look at the lies from the Democrat side: no death boards per se, the present proposals are not “single payer”, and if health care is so great in Canada, why are insurance companies there offering waiting line insurance? http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2008/10/01/bc-medical-wait-list-insurance-bcaa.html
My Irish relative have come here for medical care because the socialized system in the British Isles is sooooo good…. /sarc
For those of you that like a more domestic example, today’s Wall Street Journal has an article about the crashing failure of TennCare:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125046457087135327.html
Oh yeah: with respect to the actual topic of this thread, seeking asylum in the headquarters of a union shows what gutless weasels these pols are.
The second they stop meeting their constituents is the second they stop doing the job they were hired to do. It is also the second at which those he/she purports to represent should consider firing them.
Lgm demands your source but provides none for his/her own figures. For example, lgm’s % of GDP figures are dated (look it up yourself) and rather unspecific, as in 7-8% in “european countries.” Plus, % of GDP is very interesting when you condiser who pays. The Canadian government pays 70% of that figure, US government 46%. (Hint -Google).
But the system I like best is where you pay for yours and I pay for mine.
Grayson is a carpetbagger who was brought in to run against Republican Ric (what a name) Keller. Keller was a turncoat and lied about honoring term limits. Grayson will be out next election, thank goodness. He is so full of himself. Well, aren’t they all? The arrogance of having a town hall meeting in a union hall.
I’ve done my own research on this subject and must be looking at different data than you are. Please provide some references and I’ll be happy to read them.
If you want to learn about health care, you google. Start reading this, then this, then this. This is not esoteric or hard to find. If you really wanted to know, you would have done this already.
To those supporters of ObamaCare:
If passed, how many of you with families will voluntarily drop your private health coverage to enroll in the public system?
You simply cannot avoid the condescension, can you? It’s most likely I know much more about search engines and the internet than you do. I asked for what you have read that led to your conclusions. There was nothing sinister in my request. In fact, I believe I was quite polite in my comment.
Some of us attempt to approach your claims in good faith and if this is how you react why should we take you seriously?
I have read a lot about health care both here and abroad. I know a great deal about the underlying technologies that would be required to make such a program successful and the challenges inherent in a government run program. Do not presume to know anything about me or my desire to understand. That I have drawn a different conclusion than you does not mean that I have not made the effort. Your arrogant viewpoint has blinded you to believe that all evidence supports your conclusion, there is no room for debate, and anyone with an opposing viewpoint must be either stupid or lazy.
From your first link, which I had already previously read:
This supports the notion that there is more than one solution here, not evidence that a government-run program is superior.
Your second and third links to Wikipedia are a joke, right? Wiki is fine for a starting point, but a wise individual takes everything there with a grain of salt and searches deeper. As someone who values expert opinion, you would do well not to consider a mass collaboration tool as an expert resource.
Even so, these capture some of the talking points on both side of the fence. We can agree that the rising cost of health care is an issue. You malign those provoked by the legislation as being “anti-reform” without attempting to understand their position. They’re not anti-reform. They are opposed to a government-run program. I believe you know this, but deliberately cherry pick from the fringe to form an inaccurate argument against a whole.
I answered several of your comments with citations.
Please have the grace to respond. Feel free to use the internet (I would avoid Wiki though, due to its “fluid” association with bias and truth.
Dimsdale said (#90):
Your comments are too scrambled to answer seriously. For example, you posted (#82):
Which is the opposite of what I said, and what the proposals are. Part of health care reform has to be sensible limits on hearth care. Anti reformers say that this amounts to rationing — which it does. I’m pointing out that this is both unavoidable (nobody has an infinite health care budget) and a pre-extisting condition (we have it already).
I really don’t find the leftist censors at Wikipedia to be a credible source for much of anything.
Yes, we have it already, in the form of PRIVATE choices. If we choose to go with another choice, we can do so.
There is NO CHOICE when Obama is running everything.
I would actually like to see more choices in insurance, rather than having to pay for some procedure that some special interest group forced through at the state level, I would pay for what I need.
Nice of you to pick the one snarky remark of mine. I can currently change insurance companies if I choose. I can’t change a government option.
Now address my other responses in entry #82, particularly the ones were I cite specific sources that refute your assertions.
Are we “unscrambling”, lgm? Or scrambling for an answer?
Can’t answer the “scrambled” facts, lgm?
Or should I say “bok, bok, bok?”
Salt, you and Corkie routinely hand the collective of posters (aka, the “Agents”) who comment under the handle of LGM their hats. I am amazed and impressed by the eloquence and command of facts you both use to shut down the LGM collective’s attempts at obfuscation and distraction; they seldom respond because they can’t – the facts are not on their side.
Just ignore their rants and ramblings because, if they were serious, why would they post on a conservative site? Why not start their own blog?
Well, it has almost been the requisite 24 hours waiting for lgm to answer my questions.
I guess I can call him a gutless Obama licker.
36 hours, and lgm still can’t get his lips off of Obama’s backside……