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Comments

1. #1
   On August 18th, 2009 at 11:19 pm, ThackerAgency said:

   The big winner if a new public option passes is the UAW. They negotiated a deal with the big 3 management about their members’ health care.

   They allowed the companies to pay into a fund that the union would control and purchase their own health care out of. The big 3 would no longer be required to offer UAW members health care when they fully funded this.

   There is no way that the UAW manages the money appropriately. They’ll steal the 100 B dollars that they get for this program and force all of their members on the government plan.

   None of this will make America better.

2. #2
   On August 18th, 2009 at 11:22 pm, ThackerAgency said:

   The problem with the debate is the approach. The media and left talk about health care as it relates to health insurance premiums.

   The problem is not the premiums. The problem is the claims.

   The reason any semblance of a public option is a non-starter for conservatives is that everyone on the public option will become a LIABILITY of the government budget.

   If the government option doesn’t bring in enough money to pay claims, the taxpayer will have to bail it out. . . private insurance companies would be bankrupted.

   Public option increases government LIABILITY that future generations will be required to pay. The current generation should never KNOWINGLY force the next generation to pay for their mistakes.

3. #3
   On August 18th, 2009 at 11:28 pm, txvet2 said:

   Looks like your next best-seller is already writing itself, Michelle.

4. #4
   On August 18th, 2009 at 11:34 pm, d1carter said:

   Just how many of the White House thugs have a financial interest in ObamaCare passing?

5. #5
   On August 18th, 2009 at 11:38 pm, Red Ted said:

   WTF

6. #6
   On August 18th, 2009 at 11:44 pm, rightisright said:

   I’m so sick of this crap, no matter what side of the aisle the stink is coming from…most are liar’s, thief’s, cheat’s and scam artist’s. Almost forget about that tub of lard Ted Kennedy, their also killers.
   This is what the people of America have to represent us? That ain’t good folks.

7. #7
   On August 19th, 2009 at 12:19 am, CleanGuy said:

   Is it me, or is everyone in this administration such easy targets? Were previous admins just as bad? Is it this new ‘age of information’ just making it easier? Every time I hear something new, I just want to puke.

8. #8
   On August 19th, 2009 at 1:14 am, simcoe said:

   Culture of Corruption: Axelrod’s big problem
   [Darleen Click]

   Big problem? C’mon, big problem?

   Look around, lady! To what big problem are you referring?

   Is there even one person in Washington who makes the laws or one federal prosecutor who is supposed to prosecute the scofflaws of this nation with the stones to do squat about it?

   Axelrod is daring you to do something and laughing at your words as he pilfers your pocketbook while standing right in front of you looking you square in the eyes.

   If Axelrod has been negotiating any part of any deal involving any of these players which are funneling money to the firm that owes him money, or if he is advising the president on the deals with any of these groups, that’s a conflict of interest. Laundering the money through a “coalition” doesn’t remove the conflict much less the appearance of impropriety.

   If? If?

   Yeah, I know. Proof, proof, proof.

   This kind of writing is intellectually insulting!

9. #9
   On August 19th, 2009 at 3:17 am, dadinseattle said:

   Nothing to see, if nobody will look.
   Just a bunch of little people, looking out for the little guy!
   The “same old way in Washington” is really obsolete since the Chicago connection is the old DC squared.

   Cronyism squared, maybe cubed, conflicts of interest everywhere one turns, tax cheats, blacked out windows in the White House with lots of new Czar parking spaces. Snitch brigades.

   Gibbs is beginning to make Bagdad Bob look credible and believable in comparison and gets paid a lot of our tax dollars for scoffing at any serious question. DOJ spiking election intimidation investigations,IG firings, and outright lying about major legislation from the top guy on down, along with name calling,smears, and encouraging violence.
   This moral leadership is what everyone was hoping for right?
   Imagine the field day an actual journalist or two could have if this piqued the slightest suspicion that America has been had.

10. #10
    On August 19th, 2009 at 4:40 am, Thunderbird 1 said:

    Hugh Hewitt was on this story all day today, too. Thanks to both of you for covering it.

    I suggest nothing more than the following for your next book title, Michelle: “Culture of Corruption II.” Period. Who knew you’d get a whole book out of each six months of this administration. By the time they’re out of the White House (yes, in 2013, by the grace of God), you’ll have more volumes than Collier’s.

11. #11
    On August 19th, 2009 at 6:29 am, zorro said:

    As you always say, sunlight is the best disinfectant. Excellent reporting.

12. #12
    On August 19th, 2009 at 7:04 am, cms405 said:

    Rachel Maddow needs to read this.

13. #13
    On August 19th, 2009 at 7:23 am, Ken M. said:

    Great work again Michelle. Keep the spotlight (sunshine) on those corruptocrats.

14. #14
    On August 19th, 2009 at 7:26 am, bradley said:

    So, let me get this straight: Axelrod was Obama’s “advisor” during the campaign, yet ALSO owned the ad agency that created the work for Obama, which earned a large part of the $343,000,000 Obama spent to get elected? And he “sold out” his portion (sole ownership) AFTER Obama was elected for ONLY $2,000,000? Be nice to know how much this rat lookalike double dipped DURING the campaign, which had to be MILLIONS, otherwise he wouldn’t sell out for a measly $2,000,000. He got his $ on the front end obviously.

15. #15
    On August 19th, 2009 at 7:47 am, Danceswithdachshunds said:

    The closer you look at ‘socialism’ the more you realize it is nothing more than glorified grand theft.

16. #16
    On August 19th, 2009 at 8:02 am, Brian72 said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 7:26 am, bradley said:

    And he “sold out” his portion (sole ownership) AFTER Obama was elected for ONLY $2,000,000?

    That is not entirely correct.
    It seems that Axelrod is still owed $2million by his old company for services previously rendered.
    The cash he got for his ownership stake is entirely separate from that money, for which no firm amount is disclosed here.
    I am assuming that whomever purchased Axelrod’s controlling interest in AKPD paid in full when the deal was closed.

    The $2 million is debt outstanding to Axelrod personally.

    Does anyone recall the furor from the liberals about VP Cheney’s tenure at Halliburton, possible conflicts of interest with the energy policy meetings at the White House, not to mention contracts related to Operation Iraqi Freedom?

    To continue this theme, here is Jonah Golberg from NRO this morning:

    Imagine if George W. Bush, in his effort to partially privatize Social Security, had insisted that the “time for talking is over.” Picture, if you will, the Bush White House asking Americans to turn in their e-mails in the pursuit of “fishy” dissent. Conjure a scenario under which then-Senate Majority Leader Trent Lott derided critics as “evil-mongers” the way Harry Reid recently described town-hall protesters. Or if then-House Speaker Dennis Hastert and then-Majority Whip Tom DeLay had called critics “un-American” the way Nancy Pelosi and Steny Hoyer did last week, or if White House strategist Karl Rove had been Sir Spam-a-lot instead of David Axelrod.

    Now, I’m not asking you, dear reader, to do this so that you might be able to see through the glare of Obama’s halo or the outlines of the media’s staggering double standard when it comes to covering this White House. Rather, it is to grasp that the Obama administration has been astoundingly incompetent.

    Incompetent, combined with a unique brand of arrogance born from this President and his top people making the critical error of buying into their own hype.

    They honestly believe that they are some kind of superhuman Olympians on High, far above we pitiful mortals down here in flyover country.

17. #17
    On August 19th, 2009 at 8:12 am, iamsaved said:

    Looks like the old quote from the Watergate days is apropos – “Follow the money”.

    Those libs aren’t concerned the least bit about the poor and downtrodden having insurance or decent health care. It’s all about the libs and how much they can siphon out of the government trough.

18. #18
    On August 19th, 2009 at 8:14 am, cicerokid said:

    key Cheech and Chong:

    “Hey, Chebornik. What’s that? Looks like dogs*&t”…

19. #19
    On August 19th, 2009 at 8:22 am, Socky said:

    Under ObamaCare, ACORN gets to monitor your lifestyle.

    The health care reform bill approved by the Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions Committee (HELP) would provide federal grants to state and local governments and a “national network of community-based organizations” to “promote healthy living and reduce disparities” and to monitor people’s weight, eating, exercise habits and other individual behaviors that affect health at the community level. The language instituting the program, entitled “Community Transformation Grants,” is on pages 382-387 of the bill as posted on the committee’s Web site.

20. #20
    On August 19th, 2009 at 8:23 am, huhwhat said:

    Yep, they are incompetent, they are liars, they are thieves. Obama and company couldn’t run a crap wagon in diarrhea city, yet here they are trying to end over two hundred years of freedom and liberty. And they are aided and abetted by the MSM and unions. I get so bloody angry at them I can’t see, yet I still have the most contempt for the fools who voted for them.

21. #21
    On August 19th, 2009 at 8:33 am, Dimsdale said:

    Hey, Bobby Gibbs: Tell us again. Who’s funded by the evil health care industry?

    I think “Baghdad Bob” Gibbs would be more apropos.

22. #22
    On August 19th, 2009 at 8:42 am, Rogue Cheddar said:

    Axelrod singing: “With a thrill in my head and a pill on my tongue,
    Dissolve the nerves that have just begun.
    Listening to Marvin all night long.
    This is the sound of my soul. (This is the sound)”

23. #23
    On August 19th, 2009 at 8:45 am, stillontheroad said:

    Ok Folks and MM — this is off subject but I was just told about this:

    HR 45 – Holt Firearm Licensing and Record of sale act.
    Basically this would make it illegal to own a firearm – any rifle with a clip or ANY pistol unless:

    It is registered

    You are fingerprinted

    You supply a current Driver’s License

    You supply your Social Security #

    You will submit to a physical & mental evaluation at any time of their choosing

    Each update – change orownershipthrough private or public sale must be reported and costs $25 – Failure to do so you automatically lose the right to own a firearm and are subject up to a year in
    jail.

    There is a child provision clause on page 16 section 305 stating a child-access provision. Gun must be locked and inaccessible to any child under 18.

    They would have the right to come and inspect that you are storing your gun safely away from accessibility to children and fine is punishable for up to 5 yrs. in prison.

    If you think this is a joke – go to the website and take your pick of many options to read this. It is long and lengthy. But, more and more people are becoming aware of this. Pass the word along. Any hunters in your family – pass this along.

    They just do not stop.

24. #24
    On August 19th, 2009 at 8:49 am, jbh45 said:

    …and you can hear crickets chirping at the Justice Department….

25. #25
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:06 am, Cowboy said:

    This administration will go down as the most corrupt and inept in history.

26. #26
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:18 am, imjustsaying said:

    This is reminiscent of the cozy relationship that Halliburton had with Bush/Cheney.

27. #27
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:18 am, PatriotRider said:

    Cowboy said:
    This administration will go down as the most corrupt and inept in history

    I believe we can make that distinction already and we’re only 7 months into it.

28. #28
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:20 am, PatriotRider said:

    imjustsaying said:
    This is reminiscent of the cozy relationship that Halliburton had with Bush/Cheney.

    Yea! Exactly! It’s just the same thing! \sarcasm off\ What a tool.

29. #29
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:31 am, PatriotRider said:

    BTW it is reminiscent of Germany in ~1936. But like the German people of that time you are OK with it.

30. #30
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:42 am, John424 said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 8:45 am, stillontheroad said:

    stillontheroad:

    This was introduced back in January. It was referred to committee in February and has had no action taken on it since. Bobby Rush of IL introduced it, with no co-sponsors. It has virtually no support from anyone in congress and has been basically left to die in committee.

    However, you’re right. We can’t let down our guard for one minute. Just because this one failed, doesn’t mean another crap sandwich can’t pop up in it’s place.

    I apologize for going OT, but I wanted to kind of tie up this loose end.

    /end of OT discussion.

    As for the subject of the thread, this kind of stuff stopped surprising me long ago. It became apparent very early on that the object of the Obama administration was two-fold: 1)For him to do the bidding of whoever it is that’s pulling his strings (I’ve long suspected that Soros was a part of the chain, but I also suspect that he’s just a part of that chain), and 2)To line his and his cronies pockets to the fullest extent possible for as long as his hold on power lasts.

    Obama and his minions don’t care about the country or the people. They care about themselves. Period.

31. #31
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:50 am, GladzKravtz said:

    This is reminiscent of the cozy relationship that Halliburton had with Bush/Cheney.

    Well then, I’ll wait for outrage from the left/progressives/libs/dems.

32. #32
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:50 am, Flyoverman said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:18 am, imjustsaying said:

    This is reminiscent of the cozy relationship that Halliburton had with Bush/Cheney.

    Well that’s good you feel that way. Based on your indignation and profession of moral equivalency I am sure you will not care that we have a full investigation of this by an independent counsel.

    Calling Patrick Fitzgerald………

33. #33
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:51 am, Savage24 said:

    The stink of Washington DC is getting so strong, we smell all the way out here in New Mexico. More and more corruption, a day doesn’t go by without more corruption being uncovered. I don’t believe they can blame Bush for this.

34. #34
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:52 am, Flyoverman said:

    Well then, I’ll wait for outrage from the left/progressives/libs/dems.

    I hope you have several good books and movies to pass the time while you are waiting.

35. #35
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:59 am, GladzKravtz said:

    several good books

    I needed incentive to out and buy/read that biggie, Atlas Shrugged! Thx.

36. #36
    On August 19th, 2009 at 10:03 am, TC said:

    The Democrat Party is a criminal enterprise.

37. #37
    On August 19th, 2009 at 10:05 am, Flyoverman said:

    I needed incentive to out and buy/read that biggie, Atlas Shrugged! Thx.

    I’m currently reading Mark Levin’s book. VERY good book.

    I hope lgm is okay. This is the perfect post for one of his “moral equivalency” whines and he has not appeared…..poor guy.

38. #38
    On August 19th, 2009 at 10:26 am, bradley said:

    The $2,000,000 owed “personally” to Axelrod is the amount he sold the agency for, to his kids and like-minded syncophants. Until he “guided” further ad work for Obama to his previously-owned company, it had no business of consequence that I know of. If he got more than $2,000,000 at closing, he was literally paying himself from company profits, since he owned the company 100%. Like I said earlier, he made millions on the ad work his company did for Obama, while being paid BY Obama to “advise” him, which is double-dipping to the extreme. It’s also the Chicago Way.

39. #39
    On August 19th, 2009 at 10:28 am, spaceycakes said:

    Imagine if George W. Bush, in his effort to partially privatize Social Security, had insisted that the “time for talking is over.”

    Oh, if only. A girl can dream, can’t she?

    And Rogue–awesome Gary & Martin Kemp reference (Spandau Ballet).

40. #40
    On August 19th, 2009 at 11:01 am, norm1111 said:

    But..but..but…Haliburton!! Haliburton!! Squack!! Squack!! Haliburton!!!

    Uhh, anyone see the glaring double standard of the neo-Dem flower children trying to run our great country? I am afraid for my country with these thieving, lying criminals running the country into the ground…..

41. #41
    On August 19th, 2009 at 11:10 am, DBNinKY said:

    Oh you just know Linda Douglas is going to get all “cave-woman” over this, denouncing Axelrod in Web casts and YouTube videos! Why I wouldn’t be surprised to see Axelrod resign before the day is over – after all, this is the most transparent administration EVER!

    Sarc/

42. #42
    On August 19th, 2009 at 11:24 am, Southpaw said:

    Lookout. Cockroaches scurrying.

43. #43
    On August 19th, 2009 at 11:26 am, ArizonaNeanderthal said:

    Ah the Compassion of the Left-the best money can buy. Double dipping, voter registration of the dead and never were, skimming, out right theft-tis the Chicago way. Obama’s friends in New Jersey are no slouches in stealing either.

    IF we have one more free election to stop them there is hope. IF we can ever get an honest man in the White House and Justice we can boost the construction industry for the prisons we will need to house all these crooks.

    God Bless America except for the Blue States.

44. #44
    On August 19th, 2009 at 11:44 am, Rogue Cheddar said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 10:28 am, spaceycakes said:
    And Rogue–awesome Gary & Martin Kemp reference (Spandau Ballet).

    Thanks.
    “Ah Ah Ah Ah Ah
    I know this much is true.”

45. #45
    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:19 pm, Mainah said:

    Zeke Emanuel has supposedly been misquoted and misunderstood on rationing healthcare. Notsomuch

    http://www.ncpa.org/pdfs/PIIS0140673609601379.pdf

    …Because none of the currently used systems satisfy all ethical requirements for just allocation, we propose an alternative: the complete lives system. This system incorporates five principles: youngest-first, prognosis, save the most lives, lottery, and instrumental value. As such, it prioritizes younger people who have not yet lived a complete life and will be unlikely to do so without aid. Many thinkers have accepted complete lives as the appropriate focus of distributive justice: “individual human lives, rather than individual experiences, [are] the units over which any distributive principle should operate.” Although there are important differences between these thinkers, they share a core commitment to consider entire lives rather than events or episodes, which is also the defining feature of the complete lives system.

    Consideration of the importance of complete lives also supports modifying the youngest-first principle by prioritizing adolescents and young adults over infants. Adolescents have received substantial education and parental care, investments that will be wasted without a complete life. Infants, by contrast, have not yet received these investments. Similarly, adolescence brings with it a developed personality capable of forming and valuing long-term plans whose fulfillment requires a complete life. As the legal philosopher Ronald Dworkin argues, “It is terrible when an infant dies, but worse, most people think, when a three-year-old child dies and worse still when an adolescent does”; this argument is supported by empirical surveys. Importantly, the prioritization of adolescents and young adults considers the social and personal investment that people are morally entitled to have received at a particular age, rather than accepting the results of an unjust status quo. Consequently, poor adolescents should be treated the same as wealthy ones, even though they may have received less investment owing to social injustice.

    The complete lives system also considers prognosis, since its aim is to achieve complete lives. A young person with a poor prognosis has had few life-years but lacks the potential to live a complete life. Considering prognosis forestalls the concern that disproportionately large amounts of resources will be directed to young people with poor prognoses. When the worst-off can benefit only slightly while better-off people could benefit greatly, allocating to the better-off is often justifiable. Some small benefits, such as a few weeks of life, might also be intrinsically insignificant when compared with large benefits.

    Saving the most lives is also included in this system because enabling more people to live complete lives is better than enabling fewer. In a public health emergency, instrumental value could also be included to enable more people to live complete lives. Lotteries could be used when making choices between roughly equal recipients, and also potentially to ensure that no individual—irrespective of age or prognosis—is seen as beyond saving. Thus, the complete lives system is complete in another way: it incorporates each morally relevant simple principle.

    When implemented, the complete lives system produces a priority curve on which individuals aged between roughly 15 and 40 years get the most substantial chance, whereas the youngest and oldest people get chances that are attenuated (note: ATTENUATE – To make slender, fine, or small; To lessen the density of; rarefy; To reduce in force, value, amount, or degree; weaken). It therefore superficially resembles the proposal made by DALY advocates; however, the complete lives system justifies preference to younger people because of priority to the worst-off rather than instrumental value. Additionally, the complete lives system assumes that, although life-years are equally valuable to all, justice requires the fair distribution of them. Conversely, DALY allocation treats life-years given to elderly or disabled people as objectively less valuable.

    Finally, the complete lives system is least vulnerable to corruption. Age can be established quickly and accurately from identity documents. Prognosis allocation encourages physicians to improve patients’ health, unlike the perverse incentives to sicken patients or misrepresent health that the sickest-first allocation creates.

    Objections
    We consider several important objections to the complete lives system.
    The complete lives system discriminates against older people. Age-based allocation is ageism. Unlike allocation by sex or race, allocation by age is not invidious discrimination; every person lives through different life stages rather than being a single age. Even if 25-year-olds receive priority over 65-year-olds, everyone who is 65 years now was previously 25 years. Treating 65-yearolds differently because of stereotypes or falsehoods would be ageist; treating them differently because they have already had more life-years is not.

    Age, like income, is a “non-medical criterion” inappropriate for allocation of medical resources. In contrast to income, a complete life is a health outcome. Long-term survival and life expectancy at birth are key health-care outcome variables. Delaying the age at onset of a disease is desirable.

    The complete lives system is insensitive to international differences in typical lifespan. Although broad consensus favors adolescents over very young infants, and young adults over the very elderly people, implementation can reasonably differ between, even within, nation-states. Some people believe that a complete life is a universal limit founded in natural human capacities, which everyone should accept even without scarcity. By contrast, the complete lives system requires only that citizens see a complete life, however defined, as an important good, and accept that fairness gives those short of a complete life stronger claims to scarce life-saving resources.

    Principles must be ordered lexically: less important principles should come into play only when more important ones are fulfilled. Rawls himself agreed that lexical priority was inappropriate when distributing specific resources in society, though appropriate for ordering the principles of basic social justice that shape the distribution of basic rights, opportunities, and income. As an alternative, balancing priority to the worst-off against maximizing benefits has won wide support in discussions of allocative local justice. As Amartya Sen argues, justice “does not specify how much more is to be given to the deprived person, but merely that he should receive more”.

    Accepting the complete lives system for health care as a whole would be premature. We must first reduce waste and increase spending. The complete lives system explicitly rejects waste and corruption, such as multiple listing for transplantation. Although it may be applicable more generally, the complete lives system has been developed to justly allocate persistently scarce life-saving interventions. Hearts for transplant and influenza vaccines, unlike money, cannot be replaced or diverted to non-health goals; denying a heart to one person makes it available to another. Ultimately, the complete lives system does not create “classes of Untermenschen whose lives and well being are deemed not worth spending money on”, but rather empowers us to decide fairly whom to save when genuine scarcity makes saving everyone impossible.

46. #46
    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:21 pm, tiredofit08 said:

    Michelle Malkin is going to have to add another chapter to her book.

    give dear leader another 6 months and she can write an entirely NEW book….keep on em Michelle…loved chapter 2…

47. #47
    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:33 pm, T-Bone said:

    Power, taxation, and redistribution are all tools used to reward your friends and punish your enemies. Obama and his Chicago mobster cronies are masters at this game. That is how people in power stay in power. We are seeing it up close and personal.

    When will the American people rise up and demand answers about this criminal activity going on under the guise of politics. The left was sure upset about Haliburton. Now maybe we see they weren’t upset it was going on, they were upset it wasn’t going to their buddies. Another good reason for limited government.

48. #48
    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:45 pm, GladzKravtz said:

    When will the American people rise up and demand answers about this criminal activity going on under the guise of politics.

    And how about a little outrage by the Chicagoans? Or are they proud of this?
    I for one am glad this method of gaining power/control/$$ is seeing some good ole ‘ultra-violet’.

49. #49
    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:52 pm, Regulus said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:21 pm, tiredofit08 said:

    Michelle Malkin is going to have to add another chapter to her book.

    give dear leader another 6 months and she can write an entirely NEW book….keep on em Michelle…loved chapter 2…

    It’s going to become a contest to see whether Hope-a-Dope can write new volumes of his memoirs faster than Michelle can add new volumes to her latest book.

    Michelle, may I suggest that you put “Culture of Corruption” into a three-ring binder format? Then you can charge a monthly subscription for all the updates that are going to be needed.

50. #50
    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:54 pm, lgm said:

    Of course, this goes both ways.

    Chickenhawk conservatives don’t dare post on the substance of health care reform. They don’t dare debate whether US health care is better than in Canada or France — at least not with statistics. They don’t say that governments in Europe have established “death boards”.

51. #51
    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:55 pm, Pasadena Phil said:

    What is most offensive about our government corruption in general and within the Obama administration in particular is the brazenness. There is simply no shame among our entrenched criminal class. It is not in their DNA to be ashamed.

52. #52
    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:56 pm, GladzKravtz said:

    I hope lgm is okay.

    Fly, got your answer = #50.

53. #53
    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:58 pm, T-Bone said:

    In Chicago mobster land, if you go against the mob, your life is in real danger. That guy who did the Joker poster was afraid for his life because of the people in Chicago. Power is what drives this. People with power can exert control over your life and livelihood including the taking of your life. Who is going to speak truth to power in Chicago?

54. #54
    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:59 pm, spaceycakes said:

    at least not with statistics

    speaking of which—–where are yours?

55. #55
    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:03 pm, T-Bone said:

    #50. We have debated your points ad naseum. The fact that you are claiming we don’t dare debate if proof of your closed mindedness. Take your fingers out of your ears and pay attention. You are really dense. Are you a moonie? You are certainly brainwashed. And your moral equivilency argument is old and tired as well as a horrible debate strategy. You lose.

56. #56
    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:05 pm, conservativesRus said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:54 pm, lgm said:
    They don’t dare debate whether US health care is better than in Canada or France — at least not with statistics

    In fact, you are once again far off base. We can speak with statistics. Pick a disease – say breast cancer in women. What is the life expectancy in the USA? What is the life expectancy in Canada?

    USA wins. Your turn.

57. #57
    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:07 pm, Rogue Cheddar said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:54 pm, lgm said:
    Of course, this goes both ways.

    Chickenhawk conservatives don’t dare post on the substance of health care reform. They don’t dare debate whether US health care is better than in Canada or France — at least not with statistics. They don’t say that governments in Europe have established “death boards”.

    I had a coworker whose father was diagnosed with prostate cancer. (very treatable) he was put on an 18 month waiting list for treatment. His cancer spread and he died unnecessarily. He was the benefactor of Canada Care. You don’t need an explicit death panel, lgm, only the usual government incompetence.

58. #58
    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:11 pm, GladzKravtz said:

    Lgm, you know this health care ‘reform’ as so far proposed will hurt you too.

    There just won’t be enough doctors/nurses/techs to handle the additional people. It’s a very simple concept. You will be hurt too.

59. #59
    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:14 pm, T-Bone said:

    http://www.vancouversun.com/story_print.html?id=1878506&sponsor

    Thousands of surgeries may be cut in Metro Vancouver due to government underfunding, leaked paper.

    Pay close attention LGM. Your masters are not telling you the whole story. And there plenty more where that came from. By the way, some of those surgeries that don’t happen may result in death. You lose again.

60. #60
    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:19 pm, cheapseat said:

    don’t waste your breath rogue, lgm obviously can’t read that the head of canada’s ama says the canada care is imploding. 450k surgeries behind in canada. 45k english beaurocrats in the nhs miss work each day. the nhs has more beaurocrats than the u.s. has military personnel. lgm doesn’t want the truth, because to once see the lie of the left, his entire life shows his lack of self improvement. isn’t he a school teacher union dork. the education degree is the simplest degree colleges offer outside of the affirmative action athletic department. i guarantee that an analysis of the sat scores of education graduates is less than 900. since 1000 is dull normal, what does that tell you about teachers. they are both stupid and lazy, which may explain the high number of minorities in the profession.

61. #61
    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:22 pm, T-Bone said:

    Your condition is known as stupidosiscantthinkformyselfitis. It is curable for some that weren’t born with it.

    Drink plenty of water and stay away from liberal talking points, DailyKos, Huffpost, and Hungarian financiers.

    There are lots of other things you must do, too many to enumerate here. Look up deprogramming, that will help. It will take awhile but if you start now, you may be cured in time for the next election cycle where you can finally free yourself of this horrible disease that afflicts too many Americans.

    Oh yeah, Obamacare does not cover the treatment, it only inflames it, so you better get started now before it is too late.

62. #62
    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:32 pm, GladzKravtz said:

    Natasha Richardson
    Can’t help but wonder if she would have lived had she fallen while skiing in the US.

63. #63
    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:42 pm, lgm said:

    Rather than answer these nutty claims one by one, as I have in the past, I will simply post that, statistically speaking, you are the most ill informed demographic in America.

64. #64
    On August 19th, 2009 at 2:01 pm, Rogue Cheddar said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:42 pm, lgm said:
    Rather than answer these nutty claims one by one, as I have in the past, I will simply post that, statistically speaking, you are the most ill informed demographic in America.

    I don’t know lgm, based on these poll results, I’d say these people are very well informed and/or have learned to read between the lines.

    In our poll, 72% of self-identified FOX News viewers believe the health-care plan will give coverage to illegal immigrants, 79% of them say it will lead to a government takeover, 69% think that it will use taxpayer dollars to pay for abortions, and 75% believe that it will allow the government to make decisions about when to stop providing care for the elderly.

65. #65
    On August 19th, 2009 at 2:07 pm, Salt said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:42 pm, lgm said:

    Rather than answer these nutty claims one by one, as I have in the past…

    You mean how you’ve repeated your own claims over and again without referencing any support outside of liberal sites like TPM and ThinkProgress? (Do they give you anything for advertising for them? You hit both of them in one thread here.)

    Some of us would like to have that discussion, but you don’t. When we’ve asked to review the “actual data” you reference which formed your conclusion, you snidely tell us to “google it” or link to Wikipedia.

    So, if we’re the most ill informed demographic (I don’t personally watch Fox News), then why don’t you inform us with the data and not just more pronouncements, strawmen, Tu Quoque segues or other off topic redirects.

    Do you have a comment about David Axelrod you would care to share?

66. #66
    On August 19th, 2009 at 2:09 pm, Mainah said:

    hey lgm? Fox news rules the ratings roost, so IF we are ill-informed/crazy/illiterate/whatever, there sure are a LOT of us.

    By the way, I watch a LOT of channels. Fox is just one.

    Oh yeah, and a few people asked you a direct question, pointing to the sky with a puzzled look while changing the subject doesnt constitue an answer.

67. #67
    On August 19th, 2009 at 2:20 pm, oldcollegeguy1980 said:

    No one has stated how the liberal takeover of health care delivery improves a single process.

    What it does is entrench government in every aspect of your life.

    Cradle to grave.

    They crave power.

    And this takeover solidifys that power.

68. #68
    On August 19th, 2009 at 2:40 pm, conservativesRus said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:42 pm, lgm said:

    Rather than answer these nutty claims one by one

    Which nutty claim?
    Please enlighten me.
    Please show me where cancer survival rates for breast cancer are better in Canada than in the USA.

69. #69
    On August 19th, 2009 at 3:09 pm, spaceycakes said:

    Still waiting, lgm.

70. #70
    On August 19th, 2009 at 3:26 pm, T-Bone said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 2:07 pm, Salt said:

    Some of us would like to have that discussion, but you don’t.

    Nailed it. Many here would like to have an informed discussion on various points of interest. LGM does not as he is afflicted by the disease. He bails when the going gets rough for him.

    Hiding from the light of day just like his cowardly Democratic Congresspeople who don’t want to have a candid discussion with their constituents. They are all just ill informed fox viewers who yell. (uh, even though who have never watched Fox). Yes, that is the liberal lie. Paint everyone with the broad brush. The people are not agreeing anymore. LGM, you lost again.

71. #71
    On August 19th, 2009 at 3:27 pm, Mainah said:

    <—–LOOK! Up there….its all Bush’s fault.

72. #72
    On August 19th, 2009 at 3:34 pm, nosheep said:

    The real problem here is that there are things that aren’t actually in the bill but have purposefully inserted loopholes or vaguely interpretational clauses so that the guys in charge will “have to make” interpretations of what will be done. The guys in charge are for example going to count every illegal in this next census…
    -So you(lgm) are a fool if you believe the President is not going to include illegal’s in this program….
    -Or you are a fool to believe the President when he says he doesn’t want a single payer system…(I watched the FULL video where he actually SAY’s it)
    -Or you are a fool if you believe that the “Death Panels” are not going to be real. There won’t necessarily be this evil group who decides if Grandma dies but…when you have limited resources (and we will ALWAYS have limited resources with the DIMS in charge of spending) rationing WILL happen, HAS happened, IS happening, and Bambi is lying thru his teeth about everything in this bill.
    The fact that you happen to believe him doesn’t mean I’m misinformed.

    By the way…sorry but OT.
    All weekend the tv had references to the “Grand” influence of Woodstock and it hit me. I am from the time…I used to think and hope that when we get in charge, we will effect some real “Change” …yeah!!! Well, I’d like to think I matured and I know I no longer have the same foolish ideas of that era…..Free sex, drugs and rock and roll….”I’d love to “change” the world, but I don’t know what to do” Unfortunately my hopes came true and those guys ARE in charge, and they STILL don’t know what to do.

73. #73
    On August 19th, 2009 at 3:43 pm, T-Bone said:

    How about Axelrod having dubious connections and an obvious conflict of interest situation? Is that real or are we all just ill informed?

74. #74
    On August 19th, 2009 at 3:53 pm, Kingfish said:

    What did Mark Twain say about the three categories of lies?

    Now I remember:

    1. Lies
    2. Damn Lies
    3. Statistics

    Roll that in your bell curve

75. #75
    On August 19th, 2009 at 3:55 pm, dadinseattle said:

    Every post by the lgm types on here reinforces the obvious. Liberals believe they are smarter, better informed, and rightfully entitled to rule the masses.

    My question is surely by now at least one of us should have defected to that side, surely one of us could have been convinced by now that we are foolish to resist the overwhelming evidence of their truth?

    Poor Michele Malkin, all of us that follow her writing are hopelessly dense!

    Is that about right lgm?

76. #76
    On August 19th, 2009 at 4:14 pm, T-Bone said:

    Notice how he left. He can not defend his claims so he hides behind the internet. We are waiting for the debate from your end. Axelrods actions ok with you? Of course, you lose again.

77. #77
    On August 19th, 2009 at 4:24 pm, Bicyea said:

    Cavuto will be talking about this story in a few minutes.

78. #78
    On August 19th, 2009 at 6:32 pm, PatriotRider said:

    Other than blah, blah, isn’t the annointed one a hunk, blah, blah, it’s Bush’s fault, blah.

    lgm said:

    I’m smarter than all of you and nothing you say, no facts, not even rational discourse will change my mind. Because anything you all say does not match with what I’ve been taught and have taught about the American people. I refuse to pull my head out of my backside to experience what freedom of thought smells like because I’ve grown accustomed to the smell of the socialistic crap I’ve been fed. I refuse to open my eyes to reality because I might actuall have to take responsibility for my own actions. The goverment will protect me from myself.

    There! I think I understand LGM’s spew.

79. #79
    On August 19th, 2009 at 6:52 pm, Pasadena Phil said:

    Wadya know! AP has just picked up on “friends in cahoots to engineer a grass roots result.”

    I would say that South Side Barry is heading into an even bigger storm.

80. #80
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:23 pm, Dimsdale said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:42 pm, lgm said:

    Rather than answer these nutty claims one by one, as I have in the past, I will simply post that, statistically speaking, you are the most ill informed demographic in America.

    “Self identified Fox News watchers” on a liberal/socialist web site.

    Are you sure you are in mathematics?

81. #81
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:33 pm, CW4_KGP said:

    lgm? Low Grade Mentality? Lost Gigantic Moron? I am so trying to figure it out. I know there is a key to it all….in the interim, lgm, please partake of a Drano enema and see if that doesn’t give you a better perspective on reality.

    You are such a tool, I would almost consider you a portable power tool…minus the battery. Then, truly, every problem is a nail because you are nothing but a tack hammer. Not even good enough to drive a real nail home.

    Go home and sleep on it.

82. #82
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:38 pm, CyberCipher said:

    Great job on Hannity, Michelle. I left work early so that I could make certain to catch that segment.

    My collie says:

    Keep the pressure on.

83. #83
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:41 pm, Dimsdale said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:54 pm, lgm said:

    Of course, this goes both ways.

    I have yet to see the type of violence typified by liberal/socialists at these demonstrations. Do you have examples? Something in a retiree beating up an SEIU thug, perhaps?

    Chickenhawk conservatives don’t dare post on the substance of health care reform. They don’t dare debate whether US health care is better than in Canada or France — at least not with statistics. They don’t say that governments in Europe have established “death boards”.

    If health care is so great in Canada, why are insurance companies there offering waiting line insurance? http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2008/10/01/bc-medical-wait-list-insurance-bcaa.html

    Canadian Health Care We So Envy Lies In Ruins, Its Architect Admits

    By DAVID GRATZER | Posted Wednesday, June 25, 2008 4:30 PM PT

    The government followed his advice, leading to his modern-day moniker: “the father of Quebec medicare.” Even this title seems modest; Castonguay’s work triggered a domino effect across the country, until eventually his ideas were implemented from coast to coast.

    Four decades later, as the chairman of a government committee reviewing Quebec health care this year, Castonguay concluded that the system is in “crisis.”

    http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=299282509335931

    For those of you that like a more domestic example, today’s Wall Street Journal has an article about the crashing failure of TennCare:

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125046457087135327.html

84. #84
    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:41 pm, Dimsdale said:

    Here is an interesting article for you “there’s no death panel” groupies:

    END OF LIFE TREATMENTS WITHHELD IN EUROPE

    Life-prolonging treatment is either not given or is withdrawn at the end of life for a substantial proportion of patients in six European countries, a survey of doctors has found. Although the figures varied by country, in most places medicine was the treatment most often not given, followed by fluids or nutrition.

    The report in the February 28 issue of the Archives of Internal Medicine about how frequently care was withheld or withdrawn at the end of life demonstrated dramatic differences among six European countries.

    * Italy had the lowest percentage of deaths associated with “non-treatment” at 6 percent.
    * In five of the six European countries decisions not to treat were made in more than 20 percent of deaths.
    * In Switzerland, a wealthy country with a very sophisticated, modern medical system, non-treatment was reported in 41 percent of deaths.

    Although the United States was not included in the study, LeWine suspects that doctors in our country withhold or withdraw treatment even less frequently than the Italians.

    Why are things so different in America? According to LeWine, one can point to many possible explanations, such as the positive, optimistic, never-say-die American spirit (overall a very good attribute for society); the incredible medical advances that we hear and read about every day; the dramatic medical saves in the movies and on television; and how the rare story of a person waking up from a prolonged coma overshadows the thousands kept alive by tube feedings.

    Source: Howard LeWine “Treatments Withheld at End of Life,” Intelihealth.com, March 1, 2005; and Bosshard et al., “Forgoing Treatment at the End of Life in 6 European Countries,” Archives of Internal Medicine, Vol. 165, Issue 4, February 28, 2005.

    For text:

    http://www.intelihealth.com/IH/ihtIH/WSIHW000/24479/36146/413074.html?d=dmtContent

85. #85
    On August 19th, 2009 at 10:14 pm, jsmiddleton4 said:

    Misrepresentation dim….

    At the end of life IV fluids can be painful and create all kinds of problems for dying patients and can be quite cruel. If you have a patient who is dying and the chart shows they did not get IV fluids, that does not therefore mean a patient was killed, as you imply with your article, by inappropriately denying treatment.

    In fact not giving IV fluids might have been and often is caring and humane.

    The assumption is everyone who is dying deserves to have all sorts of “stuff” done to them and if you find statistics that show “stuff” was not done to them, those statistics prove we need to be afraid of “death panels” is the kind of bait and switch use of statistics the left uses all the time.

    Same for nutrition. As a human body dies the insides die and shut down as well as the symptoms of death and dying you see on the outside. If you dump a bunch of nutrition into a dying person’s body you bloat their gut and overwhelm their digestive system and create a great deal of discomfort including dumping syndrome and uncontrollable diarrhea.

    So if all you death panel folks come near the folks I love or myself and force me or them to take IV fluids or nutrition so that you feel better, I’ll kick the living crap out of you dude for causing pain and suffering to those I love or myself.

    The group of folks who are driving this death panel stuff have crossed over into the kind of warping and misrepresentation that is disgusting. As a group you folks need to get some facts straight before the scare tactics.

86. #86
    On August 19th, 2009 at 10:28 pm, Leatherneck said:

    Only persons with morality should be in office. These Lefturd/CFR types are a curse on this nation.

87. #87
    On August 19th, 2009 at 10:54 pm, Dimsdale said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 10:14 pm, jsmiddleton4 said:

    Point taken. But why the national disparity?

88. #88
    On August 19th, 2009 at 11:18 pm, Republicanvet said:

    On August 18th, 2009 at 11:22 pm, ThackerAgency said:

    The problem with the debate is the approach. The media and left talk about health care as it relates to health insurance premiums.

    The problem is not the premiums. The problem is the claims.

    The reason any semblance of a public option is a non-starter for conservatives is that everyone on the public option will become a LIABILITY of the government budget.

    If the government option doesn’t bring in enough money to pay claims, the taxpayer will have to bail it out. . . private insurance companies would be bankrupted.

    Public option increases government LIABILITY that future generations will be required to pay. The current generation should never KNOWINGLY force the next generation to pay for their mistakes.

    I bet the same thing happens with a public option that happened with GM and the UAW. They kept giving themselves better and better benefits while ignoring the piling up of the unfunded mandate.

    Zombie voters will keep voting better and better care for themselves until it too would be ruined.

    Can you imagine 535 + 100 members of Congress all slipping in their amendments to a bill to provide additional coverage for their pet groups?

89. #89
    On August 19th, 2009 at 11:33 pm, Republicanvet said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:50 am, Flyoverman said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 9:18 am, imjustsaying said:

    This is reminiscent of the cozy relationship that Halliburton had with Bush/Cheney.

    Well that’s good you feel that way. Based on your indignation and profession of moral equivalency I am sure you will not care that we have a full investigation of this by an independent counsel.

    Calling Patrick Fitzgerald………

    Investigations of any ties between Cheney, Halliburton and whether anything cozy went on between them after Cheney got to the WH went on throughout Bush’s ENTIRE TERM.

    IIRC I read a news article just a couple months ago on one of the last issues they were digging into…and found nothing.

    imjustsaying should shut off Mommie’s computer and go to bed.

    This will not garner much in the drive-by media, and will be totally off the radar in a week.

90. #90
    On August 19th, 2009 at 11:53 pm, Republicanvet said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 12:19 pm, Mainah said:

    Zeke Emanuel has supposedly been misquoted and misunderstood on rationing healthcare. Notsomuch

    http://www.ncpa.org/pdfs/PIIS0140673609601379.pdf

    WOW. To see people in such positions to so coldly and flippantly discuss such things is truly shocking.

    …and published in January 09.

    Yet BHO and his sycophants claim there would be no death panels or rationing.

91. #91
    On August 19th, 2009 at 11:58 pm, Republicanvet said:

    On August 19th, 2009 at 1:11 pm, GladzKravtz said:

    Lgm, you know this health care ‘reform’ as so far proposed will hurt you too.

    There just won’t be enough doctors/nurses/techs to handle the additional people. It’s a very simple concept. You will be hurt too.

    lgm is too stupid to realize that. I am sure he/she/it firmly believes he/she/it is part of the elite that will not be affected by the thugs policies.

    …or he/she/it will just blame Bush.

92. #92
    On August 20th, 2009 at 12:19 am, Roland said:

    The group of folks who are driving this death panel stuff have crossed over into the kind of warping and misrepresentation that is disgusting. As a group you folks need to get some facts straight before the scare tactics.

    YOU have just badly misrepresented the point about the death panels. NO ONE here is talking about MAKING people accept care, and I haven’t heard it anywhere else either.

    It is about not letting the GOVERNMENT decide whether we get the care.

    Pay attention.

93. #93
    On August 20th, 2009 at 2:16 am, Danceswithdachshunds said:

    Well well, looky who has kind of joined the chorus here, (day late dollar short )… Associated Press
    
    Firms with Obama ties profit from health push

94. #94
    On August 20th, 2009 at 2:27 am, Danceswithdachshunds said:

    lgm said:

    Challenge to lgm – Give us just one good reason the American People should not be fearful of a government run health plan that the Elitists in Power, (aka democrats in Congress), have EXEMPTED THEMSELVES from being forced to use?

    Lord knows constituents have asked that very same question to their representative democrats at hundreds of open forums across the country over the last few weeks – AND NOT ONE HAS ANSWERED IT THUSFAR…

    Can you?

95. #95
    On August 20th, 2009 at 7:58 am, Dimsdale said:

    lgm? lgm? Bueller? Bueller?

    Can’t say much for a guy that comes in, craps, then leaves, without so much as an admission that he is wrong in Obama proportions.