“In today’s world the blather about free trade, free markets & the joys of competition is nothing but pablum for the suckers.”
Who said it?
President Obama’s manufacturing czar, Ron Bloom — just one of the Democratic Socialists of America-tied radicals spotlighted in Trevor Loudon’s latest dossier.
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He’s partly right. As long as the corporations are running the show, it’s just a carrot on a stick.
Additionally, free trade is a quick path to third world status.
The constitution allowed for tariffs for a reason. Fair trade could fix us, but free trade sure won’t.
Wait until they try to change the name of the Democratic Party to the Democratic Socialist of America Party.
Though I don’t think they have the stones to try that yet. Oh… they want to do it…. but they’re afraid they haven’t desensitized America sufficiently, as they have with several other issues like our debt and his Czars.
They can have their stupid socialist parties. They can’t have our government!!!!
LOL—okily dokily
Let’s just say, anyone who looks like that should never call anyone a ‘sucker’.
Right out of Rules for Radicals, use the terminology the population understands and what your opposition wants to hear.
Everyone should read Walter Williams today. Capitalism vs. Socialism/Marxism.
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=110646
pablum for the suckers — Same as “As seen on TV”.
The medium is the message, you aren’t supposed to listen.
As an investment professional, I agree with that statement. We have just witnessed our government roll over on the banks. “Too big to fail” is now the official regulatory policy whereby it means that the big banks are now free to do whatever they want and if the mess up again, they are entitled to another bailout. To wrap this in a blanket of legitimacy by citing “free markets” is an intellectual fraud. If we can’t regulate these guys, we are enslaved to their whims.
I am not defending this communist but only remind people that there is always a truth at the core of what drives our enemies. It was the very failures of prior periods of unfettered capitalism that legitimized Karl Marx’ theories. Unregulated capitalism is not wise. If you’ve ever played the game “Risk”, or “Monopoly”, you understand. We are a free country because of our commitment to our Constitution, not to the senseless rape of our economy by a few wealthy and powerful GLOBAL interests.
Wake up America. Particularly you ostensible “conservatives” who use the term “deregulation” as a shibboleth.
People like me are now getting buried in new fees and costly requirements which represent the social costs (inefficiencies) of allowing unfettered capitalism to run rampant pretending that it is efficient. A virtuous society is efficient. Debauchery is not only economically inefficient, it is evil.
Pablum for the suckers = opiate of the masses.
Meaning he thinks it’s something that smart people know better than to believe.
Meaning he thinks it’s something the ruling classes use to delude the idiot bitter clingers into thinking there’s hope for them.
Meaning nothing really. Just more arrogant, self-serving noise from one of the usual suspects.
So, the game is fixed, you’re not going to win, don’t bother trying, just give up? Thank God we have big government and big unions to take care of us!
What a pathetic spineless, sackless POS!
Every once in a while, they tell the truth.
Other examples of “pablum for the suckers”:
1. Change you can believe in
2. 95% of Americans will not have their taxes raised.
3. I will close Gitmo
4. Nothing gets past Sheriff Joe
5. Illegal aliens won’t be covered by health care bill
6. Abortions won’t be covered by health care bill
Need I go on?
***
HI NJ-AVIATOR–Your comment on “rebranding” our two major political parties is dead on target. I think of the “democrat” party as the LIBERAL / SOCIALIST / STATIST / MARXIST / COMMUNIST party. It seems to fit most of our Senators and Representatives pretty well.
***
I think of the “republican” party as the PRO BUSINESS (kinda) CONSERVATIVE party. Although they have definitely gone RINO on us. Both parties are full of CORRUPTOCRATS who sell us out for their personal gain. Most have made themselves rich at taxpayer expense.
***
The name that is missing is the PRO AMERICA party. Maybe the conservatives can take back the Republican party from the RINO’s and rename it the American Conservative party. And the CORRUPTOCRAT or SOCIALIST / STATIST / MARXIST / AMERICAN COMMUNIST tags fit the democrats pretty well. Pick one or more of the above–they all seem to apply.
***
Oh–also rename the “mainstream” print and TV media the AMERICAN PRAVDA.
***
John Bibb
***
So he thinks Capitolism is pablum?
Let’s see how much is manufactured without the incentive of Capitalism. Who or what is going to pay for all those goodies Socialists and Marxists want to hand out? Will they wave a wand and make them materialize? Oh, no..they will have to make people go to work next. `You, Couch Potato, Get to the Factory. You eat to much junk food on the couch anyway. We’re only doing what’s best for you…’
We are witnessing the defeat of their antiquated ideas.
The socialist/communist countries are going capitalist, because the old system failed, and capitalism works. This government believes in the opposite. If others get burned putting their hands on a hot stove, you don’t go trying it, expecting a different result. Let’s be truthful, government. It’s all about power with you elites in charge, isn’t it?
I love Michelle, but on “Free Trade” I’m afraid we part ways.
I’m for “Fair Trade” that is, trade with Countries who’s pay scale is equivelent to ours.
I grew up in Central N.Y. a place Michelle aught to travel too. Look how great “Free Trade” has been to the common man, with help of course, from Unions.
General Motors – Closed
Carrier Corp. – Manufacturing closed
Chrysler – Gone
New Process Gear – Going soon
Oneida Royal Heater – Gone
Oneida Ltd. Silver swiths – Made in China
Rever Ware – Gone
Catarpilar – Gone
General Electric – a shell of it’s former self
Kodak – ditto
Xerox – ditto
Chicago Pneumatic – ditto
Oneida Furniture – gone
and on and on.
I now live in N.C., and have worked for a contract manufacturer for 12 years. In 2000, we had 6 buildings, and over 5,250 employees. We now have 1 building and under 400 employees. Our customers, have moved most everything to China or Mexico.
When NAFTA was signed, we were promised a trade Surplus. But what we got was higher Trade Deficits every year. Same with CAFTA. Both destroyed the Souths Textile Industry.
So, it’s quite understandable how people who don’t make their living in the real world, would have such views. Limbaugh and others share that view.
We lost one third of our manufacturing base under Bush, with Obama, I expect it to be another 40% or so.
This was once a VERY self suficient country. But free trade and greed are turning us into a Third World Country.
“A communist is someone that reads Marx and Lenin. An anti-communist is someone that understands Marx and Lenin.”
– Ronald Reagan
That an Obama czar says such things does not surprise me one bit. However, some of the comments here so far astonish me.
Whatever problems we may be having with trade and with businesses we’ve let become too big to fail, and whatever disagreements we may have about how to deal with those problems, anyone who does not understand how fundamentally anti-freedom the bashing of competition and the importance of free markets is is no conservative. More like communist.
But..Tarrifs are not the answer. Sadly, there is no answer other than elimination of Corporate Taxes. But we can not expand Government without that revenue. So, we are out of luck either way.
Bush suspended capitalism to save it, Ha, Ha, Obama kept it suspended because he’s a communist. Either way, Bi Partisonship killed us.
Hey, didn’t he play Cameron in Ferris Bueller’s Day Off?
No. Pass the FairTax. It replaces all taxes with a national consumption tax. That means that business will no longer have to deal with taxes levied directly on them.
Consumers pay all taxes anyway. Currently, business may have a tax burden, but the consumers actually pay that tax.
Free business from the ravages of having the tax burden and we would all be a lot better off.
The Fair Tax also functions as a ‘tariff’ like the Value Added Tax used by Europe and increasingly by much of the rest of the world (against us). Products we produce here to sell elsewhere aren’t burdened by it.
On September 23rd, 2009 at 10:43 am, NJ-Aviator said:
I like that! Then we could call them Dezis.
Bet you he has never worked a day in his life. Another parasite on the labor of Americans.
You realize that it is unfair right? Tell me how people who are retired or near retirement are going to pay this tax. Rent will have to be taxed, so will the cost of houses. It is double taxation. The same person who has supported this country by paying income tax all his life, would now have to pay from his savings (after tax) as he spends it during his later years.
I know that there are considerable numbers of stupid people in the world and in America in particular, but this guy is actually what I would call willfully ignorant. He knows the truth but his plans and those of his boss are incompatible with it.
Their quest for power is through deceit, coercion, and intimidation, having nothing to do with the economy or the interests of the American people. Never mind the Constitution. But I am absolutely convinced that they will easily resort to violence if they feel insulated from the consequences of it. For now they are content with using the tools of soft tyranny – as Mark Levin would say. This dude and his friends in the Obama Administration are extraordinarily dangerous on many levels.
It has a ‘pre-bate’ that keeps it from being regressive, and retired people with high incomes still have to pay taxes on their incomes, though it is true it would seem to screw people who had put their money in any income tax free vehicle like a Roth IRA or a muni bond.
ANY change will naturally have a negative impact on anyone who was trying to avoid taxes under the old system.
I agree with Phil. But at the center of both evils is the heart of man. It’s just that “social progressives” insulate their evil with the mantle of “government”. It doesn’t make the evil into good, it just changes it’s face.
In spite of that, the best economic system is a properly regulated free market, not command and control communism/socialism. The problem is unfettered politicians.
Time to address the real problem. And I have a simple thought.
Change the loophole the president is using to hire these ‘czars’. Force all new positions, ones that are claimed to not fit under existing cabinet positions, to be direct reports to the chief of staff.
This would still allow the president to create ‘floating’ positions as he deems appropriate, but it would also force senate oversight, confirmation, and what will ultimatly be the accountabliity of the actions, of these czars.
Roland: I have a feeling your comment was directed at me in part. Please elaborate. And let me ask you one question: Do you think it is fair for authoritarian countries to dump cheap products into America, suck out our jobs and the capital that created those jobs in the first place? In other words, do you think fairness matters in “free” trade? And please skip the usual mindless rhetoric and mantras. If you understand communism, and I do, you shouldn’t find any problem with what I said. Capitalism is NOT an all-encompassing ideology. It’s an economic tool that should strenghthen our constitutional democracy. We are using very poorly these days and our economy is getting gutted by grossly unfair competition.
Given this guy is talking about how things are today, I dare say he is not too far off base in today’s world.
That does not mean what he is looking at today is anything close to what free markets, competition, etc., were SUPPOSE to look like. We have not have free markets and free competition for some time.
I could probably say the same for conservative ideology. So if some Republican folks win majorities and they reduce the size of government back to the Bush years, that is not progress and we are still not able to say we have a government that is reflective of conservative ideals.
Phil, you make a terrible mistake when you confuse the problems with trade with the basic issues of freedom (which must include freedom of enterprise at its core).
When we are dealing with other nations we must remember those nations will do what is in their national interest without regard to issues of freedom, so we must also do so or we will get chewed up. The globalists do not understand (or do not care) about national interests or cultural conflicts and so on. If we get beat up to China’s advantage, then they make even more money on their China investments.
My objection to your comment had to do with the subject of MM’s post. THAT GUY is bashing freedom.
FOCUS, Phil. Our horrid trade policy is the LEAST of our worries now that the American Voter has elected a socialist and profoundly anti-American, anti-freedom government.
“Do you think it is fair for authoritarian countries to dump cheap products into America, suck out our jobs and the capital that created those jobs in the first place?”
Let’s be clear here Phil. We did that in a large part to ourselves. Is ALL of what has happened with countries dumping cheap products into our market on us? No, of course not. But in a large part we went to the store and bought the product that was 5 dollars less cause we wanted to save money which lead US based companies to start to have to manufacture over seas to stay competitive in the market.
We on our own did the most to create the current situation in which China and the “Walmart model” rule.
So don’t be too busy pointing that finger out there are those “countries” who did this to us.
And secondly phil our own government made a very hostile environment for industry. Hostile in many ways. The only way many of these companies could stay afloat and answer to their share holders was to get out of the U.S.
Again hardly the fault of other countries dumping products into the U.S.
We can’t do a dang thing about other countries. But we can change our own.
Focus, focus, focus.
Thanks for giving Trevor Loudon the credit he deserves for his indispensable research.
Out Beck on this.
It will be dealt with.
RWR
http://www.rightwingrocker.com
The most pro-America platform I’ve seen is this one (mine) – the “Federalist” Party.
There’s already a “Conservative Party”. Here is their platform.
Enjoy!
Both are head and shoulders above either The Donks or the Phants.
RWR
http://www.rightwingrocker.com
I never was a huge believer in free trade because it immediately put US manufacturers on an uphill slope. US mfrs have to deal with EPA, OSHA, labor unions, etc. Fair trade would work for me; free trade is just giving our prosperity away for nothing.
Pat Buchanan recently had a good line; he referred to WalMart as the China Factory Outlet.
Hey b-cat thanks for that link.
Williams is amazing in every way!
RWR
http://www.rightwingrocker.com
You’re most welcome, just trying to do my part to inform our side with relevant arguments. Williams is amazing indeed.
Buchanan,Savage, Paul, Chuck Baldwin, etc. The Neo CONS hate them. I think it’s because they poke gaping holes in the free trade argument. And they do it with facts, which really pisses them off. So, for the most part, the neo CONS ignore them.
The Constitution Party seems the only choice left. But the neo CONS, rather than embrace them, will continue to put their trust and faith in the “R” Jersey…
I see a lot of people suggestion Obama is pushing us toward Socialism or communism, however perhaps Fascism might be more accurate. Communism and Socialism refer to equality, there is no equality in Obama’s agenda, only more power and money for himself and his elite friends.
There is nothing altruistic about Obama or most politicians. I believe in his perfect world there would be the “Elite” ruled by “O” and plebs, the all encompassing lower class who do nothing if it does not support the “elites” and their wishes. After all if you are not an elite you can not possible know what is best for yourself much less the country. Not the kind of government I believe almost all Americans from the founding fathers forward would ever think of supporting.
Sheesh, there is no such thing as a “fair” tax or “fair” trade or “fair” anything else. “Fair” is not in the Constitution and for damn good reason. There isn’t a person in the world (and certainly on this site) who can define “fair,” other than the usual meaning — benefits me and my friends by screwing everybody else. To hell with “fair.” The best tax policy is to keep the tax incidence low. The best trade policy is to open the borders to the free flow of goods (not persons as I assume someone will eagerly misread me). Do we have to throw out over two centuries of economic knowledge just because of the blather of some hamheaded Obama adviser?
And as for a new name for the democrats, the Neo-Socialist Democrat Party of America works fine for me — that’s right, NSDAP. Look it up and have at it.
The bas!ards have OUR GOVERNMENT from top to bottom–it is up to us and only us to stop them from taking the whole damn country into generations of slavery to the state.
IF Obama and company try to Chicago or cancel the 2010/12 elections your obligations will be clear. Little things will not matter.
And yes Fascism might be more accurate.
Wow! I like that!
The problem is unfettered politicians and not unfettered markets.
Is that original?
So, according to you, because we screw our citizens and businesses through oppressive regulation and taxation, it’s only fair that other countries screw their citizens and businesses too?
You live in a fantasyland. There is no such thing as fair trade. Besides, who gets to decide what’s fair and what isn’t? The same flawed human beings you feel can’t be left to decide what’s best in a free market scenario.
Oh, and I’ll let you in on another reason why you’re living in a fantasyland: the free market you wrongly assume caused our problems doesn’t exist in this country. We don’t HAVE a free market.
Rogue—–I was thinking along the lines of a slightly diminished Neidermeyer, from ‘Animal House’…
and spittle probably flies from his mouth when he speaks.
“Fair Trade” can be a trap too- countries that lock us out through devious means-European Union for example-are not really Most Favored in my book. Their Value Added Tax rebate on exports but added to American imports is a definite subsidy.
That we import ANYTHING from Viet Nam frosts me big time. Just what did Hanoi have on John McCain? They certainly display him favorably on their Embassy Web Page.
Fair Trade/Free Trade somebody has to make sure we are not importing our own demise.
On September 23rd, 2009 at 2:47 pm, spaceycakes said:
Rogue—–I was thinking along the lines of a slightly diminished Neidermeyer, from ‘Animal House’…
and spittle probably flies from his mouth when he speaks.
mmmm I … don’t … knowwww…. Did I plagiarize someone? If not then I’m the blind squirrel who found a nut. I have a million of ‘em. Especially right before I go to sleep and right before I wake up. I think I could be a genius.
I am a theoretically an advocate of “free trade.” I think fundamentally “free trade” is “fair trade.”
The problem I see is that what we call “free trade” isn’t even close to “free trade.” There is little “free” or “fair” about the WTO. It is just another monstrous bureaucracy created by equally incompetent government bureaucrats…
The USA used Tariffs for over 150 years to build this country into economic powerhouse the likes the world has ever seen.Since we have adopted the so called free trade policies we have allowed foreign competitors to destroy one industry after another in the name of free trade.
So your saying that it is fair trade to allow predatory economic policies by foreign countries to destroy our industries.
They have been picking our manufacturing industries off one by one since the 1960′s and Congress has aided and abetted their predatory practices by signing unconstitutional free trade agreements.
Under GWB we lost over 5.5 million manufacturing jobs thanks to NAFTA.The exact opposite of what he said would happen. Ross Perot was right about the consequences.
The latest is the China Inc tire industry dumping goods here at below cost to destroy our tire manufacturers.Just like every other industry they have destroyed here they then raise their prices after they destroy our industries.
Me thinks you are the one that lives in fantasy land.I bet you believe in out sourcing too.
Who said, “the key to creativity is to obscure your sources…”
(raises hand) I did!
Well, doesn’t that sort of contradict the point of it…
In that case I am the world’s muse…
I didn’t really, I only said that because I thought you were going to give me a treat.
Back to this little twerp. I bet they all thought getting the opportunity to play your very own socialist dictator would be a lot tougher than this. Just get the Chief Dictator to appoint you as Associate Dictator. Wow. What genius!
Goes to show you how effective a few million stupid, poorly educated and/or self-interested “voters” can be. Good Golly this new government is the stuff of nightmares. What sensible Founder could have possibly thought to guard against this?
“…a pledge pin?!…”
Obama is going to do you a treat, mate!
Mr. Deaux, may I add…
7. There are no death panels
8. This will be the most transparent admininstration ever…
9. I have not been following ACORN
10. I am not for a single payer system
i am all for free trade, as long as every nation plays by the same rules. one country can’t peg it’s money to the dollar to give itself an artificially cheap product line, and countries can’t set up bs barriers like germany with iso9000 or japanese inspection plans. RECIPROCITY! if you do it to our products, we will do it to yours. europe is forever whining and going to court over microsoft’s monopoly, but they conveniently forget that companies must use sap formats for work in europe, which is of course the same thing. mr prez needs to eliminate about 90% of the u.s. regulations, and enforce fair trade rules that are the same for each nation big and small. he can then equalize our business taxes with the rest of the world and the migration would be back to the u.s., not out of the u.s.
True enough, but it doesn’t really matter.
In any of the above, the power is concentrated in the government and the people are screwed.
RWR
http://www.rightwingrocker.com
All you “fair trade” vs “free trade” advocates ought to ponder the real role of the government in this for a few seconds.
The problem is not a lack of tarriffs on imported goods. It is the regulatory, legal and tax burdens we have placed on American industry. There is no level playing field, and there never will be. No other country has a government stupid enough to strangle its own productivity.
In New York state, one in every seven workers is a government employee. Logically, that means one seventh of your pay supports them. Then take a quick look at the private sector: furloughs, pension elimination, outsourcing. Meanwhile, government pay and benefits grow. Every government employee will say they deserve it and are essential. So what? We can no longer afford to pay for it.
Welcome to the third world, America. You voted for it, and you will get it.
Marx, Lenin, Stalin, Dear Leader, Castro etc. couldn’t have put it better.
I guess we know what his qualification for the job were…
The closest thing to free trade is the trade which exists among the fifty US states. I totally support this free trade and believe it has contributed mightily in making the US wealthy.
Our free trade allows for the free movement of goods, services and capital. In addition, it allows for the free movement of people (labor) across state lines.
Because of the latter, I cannot support free trade among nations. I do not want to allow our labor markets to be undercut by people being able to move to the US at will.
Each round of trade talks manages to include more items under its umbrella. We have long had manufactures, they added financial services, and are always working on agriculture. Eventually the issue of the free movement of labor will come up, and I am worried it too will be included.
I support international trade. I just want to make sure we don’t go down the wrong path and end up with something most of us would not support.
Why are all these Obama Czars quite so nasty and unpleasant people?
Know him by the people he surrounds himself with, so we are told by Obama.
Also, I note that advocates of “free markets” are also “open borders” types who think the U.S.A. belongs to some mythical land from elsewhere and think they are “wise” compared to Americans.
^^ Not intentionally insulting anyone, just my way of saying that I’ve read a lot of commenting on the internet and for the most part, the most vehement and aggressive comments who really, really demand open borders, amnesty for illegals, removal of just about any restrictions for immigration, and are focused nearly entirely on their own ethnicity (that they hold different from ‘Americans’ for the most part) also always start demanding “free markets” and “free trade”.
Versus Capitalism, a sovereign U.S.A. and fair trade (which I support). The former lot goes hand-in-hand with people who think the U.S. needs to be remade into something akin to Mexico and/or China from a few decades ago (as does this Obama Czar, what with his insulting, low-opinion remarks).