Demcare crunch time: Kill the bill and start over; Update: Medicare expansion under the bus?
Scroll for updates…
Sen. Joe Lieberman won’t vote for Harry Reid’s health care monstrosity. Democrat Sen. Ben Nelson is also balking.
Let’s hope they mean it:
In a surprise setback for Democratic leaders, Senator Joseph I. Lieberman, independent of Connecticut, said on Sunday that he would vote against the health care legislation in its current form.
The bill’s supporters had said earlier that they thought they had secured Mr. Lieberman’s agreement to go along with a compromise they worked out to overcome an impasse within the Democratic Party. But on Sunday, Mr. Lieberman told the Senate majority leader, Harry Reid, to scrap the idea of expanding Medicare and abandon any new government insurance plan or lose his vote.
On a separate issue, Mr. Reid tried over the weekend to concoct a compromise on abortion that would induce Senator Ben Nelson, Democrat of Nebraska, to vote for the bill. Mr. Nelson opposes abortion. Any provision that satisfies him risks alienating supporters of abortion rights. In interviews on the CBS News program “Face the Nation,” Mr. Lieberman and Mr. Nelson said the bill did not have the 60 votes it would need in the Senate.
Senate Democratic leaders, including Mr. Reid and Senator Charles E. Schumer of New York, said they had been mindful of Mr. Lieberman’s concerns in the last 10 days and were surprised when he assailed major provisions of the bill on television Sunday. He reiterated his objections in a private meeting with Mr. Reid. A Senate Democratic aide, perplexed by Mr. Lieberman’s stance, said, “It was a total flip-flop, and leaves us in a predicament as to what to do.”
Democrats are desperately trying to round up 60 votes and conclude Senate debate on the health care bill before Christmas.
Democrat Sen. Claire McCaskill says she’s waiting for the latest CBO scoring:
If the current healthcare compromise doesn’t bend the cost curve and bring down the deficit, it’s “back to the drawing board,” Sen. Claire McCaskill (D-Mo.) said today. McCaskill said her vote will be determined by the Congressional Budget Office analysis of Harry Reid’s new healthcare bill. “Until we get the numbers back from the Congressional Budget Office we’re all on hold,” McCaskill told Fox News Sunday. “I have to be assured that this is going to bring down the deficit and is going to bring down healthcare costs for Missouri families.”
Democrat Sen. Dick Durbin admitted he’s “in the dark” about HarryCare even though he’s part of the leadership crusading for it.
The Hill gives a rundown of the schedule crunch as Harry Reid’s panic swells:
Reid is expected to offer a manager’s amendment that would include various changes to the healthcare bill, such as a recent compromise to replace the public option with an expansion of Medicare allowing people between the ages of 55 and 64 years old to buy coverage.
Democrats would have to file a motion to cut off a GOP filibuster of the manager’s amendment; a cloture motion on the 2,074-page Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act; and finally a motion to end debate on the underlying legislative vehicle, the Service Members Home Ownership Tax Act.
Senate Democrats also have to wait for the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) to return a cost analysis on the compromise Reid brokered to replace the public option with the Medicare expansion and a new exchange national insurance plans to be administered by the Office of Personnel Management.
“The longer the CBO takes, the less time we’ll have to go home before Christmas but we need to finish this bill by Christmas and that’s our goal,” said Durbin.
Reid’s staff have told Democratic lobbyists and allies that they plan to pass the healthcare bill by Dec. 22 or 23. But to meet that timeline, Reid would have to receive a score on his manager’s amendment by early next week and would have to begin the laborious process of filing for cloture on Wednesday.
Adding to the complicated mix, Senate Democrats also have to pass important legislation that would be attached to the Department of Defense appropriations bill, including an increase of the federal debt limit and an extension of unemployment benefits, which have begun to expire for thousands of constituents.
Filing cloture and holding a final vote on this package gives Reid one fewer day of leeway.
So, where’s the GOP leadership?
Here’s GOP Sen. Mitch McConnell:
Appearing on CBS’ “Face the Nation” Sunday, McConnell said the Democrats cannot agree on what should or should not be included in the bill, such as more restrictive language on abortion, disability insurance, a public option. or a Medicare buy-in. “It’s noteworthy that you had to have three Democrats on to explain the Democratic position,” he told “Face the Nation” host Bob Schieffer. “There are more Democratic positions than you’d find in a stack of newspapers, [and] therein lies the problem.”
McConnell also sought to dispel charges that his party are obstructionists who do not want to reform the nation’s health care system.
He cited opposition to aspects of the bill that, he claimed, would cut a half-trillion dollars from Medicare, raise taxes to subsidize health coverage for the uninsured, and increase health insurance premiums for everyone else. “I think [Democrats] are in serious trouble on this, and the core problem is the American people do not want us to pass it.”
On the matter of a Medicare buy-in, in which those without insurance age 55 and up could buy into the existing government program used by people 65 and older, McConnell said, “Everyone anticipates a lot of very sick people would buy in, and it would exacerbate the problems that Medicare has.
“What we really need to do is to stop and start over, and go step-by-step to deal with the cost issue, which is what the American people thought [health reform] this was all about.”
Kill the bill.
Declare Code Red.
No more tinkering, compromises, or pussy-footing. Stop apologizing for being “obstructionist.”
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Naked Emperor News/Breitbart TV spotlight Obama’s past statements on using Medicare expansion as the Trojan Horse for universal health care:
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Update: White House wants Reid to deal with Lieberman. Democratic caucus summoned to WH meeting tomorrow.
Update: Hmmm. Are the Dems throwing Medicare expansion under the bus? Looks like it. For now:
Senate Democratic leaders said Monday that they were prepared to drop a proposed expansion of Medicare and make other changes in sweeping health legislation as they tried to rally their caucus in hopes of passing the bill before Christmas.
After a tense 90-minute meeting on Monday evening, Senator Max Baucus, Democrat of Montana and chairman of the Finance Committee, was asked if Democrats were likely to jettison the Medicare proposal.
“It’s looking like that’s the case,” Mr. Baucus said, indicating that the provision might be scrapped as a way of “getting support from 60 senators.”
Under the proposal, uninsured people ages 55 to 64 could purchase Medicare coverage. The Senate Democratic leader, Harry Reid of Nevada, floated the idea about 10 days ago as a way to break an intraparty impasse over his earlier proposal to create a government-run health insurance plan.
The signal from the party leadership came after the closed-door session to gauge sentiment for moving ahead with a pared-back measure that would not contain elements that liberal lawmakers had sought, particularly a public health insurance option.
Lawmakers and top aides said that the overriding view at the session held just off the Senate floor was that they had come too far in the health care debate to give up and that they should forge ahead with some legislation even if it was not all that they wanted.
After the meeting, lawmakers said they believed that chances were increased for completing a health care bill and that a final product would be a substantial improvement over the current system.
“If you compared it to the alternative, it looks good,” said Senator Sheldon Whitehouse, Democrat of Rhode Island, about the prospect of moving ahead with a measure that does not have a public health insurance option. “If you compare it to the possibilities, it looks pretty sad.”
Democrats were scheduled to meet Tuesday at the White House with President Obama to discuss health care. The party meeting in the Capitol came at a crucial time since the leadership must begin taking procedural steps if Democrats hope to reach a final vote on a health care plan sometime next week.
At a brief news conference after the caucus meeting, Mr. Reid refused to answer questions. He said: “This is like a steeplechase race. The last big puddle is in front of us.”
Senator Tom Harkin, Democrat of Iowa and chairman of the health committee, appeared to be laying the groundwork for a decision to abandon the Medicare buy-in.
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DNR – Do NOT Resuscitate.
If this thing goes down, this would be my Christmas present. KILL THE BILL!
L
Democrats are evil. Not just wrong, but evil. They are Demonrats.
Hey, all you libs on here: You’re evil.
Real Americans hate you. Real Americans oppose Odumbo.
Calling a LIAR a LIAR might be a start. Call a RINO a RINO would be nice. I guess we need ALL the Republican votes right now-but not at the cost of eventually throwing them under our bus.
DINGY HARRY WANTS YOU
under his statist thumb
I don’t believe the media that insists this is dying. I believe they are only reporting that so that we’ll stop calling them.
They’re very busy doing very important things, you know. That telephone is just an annoyance.
Ah… but you all are missing one of the political tactical angles of the move to make this an expansion of Medicare…
Medicare is an existing program, thus this becomes a BUDGET BILL… and Reid will the Nuclear Option and circumvent Senate Rules for regular bills…
He only needs 50 this way.
It’s past time to set the reset button.
This is huge legislation and it has so many problems.
I’m convinced the spirit of Satan commands and controls the Democrat Party. Individually, a fair number of them may be decent enough people at home, but collectively they are damning our nation to hell.
While the photo above is appropriate, I think a bigger mallet may be needed to get that stake through the heart.
anything that takes 2000 pages of legaleze to write isn’t a bill, it’s a scam. the constitution of the united states barely covers 20 pages of handwritten legaleze. the 10 commandments were written on 2 tablets. this monstrosity is just a way to baffle the country with crap and give every crapweasel politician cover after his/her vote to say “i didn’t know that was in there, i wouldn’t have voted for it if i had known.”
Kill the bill and leave my health care alone, period and end of story.
Time to begin criminal proceedings against these people with Obama at the head of the pack. Where are the Republican and Independent leaders on this? Have daily press conferences on all this crap until the lid blows off. This is a nightmare….
What of the payoff to Soros re: the Brazil/China offshore oil deal? We’ve got to see these people in the can, and soon, or America is finished.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203863204574346610120524166.html
This bill has no heart.
After listening to Lieberman yesterday, I don’t trust him. No one has read the bill as everyone is merely fighting over the topical additions to it. Yet, Lieberman keeps saying that this is essentially a good bill because “95% of what is in it is good”. He includes extending Medicare benefits down to those 55 years old. More Kabuki theater.
Let Uma Thurman kill this bill.
Not a single one of them has questioned the Constitutionality of this bill. They should all be purged! The Dems disgust me, but the flaccid GOP disgusts me even more.
I just wish Snowe and Collins would make similar statements – and mean it. Right now, it’s conceivable for them to counter Lieberman’s and Nelson’s no votes.
Unfortunately, too many seriously ill Americans still think this is all about lowering costs, and that it will have an immediate and direct effect on their situations.
It is easy to forget you are there to drain the swamp when you are up to your a** in alligators.
So what’s the status of the requirement for everyone to buy insurance or go to jail?
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I don’t believe that the so-called blue dog democrats, independent (aka 95% demo) Joe Lieberman, or the RINO sisters from Maine are against the ObamaCare C**P SANDWICH bill.
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It’s the squeaky wheel that gets the grease (aka dinero). They are just holding out for bigger slices of our Taxpayer money–Mary Landrieu of Louisiana style. What’s it take–how much do you want? New dam? Ambassadorship? Contribution to your favorite political group?
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Dirty Harry Reid will use the “reconciliation” (aka nuclear) option to cram this down our throats. And it will “squeak through” with just the 50 votes needed so the Senators from more conservative areas can vote against it and save their “careers”–aka fiefdoms.
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Remember their names and vote them out in 2010 and 2012. Remember those who voted to put it on the floor. SARAH’CUDA for POTUS, JOHN BOLTON for VP–the AMERICA FIRST ticket. Teaparty these CORRUPTOCRATS at all opportunities.
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John Bibb
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That’s okay. Real Americans also typically prefer Budweiser over Burgundy and made Titanic the highest grossing movie of all time, so we know how much stock to put in their opinion.
RedDog…I do believe the Republicans are trying to have press conferences…but no one covers them!! Last week, McCain had a press conference and just blasted the bill and a bunch of other stuff. FOX covered it…I turn on other stations and no one had it, not even CNN. Then later in the day, Reid had a press conference and, you guessed it, CNN, FOX, CNBC, etc. all carried it. The MSM refuse to give truth a voice. How do you fight that??
It is kind of fun watching Harry Reid become the Human Pretzel trying to contort into a position that yields 60 votes.
Not working for you Harry?
Chap—you drink Burgandy????? Is that the best a lawyer can afford these days??? I’m a Bud man–I’d even take PBR over Burgandy.
Barring any unforeseen emergency, this defeat on this BOONDOGGLE HEALTH “REFORM” is historically the most important vote the SENATE will make this session… Plain and simple, it must go down in flames… In the vernacular of BRAM STOKER, we must drive a STAKE THROUGH THE HEART of this sucka!!!
Ummm…do you know what real Burgundy is? From France? I am not talking about Carlos Rossi 3 liter jugs of dreck.
It is just a show. With only a couple of serious Senators that actually care about what’s best for the country versus Party and Personal Agenda, we are in trouble. There is no telling what is being forced on the country and slipped in behind the scenes.
Is that the one in the box?
One bum’s Burgandy is another bum’s sterno!
Real Burgundy has a twist off cap.
While I agree that we need to kill it and kill it now, we’d better be thinking of ways to kill it later if we have to. So far, its all regulation and tax, tax, tax. The entitlement is — I think — currently missing, ie., the public option. I don’t trust Lieberman, and I don’t trust Nelson, and I sure don’t trust Olympia Snowe and her ilk. Right now I wouldn’t bet against this true abortion passing, and getting made worse in conference committee to boot. My wife saw a button in a store at the airport that said, “Where are we going and why are we in this hand basket?” Pretty much sums it up.
Chap–Burgandy from France–who woulda thought. Does it come with a complimentary embossed white surrender flag??
I agree. This bill is going to pass and they will get everything they want. Why? Because their lies are covered up and the majority of the People have no clue what they are pulling. With Obama’s Chicago Mafia tactics, he is threatening, cajolling, whatever it takes to get people in line. How many dems have the balls to stand up to him. NONE!! ZERO!! They will bluster and complain in front of the cameras while at the same time cut deals and fawn all over Teh One behind closed doors. This is politics today. It has always been like that, but this time, true evil has been added to the mix. There is NO truth being told. The American People are being totally scammed and are blindly going over the cliff.
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Stay away from the Muscatel–aka “sneaky Pete”. Ditto the MD20/20, Ripple, and Night Train.
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Jack Daniels, Bud, Miller, Tecate, Dos Equis (XX), Carta Blanca, Corona, and Sangria are all on the highly quality tested Rocketman approved list. Like Du Pont used to say before they got into the Napalm business–BETTER LIVING THROUGH CHEMISTRY!
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John Bibb
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Have you noticed lately that Obama is looking more stern and militant every day? He looks downright MEAN and he frowns a lot. If a reporter asks a question he doesn’t like, his glare is truly frightening. This is a dangerous man. We are only beginning to see what he is capable of, under the guise of “loving husband and daddy”. He even chastized a fellow black democrat for “demeaning” him, merely because the guy disagreed with Teh One. That is just not acceptable to this egomaniac.
Jack Black and Shiner Bock are on the approved list and I drive a used car also. No limo for me.
I think Chap is a closet Carlo Rossi drinker. Me thinks he puts it in those foofy French wine bottles to impress.
I’m not a wine drinker. So, back to the topic, just remember to try everything you can to get in touch with these creeps. Call, e-mail, fax, etc. I know they are ignoring us. But we need to make ourselves so “in-their-faces” that they know we mean business. Our silence only encourages their delusions of grandeur.
The cost is important but it is more about freedom than anything else. I wish the Republican delegation would start talking about how this bill is stripping the American individual of his/her liberties. They can also start the discussion on how the silly climate change bill rejects American sovereignty.
TORT REFORM FIRST!
TORT REFORM FIRST!
TORT REFORM FIRST!
This should be shouted from the top of every mountain and from sea to shining sea by everyone interested at all in any health reform.
Happy–you might be when this Obamination passes. Everyone of these political whores are just waiting to get their pay off. 500 earmarks in the 1.1 trillion $$$$ budget passed Sunday while most were enjoying family or watching football. What’s the word–Thunderbird–What’s the price–50cents twice.
Don’t forget interstate insurance competition. These are the two critical elements needed and neither are even in the bill. An ammendment to cap mal-med attorney fees was defeated over the weekend.
Your post should arouse chap from his Burgandy induced slumber. Whip out the bogus stats compiled by the lawyer lobbies counselor. Can’t wait.
We have been shouting!! THEY.AREN’T.LISTENING! This is what is so freakin’ frustrating! Just listen to some of the “debates” on FOX. The republican mentions cost, abortion provision, etc. And the democrat doesn’t even acknowledge that the subject was mentioned, but instead goes into the dem talking points once again. They are completely ignoring everything that is said and just plow through full steam. This is a massive takeover and they will not be denied.
Possible, possible, but I was thinking more on the lines of Boones’s Farm Apple Wine.
A good post. And the crunch time is now for health care.
The CBO can’t possibly have numbers that are anywhere close to accurate. They have to first ESTIMATE how many people would want to get on the ‘new’ Medicare plan for people 55-64. Then they have to determine the costs (claims) of those people to the system. So they have to determine not only how many, but what type of people will elect the plan.
Once they come up with those arbitrary figures, then they can put a price tag on how much it will cost to purchase it. Of course, this is just an estimate and will be adjusted annually.
So in essence, the CBO must make up numbers to create ‘factual’ analysis on this fairy tale idea. There is no way on God’s green earth that they can come up with a number in the ballpark of reality. And chances are when they make an error, it will be on the side of ‘it doesn’t cost too much’ instead of ‘wow, this is way too expensive’.
Your theories, while intriguing, are both wrong. Vintage Bartles & James Peach Fuzzy Navel, served from a parabola decanter.
You are right, Thacker. However, they need to add to the estimate everyone that is in that age bracket that will be dropped by either their current heathcare insurer or dumped into the Medicare system by their employer to lower their own costs. I’m betting that figure would include most people in the age bracket.
Kill the bill, but do NOT start over. Not with this Congress. Not with this administration.
I’ll believe this bill fails when I see it with my two beadie brown eyes. Until then, it’s just a bunch of talk from politicans.
Nice decanter, bit pricey though. Do you know how many cans that would buy of King Cobra?
Oooo, I’ll bet that stuff would also be useful for removing old paint and varnish.
Not a single one of the stats I have produced was compiled by lawyer lobbies. in fact, not one of the stats I produced was compiled by anyone arguing against tort reform per se. I am just smart enough to put 2 (in this case being the many states that already have comprehensive tort reform) and 2 (in this case being that these states health care costs have risen at the same rate as all the other states) together to make 4 (in this case being med mal costs are too small a percentage of overall health care costs to make a significant difference).
No one has yet to produce any evidence to the contrary. The closest one has come is to cite a CBO study saying that $10 billion annually could be saved nationwide. Whoop dee do. What is $10 billion into $2.2 trillion?
Oh, and the decanter I use is like this.
Did you actually watch Titanic?
Maybe you’d like to become a French citizen so you can fully cloak yourself in your French poodle sensibilities.
Or you can stay in the good ol’ U. S. of A, bash Americans, have your gateau and eat it to. LOL
ACTION ITEM: When our Congresspeople and Senators come home for their Christmas break, MAKE SURE THEY SEE HOW MUCH SUPPORT THEIR OPPONENTS HAVE FOR THE 2010 ELECTION.
Are there any TOWN HALL MEETINGS in your area during this period?
Keep the pressure on! It is our only hope!
Yes. It was schmaltzy awfulness. If nothing else, I can never forgive it for popularizing Celine Dion.
Chaps, I agree there was a lot of schmaltz and it was not Leonardo’s best acting effort. But it had plenty of entertainment value. That’s not a bad thing.
Chap–nice decanter. Did you find it at Walmart or was it a K-mart blue light special. A 3-liter of Carlo Rossi will lighten your wallet more than that.
Just sayin’.
Back on topic (sort of).
Dennis Miller on Harry Reid:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1iJZ9SrIJ7k
What’s with the gov thinking that it’s ok to shove this legislation down our throats? Since when is it ok for the gov to deliberately put private businesses like the insurance companies out of business because they want a single payer system? Guess no one cares about saving those jobs. The government has no right to skewer us with our own money!
It’s nice when we can put aside our differences and join together in one harmonious voice and say “Titanic sucked”.
Reid shouldn’t have any trouble getting the 60 votes, have we forgotten the traitorous Snowe and Collins, along with the other deep blue RINOs ?
I think most everything Spielberg has done sucks. Especially E.T.
Couldn’t agree more, this is not just typical politics, this is a fight to SAVE our great country. If you are on the left , you are the enemy…make no mistake about it.
Odopo should not have been elected, for different reasons, starting with his birth certificate, going to his anti-American ideas. I’m smart enough to know I’m not, so I ask myself what were all these enlightened independents doing during the campaign. If I saw what this clown was for how did they miss it?
So…I take it I can scratch your name from my Solstice Celebration card list?
I liked Shindler’s List.
And Casablanca. Oh, wait…
That has become a big oxymoron.
How hard is it to go to the American people and tell them that the lower income people who will still not be able to afford coverage will be assessed a tax on their income tax. I think people would be outraged to know poor people face a penalty. Personally, I cannot figure out how my wife and I will afford it. I am unemployed and she works at a daycare for $8.50/hour (until this bill passes and they close the doors because the business will not be able to afford to insure its employees so the little people get hurt again).
The GOP is just stupid for not taking advantage of this information.
P.S. The Titanic with George C. Scott sucked too.
The GOP has been locked out of the meetings with Dems, so don’t buy into the “bipartisan” health care plan. The Dems are in violation of Amendment 28 for starters since they are excluding themselves–when have you EVER heard a Repub saying anything about this? How many Repubs even make any kind of an attempt to get their position on this health care Tax & Spend Bill on any kind of news outlet? They are ALL in on this–huge power grab and control over the American people. It.Is.Beyond.Disgusting: It’s Unconstitutional and immoral.
I wish Fox had more commentators, from their silly softball morning show on up, as strident about such a vital issue as you. I almost wish Tea Partyers could storm the Congress like the Bastille to decry the constitutionality of this monster and aid and abetting of the MSM. No wonder Fox hasn’t offered MM a perm slot somewhere in its shows and programming.
James Greenidge
Queens NY
Screw health care – what about the economy? Nobody’s done a thing about it.
I love Fox and Friends just the way it is! They get their conservative viewpoint in.
Quite amusing, watching the Democrats in Congress playing
Whack-A-Mole with all the bad ideas that keep popping up in their health care reform.
There is so much desperation among the dems to pass the healthcare bill that I am led to believe that something is afoot!
The dirt has been done.
On Hot Air, it is posted that “Lieberman Won” since the public option has been removed.
Now the vote moves forward – before they adjourn for Christmas.
Thank the dolts for their present to us, gang.
http://danielmcandrew.com
Correction: the “Medicare buy-in” has been removed.
Like. This is going to be any real difference.
I hope this is not off topics but…
Has anyone ever seen our MM and Melrose Place star Stephanie Jacobsen in the same place at the same time?!?!? Could it possibly be that MM spends her ~spare~ time doing dramatic television?
To form your own opinion, checkout the Jacobson photo in the right-hand column of Features and Faces at http://www.foxnews.com
(We gotta amuse ourselves somehow while we wait for the Dems. to announce details of their latest corrupt health care proposal.)
I heard over the radio that Lieberman will now vote FOR the bill. A deal has been worked out.
NEVER trust a liberal.
NEVER trust a blue dog.
NEVER trust a democrat.
I’ll believe it, when I see it.
Everything we’ve been seeing is just the typical Washington Kabuki Theater designed to give all the Dimocrats who have to stand for election in 2010 some semblance of political cover. This whole thing has been a “done deal” from the beginning. The Senate and House bills will be combined in the conference commitee and just enough Dimocrats in both Houses of Congress will vote for the resulting abortion so as to pass it into law. Then we can all watch as another batch of nails are pounded into the coffin containing the Constitution and our Republic, and there isn’t a thing we can do about it.
*When dealing with Democrats/Liberals I always say, “Don’t trust, then verify why”; You will never be disappointed in the end, as they will always give you the goods as it relates to that mantra!
*On a related note, more Dems are abandoning the sinking Obamatanic; Bart Gordon(TN6) announced today he will not seek reelection; That makes 2 open Dem seats right here in Tennessee(Tanner was first); Conservatism is the cure for the disease that is liberalism!
Reid, your idea to expand Medicare to those between 55 and 64 stinks. I don’t want it when I’m 65; I sure as hell don’t want it at 62.
Reid, how about you simply introduce legislation that says we get whatever you get in the way of a healthcare plan. You already know what that is so it should be easy to write up the bill and get it passed before Christmas. Mission accomplished, Reid. And you have the added benefit that you wouldn’t have to keep jawboning with Lieberman.
That would never work for them, because it doesn’t meet their agenda & isn’t in line with their processes.
The goal is to create a crisis, put forth a faux solution, & as a result grow Government using our money & therefore increase their power over the people. It’s really that simple with this administration, & their cronies. Like Coolio once said, Power & the Money, Money & the Power, Minute after Minute, Hour after Hour. It’s what dirty politicians worship & live for..