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Comments

1. #101
   On March 13th, 2010 at 5:26 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

   On March 13th, 2010 at 5:14 pm, swede said:

   If I were a gambler I’d bet they won’t do it. They are stupid enough, but not self destructive enough to try it.

   Democratic Socialist “Progressives” have been trying for about 100 years to pass socialized medicine – what Lenin called “the keystone to the arch of the socialist state”.

   The Democratic Socialist “leadership” absolutely don’t care if they have to become political martyrs (or steal elections to remain in power), as long as they pass this.

   The next 6 to 7 days will be an all out ideological war for the survival of our Constitutional Republic.

   THEN: The Manager’s Amendment will be posted online and the 72-hour clock will start (this may overlap with the 72-hour clock on the reconciliation language). When Manager’s Amendment is done final process decisions will be locked in.

   THIS MEANS: We will likely vote Friday or Saturday. (As you probably saw, POTUS pushed back the departure for his Asian trip from Thursday the 18th to Sunday the 21st; this was not a coincidence.) The Speaker has publically committed to trying to get a vote on both the reconciliation bill and the Senate bill on the same day. They are still trying to work out the final process on this and much of what we do depends on what the Senate Parliamentarian decides. You may be receiving calls about the “Slaughter Rule” and other rumors about what the process will be. Again, please understand: no decision has yet been made on the process for consideration on the House floor.

2. #102
   On March 13th, 2010 at 5:28 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

   It’s time for any “Kennedy Democrats”, who are socially liberal but at the same time anti-Communist, to stand up against this Slaughter House, and be counted as modern-day “PROFILES IN COURAGE“.

3. #103
   On March 13th, 2010 at 5:32 pm, jangar said:

   If these people bypass the Constituion and attempt to seize 1/7th of the private sector in effect by fiat, our duty is as clear as the oath we took.

   We have a different military now. Gates is as big a tool as the rest of them.

4. #104
   On March 13th, 2010 at 5:35 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

   Call them the “Malcolm X Congress”…

   … they will try to pass this “by any means necessary“…

   … but they may find “chickens coming home to roost“…

   [That is intended as an observation, NOT as a threat of any kind]

5. #105
   On March 13th, 2010 at 5:37 pm, Hadenough said:

   We need someone, anyone from the MSM (Major G., Tapper, Etc…) to pin Obama or his mouthpiece Gibbs down regarding the President’s position on this high crime. Anything less from the MSM at this point makes them complicit.

6. #106
   On March 13th, 2010 at 5:49 pm, swede said:

   If these people bypass the Constituion and attempt to seize 1/7th of the private sector in effect by fiat, our duty is as clear as the oath we took.

   Roger that. I lived in Manila during the second “EDSA Revolution” – I lived 6 blocks from the rally. Estrada had to step down when the military declared him no longer the CiC. In ’86, Marcos ordered the military to use force on the crowd. They laid down their weapons and stood with the people.

   Your stand with Nixon was corageous and correct. Do you think officers are having similar discussions now? Just curious if its gotten that far yet.

   The Democratic Socialist “leadership” absolutely don’t care if they have to become political martyrs (or steal elections to remain in power), as long as they pass this.

   I’d have to disagree RP, I think they want their jobs more than any principled agenda they want to advance. They are not political martyrs, just typical politicritters. They do not have the conviction or courage to make the stand you suggest.

7. #107
   On March 13th, 2010 at 5:56 pm, Pasadena Phil said:

   On March 13th, 2010 at 5:32 pm, jangar said:

   We have a different military now. Gates is as big a tool as the rest of them.

   You are missing the point. ALL military and police took that oath. That Gates is a political tool changes nothing. He will be issuing illegal commands that his underlings can refuse to obey.

   I have made the point several times here and elsewhere that the most important level of the military command is the colonel level. That is as high as you can go on merit alone. Generals are politicians mostly. The colonels can hear the grumbling of the troops and I am very confident that the line will hold.

   In America, the military and police are “one of us”. They will honor their oaths when the order comes to “deal” with us Tea Party protesters. They will not turn on their family and friends.

   That will be the moment of truth as we continue to lean into the government peacefully but with great numbers and openly in the streets. If the military sides with us, what will they do? Call for SEIU and LaRaza riots? Call in the UN? I’ll be shooting at blue helmets if that comes to pass. The UN without US troops is just a ragtag bunch of hooligans in uniform. They are no match for us.

8. #108
   On March 13th, 2010 at 5:56 pm, rambler said:

   Guess that oath to protect and defend the Constitution had no meaning to these Constitution shredders. If they can’t be true to their oath, they need to resign or be charged with some form of treason.

9. #109
   On March 13th, 2010 at 5:58 pm, jangar said:

   I’d have to disagree RP, I think they want their jobs more than any principled agenda they want to advance. They are not political martyrs, just typical politicritters. They do not have the conviction or courage to make the stand you suggest.

   C’mon swede, the handwriting is on the wall and they’re all dead meat this November. What they are doing is a last gasp at taking over the economy, giving us all a unique number and calling all the shots. I doubt they’ll get away with it, but it won’t keep them from trying to make a permanent grab.

10. #110
    On March 13th, 2010 at 6:01 pm, Ed Mahmoud abu al-Kahoul said:

    Pelosi will lose the gavel and her USAF Party Bus in the Sky for this, but she won’t lose her seat in the House.

    There are a number of Marxists, Obama included, willing to lose the House and maybe half the 18 seats the Demonrats are defending in 2010 for this, the question is what kind of bribes can they offer rank and file Demonrats to agree to be unemployed next January?

    Maybe senior positions in the new US National Health Service or elsewhere in the Administration. Overseas postings.

    Just have to bribe enough moderate district representing Dems to agree to lose their seats in November.

    And losing the House is obviously a price Obama is willing to pay, unless he thinks ACORN can generate enough fraud to overcome 5%, even double digit vote margins in a lot of races.

11. #111
    On March 13th, 2010 at 6:02 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    I’d have to disagree RP, I think they want their jobs more than any principled agenda they want to advance. They are not political martyrs, just typical politicritters. They do not have the conviction or courage to make the stand you suggest.

    Many of them already realize that they won’t be keeping their job, regardless of how they vote on this.

    Now, those on the fence are being highly pressured to pass this for Obama’s sake.

    The question is: will they remember that they serve in “The People’s House”, and follow the will of the people they represent, or will they follow the Democratic Socialist (Communist) leadership of their party?

    Again, it’s time for “Kennedy Democrats” to be modern-day
    “Profiles in Courage”.

12. #112
    On March 13th, 2010 at 6:09 pm, swede said:

    jangar said:
    C’mon swede, the handwriting is on the wall and they’re all dead meat this November. What they are doing is a last gasp at taking over the economy, giving us all a unique number and calling all the shots. I doubt they’ll get away with it, but it won’t keep them from trying to make a permanent grab.

    Yes sir. Exactly why Nanny can’t get the votes to do this legally and never will. Her only problem with her SF constituents is she is not liberal enough! Her seat is not in any jeopardy, yet she’s telling the others to fall on their swords for the cause, and they are telling her to go pi$$ up a rope.

    I think even calling these cretin committed socialists gives them way too much credit. They do not have the committment, courage or guts to make a principled stand. They are cowards.

    ITookTheRedPill said:
    The question is: will they remember that they serve in “The People’s House”, and follow the will of the people they represent, or will they follow the Democratic Socialist (Communist) leadership of their party?

    IMHO, neither. They will cover their own a$$es at all cost.

13. #113
    On March 13th, 2010 at 6:15 pm, Virginia Patriot said:

    You gotta see this if you haven’t, Ramirez strikes again!

    http://hotair.com/archives/2010/03/13/ramirez-on-democrats-obamacare-death-wish/

14. #114
    On March 13th, 2010 at 6:21 pm, Virginia Patriot said:

    Thanks Rags for the original link, everybody needs to see that cartoon. Ramirez is the best political cartoonist working today.

15. #115
    On March 13th, 2010 at 6:31 pm, Rogue Cheddar said:

    The House Of Representatives has been mislabelled, it’s really ‘Motel Hell’!

16. #116
    On March 13th, 2010 at 6:57 pm, beenthere said:

    Virginia Patriot said: Thanks Rags for the original link, everybody needs to see that cartoon. Ramirez is the best political cartoonist working today.

    It’s a good cartoon, but we should note that while the suicide bomber does die — by definition — he/she takes a lot more with him. Let’s face it, in the words of John Derbyshire, we are doomed. All those democrats who will go down this Fall, and who knows how many will actually be defeated by conservatives or more likely by RINOs, will enter the cushy earthly heaven of very high-paying jobs in Obama’s vast deathcare bureaucracy. Jobs for life, if you wlll, that will give them total power over your life and those whom you love.

    In the meantime, though it has hardly been noted on this site, it is now all but impossible to criticize Islam on Foxnews. I mention this seemingly unrelated fact because very few American’s will now want to enter the high-risk/much lower paying medical field, so many of our new doctors over the years will be of Islamic heritage — this is what has happened in Britain. Or people of limited ability and motivation, shall we say. They all will be good democrats, of course.

17. #117
    On March 13th, 2010 at 7:09 pm, dadinseattle said:

    This vote is against America, never forget this!
    The politicians are squirming over the vote on the health care takeover but they are also being reassured by their pied pipers that they must stand strong “for the party” and besides that remember that the voters have very short memories and November is 8 months off.

    We the people will need to make it perfectly clear that we will not forget about their vote against freedom now or ever, and we will remind other voters every chance we can between now and November and beyond. In fact we will remember and remind voters until each and every member of either chamber who did vote for this thinly disguised power grab is voted out of office no matter how long it takes.

    When you think of Obamacare think of it for what it truly is…A vote against America.

    Please make it a point to commit to reminding others about who votes or sides with this measure and who sided with our freedom and liberty!

18. #118
    On March 13th, 2010 at 7:38 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    Pelosi is moving forward because they have used “the persuasion of power” against enough representatives to have the votes to pass the “Slaughter Solution”.

    Pelosi simply won’t bring a vote to the floor unless she knows in advance that she has the votes.

    The only time that I am aware of where she lost a vote in this session of Congress was when she did her “Blame Bush!” tirade speech, in front of the C-SPAN cameras, immediately before the vote. Nanzi ticked off a few Reps who flipped their votes. She was publicly embarassed, and she’ll never let that happen again if she can help it.

    We have to make our disgust with this “Slaughter Solution” clear, then hope and pray that there are enough Democratic Representatives who are uneasy with the agreement they made with Pelosi to vote for this Unconstitutional deceipt, and who choose to “do the right thing” and secretly decide to vote “No” when the floor vote is taken.

19. #119
    On March 13th, 2010 at 7:47 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    This is fairly obvious, but deserves consideration…

    Obama promised NOT to do Healthcare Reform with a
    “Fifty plus one” vote.

    Now they want to pass Healthcare with ZERO votes in the House and “Fifty plus one” in the Senate.

    Barry, YOU LIE!

    If Barry were truly “post-partisan”, he would have them start over and craft a new bill, done transparently with 100% of negotiations covered by C-SPAN, which could gain passage with at least 60% YES votes in both houses.

    But Barry is no “post-partisan” centrist…

    Ayers is a Violent, Revolutionary Communist.
    What is Obama?

20. #120
    On March 13th, 2010 at 8:33 pm, jangar said:

    If Barry were truly “post-partisan”, he would have them start over and craft a new bill, done transparently with 100% of negotiations covered by C-SPAN, which could gain passage with at least 60% YES votes in both houses.

    Nothing post-partisan about him. His mission is clear – to take down the world’s superpower from within, level the playing field.

    These are extraordinary times we live in, looking toward the eastern sky…

21. #121
    On March 13th, 2010 at 8:35 pm, RogerCfromSD said:

    Isn’t attempting to subvert the Constitution an act of treason? Seriously!

    Aren’t the Democrats breaking their oaths to uphold the Constitution with this gambit of theirs?

22. #122
    On March 13th, 2010 at 8:41 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 8:35 pm, RogerCfromSD said:

    Yes, and Yes.

23. #123
    On March 13th, 2010 at 8:59 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    The Congressional Oath of Office:

    I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter: So help me God.

24. #124
    On March 13th, 2010 at 8:59 pm, swede said:

    Nothing post-partisan about him. His mission is clear – to take down the world’s superpower from within, level the playing field.

    These are extraordinary times we live in, looking toward the eastern sky…

    Which will make his utter failure to do so – and fading into obscurity – that much sweeter. Do you honestly believe Americans are going to sit down, shut up and do what this cretin tells us? Not going to happen. I think this country is much stronger than these pukes.

    “Snake Oil” salesmen made a good living, but dared not stay in town long. When people found their hopeychangey alixer to be useless, they would be tarred, feathered and run out of town on a rail. We are already coming back. If they try this Slaughter Snake Oil – tar and feathers time!

25. #125
    On March 13th, 2010 at 9:14 pm, Pasadena Phil said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 8:59 pm, swede said:

    This guy is not going to fade into obscurity. He will become a cultural Marxist hero whose myth will grow with each passing year. He will be in great demand on the international lecture circuit. Hollywood will make movie after movie about him. The truth will not prevail unless we impose a complete change of culture in DC.

    We need to purge all incumbents and start fresh with a clear mandate of smaller government. We also need to begin criminal investigations into what has been going on and be willing to put most of these traitorous criminals in prison.

26. #126
    On March 13th, 2010 at 9:15 pm, Flyoverman said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 5:49 pm, swede said:

    Do you think officers are having similar discussions now? Just curious if its gotten that far yet.

    I would hope so Swede. I find the Oathkeepers organization intriguing. I worry about them being a fringe ground, but their apparent charter is compelling.

    What I find frightening is the willingness of Democrats, to watch what is happening and say nothing. You now have a thorough understanding of how Western, educated nation like Italy and Germany could end up the way they did in the 1930′s.

27. #127
    On March 13th, 2010 at 9:40 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    This guy is not going to fade into obscurity. He will become a cultural Marxist hero whose myth will grow with each passing year.

    Watch this:

    PJTV: The Power & Danger of Iconography

    Then look at this Obama game-plan:

    The Final March for Reform

28. #128
    On March 13th, 2010 at 9:43 pm, fulldroolcup said:

    Nothing Obama signs carries any weight of law, because he is not Constitutionally qualified to hold the office. (“his Kenyan citizenship” and British subjecthood at birth disqualify him, regardless of where he was born)

    I am so fracking sick of reading this utterly unsupported and insupportable position.

    Per wikipedia:

    In the case of United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898), the Supreme Court ruled that a person becomes a citizen of the United States at the time of birth, by virtue of the first clause of the 14th amendment of the Constitution, if that person is:

    * Born in the United States
    * Has parents that are subjects of a foreign power, but not in any diplomatic or official capacity of that foreign power

    Title 8 of the U.S. Code, Section 1401, further defines the following as people who are automatically “citizens of the United States at birth:”

    •Anyone born inside the United States (aside from those who parents are here as diplomats or other capacity in service of a foreign government).

    Anyone claiming that a person born in the U.S. and a “citizen at birth” under the 14th amendment and the statute is not legally “natural-born” needs to offer statutory provisions OR a holding, not dicta, of the US Supreme Court.

    Otherwise you are left with nothing but wooly theories that do not reflect the law, and theories are not going to get Barack removed from office, or negate his presidential authority.

    The “dual citizenship” claim is a red herring — especially since Barack’s mom was a U.S. Citizen. When Barack was born the UK did not have jurisdiction over him, nor did he owe allegiance to it.

    Claims that citizenship must flow through the father and not the mother lead to the nonsensical conclusion that child born to a female U.S. citizen who gives birth without marrying, or after her husband (citizen or not) has died, cannot be “natural born” under the Constitution or the 14th Amendment.

    Would anyone like to argue that Bill Clinton was not a Natural-born citizen because he was born three months after the death of his father?

    Birthers and Truthers are birds of a feather.

29. #129
    On March 13th, 2010 at 9:44 pm, fulldroolcup said:

    Oh and btw: I fervently hope Barack and his presidency go down in flames.

30. #130
    On March 13th, 2010 at 9:49 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    The Obama Propaganda Roll-out and Final Push:

    Final March Day 1: Spread the Facts LIES

    It’s time to show the insurance lobbyists that no smear campaign can match the power of millions ready for change and committed to the truth.

    If you haven’t already, please download the fliers and posters below, and make sure everyone in your community sees the facts about reform.

31. #131
    On March 13th, 2010 at 9:51 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    Final March Day 2: Call Congress

    We’re in the middle of an unprecedented week-long campaign sprint — our “Final March for Reform.”

    Everything we’ve worked for depends on winning this upcoming vote in the House of Representatives, and it’s going to be very, very close.

    There’s no time to spare. Call today and make it clear that Americans support reform.

    Final March Day 3: Attend an Event

    As the next step in the Final March for Reform, OFA supporters like you will be gathering at volunteer phonebanks across the country.

    We’ll be calling supportive voters in critical districts nationwide, asking them to reach out to their representatives and express their strong support for reform.

32. #132
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:00 pm, jangar said:

    ITookTheRedPill said

    Well, now we know where ACORN went…

33. #133
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:00 pm, bluesoc said:

    ITookTheRedPill, swede, jangar, BOB, Pasadena Phil:

    Don’t you guys realize that all posting in the same place makes it that much easier for the Feds/Communists/Kenyans to watch you? Amateurs.

    PS: I apologize if any other members of the conspiracy crowd felt left out by not being included.

34. #134
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:03 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 9:43 pm, fulldroolcup said:

    Per wikipedia:

    Your source is wikipedia?
    Really?

    I’ve been over this so many times before.

    You want to claim that being born a citizen is equivalent to being a “natural born citizen”.

    That is false.

    Obama may or may not have been born a citizen (let’s see Hawaii release the initial birth certificate, rather than a COLB produced at and by the Obama campaign headquarters), but he most certainly was not a natural born citizen.

    Birthers and Truthers are birds of a feather.

    I personally challenge you to disprove even a single one of the Truth: statements here.

35. #135
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:04 pm, swede said:

    This guy is not going to fade into obscurity. He will become a cultural Marxist hero whose myth will grow with each passing year.

    Have to agree to disagree I guess. I think he’s going down, and since the MSM and his elitist whacko cultists have put him at such a lofty place, he will fall hard. Watch for it. But only time will tell, no?

    You now have a thorough understanding of how Western, educated nation like Italy and Germany could end up the way they did in the 1930’s.

    The difference I think is Hitler took post WW I Germany out of deep depression and turned it into a superpower. An absurdly effective hopeychangey populist like Barry, but unlike Barry also capitalized on nationalist pride. Musolini did much the same in Italy.

    Barry’s national self loathing and repalcing wealth and industry with debt will bring him down. Sooner rather than later I’d think (hope). Some huge differences, no?

36. #136
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:09 pm, Flyoverman said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:04 pm, swede said:

    Some huge differences, no?

    Well said.

    My point was history repeating itself in terms of normal, rationale, people who seem to love freedom, embracing a despot merely because he is their guy.

37. #137
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:13 pm, Pasadena Phil said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:00 pm, bluesoc said:

    The feds have plenty to nail me with already. This is just gilding the lily.

38. #138
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:14 pm, jangar said:

    bluesoc said:

    Laugh it up, fuzzball. There are those in power that want complete destruction and chaos and will stop at nothing to achieve it.

39. #139
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:15 pm, swede said:

    bluesoc said:
    PS: I apologize if any other members of the conspiracy crowd felt left out by not being included.

    If by conspiracy crowd you are referring to Birthers, you may appologize for including me. If you mean holding Congress accountable to the Constitution is some kind of conspiracy…whaaaaaatever.

40. #140
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:16 pm, bluesoc said:

    ITookTheRedPill said: I personally challenge you to disprove even a single one of the Truth: statements here.

    I strongly suggest everyone who is interacting with ITookTheRedPill visit the link he provided. The following is taking verbatim from his site:

    Repeated Question: What did William Ayers know about the 9/11 attacks, and when did he know it?

    Final Question: What did Barack Hussein Obama know about the 9/11 attacks, and when did he know it?

41. #141
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:22 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    Obama on “the Final March for Reform”

    Note the purple tie (shout-out to SEIU).

42. #142
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:26 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:00 pm, bluesoc said:

    ITookTheRedPill, swede, jangar, BOB, Pasadena Phil:

    Don’t you guys realize that all posting in the same place makes it that much easier for the Feds/Communists/Kenyans to watch you? Amateurs.

    Go report us to FLAG@WHITEHOUSE.GOV

43. #143
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:28 pm, BOB said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 9:44 pm, fulldroolcup said:
    Oh and btw: I fervently hope Barack and his presidency go down in flame

    Got any ideas on why Obama is hidding as much of his past as possible? Is it just to make people mad or something? No records of anything that normally would be available from any other president. No actual birthplace, no hospital that claims he was born there…not one witness to his birth in Hawaii, no doctor, no nurse, nobody actually has any memory of Obama’s birth, and there is no place to hang the plaque….seems a bit odd to me. I better not mention it though, I don’t want to be called names or anything for asking what seem to me like reasonable questions about the presidents past. I even wonder why there are numerous articles, (still available on the net), from 2004 up to 2008 referring to Obama as “Kenyan Born”? They must all be photo shopped, I guess. When he was Barry Soetoro was he adopted?….when he returned from Indonesia to the USA did he legally return his name back to Barack Obama, or is he still legally Barry?

    I tell you what I am tired of, I am tired of no one having the courage to discuss the many variables with Obama’s past, and what effect, if any, they have on his eligibility. Perhaps to some the certifiably bogus COLB is OK to conclude Obama is a, “natural born citizen”, per the requirements of the U.S. Constitution. I’m not one of them.

    And…..the record hidding and the fear of the media to discuss the issue makes me believe that they believe more discussion will only raise more doubt.

    I believe the “birthers” will be vindicated….though Obama may be long gone from the presidency before it happens. There is absolutely no way believing Bush and Cheney were involved in causing the horror of 911 and expecting the most, “open and transparent”, president in history to fork over 25 bucks for a copy of his real long-form birth certificate are related. Making the two, “equal”, is just another Alinsky tactic….and, it works on some people.

44. #144
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:33 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    The following is taking verbatim from his site:

    And I make no apology for that.

    How long have leftists been claiming that 9/11 was an inside job?

    If anyone in this country had foreknowledge and/or involvement in 9/11, who are the most likely suspects?

    How about people who had already bombed the Pentagon, already bombed the Capitol building, already bombed a police station (killing an officer), and who on the same day and in the same city where Jihadists flew planes into the WTC said that they didn’t regret setting those earlier bombs, but rather think they had not done enough?

    Mighty big coincidence, there.

    And you have failed to meet the personal challenge I made to you.

    Go ahead. Try to ignore the numerous TRUTH: statements. I haven’t even kept that up-to-date with all of the new developments, like Holder concealing the TRUTH that he had helped write two briefs in support of a terrorist.

45. #145
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:33 pm, jangar said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:28 pm, BOB said:

    Ditto. The whole thing stinks, and has for a couple of years.
    We’re getting the middle finger in a brand new way.

46. #146
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:36 pm, bluesoc said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:33 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:And you have failed to meet the personal challenge I made to you.

    Go ahead. Try to ignore the numerous TRUTH: statements.

    It doesn’t matter whether the premises are true. What matters is whether your conclusions are reasonable.

47. #147
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:43 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:36 pm, bluesoc said:

    It doesn’t matter whether the premises are true.

    They aren’t “premises”, they are TRUTHS.
    And yes it matters that they are TRUE.

    What matters is whether your conclusions are reasonable.

    Every week that goes by, Obama’s Communist-friendly, Jihadist-friendly actions make the questions I asked more and more reasonable.

48. #148
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:44 pm, jangar said:

    Wating for bluesoc to provide further excuses for Obama…

49. #149
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:52 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    One of the lies you’ll hear from Obama and the other Democratic Socialists this week is that they don’t have to honor their pledge to post bills online for five days before voting on them because…

    … the contents of the Senate bill have been known since before Christmas.

    … But they won’t be voting on the Senate bill…

    They will be voting on the “Slaughter Solution” which will likely be released at somewhere around 3 AM on the day they will rush to vote on it.

50. #150
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:53 pm, bluesoc said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:44 pm, jangar said:

    Wating for bluesoc to provide further excuses for Obama…

    Are you all sheep? Do you really not see what’s going on?

    Obama is secretly conservative. Since the Great Society, socialism has been creeping little by little. Obama knew that most God fearing citizens wouldn’t rise up and take back America unless that knew that they had no other choice. So this whole thing is an act to inspire true conservatives, like us, to take back our country. Every day that goes by, and every Socialist policy he supports, the more evidence to prove me correct. It’s brilliant!

51. #151
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:54 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    “the Final March” and the “Slaughter Solution“…

    Does any iconography from the 1930′s come to mind?

52. #152
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:58 pm, swede said:

    Flyoverman said:
    My point was history repeating itself in terms of normal, rationale, people who seem to love freedom, embracing a despot merely because he is their guy.

    Understood, but do you really think these people will follow Dear Leader all the way to ultimate destruction ala Germany? Based on his crashing polls, I think not so much.

53. #153
    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:59 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:53 pm, bluesoc said:

    I commend your satire.

    But I have to remind you that Obama himself said,
    

    “My fellow Progressives…”

54. #154
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:04 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    CBS Interview 11/2/04

    My understanding of the Senate is that you need 60 votes to get something significant to happen, which means that Democrats and Republicans have to ask the question, do we have the will to move an American agenda forward, not a Democratic or Republican agenda forward?

    Change to Win Convention 9/25/07

    The bottom line is that our healthcare plans are similar, the question once again is, who can get it done? Who can build a movement for change? This is an area where we’re going to have to have a 60% majority in the Senate and the House in order to actually get a bill to my desk. We’re going to have to have a majority to get a bill to my desk. That is not just a fifty plus one majority.

    Obama Interview with the Concord Monitor 10/9/07

    You’ve got to break out of what I call the sort of fifty plus one pattern of presidential politics. Maybe you eke out a victory of fifty plus one. Then you can’t govern. You know, you get Air Force One, there are a lot of nice perks, but you can’t deliver on healthcare. We are not going to pass universal health care with a fifty plus one strategy.

    Center for American Progress Conference 7/12/06

    Those big-ticket items: fixing our health care system. You know, one of the arguments that sometimes I get with my fellow progressives, and some of these have flashed up in the blog communities on occasion, is this notion that we should function sort of like Karl Rove where we identify our core base, we throw ‘em red meat, we get a fifty plus one victory. See, Karl Rove doesn’t need a broad consensus because he doesn’t believe in government. If we want to transform the country, though, that requires a sizeable majority.”

    Video here.

    And here’s what other Democrats have said.

55. #155
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:05 pm, RedDog said:

    Tar. Feathers. Rails. Now.

56. #156
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:07 pm, swede said:

    Obama is secretly conservative. Since the Great Society, socialism has been creeping little by little.

    Now that you mention it, if you look really close at the Dealy Plaza photos, you can see a silhouette with jug ears behind the stockade fence on the grassy knoll! It’s all coming together now. Thanks!

57. #157
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:14 pm, mattm said:

    Kinda OT

    A new Coffee Party has formed, by a fmr. Obama campaign staffer or vol. They claim the are for small gov’t/less taxes but discussed climate change/crisis, medicare for all and reducing the military budget. Apparently CNN was covering it. They literally has focus groups at coffee shops with groups of 15-20 people.

58. #158
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:15 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 10:58 pm, swede said:

    Understood, but do you really think these people will follow Dear Leader all the way to ultimate destruction ala Germany? Based on his crashing polls, I think not so much.

    Do you not find it shocking the percentage of people who “strongly support” what Obama is doing?

    Yes, I do think those people would follow Dear Leader all the way to ultimate destruction ala Germany.

    Obama’s “family friend” Bill Ayers planned for the extermination of 25 million people.

    And “Bill Ayers” has shown up on the White House guest list.

    We are told to take the Obama administration at their word that that was “a different Bill Ayers”. I say prove it. Show us who this other Bill Ayers is, and what official business he had at the White House.

    Same thing applies to White House guest “Jeremiah Wright”. Oh, but that was also “a different Jeremiah Wright”. Sure, sure it was.

59. #159
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:28 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:14 pm, mattm said:

    Kinda OT

    A new Coffee Party has formed, by a fmr. Obama campaign staffer or vol. They claim the are for small gov’t/less taxes but discussed climate change/crisis, medicare for all and reducing the military budget. Apparently CNN was covering it. They literally has focus groups at coffee shops with groups of 15-20 people.

    site:hotair.com “coffee party”

    We’ve known about it for a few weeks.
    It’s ASTROTURF, and their numbers are laughable.

    Interesting name though,
    Coffee Party USA
    as in
    CPUSA
    as in
    Communist Party USA (cpusa.org)

    And oh, did you know that Obama is a “teabagger”?

    But my journey is part of a larger journey – one shared by all who’ve ever sought to apply the values of their faith to our society. It’s a journey that takes us back to our nation’s founding, when none other than a UCC church inspired the Boston Tea Party and helped bring an Empire to its knees.

    …except that the Tea Parties I’ve attended were about restoring our Constiutional Republic, not about bringing “an Empire to its knees”. It sounds like Obama shares his “journey” with Marist Revolutionary “fellow travellers”, not with those who want a Constitutional Republic.

60. #160
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:30 pm, fulldroolcup said:

    #146: Red Pill: I pointed to wikipedia’s citation of the Wong Kim Ark case, and correctly gave its holding. You can look up the case yourself. The holding is not a matter of opinion; it’s a statement of the law.

    YOU cite nothing but your own and other’s opinions, which are not based on any case law HOLDINGS or statute. At your site you even point to an 1828 political catechism, which (a) incorrectly asserts that a naturalized citizen can become president, and (b) was made moot by both the 14th amendment and the Wong case, as well as other holdings and statutes.

    On top of that, your argument is that Barack wasn’t born in Hawaii, except that even if he was, he’s not natural-born.

    You want to claim that being born a citizen is equivalent to being a “natural born citizen”.

    That is false.

    I didn’t say they were equivalent, I implied that no court since Wong has ever ruled that a “citizen at birth” BORN IN THE US is NOT a native-born citizen — and I am right.

    You say Barack is “most certainly” not natural-born, yet a perusal of your site indicates all you do is make empty assertions.

    What is your legal theory, sirrah? If it’s that he wasn’t born in Hawaii, then you are an Uber-Kook, and not worth dealing with. For your crackpot notion to be true, even the Republican governor of HI would have to be “in on it”. Snork!

    As for your challenge: until you made it, I wasn’t aware that anyone actually linked Ayers to 9/11. It takes a rare kind of paranoia to do that!!

    Free clue: it’s up to YOU to prove your case, not to us to disprove it.
    Listing an encyclopedia of disjointed facts does not make a evidentiary case that Ayers or any of the other actors you cite had a hand in, planned, or carried out 9/11. For your claim to be true, literally thousands of Americans, including conservatives and a GOP president would have had to be “in on it”. THAT is not just paranoia, it’s deep in the Realm of Kookdom.

    p.s. are you such a rube not to understand that Allahu Akhbar is a phrase universally used by Muslims, and that, given his time in Indonesia and associations with Islam, Barack Obama would be well aware of the phrase? You think that “proves” something? Are you imposing a religious test on Barack? Would he really have sat in Wright’s pew for 20 years and been secretly…a Muslim? If so, where does he pray five times a day, Red Pill?

61. #161
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:30 pm, bluesoc said:

    ITookTheRedPill,

    How do I know you’re not a leftist plant trying to make true conservatives look like idiots? I’m not saying that you are, I’m just asking questions. How do you respond?

62. #162
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:31 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    Marxist, not Marist

63. #163
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:34 pm, swede said:

    mattm said:
    Kinda OT

    A new Coffee Party has formed, by a fmr. Obama campaign staffer or vol.

    NYT and WaPo and the usual MSM suspects have been hyping them up as well. Website is here. It is clearly another lefty bunch pretending to be “centrist.” In their priority poll, they did not even mention the economy or national security, the top two in national polling. Stuff like healthcare, climate change were their biggies.

    Do you not find it shocking the percentage of people who “strongly support” what Obama is doing?

    Yes, I do think those people would follow Dear Leader all the way to ultimate destruction ala Germany.

    Some would, yes. But he needs a decisive majority to take the country down with him. Per Rasmussen’s “passion index” (strongly approve 27% – strongly dissaprove – 42%) Dear Leader is solidly in the red, and the trend is crash and burn.

64. #164
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:37 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:30 pm, bluesoc said:

    Your comment doesn’t really deserve a response, but I feel like responding anyway. Your Alinsky tactics are blatant. You can’t discredit the truths I am sharing, so your only hope is to attempt to discredit me.

    My conservative credibility can be traced back to my first post to HotAir.com, three and half years ago:
    ITookTheRedPill on September 25, 2006 at 11:40 AM

65. #165
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:43 pm, fulldroolcup said:

    BOB said: “Got any ideas on why Obama is hidding as much of his past as possible? Is it just to make people mad or something? No records of anything that normally would be available from any other president. No actual birthplace, no hospital that claims he was born there…not one witness to his birth in Hawaii, no doctor, no nurse, nobody actually has any memory of Obama’s birth, and there is no place to hang the plaque….seems a bit odd to me.”

    I dunno why you say there’s no extrinsic evidence of Barack’s birth in Hawaii — there’s lots of it, including a squib in a Honolulu newspaper reporting it, and the attending physician’s recollection of it. Then there’s the Birth Certificate, which many people won’t accept as authentic, even if the GOP governor of Hawaii says it’s the real thing.

    As to why he seems to be hiding everything about his life —- I certainly wonder about that myself. Re Hawaii: maybe he’s listed on the BirthCert as White, or born to a different father?

    What I’m especially suspicious of is his academic history. I think he was given an Affirmative Action pass every step of the way. I suspect his grades are crappy . I think he got into Harvard via AA. His “President of the Law Review” credential is meaningless — that’s a result of a student popularity contest, not based on academics. We KNOW he’s published nothing of a legal nature. We don’t know when he took his bar exam, let alone if he actually passed it.

    Nothing he’s every said relating to law or the constitution strikes me as “learned”, and his pre-judging the Gates case was appallingly “stupid” for someone who claims to have been a lawyer.

    Bottom line: I think the guy is a fraud and a liar about most everything, and with each passing day more people are asking the questions they should have been asking two-three years ago.

    But not me!!! I thought I had his number all along, and…I did!

66. #166
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:45 pm, bluesoc said:

    My conservative credibility can be traced back to my first post to HotAir.com, three and half years ago:
    ITookTheRedPill on September 25, 2006 at 11:40 AM

    That proves your conservative credibility?!? You were attaching Clinton to try to get Obama elected!!! I knew it!

67. #167
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:49 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:30 pm, fulldroolcup said:

    At your site you even point to an 1828 political catechism, which (a) incorrectly asserts that a naturalized citizen can become president, and (b) was made moot by both the 14th amendment and the Wong case, as well as other holdings and statutes.

    Both (a) and (b) are false.

    The catechism does not assert that a naturalized citizen can become president.

    Neither the 14th amendment nor the the Wong ruling declare Wong a “natural born citizen”, but rather only a “citizen”.

    I’ve covered this at length on my blog, as has Leo Donofrio (although he took down those posts while he is working the Chrysler bankruptcy case). You may also reference the Obama File Natural Born Citizen page until he makes the Obama File subscription-only.

68. #168
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:49 pm, bluesoc said:

    “President of the Law Review” credential is meaningless — that’s a result of a student popularity contest, not based on academics.

    Just FYI. To get on law review in the first place you either have to have really good grades, or be a really good writer. The whole process is anonymous.

69. #169
    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:53 pm, ITookTheRedPill said:

    My apologies for feeding the trolls.

    Staying on topic:

    Obama ‘American Agenda’ Flashback: Dems Should Not Pass Healthcare With a 50-Plus-1 Strategy

    Obama & Dems in ‘05: 51 Vote ‘Nuclear Option’ Is ‘Arrogant’ Power Grab Against the Founders’ Intent

70. #170
    On March 14th, 2010 at 12:19 am, fulldroolcup said:

    Just FYI. To get on law review in the first place you either have to have really good grades, or be a really good writer. The whole process is anonymous

    You are assuming that “politics” or Affirmative Action had nothing to do with it. I have no evidence that this was the case, but there’s no academic evidence anywhere to indicate that Barack was a top student before he got to Harvard. OTOH a bastion of Political Correctness like Harvard could easily bend the rules in the name of “diversity”.

    In any case his supporters have been happy to assert that he was Editor, not President.

    Recently it’s been reported that Barack got his gig at the Univ. of Chicago not on merit, but through politics, and that the regarded him, a lecturer and not a “Constitutional Law Professor”, as a lightweight.

71. #171
    On March 14th, 2010 at 12:32 am, bluesoc said:

    You are assuming that “politics” or Affirmative Action had nothing to do with it

    I think you should do some research into Law Reviews selection. After their first year, students apply to be editors on law review. Half the students are chosen based on their first year law school grades, half on a writing competition created specifically for this purpose. The process is anonymous and run by students. During their second year, the students apply for the leadership positions. This process is not anonymous.

72. #172
    On March 14th, 2010 at 12:35 am, fulldroolcup said:

    Red Pill, the Obama File site you send us to begins with this defintion of a NBC:

    1. A “natural born” citizen is any person born of US citizen parents (that’s two) in the U. S. mainland (includes Alaska and Hawaii) — think Ronald Reagan — in this case, parentage is important AND birthplace is important.

    I ask again: was Bill Clinton, born three months after his father’s death, an NBC?

    What about unmarried moms who have no clue who the father is? Are their children disqualified???

    And if you have a case or a statute that says the US-born child of two married Mexican illegals isn’t a “natural born citizen”, please produce it, will ya?

    Just answer the frackin questions!!!

    Or else STFU.

    Please don’t tell us that every child has two parents, whether the father is known or not!!!

    That site also makes the entirely spurious “dual nationality” claim as disqualifying a person from being a NBC, one that NO COURT HAS EVER HELD.

    QED.

    As for you feeding the trolls: You ARE the troll. You offer inane and unsupported asssertions, which you treat as self-evident and self-proving.

73. #173
    On March 14th, 2010 at 12:37 am, bluesoc said:

    Recently it’s been reported that Barack got his gig at the Univ. of Chicago not on merit, but through politics, and that the regarded him, a lecturer and not a “Constitutional Law Professor”, as a lightweight.

    I agree that in the world of legal academia he’s a lightweight. To be a player in Constitutional law, you need to have clerked for the supreme court and publish publish publish. In other words, legal academia must be your life. Obviously that wasn’t his chosen career path.

74. #174
    On March 14th, 2010 at 12:41 am, BOB said:

    On March 13th, 2010 at 11:43 pm, fulldroolcup said:
    including a squib in a Honolulu newspaper reporting it, and the attending physician’s recollection of it. Then there’s the Birth Certificate, which many people won’t accept as authentic, even if the GOP governor of Hawaii says it’s the real thing.

    Very hard for me to believe that you see proof that Obama is, by the requirements of the U.S. Constitution, a natural born U.S. citizen.

    The newspaper squib was a “standard issue”, just like all the others, two line entry that would have been generated with the request of a COLB, which in 1961 could and was gotten by people who were not born in Hawaii…how does it prove anything? Better check the report of the “attending physician”, there was no such recollection. What’s the attending physicians name, and did he say he signed Obama’s real birth certificate? What, exactly did the Governor of Hawaii say about Obama’s COLB? It has been certified to have been tampered with by at least three different experts, which, according to the certificate itself, renders it invalid. Did the Governor say that the COLB displayed on the web is a copy of one issued by the Hawaii Department of Health? Did the Governor say that if the COLB was real that meant that Obama was a natural born U.S. citizen and therefore eligible to be president?

    Again, I don’t know all the answers, but I do know there are a heck of a lot of legitimate questions that the media, including the Becks, O’Reillys and Hannitys of the world, are afraid to ask…why is that.

    You didn’t address the question of the time Obama spent as Barry Soetoro, and was he or was he not adopted, if there are any records on this they too are hidden.

    Most of the hidden, lost or destroyed records have one thing in common…they ask questions of Obama, (or his parents/grandparents), like, “where were you born”, “what country are you a citizen of”, “are you applying for foreign student status”, etc. His kindergarden records from Hawaii, which would have asked for a copy of his birth certificate were…yep,…lost.

    Please give me a break, is there not enough uncertainty here for a real investigation of who Obama is? Depending on whether he was adopted or not, and how he handled U.S. immigration when he returned to the U.S., it’s even possible he could be an illegal alien, which may account for why he wants a “path to citizenship for all illegals”.

    Seriously, if it was anyone but Obama, this would be discussed by the media 24/7 until real, believable, answers were uncovered.

    Why so much fear?

75. #175
    On March 14th, 2010 at 12:45 am, fulldroolcup said:

    bluesoc, all I am saying is that the rules have seemingly been bent for Barack at every turn. You yourself say:

    The process is anonymous and run by students.

    We’ve recently seen how scientific peer review, itself supposedly anonymous, and managed by supposedly-aboveboard scientists, was perverted in the Climategate scandal.

    If Barack’s academic records were public (as were Bush’s, Kerry’s and the Clintons’, for example), there would be no room for suspicion.

    That’s all I’m sayin’.

76. #176
    On March 14th, 2010 at 12:52 am, love2rumba said:

    Obama is secretly conservative. Since the Great Society, socialism has been creeping little by little. Obama knew that most God fearing citizens wouldn’t rise up and take back America unless that knew that they had no other choice. So this whole thing is an act to inspire true conservatives, like us, to take back our country. Every day that goes by, and every Socialist policy he supports, the more evidence to prove me correct. It’s brilliant!

    What are you smoking, Bluesock?

77. #177
    On March 14th, 2010 at 12:56 am, purplepeep said:

    ITookTheRedPill said:

    How about people who had already bombed the Pentagon, already bombed the Capitol building, already bombed a police station (killing an officer), and who on the same day and in the same city where Jihadists flew planes into the WTC said that they didn’t regret setting those earlier bombs, but rather think they had not done enough?
    Mighty big coincidence, there.

    Pill, I think 9-11 trooferism is a hard sell to start with; claiming it was an inside job by Obama and Ayers really doesn’t make it much more of a salable proposition.

78. #178
    On March 14th, 2010 at 1:05 am, fulldroolcup said:

    Bob, I’m not gonna replough all the ground concerning the Birth Certificate. You have “questions”? Then YOU answer them. I can’t satisfy you. As for the newspaper squib, I understand you can go down to the newspaper or local libraries, look in their microfiche and see the notice for yourself. You think it was faked? Hell, half of Hawaii would have to be in the conspiracy!

    You didn’t address the question of the time Obama spent as Barry Soetoro, and was he or was he not adopted, if there are any records on this they too are hidden.

    That “question” has NO bearing on Obama’s citizenship.

    His kindergarden records from Hawaii, which would have asked for a copy of his birth certificate were…yep,…lost

    I note you say “could of”. Maybe not.

    Depending on whether he was adopted or not, and how he handled U.S. immigration when he returned to the U.S., it’s even possible he could be an illegal alien, which may account for why he wants a “path to citizenship for all illegals”.

    That is NOT POSSIBLE. The courts have held clearly that adoption by a foreign national doesn’t take away a child’s American citizenship, nor does living abroad. Your parents, step-parents or adoptive parents can’t take away your citizenship. Likewise, I can’t adopt an Indonesian kid and make him a US citizen through that act.

    As for “fear”: the people raising all the issues certainly don’t fear raising them. More facts keep turning up (such as the disdain the Univ. chicago profs had for him), and it’s my hope that eventually the “truth will out”. Just consider, for example, how much dirt we have on the Kennedys since the days they were lionized and protected by the press.

    From my comments to red Pill, you should understand that I don’t trust Obama, either. But there’s speculation and theories, and then there’s facts and law. they need to be distinguished.

79. #179
    On March 14th, 2010 at 1:22 am, purplepeep said:

    fulldroolcup said:
    there’s speculation and theories, and then there’s facts and law. they need to be distinguished.

    Yup, FDCup, the law makes a clear distinction between opinion and material fact in legal matters. Conjecture and a dollar will buy ya a cheap, but okay, cigar.

    But on this:

    As for the newspaper squib, I understand you can go down to the newspaper or local libraries, look in their microfiche and see the notice for yourself. You think it was faked? Hell, half of Hawaii would have to be in the conspiracy!

    That in and of itself isn’t an obstacle against the argument. I think even today birth notices are placed in papers “back home”.

    I believe if you ask folks who have served or worked overseas and who had a kid, you would find it’s not uncommon. I know when my one of my nephews was born in Germany in the early 60s there was a notice, along with all the other births, in our local paper. That was years before his mother had ever even visited here and more than a few years after the father (an older bro) had left home to join the USA. There was also a notice in the mother’s USA hometown paper in another state.

80. #180
    On March 14th, 2010 at 1:52 am, fulldroolcup said:

    The birth announcement, which appeared in two papers, included the parents’ Hawaii address as well.

    OF COURSE the announcements aren’t dispositive. But they are “evidence”.

    If you’re arguing he “really” was born in Kenya, good luck.

81. #181
    On March 14th, 2010 at 2:32 am, rightwingrocker said:

    The birth announcement, which appeared in two papers, included the parents’ Hawaii address as well.

    OF COURSE the announcements aren’t dispositive. But they are “evidence”.

    If you’re arguing he “really” was born in Kenya, good luck.

    Evidence they are, as long as you can furnish proof that the information contained in them is genuine.

    I can think of a number of reasons a pair of commie nutbags like Barack Obama, Sr. and Stanley Ann Dunham would have wanted to conceal the fact of any travels they may have made to a place like Kenya.

    The real issue here isn’t really his actual place of birth, though if it turns out he was, in fact, born abroad, it saves us the work of having to investigate the citizenship of his father, which doesn’t seem to be in question – Barack Obama, Sr. was legally a British subject at the time of Barack, Jr.’s birth, thus removing any chance that he could be a natural born citizen.

    Birth to an American mother and/or birth in Hawaii would make him a citizen, but the citizenship of his father IS relevant, despite the efforts of even many on the right to change that.

    The definition of natural born citizen, as expressed by Justice Henry Brockholst Livingston (who served in the Continental Army during the war), says that natural born citizens are those born in the country to parents who are also citizens (Livingston, 1814). The ruling in question regarded the officers aboard US naval vessels to be natural born citizens so that British officers would have no excuse to arrest them and execute them for treason (one of the causes of the War of 1812, in case you didn’t know).

    I’m not sure why so many people are trying to make the case that being born in Hawaii to an American mother is enough (especially given that under some jurisdictions she would have been too young to confer citizenship upon Barack even as an American citizen – you’ll have to do your own research on that one). No less than four US Supreme Court decisions have supported the Vattel definition of the term, as would the Founding Fathers, as evidenced by the President at the time of the War of 1812 having been one of the most influential among them, James Madison himself.

    If Barack Obama, Jr. was really born in Kenya, it simply saves us the trouble of bringing this information forth (and the Kenyan birth certificate that is currently in the courts has not been determined to be a fake, in case you didn’t know). In order for this man to qualify, he would have to have one of two situations that I can think of, both of which would expose him as a liar and a fraud. (1) He would have to have been the biological son of a father other than Barack Obama, Sr., or (2) Barack Obama, Sr. would have had to have been naturalized as an American prior to Barack, Jr.’s birth. I don’t see either of those happening, even if it can be demonstrated that he was, in fact, born in Hawaii.

    RWR
    http://www.rightwingrocker.com

82. #182
    On March 14th, 2010 at 2:38 am, rightwingrocker said:

    In the case of United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898), the Supreme Court ruled that a person becomes a citizen of the United States at the time of birth, by virtue of the first clause of the 14th amendment of the Constitution, if that person is:

    * Born in the United States
    * Has parents that are subjects of a foreign power, but not in any diplomatic or official capacity of that foreign power

    The Wong Kim Ark case established natural born citizenship as follows:
    

    At common law, with the nomenclature of which the framers of the Constitution were familiar, it was never doubted that all children, born in a country of parents who were its citizens, became themselves, upon their birth, citizens also. These were natives, or natural-born citizens, as distinguished from aliens or foreigners.

    Watch what you get on Wikipedia. It’s not always accurate.

    RWR
    http://www.rightwingrocker.com

83. #183
    On March 14th, 2010 at 2:47 am, rightwingrocker said:

    I believe the “birthers” will be vindicated….though Obama may be long gone from the presidency before it happens.

    On the other side of this …

    As a “birther” myself, I will acknowledge that once it is determined once and for all (to everyone’s satisfaction) that Barack Obama, Jr. is, in fact, a natural born citizen of the United States of America, I will drop the subject. I do believe that I speak for the rest of my “ilk” when I say that as well.

    The point here is to enforce the Constitution. Every citizen of this country has a responsibility to push this issue until it is resolved. If it resolves in Barack’s favor, then so be it. The point is that he must show the proof so that we, the final arbiters of the law, may make our decision based upon ALL of the facts, and not just the ones he wants us to see.

    RWR
    http://www.rightwingrocker.com

84. #184
    On March 14th, 2010 at 2:48 am, Loose Cannon said:

    As to BO’s educational background:

    1. A friend of a friend who attended Punahou (expensive private school) in Honolulu at the time Barry, as he was known, was enrolled, recalls the future leader approaching a classmate, calling him a “fat Jap” and then running away as the obese Asian chased him.

    2. A former federal prosecutor told me that he attended a reunion for his graduating class from Columbia the same night that BO’s class (younger) was also holding its own at the same venue. No one seemed to recall much about Mr. Obama except that he had a white girlfriend and smoked a lot of dope.

85. #185
    On March 14th, 2010 at 3:02 am, rightwingrocker said:

    It violates ANY provision by forcing Americans to purchase insurance or be criminalized.

    It violates the Tenth Amendment by its mere passing.

    RWR
    http://www.rightwingrocker.com

86. #186
    On March 14th, 2010 at 3:07 am, rightwingrocker said:

    1. A friend of a friend who attended Punahou (expensive private school) in Honolulu at the time Barry, as he was known, was enrolled, recalls the future leader approaching a classmate, calling him a “fat Jap” and then running away as the obese Asian chased him.

    I would consider this one a cheap shot, especially if it’s pre-high school. Kids do this sort of thing all the time without ruining their own adult personalities.

    Your other point, however, should be fair game, especially the part about him smoking a lot of dope. I do support legalization, BUT use still has consequences, including scrutiny with regard to public office. I don’t wish to stand in the way of people who would approve of this in their leaders, but I don’t.

    RWR
    http://www.rightwingrocker.com

87. #187
    On March 14th, 2010 at 3:38 am, Lockstein13 said:

    Butchering the Constitutuion has too its precedents:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enabling_Act_of_1933

    Heed its consequences.

88. #188
    On March 14th, 2010 at 3:48 am, AlohaGuy said:

    That “question” has NO bearing on Obama’s citizenship.

    Uh yesh it does. If he claimed to be an Indonesian citizen – after the age of 18 – in order to get preferential entry to any of his colleges, or for scholarships – then what?

89. #189
    On March 14th, 2010 at 4:06 am, BOB said:

    You didn’t address the question of the time Obama spent as Barry Soetoro, and was he or was he not adopted, if there are any records on this they too are hidden.

    From Droolcup…

    “That “question” has NO bearing on Obama’s citizenship.”

    I am not asking you to answer the questions I have have posed, I am asking just that they be answered.

    As for the adoption question. I don’t believe that a person can live outside the USA and be adopted, and then return to the USA years later, do nothing with American immigration services, change their name from the adopted name back to a name they had used years before, and then sign legal documents with the name they returned too, and have the signature be worth anything. The evidence he was adopted is that the one school record he didn’t get hidded, from Indonesia, has him listed as name, Barry Soetoro, Nationality, Indonesian, and Religion, Muslim. Also the Dunham/Soetoro divorce papers refer to him as Barry Soetoro.

    My point is not whether what I am saying is correct, or that you are correct when you “correct” me….it’s that this issue is so far beyond the threshold for a full-scale investigation that it isn’t even funny…..yet, all we get is silence from the, (almost), entire media. Where is the absolute proof that should be obtained to support the requirements of the U.S. Constitution, and if the media isn’t, “afraid”, to pursue the issue, then why are they not touching it?

90. #190
    On March 14th, 2010 at 4:48 am, purplepeep said:

    fulldroolcup said:
    OF COURSE the announcements aren’t dispositive. But they are “evidence”.

    Not “evidence” in the legal sense, FDCup.

    Here’s a WND article detailing some problems with the address listed in that notice.

    If you’re arguing he “really” was born in Kenya, good luck.

    No thanks, I’ll pass, not into the birther shtick; I believe it’s pretty much an obsession leading to nowhere. And right now, it’s counter-productive since we have one huge non-hypothetical real-world fish to fry in defeating gov’t run healthcare.

91. #191
    On March 14th, 2010 at 7:30 am, ITookTheRedPill said:

    IN times of impending calamity and distress; when the Liberties of America are imminently endangered by the secret machinations and open assaults of an insidious and vindictive Administration, it becomes the indispensible duty of these hitherto free and happy Colonies, with true penitence of heart, and the most reverent devotion, publickly to acknowledge the over ruling providence of God; to confess and deplore our offences against him; and to supplicate his interposition for averting the threatened danger, and prospering our strenuous efforts in the cause of Freedom, Virtue and Posterity.

    That was 234 years ago… and equally true today.

    In Congress, March 16, 1776

92. #192
    On March 14th, 2010 at 7:35 am, BOB said:

    No thanks, I’ll pass, not into the birther shtick; I believe it’s pretty much an obsession leading to nowhere. And right now, it’s counter-productive since we have one huge non-hypothetical real-world fish to fry in defeating gov’t run healthcare.

    It’s not counter productive to me…I can multi-task…..and, it’s so obvious that something is bad wrong with the made-up past of the Messiah there is no way I’m giving him a free pass just because an ostensibly derogatory name has been invented to describe those who possess common sense.

93. #193
    On March 14th, 2010 at 7:55 am, jamesgreenidge said:

    I guess Fox & Friends this morning doesn’t think it’s all much a constitutional crisis, being crammed with pregnant models and alligator wrestling silly sex surveys while looking like the ass-end of a bad late night talk show.

    
    Obama pollster: U.S. will like healthcare bill, despite poll numbers
    

    This is what they’re banking on — and it WILL work since Americans seem to indulge a high pain threshold into socialism (like the boiled frog thing). I’m telling you, sure as the sun rises, in a year he’ll pop Nationalized Housing — and with that goes the whole incentive/necessity to WORK!

    Is there a H.Q. of coordination for gathering constitutional challenges to O.B.care?

    Only alternatives to repealing this monster, a National Tax Strike and Total non-compliance signing on to O.B.care! I’ll DO it all! Can at least all the Tea Party too??

    James Greenidge
    Queens, New York

94. #194
    On March 14th, 2010 at 8:06 am, BOB said:

    On March 14th, 2010 at 7:55 am, jamesgreenidge said:
    I guess Fox & Friends this morning doesn’t think it’s all much a constitutional crisis, being crammed with pregnant models and alligator wrestling silly sex surveys while looking like the ass-end of a bad late night talk show.

    I noticed that too, over the past months Fox News has greatly softened their reporting of all things Obama. I believe Obama accomplished something back when he was openly criticizing Fox News, exactly how he made this change happen, I’m not sure. Intimidation, and/or a change in at least part of the ownership of Fox News?

95. #195
    On March 14th, 2010 at 8:20 am, Flyoverman said:

    On March 14th, 2010 at 7:55 am, jamesgreenidge said:

    Obama pollster: U.S. will like healthcare bill, despite poll numbers

    This is what they’re banking on — and it WILL work since Americans seem to indulge a high pain threshold into socialism……

    I am sorry, but the Obama pollster is flat lying and the pollster knows it. spin, spin, spin….

    I don’t care what the program is. No one is going to “like” something where they have to pay for a product for four years before they see any benefit.

    If you can find ONE, just ONE person who has that much patience I would love to meet them…….

96. #196
    On March 14th, 2010 at 9:02 am, swede said:

    Obama pollster: U.S. will like healthcare bill, despite poll numbers

    Hmmm. I’m wondering what kind of question could lead to such a poll result:

    What is your position on the Obama Healthcare bill?

    A) Strongly approve
    B) Somewhat approve
    C) Somewhat dissaprove
    D) Strongly dissaprove
    E) Dissaprove now, but will approve after it is passed

97. #197
    On March 14th, 2010 at 9:18 am, Flyoverman said:

    On March 14th, 2010 at 9:02 am, swede said:

    R O T F L M A O!

    Exactly Swede!!

98. #198
    On March 14th, 2010 at 9:19 am, swede said:

    Since there is no difinitive proof of Barry’s birth, we must conclude he was in fact not born at all, but manufactured by aliens who put him here to take over the planet. The big ears are obviously antennae to pick up signals from the mother planet on what to say next – should the teleprompter they control fail.

    When Barry starts to uuuuummmmm, aaaaahhhh it is because of interference in the signal caused by solar activity, so they will move the earth further from the sun to compensate. Don’t stow your winter clothing just yet!

99. #199
    On March 14th, 2010 at 9:45 am, tarpon said:

    Yes, you will love it, especially if you are Indonesian and can’t read or write.

    Remember 1994, the Democrats said we will love the Assault Weapons ban, we sure did.

    But the biggest Democrat miscalculation of them all was when Democrats in 1854 voted for “The Kansas-Nebraska Act” which legalized slavery. The rest as they say is history.

    Obama AKBAR!!!

100. #200
     On March 14th, 2010 at 1:26 pm, purplepeep said:

     swede said:

     Since there is no difinitive proof of Barry’s birth, we must conclude he was in fact not born at all, but manufactured by aliens who put him here to take over the planet. The big ears are obviously antennae to pick up signals from the mother planet on what to say next – should the teleprompter they control fail.

     When Barry starts to uuuuummmmm, aaaaahhhh it is because of interference in the signal caused by solar activity, so they will move the earth further from the sun to compensate. Don’t stow your winter clothing just yet!

     Heh. Good ‘un, Swede. But I thought the ummmms & ahhhhhs were due to fine tuning and that it was the stuttering that was due to the solar static.