The McChrystal mess; Update: Gibbs says Obama hasn’t talked with the general (nothing new there!); WH questions maturity, judgment
No matter how right or wrong I think Gen. McChrystal may be (praise here, criticism here), I think we can all agree that in a time of war, the last place a military commander should be blabbing is an anti-war pop culture rag that specializes in slime.
Sharia law remains a looming threat against Western civilization. Our men and women in uniform are targeted every day by Allahu Akbar-shouting jihadists. And in case you didn’t notice, self-declared “Muslim soldiers” are among us:
Calling himself a Muslim soldier, a defiant Pakistan-born U.S. citizen pleaded guilty Monday to carrying out the failed Times Square car bombing and left a sinister warning that unless the U.S. leaves Muslim lands alone, “we will be attacking U.S.”
Wearing a white skull cap, prison smocks and a dark beard, Faisal Shahzad entered the plea in U.S. District Court in Manhattan just days after a federal grand jury indicted him on 10 terrorism and weapons counts, some of which carried mandatory life prison sentences. He pleaded guilty to them all.
U.S. District Judge Miriam Goldman Cedarbaum challenged Shahzad repeatedly with questions such as whether he had worried about killing children in Times Square.
“One has to understand where I’m coming from,” Shahzad calmly replied. “I consider myself … a Muslim soldier.”
More re. Shahzad from Scott Johnson at Power Line and Andy McCarthy at NRO. But we’re not talking about that today, are we?
Milblogger Matt Burdent at Blackfive sums up the McChrystal mess:
1. GEN McChrystal should never have said he voted for anyone. In fact, I know General Officers who claim they don’t vote for Presidents at all to avoid ever taking political sides. He voted for Obama?!
2. GEN McChrystal fired a subordinate for giving the reporter access to the general (in essence, he did his job – albeit, naively).
3. It is against the UCMJ to criticize the President, Congress, etc. Period.
4. This event is what the anti-war lefties want (we lost). This event is what the take-the-gloves-off right want (less ROE restrictions). However, this makes things in AFPAK infinitely more difficult.
Update: At the White House press briefing this afternoon, spokesman Robert Gibbs says Obama hasn’t talked to the general yet about the current unpleasantness. That’s nothing new, of course. Flashback September 2009:
“Once in 70 days”
By Michelle Malkin • September 28, 2009 11:09 AMThat’s how many times President Obama has talked to General Stanley McChrystal.
Obama is for “engagement” and “dialogue” with everyone else in the world except his own military commanders.
***
Milblogger Laughing Wolf at Blackfive:
Anyone who has done any reading on the situation in Afghanistan would be understanding of frustration with Eikenberry (see link on recall above), much less frustration with the administration, on the part of McChrystal and staff. That said, it seems a tad bit unwise to let loose on everyone in an interview while still in the middle of the fight. In point of fact, if the interview is even half of what is being belled in advance, then the fecal matter will be hitting the rotary impeller at warp speed. Even if it is not, expect to see this used to savage not just McChrystal but all military efforts. In fact, I will bet right now that his career is over, regardless of the content as politics will rule the day and there are many in political circles that want his scalp.
Which brings me to my final point on judgment and possible lack thereof. Who thought doing a frank and/or candid political interview with Rolling Stone while you are in the middle of the fight was a good idea? I can empathize with the frustration of not being given what you asked for and needed to do the job, or in finding yourself being attacked by the person who is supposed to be helping you and instead is doing everything they can openly or otherwise to block you, and in not seeing your ideas translated out and done as you desire. Yet, you don’t do something like this unless either you are already gone (and even then it’s not a good idea because of collateral damage), or all is already lost. So, was this just incredibly poor judgment on someones part in agreeing to the interview, or are other things in play?
***
William Jacobson at Legal Insurrection takes note of the Shinseki-McChrystal double standard.
WH spokesman Robert Gibbs notes at his press briefing this afternoon that the president hasn’t talked with McChrystal yet. Nothing new there. Flashback September 2009:
“Once in 70 days”
By Michelle Malkin • September 28, 2009 11:09 AMThat’s how many times President Obama has talked to General Stanley McChrystal.
Obama is for “engagement” and “dialogue” with everyone else in the world except his own military commanders.
***
To borrow a favorite phrase from Allahpundit, it’s come to this: Headline from ABC News – “White House Questions McChrystal’s Judgment, Maturity.”
Asked about a passage in the story where a McChrystal aide describes the general as having been “pretty disappointed” after his first meeting with President Obama because the president “didn’t seem very engaged,” Gibbs said McChrystal will “have his attention tomorrow.”
Gibbs just said parents of the more than 90,000 US troops in Afghaniatan need to be confident that the command structure — meaning McChrystal — is “capable and mature enough” for this mission.
Could McChrystal be fired?
“All options are on the table,” Gibbs said, though the president believes the general should be given a chance to explain himself. Gibbs declined to say whether the general’s job is safe, saying the public would know more after the meeting.
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Yup, Blackfive nailed it down just fine. It’s bad enough & dumb enough when the Dixie Chicks do it.
We shouldn’t be there, there is nothing to win there. The sooner we say that the sooner we will stop getting OUR finest killed for Afghanis.
I can appreciate the military readiness that a live training exercise in Afghanistan might be for the brass, but let’s practice here in America.
Our military isn’t fighting a war, they are policing a foreign land. they aren’t designed to be police, they are designed to conquer.
Bring our guys home and use the state department as the most effective fence ever created by not allowing people who travel to or through Pakistan or Afghanistan and Somalia to come to America.
Solutions are simple, effective, and inexpensive. We don’t have to be in afghanistan to fight against Sharia here. If they want sharia, no matter how many people we kill, it won’t matter. They’ll fight to the death to live in caves and beat their women. . . it’s not our business to spend our soldiers’ lives to fight for or against that.
the war was lost when we allied with Pakistan. that was bush’s fault. . . and the media’s fault for believing that having nuclear weapons means you can’t fight against them (forgetting that we fought many times against soviets in the nuclear age).
Gibbs is speaking in the briefing as though BHO has already decided to fire the general. Also, Gibbs called the general “immature”. What a farking loser!
Obama, to be in charge of so much seems to not talk to hardly anyone.
Incompetence on display.
Immature? That coming from the White House Children.
Obama hasn’t spoken to McChrystal yet because the Media isn’t done hanging the General for him yet. Also, he wants to see the polls on this.
I read several of the excerpts and if what is reported is true, it exposes a dangerously insecure, unprepared and disengaged CIC. I am withholding judgment until this has percolated for a while.
General McChrystal is no doubt dead on target with his comments. He was also insubordinate. Like it or not the President has no choice, but to relieve him.
“Life is tough. It’s tougher when you’re stupid.” – John Wayne
If you fight this war through the Visas with the State Department, it will also discourage the leadership or royalty of foreign nations from supporting terrorism.
If you knew that your country would not be allowed to come to the paradise of America if your people were terrorizing Americans, you would likely put more effort in cleaning it up.
The rich people in leadership positions wouldn’t like not being able to come to America and their international businesses would hate having business cut off.
Wars can be won without the military. But if you use the military, you should expect to kill a lot of people – both good people and bad people and that’s war. If you are killing people with your military (military or civilian) you shouldn’t apologize because the soldiers are just doing their jobs.
File this one under the, “What on Earth were you thinking?” category:
1. According to an article by Byron York, McChrystal was a ticking time bomb of intemperate statements aimed at others in his military and civilian chain of command; looks like his timer finally ran out. If that’s true, then how he made it to the general ranks with that kind of personality trait is a mystery.
2. Have to agree that it’s a bad idea to talk to Rolling Stone writers, period. But to say the things he supposedly said in front of someone from that rag can only be considered a career death-wish.
Maybe McChrystal figures that the war in Afghanistan is already lost, and that he’s going to be thrown under the bus for it in any event, so he might as well go down swinging?
With a loved one in the general area of Kabul, we are deeply troubled by what George Will referred to as the rules disengagement. The layers of command are many and I regret the president is the CIC. He has no qualification for this responsibility. The military puts their lives on the line. The president risks nothing but his political career.
Talk about the pot vs. the kettle!
My guess is it will be more like the all-time fave classic of “retiring to spend more time with the family”.
We have a choice now that this has come out. Support McC or not. I won’t add to those who are carping about it.
We have an opportunity right now.
I believe we need to use the attention this is getting to focus on what the BHO administration is doing to mess up the war. Get the attention off McChrystal.
May your loved one and his/her comrades stay safe. Its worse, because we have had to endure this before.
Never put a Democrat on your flank.
As a VET, MICHELLE, only one thing to say… As long as you are active, the POTUS is COMMANDER IN CHIEF, right or wrong, no ifs ands or buts!!! When I was in we often said to one another, “WELL, KISS MY JOHNSON”!!! This to one another, never to an outsider…
Hey WH! That’s how most of us feel about the President!
If it is in fact true that Stanley McChrystal voted for bho, then indeed the man is one with incredibly poor judgment. We need military leaders who can see actions related to consequences. A vote for bho resulted in a community organizer as your boss.
Stan should swing by the Pentagon Admin section to put his papers in enroute to the White House. If you can’t bite your tongue while working for someone you don’t like, you’d better leave.
On a personal level, I’m behind the man completely. It’s refreshing to see somebody in a position to know exactly what’s going on speak his mind about what a hash Hope-a-Dope is making of things in Afghanistan.
Professionally speaking, however, if those are the things he’s said then there really isn’t any defense.
I’ll tell you whose maturity and judgment is questionable, and he lives in the White House, not Afghanistan! Everything he touches…
I totally disagree with this statement. If we leave Afghanistan without doing what is needed, they will plot and plan over there and attack us on our own soil. The “finest” that will die then will be you and I.
I will not submit.
and then blames Bush for everything….
Oh my gosh yes. I can’t believe I’m still hearing some of BHO’s cronies still regurgitating that crud…
McChrystal is gone. The president’s skin is too thin…the insubordination is the justification for the General’s sacking, but the real reason will be that Obama takes it personally, and he simply can’t countinance the perception that he is incompetent, clueless, and disengaged, even though he knows that it to be true.
The entire incident will focus on McChrystal’s insubordination, and all efforts will be made to stay away from the substance of what he and his staff said about the civilian authority (Obama’s feel good team) undermining the military effort in country.
I have it on good authority, soldiers in theater, have zero respect for Obama, feel he is preventing them from doing the job for which they were tasked, and believe, in the end, he will hang them out to dry. Knowing this, they continue to try and fight the good fight, because they are men of honor.
I wonder…is this the beginning of a big fight between the clueless civilian authority (who deem themselves smarter than our warriors) and our defenders of freedom? I hope sanity reigns, and a repeat of the childish responses we’ve seen in the past from this administration are not pushed to the forefront. If that happens, it will be more than just our military who suffers.
Way I see it, the more generals that speak out against Obama the better. They must have our backs when he decides, as he will, to over-reach the office of President.
Off topic, but a Federal Judge in Louisiana has blocked Obama’s moratorium on off shore drilling! Fox is listing it on its breaking news banner.
A soldier is to be loyal to the Constitution and the country. We currently have a president who could care less about the military, the country or the Constitution. Exactly what should a general do when there is a traitor in the White House? I would have resigned first and then given my opinion.
One problem with that is McChrystal has apologized for his comments and “poor judgment”, Gladz.
has anyone considered that the ‘rag’ chosen was chosen on purpose–
these guys are not fools–and are well able to use subtle messages because they know they cannot be overt-
example- bho’s first photo op speech at West Point one cadet- holding the Brad Thor novel that has- as one character-a incompetent-US president–subtle-and true…
C-CS
How true. I read McCrystal’s comments and thought, “they are all exactly true”. However, being a retired vet, I remember well what you risk when “making waves” against the political establishment who view themselves as all-knowing, all-perfect and never worthy of ridicule. The road is littered with the carcasses of military who have dared criticise their civilian political bosses. But, sometimes you just have to speak out, or you will self-destruct under the blatant idiocy.
To be honest that is a very bad idea. If the chain of command breaks down in the military then that will lead to all sorts of problems and ultimately a power struggle within the military and civilian command. The ones who will suffer the most would be our troops and no one wants that.
Do we need better leadership from the top down, of course we do. Do our guys need to have their hands untied, of course they do. But this is not the way to go about doing it. All this really does is two things. One it gives teh enemy a look at the porblems going on within our military command structure which they can then use against our troops. And it gives the Democrats an excuse to bad mouth the military further than they already do.
We either need to be in there to win or we need to go home.
I believe the general is telling us Obama’s current strategy is not a win the war startegy.
Glad he is acting in a way to protect the troops. Will be interesting to see how the general’s risks plays out.
And if the enemy is us?
Hey T-Bone, let me illustrate the effectiveness of this ‘plan’ by introducing you to a post surge Faisal Shazzad
Times Square bomb plot: Faisal Shahzad warns of further attacks
Why do you think anything can be more effective than our state department visa program? They come here and do whatever they want whether we are there or not.
After 9/11, we should have gone in full bore without relying AT ALL on Pakistan. If they wanted to shoot at our jets going into Tora Bora, we’d shoot back. We should have hit hard unilaterally with everything we had, gotten bin laden and zawahiri and left within the year.
we should have had as much collateral damage as necessary to accomplish the mission.
As it stands now, Af/Pak’s greatest industry is the American tax dollars subsidising that war. We give Af the money, they pay it to Taliban for safe passage. Pakistan blows up someone they might not like and demand more billions from our taxpayer.
We are funding our enemies through our ‘friends’. . . how do you expect to win a war like that? how do you expect to be safe in America with them over there and Shazzad’s over here.
Wake up. . . the war in afghanistan is pointless.
Is this the way warriors talk amongst themselves? HELL YES!
Should they have spoken this way with a reporter there? HELL NO!
Signed
Gen Georgs S. Patton
How many times has Obama and McC met? How many hours have they spent talking with each other in person and/or via emails, phones, etc? I’ll wager not much.
I consider the war effort our BIGGEST issue. Until we solve that huge drain on our economy and blood and treasure, it will continue to affect all our policies. It should be job #1.
How much time has Obama spent with the guy leading the effort?
Dither, wither, slither.
Not true. He’s on a first name basis with the cart girl at the Fort Belvoir golf course.
” But, sometimes you just have to speak out, or you will self-destruct under the blatant idiocy.”
Sometimes you just have to speak out to keep the troops who are loyal to you and serve under your command from losing their lives for nothing.
Just like he has no protect the borders strategy or a protect the gulf strategy or a jobs strategy. He just has a progressive strategy.
don’t take that comment as my believing America is ‘at fault’ for Faisal being angry and wanting to blow us up. He claims it is revenge for us being in Afghanistan, but that’s not what I’m saying.
We just defended Muslims in Kosovo before 9/11 and they still did it.
These people want to kill us no matter what we do. Having our military over there doesn’t make us safer here. It costs us lives and money and we get nothing in return but a battle seasoned military and more body bags than we should use.
General McChrystal asks for more troops, and Obummer wastes several months before responding.
General McChrystal insults him, and Obummer wastes no time in responding.
I can clearly see where Obummers priorities lie.
And please too note that I’m not disparaging Muslims.
The reason Faisal is doing this is because he ‘loves God’. that is a wonderful thing. He just shows his love for God inappropriately. He thinks killing Americans will prove that he loves God. That is the problem.
We need to teach them that loving God is good, and God would never want his creation destroyed. And no man of God would be a man of destruction. Love God but don’t kill or take revenge.
They need a little Corinthians 13
I feel safer with our men fighting there than fighting here. Something about artillery shells exploding in my neighborhood makes me feel uneasy.
Dear Leader has already established his Jerk-the-Chain of Command style of leadership model. Just like in his handling of the Gulf spill, he doesn’t require verbal input, because he is uber astute, and has vast mind-reading skills.
Obama has said it himself…he doesn’t need to talk to these people. He knows what they are going to say…
“They are just going to tell me what I want to hear.”
I guess Obama found someones @ss to kick.
Then McCrystal should not have been upholding the ridiculous ROE in Afghanistan. Byron York has a good article about it in the Washington Examiner:
If this is true then it sounds to me like McCrystal is just as culpable in the situation as Obama and perhaps he needs to take some of the blame himself. I still say he should have resigned instead of talk crap as it woudl have been the right thing to do and it still would have sent a message to our troops (they would have understood why he was resigning).
I am just surprised that Obama is going to do this face to face…Do you think it will be Mo or the teleprompter that has his back?
Strategy vs Mission
The strategy in Afghanistan is “Take, Hold and Build”
What exactly is the Mission?
McChrystal should resign, he is being used as a pawn by this administration
McChrystal may know exactly what he’s doing, exposing the Shuck & Jive Clown Show in the White House.
For the sake of the nation.
No win sitation for Barry and the boys, the General has their attention now.
purple, doesn’t matter to me. Because we can’t change what has happened or been said, we should take this opportunity to blast the administration in its handling of the war. You know, turn it all right back around on them by taking a closer look and discussing any problems McC may have mentioned in the article.
I always loathed civilians trying to tell me how to do my job in the military, as if my years of training and experience didn’t mean a thing. I found that it was better to smile and acknowledge the sounds that they were making. It enabled me to get back to my job with a minimum of wasted time.
Clouseau: That man is crahzy!
Nurse: We don’t use that word around here,sir
Clouseau: Then what word do yeu use?
Nurse: Now now…
Clouseau: That man is very now now !
Amen to that!
who cares about the McCrystal mess, we can’t win in Afganistan anyway.
At least not until we identify the enemy. And the enemy is Islam.
We now have a 2nd admission (at least) in the person of the Times Square bomber that the enemy is inside the perimeter.
But whether it is in the ME or here at home we need to recognize that ISLAM, not “radical Islam”, and there is no “moderate Islam” is the problem and it’s only going to get worse.
See my proposal at http://pedestrianinfidel.blogspot.com/2007/02/proposed-constitutional-amendment.html for a Constitutional amendment to deal with Islam in the US.
Here’s the meat of it -
“Article III
Immediately upon passage of this Amendment all Mosques, schools and Muslim places of worship and religious training are to be closed, converted to other uses, or destroyed. Proceeds from sales of such properties may be distributed to congregations of said places but full disclosure of all proceeds shall be made to an appropriate agency as determined by Congress. No compensation is to be offered by Federal or State agencies for losses on such properties however Federal funding is to be available for the demolishing of said structures if other disposition cannot be made.
The preaching of Islam in Mosques, Schools, and other venues is prohibited. The subject of Islam may be taught in a post high school academic environment provided that instruction include discussion of Islam’s history of violence, conquest, and its ongoing war on democratic and other non-Islamic values.
The preaching or advocating of Islamic ideals of world domination, destruction of America and democratic institutions, jihad against Judaism, Christianity and other religions, and advocating the implementation of Sharia law shall in all cases be punishable by fines, imprisonment, deportation, and death as prescribed by Congress. Violent expressions of these and other Muslim goals, or the material support of those both in the United States and around the world who seek to advance these Islamic goals shall be punishable by death.
Muslims will be denied the opportunity to immigrate to the United States”
Its this now (or soon), or the alternative will be genocide, theirs, or ours.
Why in the world would McChrystal say what he said in “Rolling Stone” and then apologize for it as soon as it leaks that he said what he said? If it had been me, my response would have been “I’ll discuss my comments with the President in Washington, DC tomorrow.”
Why slam the President in a national magazine and then start waffling as soon as the aroma of cow dung hits the breeze? It doesn’t make sense. Frankly, I wouldn’t have given the interview to “Rolling Stone.” I would have hopped a flight to DC and told Obama myself while I put my stars on the desk in the Oval Office.
But, going public and then backpedaling as soon as you do, while claiming you “have tremendous respect” for the guy you just hammered in a public interview demonstrating YOU HAVE NO RESPECT FOR THE GUY is just a tiny bit inconsistent.
Obama is a vacillating idiot with no clue how to win any conflict waged outside of Chicago. Obama’s biggest problem is that he wants to appear to be winning in Afghanistan without actually achieving victory. Basically, he doesn’t want to be the first president to lose a war but he doesn’t want America to win. That is the definition of a dilemma. Good luck on that one, Barry…
But, McChrystal needs to make up his mind. If he has a a problem with the war he should get in Barry’s face and tell him so! Don’t play stupid games with a magazine and then apologize when you get caught while soldiers under your command die for a cause you don’t think you can win. Come out and say what you need to say and do what you need to do. Lead, follow or get out of the way…
Bingo. We are blinded by our own PC. Its written in their Koran for goodness sake. It is more than a religion. Its a political, social, and religious way of life. To be a true Muslim, you follow Allahs law not ANY other. That means they are not beholden to any constitution which we swear to uphold.
They don’t.
Excellent point WarEagle.
The good General should have waited until his resignation was tendered. He spoke his peace, now he has to face the pipers.
Most of the critical remarks in the article come from aides to the general, rather than McChrystal himself.
That’s where we’ll have to agree to agree to disagree, Gladz. Though I understand your passion and reasoning.
What matters to me is that someone says what they mean and that they mean what they say. Owning one’s words, especially if they believe in what they say.
Rephrasing or explaining in detail his positions for clarity’s sake would have been completely acceptable. But he didn’t do that, instead he walked it back.
Its as if the good General has no sense. Maybe thats why we are “not winning”.
It will also be the reason Obama keeps him.
I think that would have been much more effective in getting across whatever points he wanted to make.
Yup. That’s how life is for everyone and moreso for those in the military.
That’s an original idea! Thacker Agency
From the UCMJ Article 88 Contempt Towards Officials.
“Any commissioned officer who uses contemptuous words against the President, the Vice President, Congress, the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of a military department, the Secretary of Transportation, or the Governor or legislature of any State, Territory, Commonwealth, or possession in which he is on duty or present shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.”
Elements.
(1) That the accused was a commissioned officer of the United States armed forces;
(2) That the accused used certain words against an official or legislature named in the article;
(3) That by an act of the accused these words came to the knowledge of a person other than the accused; and
(4) That the words used were contemptuous, either in themselves or by virtue of the circumstances under which they were used. Note: If the words were against a Governor or legislature, add the following element
(5) That the accused was then present in the State, Territory, Commonwealth, or possession of the Governor or legislature concerned.
If Gen McChrystal did indeed make the statements being attributed to him. Then he may have violated this punitive article of the UCMJ. That in and of itself is an exercise in poor judgement, especially when one considers to whom these words were allegedly uttered.
However, I recommend withholding commentary until the facts are made public.
Inexperienced and incompetent armchair warriors are questioning the judgment and maturity of a battlefield tested General!
Oh, and by the way:
Mexican Drug Cartel Threatens Nogales Police:
http://www.redstate.com/absentee/2010/06/22/mexican-drug-cartel-threatens-nogales-police/
Mexican Gangs Maintain Permanent Lookout Bases in AZ Hills:
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/06/22/mexican-gangs-permanent-lookouts-parkland/
Looks like the war in Arizona isn’t going any better than the war in Afghanistan. But then, what did you expect from the Shuck & Jive President.
HHHMMMM maybe Obama should stop projecting and double check his maturity and judgement?????
Heard loud and clear, purple. My ‘strategy’, weak as it may seem was to turn this thread into bashing (BHO &) this administration’s handling of the war. Guess that will all come out soon enough, overall, I just want our boys and girls in the military to have the best chance to come out alive (& victorious would be good too).
If he couldn’t embrace the current ROE and the jeopardy the men under his command were being placed in, he should’ve honorably resigned his commission. Now, he’s just being another mealy-mouthed sychophant.
Gibbs says Obama hasn’t talked with the general (nothing new there!)
Well, it is not the sort of conversation you want to have over the phone.
Nope. Both parties should be in the same room at the same time face to face.
ROE Question:
Where do the ROE fall into overall strategy in war?
Is a general/or a ‘McC’ given high level goals and then he makes the ROE as in methods and procedures? If that’s the case, well, I’ll wait till someone answers….
Disgruntled Generals typically do one of two things:
The either fade away or get elected President.
And arrogant, incompetent, former community organizers generally fail at pretty much everything…
Cheddar, have you read -
“the bigger problem with McChrystal’s leadership has always been the general’s devotion to unreasonably restrictive rules of engagement that are resulting in the unnecessary deaths of American and coalition forces.”
McChrystals Real Offense
Name one.
It doesn’t have to be original to be accurate. he didn’t make the decision on his own, but he made the ultimate decision as ‘the decider’ and it was a bad decision.
Lee made a bad decision at Ghettysburgh, Napoleon made a bad decision at Waterloo (and wrt Russia).
but the decision to befriend the only country that recognized the Taliban as legitimate government and even CREATED. . . yes, Pakistan CREATED the Taliban. . . THAT was an EPICALLY BAD decision.
He made it because the CIA had some covert ops in the mountains of Pakistan that they didn’t want to disturb. We should have fought through India.
On June 22nd, 2010 at 4:19 pm, J S Ragman said:
What war was fought to bring down that wall that USED TO split Berlin. I don’t remember tanks or a surrender ceremony at the end of the Cold War. We won by being powerful, but not by firing a shot.
War of the Roses?
Can you imagine being a General and having to work for this jug eared dimwit.
What could you possibly talk about? Obama’s golf swing?
“Star Wars?”
What about the 70s show: “Battle Of The Celebrity Stars”?
Or a “Battle Of The Bands”?
And didn’t you ever play the card game “War” when you were a kid?
Plenty of examples, JS!
If that’s the case, he’s not my kind of general. The lives of your men should always come first.
That was a pretty good movie, back before Kathleen Turner got ill. Danny Devito was in it and he was a lawyer. Effectively, he won “The Ware of the Roses.”
I remember that one, it was a thorny situation.
McChrystal: “Would you please ask the President to call me back, as I have some serious issues I need to air regarding the current Afgani strategy?”
White House Aide: “Yes, General. I will relay your message.”
One week later…
McChrystal: “Would you please ask the President to call me back, as I have some serious issues I need to air regarding the current Afgani strategy, that is of strategic importance?”
White House Aide: “Yes, General. I will relay your message.”
One month later….
McChrystal: “Would you please ask the President to call me back, as I have some serious issues I need to air regarding the current Afgani strategy, that is of strategic importance, and cannot wait?”
White House Aide: “Yes, General. I will relay your message.”
Three months later….
McChrystal: “Would you please ask the President to call me back? The points I wanted to discuss three months ago regarding his Afgan Strategy have been resolved. I wanted to make recommendations that would save lives, but apparently, the President doesn’t have the time, or doesn’t want to take the time to interact with commanders under his charge. Tell him it is beyond urgent that he contact me, ASAP.”
White House Aide: “Yes, General. I will relay your message.”
Six months later…
Rolling Stone Magazine is features an article outlining the General’s concerns regarding the Afgan Theater of Operations, and the Obama Administration’s mishandling of the WOT.
White House Aide: General McChrystal, the President asked me to relay this message to you; “Get your ass back here, now! You have something to say to me, say it to my
handface!”At least that’s what I think has happened. How else would the General be able to get the POTUS’s attention?
On June 22nd, 2010 at 1:40 pm, pueblo1032 said:
As a VET, MICHELLE, only one thing to say… As long as you are active, the POTUS is COMMANDER IN CHIEF, right or wrong, no ifs ands or buts!!! When I was in we often said to one another, “WELL, KISS MY JOHNSON”!!! This to one another, never to an outsider…
Not one here to disagree with you Pueblo (or your service, btw, thanks…)
but…
Obama is a brand new type of animal in the WH… He is indeed the enemy of America…and I for one believe he dreams of our demise…
He is unlike any President before (far as I know…)
and ROI in Afganhistan are severely FUBAR…
so maybe, yeah, screw protocol… If they wan to drim the General out, so be it…
I only wish he would’ve stuck to his guns…
/fingers crossed for more McChrystal criticism of Jug Ears…
Exactly.
drimdrum
Well, to be fair, a person should really do some additional reading before making a judgment. Googling “McChrystal”, “ROE” and “JSOC” would yield up more information which might result in differing and various takes.
But I agree it’s troubling to read the info in the article I linked.
Teddy Kennedy…
…as always, you make me laugh. Good one.
I read the article, and while diplomacy is not his strength, I don’t see a lot–or any?—real criticism directed at at Prez Thin-Skin whiney-pants nor his administration. McChrystal apparently peed in someone’s sandbox, however, and will probably be forced to resign. This is more a like a tempest in a teapot. I am not the only person who wonders:
http://legalinsurrection.blogspot.com/2010/06/has-anyone-including-mcchrystal.html
I did note that the soldiers resent the rules of engagement these days, but have to think General McChrystal is only following orders from higher in the chain of command and doesn’t agree with them, either.
Certainly you military guys are a better judge of this mess than I.
The Cold War was a series of small hot wars, fought between the US and our allies and a number of Soviet surrogates over a 40+ year period from 1945-1989.
The Greek Civil War, Korea, Vietnam, the six-day Arab/Israeli War, Cambodian Civil War, the Soviet War in Afghanistan, and Grenada come to mind.
But you are correct, we won by having a powerful military. That this same military never fired a shot is what is up for debate.
This could be the most laughable headline of the Obama Non-Presidency.
You missed the point of that statement.
Am reading on the Corner National Review that he has resigned. Unconfirmed, but no surprise.
General McChrystal has done exactly what needed to be done.
By opening up even a little to the press, albeit a Rolling Stone reporter, he has put the failure of this administration front and center.
He could do no more
He knew when he was saying these, by my understanding at this time, modest criticisms of the administration, he was effectively signing his resignation papers
Who now will want to be the point man on Obama’s “War of Necessity”
I am proud McChrystal finally did what he did
In my opinion he should have done it sooner
I agree with collegeguy. I think McChrystal was fed up & wanted to make sure his feelings were made public before he quit or got fired. If he had met with BHO & spoke his mind nobody else would know how he really felt. I think he got to the point where he just didn’t care.
Drudge just announced someone claims McC has resigned. Frankly, he should have done this INSTEAD of talking to “Rolling Stone.”
This is a confused situation and it does not put the General in the best light. Self-inflicted wounds are always nasty but not always fatal…
While I 100% support the Constitutional mandate for a civilian-led military, one dilemma for service members has now, finally, come to the forefront of public discourse. If warfare, as Von Clausewitz said, is “policy by other means,” then what is a military leader to do if there is no policy by which to base his strategic and operational decisions? Most Americans don’t understand this, but the military decides the operational and strategic plans, but they do not write policy. This comes from our civilian leadership.
Things get sticky for those in the military when we’re asked, “hey, what do you think of the war?” What do people want to hear? We’re not allowed to speak our minds while in uniform, but who else has the expertise these days and situational awareness that those of us in uniform have? Don’t ask, if you don’t want an honest assessment. Even better, don’t put me in the position where I must either remain silent or falsely state that I think things are going well or not, depending on which way the civilian leadership happens to be leaning on this day or that. Americans truly need to study “politics and war” again, as Adams said. And again I assert that the POTUS and members of the Congressional Armed Services Committees should have military experience, just for this reason. As it is, most folks don’t know the difference between a Lieutenant and a First Sergeant, much less the difference between policy and the strategic, operational, and tactical levels of warfare.
Gee, Send_Me, I’d be glad if Obama and his crew had “experience” at this point, military or otherwise…
This “War of Necessity” as Obama put it has never had an underlying cogent mission
There were short term staregies spelled out for specific operations, but no overarching Mission
Obama’s war in Afghanistan is just like his jobs programs
A failure
Obama is a Failure
What? You mean having been a “Community Organizer” doesn’t command the military’s awe and devotion anymore as the way it had over so many centuries?